summer swim volunteer points

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tanterra does this. I think it’s around 17 points per family. Feels unfair to families where both parents are working during the summer.

Parents need to choose activities that work for them, or find solutions.

Summer swim worked for my family when other activities that cost more because they don’t rely on volunteers didn’t. I didn’t go to those activities and complain that they were unfair to my middle class family. I recognized that they weren’t for us.

It’s ok to say that summer swim isn’t for you. It’s also ok to problem solve. My teens are happy to work set up, take down, picking up things for you, for a price. Hire a babysitter and work a meet your kids aren’t in. Or arrange your schedule to watch your kids and work at the meets they do swim in.

Spinning off this comment, something I don't understand about the culture of summer swim at our pool is that all these strong, strapping teen swimmers leave at the end without lifting a finger at all to help while the parents are left to move all the chairs, tables, benches, umbrellas, etc. back into place. Some are wrought iron and heavy. Why can't each teen put one chair back into place or something on their way out?

Oh my god YES. We don't do swim team but it is huge at our community pool so I see how it functions. All these moms out there setting out chairs and taking out and putting back in ladders! Why the heck aren't their teenage kids doing this instead! These kids seem so spoiled. And why the moms and not the dads? It's ridiculous.

I'm the PP who suggested hiring other people's teenagers. I see a huge variation in this from pool to pool, and from family to family. Our pool does have some teenagers who help out, but could definitely have more. I see the same pattern in other activities my kids are in. In some families the kids don't help in any context, and I find that sad.

At the same time, by the end of the meet, my teens have usually helped with set up, and then spent the whole morning wrangling the little kids. Many days, they have a few minutes to scarf down some food before their lifeguarding shift begins. I've put in way more than my share of hours as stroke and turn. If a parent who chose not to come early for set up, and chose not to volunteer during the meet despite being there, signs up for take down, I don't feel the need to have my kid do that job for them.

I'm the original PP asking, and our pool has mandatory volunteer slots per family so I don't think there are slacker families. We have parent volunteers to wrangle little kids so teens aren't doing that. I don't see the teens doing any of what you describe. It is only a few little kids who help with setup and breakdown, because they are there with their parents. As the PP said, the teens seem so spoiled. [And, yes, mostly moms doing the setup and breakdown at our pool, too].

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think any of the “fun” social volunteer slots should be filled until the slots required to host a meet are filled. Great there is a Friday morning pancake breakfast but timers are more important when running a swim meet.

Personally I think the volunteer tasks should be stripped to a bare minimum. Only necessary ones like timing meets should count towards volunteer requirements. Kids dont need snacks, gift bags, pancake breakfasts, banquets. If someone wants to do that on their own time, fine. But dont pressure me into it.

Frankly, that's part of the community of summer swim teams around here. If it's not your thing, great sign up to time or be clerk of course or run concessions and don't volunteer for the things you find distasteful.

We don't have a points requirement, but our reps spend a lot of time pushing people to fill those last slots. Swimtopia let's you see volunteer shifts from the backend so team reps can see who isn't contributing. As a former team rep I'd occasionally reach to families who had done very little and say that I've noticed they haven't done anything yet and they have kids swimming so I've assigned them to be a second half timer, or something similar.

We all have particular meets that for one reason or another we can't volunteer but as a general rule you should be trying to participate. This is what you signed up for. We say it from the start so there isn't a surprise of the expectations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tanterra does this. I think it’s around 17 points per family. Feels unfair to families where both parents are working during the summer.

Parents need to choose activities that work for them, or find solutions.

Summer swim worked for my family when other activities that cost more because they don’t rely on volunteers didn’t. I didn’t go to those activities and complain that they were unfair to my middle class family. I recognized that they weren’t for us.

It’s ok to say that summer swim isn’t for you. It’s also ok to problem solve. My teens are happy to work set up, take down, picking up things for you, for a price. Hire a babysitter and work a meet your kids aren’t in. Or arrange your schedule to watch your kids and work at the meets they do swim in.

Spinning off this comment, something I don't understand about the culture of summer swim at our pool is that all these strong, strapping teen swimmers leave at the end without lifting a finger at all to help while the parents are left to move all the chairs, tables, benches, umbrellas, etc. back into place. Some are wrought iron and heavy. Why can't each teen put one chair back into place or something on their way out?

Oh my god YES. We don't do swim team but it is huge at our community pool so I see how it functions. All these moms out there setting out chairs and taking out and putting back in ladders! Why the heck aren't their teenage kids doing this instead! These kids seem so spoiled. And why the moms and not the dads? It's ridiculous.

I'm the PP who suggested hiring other people's teenagers. I see a huge variation in this from pool to pool, and from family to family. Our pool does have some teenagers who help out, but could definitely have more. I see the same pattern in other activities my kids are in. In some families the kids don't help in any context, and I find that sad.

At the same time, by the end of the meet, my teens have usually helped with set up, and then spent the whole morning wrangling the little kids. Many days, they have a few minutes to scarf down some food before their lifeguarding shift begins. I've put in way more than my share of hours as stroke and turn. If a parent who chose not to come early for set up, and chose not to volunteer during the meet despite being there, signs up for take down, I don't feel the need to have my kid do that job for them.

I'm the original PP asking, and our pool has mandatory volunteer slots per family so I don't think there are slacker families. We have parent volunteers to wrangle little kids so teens aren't doing that. I don't see the teens doing any of what you describe. It is only a few little kids who help with setup and breakdown, because they are there with their parents. As the PP said, the teens seem so spoiled. [And, yes, mostly moms doing the setup and breakdown at our pool, too].

I didn’t call them slackers. The parents doing A meet breakdown and B meet setup are earning their hours. They chose that as the way to earn their hours. Which is fine, but I don’t feel obligated to have my teens jump in to help when our hours are covered.

My kids have jumped in when there aren’t enough parent volunteers (usually A meet set up and B meet takedown which you aren’t seeing if you are a pool member and not a team family), or if a family has a genuine need, they will offer to help cover their hours.

I don’t know why you see more moms than dads. That is an individual decision made by individual families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think any of the “fun” social volunteer slots should be filled until the slots required to host a meet are filled. Great there is a Friday morning pancake breakfast but timers are more important when running a swim meet.

Personally I think the volunteer tasks should be stripped to a bare minimum. Only necessary ones like timing meets should count towards volunteer requirements. Kids dont need snacks, gift bags, pancake breakfasts, banquets. If someone wants to do that on their own time, fine. But dont pressure me into it.

Does your team do senior speeches? These are the things that seniors cite as their favorite memories of swim team. It’s not just about the hours in the water and the meets. The extra things like pancake breakfasts and raft nights are the things that bring true joy to summer swim.

If this doesn’t jive with you, if the extras irritate you, then don’t sign your kids up for summer swim. It’s as simple as that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We have to get 10 points a family. There doesn’t seem to be any enforcement of this and there are families that never volunteer (and there’s no buy out option). It’s a really strange environment with parents - like there’s some sort of hierarchy of volunteering and the “best” jobs are done by a clique of the “in-crowd”. I’m not in middle school anymore so I couldn’t care less, but the discussion between timers yesterday made it very clear that some of them were angling to be the head timer. lol…

I’m really curious; what are these “best” jobs? I became our team’s head timer after the previous one’s kid graduated, and I was asked if I would do it. It’s fine, but no one on our team has ever seemed jealous of this, or any other position. It’s more like trying to find enough people to fill such positions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tanterra does this. I think it’s around 17 points per family. Feels unfair to families where both parents are working during the summer.

Parents need to choose activities that work for them, or find solutions.

Summer swim worked for my family when other activities that cost more because they don’t rely on volunteers didn’t. I didn’t go to those activities and complain that they were unfair to my middle class family. I recognized that they weren’t for us.

It’s ok to say that summer swim isn’t for you. It’s also ok to problem solve. My teens are happy to work set up, take down, picking up things for you, for a price. Hire a babysitter and work a meet your kids aren’t in. Or arrange your schedule to watch your kids and work at the meets they do swim in.

Spinning off this comment, something I don't understand about the culture of summer swim at our pool is that all these strong, strapping teen swimmers leave at the end without lifting a finger at all to help while the parents are left to move all the chairs, tables, benches, umbrellas, etc. back into place. Some are wrought iron and heavy. Why can't each teen put one chair back into place or something on their way out?

Oh my god YES. We don't do swim team but it is huge at our community pool so I see how it functions. All these moms out there setting out chairs and taking out and putting back in ladders! Why the heck aren't their teenage kids doing this instead! These kids seem so spoiled. And why the moms and not the dads? It's ridiculous.

I'm the PP who suggested hiring other people's teenagers. I see a huge variation in this from pool to pool, and from family to family. Our pool does have some teenagers who help out, but could definitely have more. I see the same pattern in other activities my kids are in. In some families the kids don't help in any context, and I find that sad.

At the same time, by the end of the meet, my teens have usually helped with set up, and then spent the whole morning wrangling the little kids. Many days, they have a few minutes to scarf down some food before their lifeguarding shift begins. I've put in way more than my share of hours as stroke and turn. If a parent who chose not to come early for set up, and chose not to volunteer during the meet despite being there, signs up for take down, I don't feel the need to have my kid do that job for them.

This is more like the scenario at our pool too, but we actually have most men sign up for setup and breakdown.

Re: teens. One of my kids was a “volunteer” coach in 8th grade and parents yelled at DC and friend for not controlling the kids well enough. Ummmm…you can’t control these unruly kids how do you expect an 8th grader. Both never volunteered again. I do well beyond the volunteer requirements at our pool and I’m not forcing my teen to be verbal abused by these parents, who don’t like how DC did the job.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have to get 10 points a family. There doesn’t seem to be any enforcement of this and there are families that never volunteer (and there’s no buy out option). It’s a really strange environment with parents - like there’s some sort of hierarchy of volunteering and the “best” jobs are done by a clique of the “in-crowd”. I’m not in middle school anymore so I couldn’t care less, but the discussion between timers yesterday made it very clear that some of them were angling to be the head timer. lol…

I’m really curious; what are these “best” jobs? I became our team’s head timer after the previous one’s kid graduated, and I was asked if I would do it. It’s fine, but no one on our team has ever seemed jealous of this, or any other position. It’s more like trying to find enough people to fill such positions.

Preach! Nobody is jealous of any of these jobs. I will say that ribbon writing is pretty easy if you are going to be there anyway. Runners are also a good job if you want to get your steps in and not have to wrangle kids. It is very easy to watch your kid/s swim with both of these jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have to get 10 points a family. There doesn’t seem to be any enforcement of this and there are families that never volunteer (and there’s no buy out option). It’s a really strange environment with parents - like there’s some sort of hierarchy of volunteering and the “best” jobs are done by a clique of the “in-crowd”. I’m not in middle school anymore so I couldn’t care less, but the discussion between timers yesterday made it very clear that some of them were angling to be the head timer. lol…

I’m really curious; what are these “best” jobs? I became our team’s head timer after the previous one’s kid graduated, and I was asked if I would do it. It’s fine, but no one on our team has ever seemed jealous of this, or any other position. It’s more like trying to find enough people to fill such positions.

Preach! Nobody is jealous of any of these jobs. I will say that ribbon writing is pretty easy if you are going to be there anyway. Runners are also a good job if you want to get your steps in and not have to wrangle kids. It is very easy to watch your kid/s swim with both of these jobs.

We're relatively new but I think any of the table jobs where you're sitting down writing or reading out times, ribbons, etc. are considered better and go fast (or are taken before signups begin). Timers and kid wranglers seem less desirable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think any of the “fun” social volunteer slots should be filled until the slots required to host a meet are filled. Great there is a Friday morning pancake breakfast but timers are more important when running a swim meet.

Personally I think the volunteer tasks should be stripped to a bare minimum. Only necessary ones like timing meets should count towards volunteer requirements. Kids dont need snacks, gift bags, pancake breakfasts, banquets. If someone wants to do that on their own time, fine. But dont pressure me into it.

Does your team do senior speeches? These are the things that seniors cite as their favorite memories of swim team. It’s not just about the hours in the water and the meets. The extra things like pancake breakfasts and raft nights are the things that bring true joy to summer swim.

If this doesn’t jive with you, if the extras irritate you, then don’t sign your kids up for summer swim. It’s as simple as that.

+1

It is the "extras" that make summer swim special and fun for kids of all ages. Our older swimmers love when they turn 13 and get to cook the pancakes or time at the lollipop meet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think any of the “fun” social volunteer slots should be filled until the slots required to host a meet are filled. Great there is a Friday morning pancake breakfast but timers are more important when running a swim meet.

Personally I think the volunteer tasks should be stripped to a bare minimum. Only necessary ones like timing meets should count towards volunteer requirements. Kids dont need snacks, gift bags, pancake breakfasts, banquets. If someone wants to do that on their own time, fine. But dont pressure me into it.

That's cool. I hope you are telling your kids they don't need these thig and can't attend.

The beauty of summer swim, when all parent volunteer, is that is all gets done and there is a job for everyone. If you hate planning fun activities then stick to working as a stroke and turn offial.

Hate all things volunteer related- don't sign your kid up for summer swim team.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We're relatively new but I think any of the table jobs where you're sitting down writing or reading out times, ribbons, etc. are considered better and go fast (or are taken before signups begin). Timers and kid wranglers seem less desirable.

NVSL offers training for things like data, so at our pool we usually pre-assign some of the jobs where attention to detail really matters to folks who have done the training. We then add extra slots for parents who want to shadow and learn how to do those roles.

Similarly, roles like announcer we have a cadre of announcers to choose from. If you're interest, speak up! Email your team rep and ask if you can try it out or work with one of the experienced announcers. It sounds silly but a good announcer works with the ref to keep the meet moving. We always have at least one experienced clerk of course at each meet. Wrangling kids is tough so it helps if there's at least one adult who does it all the time.

It's not about popularity or playing favorites at our pool. We try to outreach early and often to families to express interest and identify roles where they want to learn or get involved. Of course we all need timers more than anything, but the jobs that might require a bit more knowledge no matter how basic we try not to have a newbie do it by themselves and end up stressed out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The concessions price gouging is another story

Maybe? It’s hard to know for sure. Some teams have to independently fund raise without the support of the pool. Coaches salaries, equipment costs, and other items will easily run a team thousands of dollars and then some.

I've seen it both ways - no gouging and ridiculous gouging (like $4.00 for a slice of pizza that in total cost $12, or the same for Cup-of-Noodles or bagels bought at Costco). The smart move is to just pack a cooler with drinks and a backpack with snacks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our team is thinking of instituting a point system for volunteering and I am trying to understand how this works.

I have two Qs:

For your team, what are the consequences of not earning sufficient volunteer points?

For your team, is there an option to buy out the points - just pay a certain amount per point maybe? I have no judgement on this as an option. Just wondering how it works since it’s part of the proposal for our team for next summer.

Our team tried a buyout in 2022 and never again. There was a fantasy that they could use the additional funds to pay teens to handle the jobs, but teens who were willing to work had already picked up life guarding or snack bar shifts or were swimming themselves. Ultimately the people who chose the buyout option got away with not volunteering and the people who didn’t do the buyout had to pick up additional shifts beyond the minimum to make meets work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our team is thinking of instituting a point system for volunteering and I am trying to understand how this works.

I have two Qs:

For your team, what are the consequences of not earning sufficient volunteer points?

For your team, is there an option to buy out the points - just pay a certain amount per point maybe? I have no judgement on this as an option. Just wondering how it works since it’s part of the proposal for our team for next summer.

Theoretically the consequence is that registration is blocked the next year, but the Board and manager never have the heart to block registrations. And some families take advantages of that policy by not volunteering when they know it’s their kids’ last summer of competing.

No matter what our board and team has tried, the reality is that some people step up and some will always think their excuse for not being available is more valid than anyone else’s. My favorite as rep was when someone would time a lane during a shift they’d signed up for. They said “I actually can’t to it because I want to watch my kid swim.”

I still wonder if they were curious why the rest of us parents were there if not to watch our kids swim!

[Anonymous]

Our requirement is 20 points per family. If it’s a need to train position (ref, starter, data, stroke and turn, etc.) you get 10 points for going to the training each year so that only requires one meet in that role. Most people though who go through the certification generally are willing to do a few meets. Timers and concessions are about 3 points per meet. If you don’t get to 20 (and kids can earn family points for set up), then you are charged a fee that is larger than the swim team registration.

Moving to this model incentivized more parents to be willing to jump into new roles. We are a tiny swim team (about 60 members).