Do you think that the Mundo Verde's demographics will change because of the move?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:LAMB also used to (illegally) run a separate lottery for Spanish speakers. They had to stop when the charter board intervened, but that means that with sibling preference you still also have a lot of kids coming from the heavily populated Latino neighborhoods like Adams Morgan.

Please point out the law or statute on this. You have no clue of what you are talking about

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:LAMB also used to (illegally) run a separate lottery for Spanish speakers. They had to stop when the charter board intervened, but that means that with sibling preference you still also have a lot of kids coming from the heavily populated Latino neighborhoods like Adams Morgan.

Please point out the law or statute on this. You have no clue of what you are talking about

Not the poster you are responding to, but LAMB did have a form for spanish dominant applicants. This was maybe 2 years ago when I was interested in attending.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really tough to call this one. My money is on:

1) a lot of current families will stay through the move, because they like the school and have grown attached to it. Some small number will leave due to the move (they will either lottery into another charter closer to home, lottery into DCPS, or go DCPS if they have a good IB option).

2) for new families entering PK3, a lot of Mt Pleasant families will choose Bancroft or DC bilingual instead. (Same goes for Creative Minds, when it moves next year)

3) CoHi, Crestwood, Petworth, AdMo families may continue to choose MV or may begin to prefer IB options. It depends how they evaluate their IB options and also DC bilingual or LAMB vs MV. I suspect Powell will get a lot of attention, maybe Tubman too? HD Cooke also seems to be getting more interest.

4) WOTP families will choose MV less and less - that is a long and bad commute.

5) latino population will drop steadily at MV because DC is only 10% latino whereas CoHi, Mt Pleasant is 25% latino (approx?). MV is moving from the single highest concentration of latinos in the District to one of the lowest. Latino population of Bloomingdale was zero in the 2010 census, I believe. I know that's just one of the neighborhoods.

6) too close to call on white versus African American demographics or wealthy vs FARMS because both MV's old location and its new location have lots of both (black and white, rich and poor)

My main assumption underpinning all of this is that location does matter to a lot of parents for ES but it's not absolute. So overall, over time, I expect gradually fewer Crestwood/Mt Pleasant/Co Hi parents and gradually more from near the new location.

Bloomingdale demographics have changed quite dramatically since the 2010 census even though it's only been 4 years. I personally know several Latino families in Bloomingdale so it's certainly not "zero".

I've lived here since the '90s. Nobody has bought into Bloomingdale within the past 5 years without paying at least $600K, which would be a bargain. The "Bloomingdale Kids" neighborhood group is hopeful that MV's location will make it easier to get in. Nobody wants the neighborhood DCPS schools and LAMB and YuYing are desirable but the WLs are so long.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I go to another charter school and have to say, this is why people dislike charter school parents.

It is NOT a neighborhood school. Sorry that you may get more Bloomingdale families and have to "gasp" be neighborly with them for your play dates.

If you want a neighborhood school, go to one.

OP here, I don't care if people dislike me as a new charter school parent. I have spent the last three years with one DC in a private and had to trek all over DC and Maryland to play dates and birthday parties and quite frankly, I am sick of it. I have absolutely no more interest in trekking to any location east of Georgia Avenue for play dates and parties. I have no energy to give to this and will not apologize for it. I have friends in Bloomingdale and our kids go to the same school but we NEVER do playdates. On the other hand, I regularly see my friends who are in Mt Pleasant because it is effortless. With my work schedule and my kids school schedule, I will not apologize for wanting one aspect of my life to be easy. Further, I have found that kids tend to develop closer relationships with kids they can hook up with in the blink of an eye for an impromptu outing to a park. That can't happen if the kid lives on the Hill and I am on the other side of D.C. If my in bound DCPS were a viable option, you can bet I would choose it, but at the end of the day it is not and very few people in my neighborhood even send their kids to our in-bound DCPS.

I couldn't give less of a damn about you as a charter school parent, but I definitely dislike you as a bitchy whiner.

You're pathetic.

[Anonymous]

Over time, the Latino population will go down at MV --- although it wont be drastic during the first few years. The FARMS rate should also go down as there are numerous Latino FARMS at MV. On a related basis, expect the literacy rate to go up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you are saying that you never want to go east of Georgia Ave, please don't send your child to a school that is east of Georgia Ave. Simple.

Seriously? Petworth is a couple of steps down from where you look, when you wanted to buy into Bloomingdale and realized you couldn't afford it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really tough to call this one. My money is on:

Bloomingdale demographics have changed quite dramatically since the 2010 census even though it's only been 4 years. I personally know several Latino families in Bloomingdale so it's certainly not "zero".

I'm the PP to whom you're responding. Sure, fair point, not zero, but not very many at all, and many fewer than Mt Pleasant / Columbia Heights / Petworth / Adams Morgan in both absolute and relative terms.

This thread has unfortunately descended into a flame-war, which is too bad, because the title of the thread remains an interesting question. Mundo Verde is a bilingual program. It is currently 45% hispanic. What will happen to that number following the move?

I predict that number will steadily drop over the years, unless MV institutes some kind of dual lottery like Oyster (can charters do that?).

When they were situated right in the middle of the largest concentration of latinos in the District, they went to 45%. Now that they are moving to one of the lower concentrations, you would expect that number to fall, because there is a limit to how far most families can travel for preschool and elementary school, and the overall hispanic percentage of the DC school population is around 13%. There seem to be many on DCUM who are willing and able to drive long distances for PK3. I would be curious to see how often that is observed among latino families in the district.

Yes, I am using hispanic and latino interchangeably here which is wrong from a census perspective but I think they overlap reasonably well in DC. Apologies to all you non-latino hispanics.

OP here, sigh, finally someone has gotten back to the central question, which is, what does the move mean for the demographics? Anyway, I am signing off here because I am sure my posting will only generate more over the top assumptions that will have nothing to do with the first question. I am done being entertained for the day.

I'[m PP.

First off, I thought that people were being unnecessarily mean, so bravo for putting your name down and calling the bluff of all the anonymous detractors who were insulting you. You indeed win DCUM today.

Second, yes, I think the move presents a real challenge, and I suspect that one reason why most PPs have ignored my analysis above is that this is an uncomfortable truth, about MV and about dual-language charters in general.

Currently under the charter laws the charter schools have to hold blind city-wide lotteries. They are not allowed to control for income or race or language dominance, as far as I know. This issue has come up regarding the low FARMs percentage at Creative Minds.

For MV, it's not FARMs that is most important, it's the hispanic percentage, because it's really hard to sustain a quality bilingual program when you don't have a critical mass of spanish-speaking families attending. Oyster recognized this years ago, saw the writing on the wall in terms of Woodley Park/Kalorama demographics, and instituted a dual lottery. Meanwhile some DCPS schools mentioned in this thread, Bancroft for example, have a large latino IB population and therefore don't need a dual lottery. I believe Powell and Marie Reed also have a decent IB percentage? Less sure about Marie Reed, maybe someone there can comment.

I am interested to see what happens and how MV responds to it, but would we be surprised if we saw the hispanic percentage drop below 30% for the incoming PK3 classes, given the new location? I believe Cleveland is the closest dual language DCPS to the new MV location? Cleveland has 30% hispanic.

Now, on the other hand, LAMB is maintaining a decent percentage so far, and neither LAMB location is an especially hispanic neighborhood.

We'll see.

This ignores the fact that A) as a DCPS school, Oyster is allowed to hold different lotteries and MV is not. B) Despite that, MV is widely regarded as a better school than Bancroft. MV is bilingual by design. Bancroft is bilingual by default. AND it has the legacy staff from DCPS.

SO sad.

The reference to LAMB is relevant though. Also, Yu Ying? It doesn't have a majority Asian population, yet has managed to become a high-performing school within 5 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Over time, the Latino population will go down at MV --- although it wont be drastic during the first few years. The FARMS rate should also go down as there are numerous Latino FARMS at MV. On a related basis, expect the literacy rate to go up.

True. The new location puts it on the radar for Capitol Hill families, and there are a LOT of families dissatisfied with the DCPS situation on the Hill. If a shuttle could be organized up to Brookland for YY, it could easily be done for MV in NoMa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP could have avoid all her issues by living WOTP in JKLMM but she wanted it all including inexpensive housing... now she's complaining about the inconvenience of it all. BOO HOO!!!

My house is EOTP and costs the same as homes WOTP so get over yourself. I value diversity which is why I did not move WOTP.

So you own a rowhome in Logan?

NP. Why assume? There are million dollar homes in Brookland, Shepherd Park, Col Village, Crestwood and Cap Hill to name a few. Logan is certainly not the only neighborhood with high prices homes. My EOTP home is valued higher than quite a few WOTP homes. Some people choose to live east even of they can afford west.

[Anonymous]

OP, you're such a douche. I also like how you got worried that you'd be discovered, so fake admitted that you faked details, then threw up a stupid smokescreen identity to make it seem like you were originally faking it. Weak sauce.

Obvious ignorant poster is obvious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, you're such a douche. I also like how you got worried that you'd be discovered, so fake admitted that you faked details, then threw up a stupid smokescreen identity to make it seem like you were originally faking it. Weak sauce.

Obvious ignorant poster is obvious.

+1. No worse then the completely oblivious posters who kept saying "Bravo" to the stupid smoke screen b/c OP is so brave and "fake" owns what she wrote.

Pathetic, whiny bitch. Since she lives in Mt Pleasant just go to Bancroft, Cooke, Powell, Tubman, Reed or Oyster, whatever.... if getting to MV is such a hardship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you're such a douche. I also like how you got worried that you'd be discovered, so fake admitted that you faked details, then threw up a stupid smokescreen identity to make it seem like you were originally faking it. Weak sauce.

Obvious ignorant poster is obvious.

+1. No worse then the completely oblivious posters who kept saying "Bravo" to the stupid smoke screen b/c OP is so brave and "fake" owns what she wrote.

Pathetic, whiny bitch. Since she lives in Mt Pleasant just go to Bancroft, Cooke, Powell, Tubman, Reed or Oyster, whatever.... if getting to MV is such a hardship.

Y'all should sleep more. Being up this late had made you mean and stupid. I promise you it will be better in the morning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:LAMB also used to (illegally) run a separate lottery for Spanish speakers. They had to stop when the charter board intervened, but that means that with sibling preference you still also have a lot of kids coming from the heavily populated Latino neighborhoods like Adams Morgan.

Please point out the law or statute on this. You have no clue of what you are talking about

Not the poster you are responding to, but LAMB did have a form for spanish dominant applicants. This was maybe 2 years ago when I was interested in attending.

Yes, because their approved charter allowed it. However, it was not "illegal" the charter school board asked them to amend it and they agreed.

Before you claim "illegal" you may want to actually read the statute.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP could have avoid all her issues by living WOTP in JKLMM but she wanted it all including inexpensive housing... now she's complaining about the inconvenience of it all. BOO HOO!!!

My house is EOTP and costs the same as homes WOTP so get over yourself. I value diversity which is why I did not move WOTP.

So you own a rowhome in Logan?

NP. Why assume? There are million dollar homes in Brookland, Shepherd Park, Col Village, Crestwood and Cap Hill to name a few. Logan is certainly not the only neighborhood with high prices homes. My EOTP home is valued higher than quite a few WOTP homes. Some people choose to live east even of they can afford west.

Actually it is safe to assume that with two identical red brick colonials (4bed 3 ba), big trees, redone kitchen....

the one in AU park/spring valley/friendship heights/ Cleveland park will cost more than the same exact house in sheperd park/16th st hts/crestwood and certainly brookland.

But sure, there are big stone detached homes all over eotp, nwdc neigjborhoods that cost more than the smaller bungalows that are common in CCDC. They're gorgeous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP could have avoid all her issues by living WOTP in JKLMM but she wanted it all including inexpensive housing... now she's complaining about the inconvenience of it all. BOO HOO!!!

My house is EOTP and costs the same as homes WOTP so get over yourself. I value diversity which is why I did not move WOTP.

So you own a rowhome in Logan?

NP. Why assume? There are million dollar homes in Brookland, Shepherd Park, Col Village, Crestwood and Cap Hill to name a few. Logan is certainly not the only neighborhood with high prices homes. My EOTP home is valued higher than quite a few WOTP homes. Some people choose to live east even of they can afford west.

Actually it is safe to assume that with two identical red brick colonials (4bed 3 ba), big trees, redone kitchen....

the one in AU park/spring valley/friendship heights/ Cleveland park will cost more than the same exact house in sheperd park/16th st hts/crestwood and certainly brookland.

But sure, there are big stone detached homes all over eotp, nwdc neigjborhoods that cost more than the smaller bungalows that are common in CCDC. They're gorgeous.

But that same house in Logan circle would be a lot more.