Sick of Smug Girlfriends

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Because to most women (though certainly not all), whether they choose to admit it publicly, marrying a rich guy and staying at home is winning the lottery. Men don't have that luxury. Feminism has really messed up this cushy gig for women.

Nope. Not a cushy gig if you are really invested in children, keeping house, cooking. Far more common are women who work a full time job, then are expected to do all the wifely duties at home. The result of that kind of marriage? Exhausted women, failed marriages, neglected children and, quite often, bankruptcy when one job falls apart but the couple's have borrowed up to the limit based on two incomes. I can think of only one marriage with two working parents in which the husband/father does even close to 50 percent of home/child care and a whole bunch where the man wants the lifestyle afforded by a working wife and the benefits of an at-home wife.

See "The Two Income Trap" by Mass. Sen. Elizabeth Warren.

[Anonymous]

Hard to say whether your "friends" are awful or you're projecting some dissatisfaction/jealousy or some combination thereof. They sound awful, to be sure, if that is what you are asking.

But . . . I think women have a certain tendency to project insecurities. Like, feeling guilty about giving up ambitious career, friend could come off as "bragging" as she tries to justify it to you. And you may tend to perceive the justification/bragging as condemnation of you instead.

The older I get, the more I get it . . . from both ends. There's so much pressure. Some self-imposed, some not. I've never ever seriously entertained the idea of being a SAHP . . . but I damn sure get the appeal. I usually like my job and it is an important part of my identity and my contribution to the world and my family. And it irks me to no end when I've heard people cluck their tongue about how little time I get with my kids. Jerks. But . . . my job sucks so hard right now; I have thought more than once that I wish I had the flexibility to walk out and just parent my kids for a couple of years. It would be amazing to get that time with my kids and really focus on them. And I get how SAHP feel judged too - as though caring for your family is unimportant. Jerks.

Anyway, this is mostly just a longwinded appeal to be kinder to one another.

[Anonymous]

OP, one of the mistakes I made as a young adult was to vastly overestimate the importance of friends. It turns out they are not very important. Your family and your husband are many orders of magnitude more important even if it feels that your friends understand you much better. I am now barely in touch with college friends I spent hundreds of hours discussing what I thought were the most important things in the world... but turned out not to be. At all.

Focus on your husband and your family and dial down contacts with your friends if they remain a source of frustration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband is sitting on tens of millions of family wealth and himself makes 300K+ a year. My family are first generation immigrants so their wealth isn't as large but it ain't shabby either. I make 250K a year. Neither of us are interested in leaving our professions which we are lucky to have and love. We have one child whom we adore and are debating another (because we have no family in the area and it's tough). We share childcare and household duties equally.

What you describe is not a great choice for most women (those who can't actually choose, even if appears they willingly gave up their professional lives). The women who opt for this "life of luxury" will soon realize that something is missing in their lives, that they will not be able to develop themselves fully as people. Perhaps some will, but not everyone is cut out to be Martha Steward (just like not everyone is cut out to be a pilot, engineer, lawyer, artist). Staying at home and supporting a husband (let alone taking care of kids or managing a household) is no walk in the park, don't be fooled. My guess is many of these women were coerced in some subtle and not so subtle ways into that role, and many will end up feeling like the women of Mad Men. (Again, some will really find themselves in homemaking as a calling, but many many more will not.)

Feminism has a long way to go, until we don't discuss staying home with a rich husband as a life of luxury. Now if you'll excuse me, I gotta get to work.

-1,000

Pathetic.

This is asinine, on a lot of levels. But the primary one is you assume everyone thinks like you, and believes that slaving away for a wage is the life one should live.

Realize that you can't even see past your own point of view enough to appreciate that there are many people out there like us, rich, middle class, and poor, who would love *more time* to ourselves and less time **working.** And that this is not "anti-feminist."

I don't think you really read what I wrote. And if you did, then your response to me also replies to you. In any case, my point was that women should be able to genuinely choose/build their lives in a way they find fulfilling. I'm not saying anyone is dreaming of living the rat race day in day out either!

[Anonymous]

Why are we constantly discussing women's issues in this world? Should they work? Should they stay at home? Should they be allowed the freedom to make their own choices? Should they have kids? Should they not have kids? Is there too much "pressure" on women to be perfect? On and on and on. We never talk about men's issues. Men are just expected to shut up and keep working until they die. Someone will now say that men have the same choice to be a SAHP, but that's really a joke. Whether or not you have one anecdotal successful example of a man who is a stay at home dad is irrelevant. Men that don't work lose all respect from their wives and are scorned by society. Feminists really don't care about this, despite lip service to the contrary. They want men to keep working, but mostly in construction or menial jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My husband is sitting on tens of millions of family wealth and himself makes 300K+ a year. My family are first generation immigrants so their wealth isn't as large but it ain't shabby either. I make 250K a year. Neither of us are interested in leaving our professions which we are lucky to have and love. We have one child whom we adore and are debating another (because we have no family in the area and it's tough). We share childcare and household duties equally.

What you describe is not a great choice for most women (those who can't actually choose, even if appears they willingly gave up their professional lives). The women who opt for this "life of luxury" will soon realize that something is missing in their lives, that they will not be able to develop themselves fully as people. Perhaps some will, but not everyone is cut out to be Martha Steward (just like not everyone is cut out to be a pilot, engineer, lawyer, artist). Staying at home and supporting a husband (let alone taking care of kids or managing a household) is no walk in the park, don't be fooled. My guess is many of these women were coerced in some subtle and not so subtle ways into that role, and many will end up feeling like the women of Mad Men. (Again, some will really find themselves in homemaking as a calling, but many many more will not.)

Feminism has a long way to go, until we don't discuss staying home with a rich husband as a life of luxury. Now if you'll excuse me, I gotta get to work.

+1000! It's fantastic to know that there is a gender-equal two-income household out there. I personally don't think highly of women who quit work to be someone's pet at home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, one of the mistakes I made as a young adult was to vastly overestimate the importance of friends. It turns out they are not very important. Your family and your husband are many orders of magnitude more important even if it feels that your friends understand you much better. I am now barely in touch with college friends I spent hundreds of hours discussing what I thought were the most important things in the world... but turned out not to be. At all.

Focus on your husband and your family and dial down contacts with your friends if they remain a source of frustration.

Wow, can I just say I think this is horrible advice?? How old are you, PP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, one of the mistakes I made as a young adult was to vastly overestimate the importance of friends. It turns out they are not very important. Your family and your husband are many orders of magnitude more important even if it feels that your friends understand you much better. I am now barely in touch with college friends I spent hundreds of hours discussing what I thought were the most important things in the world... but turned out not to be. At all.

Focus on your husband and your family and dial down contacts with your friends if they remain a source of frustration.

Wow, can I just say I think this is horrible advice?? How old are you, PP?

I’m a NP and I don’t think it’s necessarily think it’s horrible advice. I agree in fact. I spent my 20s and early 30s cultivating a large group of women friends, going our, having lunch, getting nails done, when are we gonna have a Girls night oooooooout? I need some girl time! Etc.
I should have been focusing on my kids and husband. Now at 40, almost all of those women are involved in girl drama with their kids, or drinking pitifully.
Theee close friends I can confide in but don’t have desire for a GNO? That’s gold. And enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, one of the mistakes I made as a young adult was to vastly overestimate the importance of friends. It turns out they are not very important. Your family and your husband are many orders of magnitude more important even if it feels that your friends understand you much better. I am now barely in touch with college friends I spent hundreds of hours discussing what I thought were the most important things in the world... but turned out not to be. At all.

Focus on your husband and your family and dial down contacts with your friends if they remain a source of frustration.

Wow, can I just say I think this is horrible advice?? How old are you, PP?

I’m a NP and I don’t think it’s necessarily think it’s horrible advice. I agree in fact. I spent my 20s and early 30s cultivating a large group of women friends, going our, having lunch, getting nails done, when are we gonna have a Girls night oooooooout? I need some girl time! Etc.
I should have been focusing on my kids and husband. Now at 40, almost all of those women are involved in girl drama with their kids, or drinking pitifully.
Theee close friends I can confide in but don’t have desire for a GNO? That’s gold. And enough.

Just as it’s bizarre that OP actually has three different friends who are caricatures of reality tv stars, it’s equally bizarre that all of your female friends have become pathetic, drunken fools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why are we constantly discussing women's issues in this world? Should they work? Should they stay at home? Should they be allowed the freedom to make their own choices? Should they have kids? Should they not have kids? Is there too much "pressure" on women to be perfect? On and on and on. We never talk about men's issues. Men are just expected to shut up and keep working until they die. Someone will now say that men have the same choice to be a SAHP, but that's really a joke. Whether or not you have one anecdotal successful example of a man who is a stay at home dad is irrelevant. Men that don't work lose all respect from their wives and are scorned by society. Feminists really don't care about this, despite lip service to the contrary. They want men to keep working, but mostly in construction or menial jobs.

It's an open forum, start a thread. As a woman, I discuss women's issues because they affect me every moment of every day. I am constantly reminded that I'm not supposed to be where I am, my male colleagues and bosses underestimate my intelligence and man-splain things to me daily, I have to be twice as good as peers to advance, I had to be back at work while still exhausted from breastfeeding and when I was not emotionally ready to hand my baby to someone at three months old (and I'm supposed to be grateful for the "amazing" three-month mat leave my firm gives), my super successful female director was fired without explanation... So I discuss what affects me and what I see. The world is YOUR oyster, white man, not mine. Start a thread.

[Anonymous]

If what OP writes is true, they are low class women. Nobody with proper manners and values talks like that. Getting an education can't change insipid people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Because to most women (though certainly not all), whether they choose to admit it publicly, marrying a rich guy and staying at home is winning the lottery. Men don't have that luxury. Feminism has really messed up this cushy gig for women.

Nope. Not a cushy gig if you are really invested in children, keeping house, cooking. Far more common are women who work a full time job, then are expected to do all the wifely duties at home. The result of that kind of marriage? Exhausted women, failed marriages, neglected children and, quite often, bankruptcy when one job falls apart but the couple's have borrowed up to the limit based on two incomes. I can think of only one marriage with two working parents in which the husband/father does even close to 50 percent of home/child care and a whole bunch where the man wants the lifestyle afforded by a working wife and the benefits of an at-home wife.

See "The Two Income Trap" by Mass. Sen. Elizabeth Warren.

No marrying a rich guy is an easy life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why are we constantly discussing women's issues in this world? Should they work? Should they stay at home? Should they be allowed the freedom to make their own choices? Should they have kids? Should they not have kids? Is there too much "pressure" on women to be perfect? On and on and on. We never talk about men's issues. Men are just expected to shut up and keep working until they die. Someone will now say that men have the same choice to be a SAHP, but that's really a joke. Whether or not you have one anecdotal successful example of a man who is a stay at home dad is irrelevant. Men that don't work lose all respect from their wives and are scorned by society. Feminists really don't care about this, despite lip service to the contrary. They want men to keep working, but mostly in construction or menial jobs.

Nobody is making you post here and yet here you are! It is a forum that was called Dcurbanmom! And then added dads. Also, who loses respect for SAHD? maybe you with your narrow minded views. I know several SAHDs of teens now, and they are great SAHP, their kids are doing great, and I have not heard a single person in our groups EVER put them down. Among them are two Eastern European Dads, one African American, white American. In fact, among my circle right now half of our friends are SAHD and other half SAHM, and clearly many others are both working. Let's talk about men issues? What do you want to talk about?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, one of the mistakes I made as a young adult was to vastly overestimate the importance of friends. It turns out they are not very important. Your family and your husband are many orders of magnitude more important even if it feels that your friends understand you much better. I am now barely in touch with college friends I spent hundreds of hours discussing what I thought were the most important things in the world... but turned out not to be. At all.

Focus on your husband and your family and dial down contacts with your friends if they remain a source of frustration.

Wow, can I just say I think this is horrible advice?? How old are you, PP?

I’m a NP and I don’t think it’s necessarily think it’s horrible advice. I agree in fact. I spent my 20s and early 30s cultivating a large group of women friends, going our, having lunch, getting nails done, when are we gonna have a Girls night oooooooout? I need some girl time! Etc.
I should have been focusing on my kids and husband. Now at 40, almost all of those women are involved in girl drama with their kids, or drinking pitifully.
Theee close friends I can confide in but don’t have desire for a GNO? That’s gold. And enough.

Just as it’s bizarre that OP actually has three different friends who are caricatures of reality tv stars, it’s equally bizarre that all of your female friends have become pathetic, drunken fools.

I agree with last poster I have two very, very close girlfriends who have actually always been there for me and have helped my marriage. I have been really angry at my husband I can sit and have a glass of wine and talk to them and put things in perspective. When I come back home I am not as angry with my husband because everything has been put into perspective. Maybe you have cultivated the wrong friends. All you need is just one or two good friends. I am glad that my husband is not my only friend. He is a very good friend, but he does not replace the friendship of a girlfriend

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your head was probably somewhere thinking about what really matters in a partner.

Op here. I was focused on finding a guy who could e my best friend and would treat me well. My husband is smart and I’m sure in time will do well but marrying him wasn’t like my ticket to the high life. I never thought of dating that way. Who even thinks like that? I feel so...betrayed by these women. All our late night chats about empowerment and women’s rights and independence... all of them are ready to become stepford wives.

So disheartened.

Smart women should think of everything. Including finances.