60% of girls say they want college, only 46% of boys

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Having a boy really opened my eyes to this issue. My well behaved, introvert, academically inclined DS is completing college a semester early with nearly perfect gpa, and even he ran into the bias against boys in the educational system. He had some wonderful teachers through the years, but he had some that clearly just didn’t like boys. I had friends with boys who were naturally rowdier who really struggled with it.

It has nothing to do with how they do on their academic assignments, but teachers who expect boys to act like girls and penalize them when they don’t and then wonder why they don’t like school. My son has had a great academic career, but I regret not sending him to an all boys school through at least middle school.

I don't have any sons, only daughters but I do agree there is sort if a bias against boys. Lots of teachers are female so that might be one of the reasons. Also I have no doubt that boys raised in divorced families with no fathers or a father figure has had an impact. Bottomline, we need more male role models.

How come boys used to thrive in the classroom then? Back in the baby boomer generation.

They were class presidents, leaders, valedictorians. This was in an era when teachers were female and classroom rules were very strict and prescriptive. Today, students are allowed to make noise and roam around in class. Back then they had be still and quiet.

So, how come boys were more successful academically back then?

Because back then society (and thus teachers, principals, the entire system) assumed that they would become executives, managers, doctors, lawyers, and all of this translated into how boys were treated in the classroom. In the last 15 years things have shifted, we gave girls the same opportunities, the collective expectation of what they could do and could become matched our expectations of boys. Except girls have more work ethic in elementary and middle school. And the expectations + the work ethic = really really strong girls who started believing they could run with and outmatch the boys. In middle school I asked my DD if she thought any boy in her class was smarter than her in math (I asked because studies at the time indicated that once the math got hard, girls started retreating in the STEM classes). She flat out said no. We have never paid attention to the work ethic of boys. Not in the boomer generation (because they could ride the patriarch wave) and not now (because we focused on the girls). But we need to, because the boys are falling way behind the girls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Having a boy really opened my eyes to this issue. My well behaved, introvert, academically inclined DS is completing college a semester early with nearly perfect gpa, and even he ran into the bias against boys in the educational system. He had some wonderful teachers through the years, but he had some that clearly just didn’t like boys. I had friends with boys who were naturally rowdier who really struggled with it.

It has nothing to do with how they do on their academic assignments, but teachers who expect boys to act like girls and penalize them when they don’t and then wonder why they don’t like school. My son has had a great academic career, but I regret not sending him to an all boys school through at least middle school.

I don't have any sons, only daughters but I do agree there is sort if a bias against boys. Lots of teachers are female so that might be one of the reasons. Also I have no doubt that boys raised in divorced families with no fathers or a father figure has had an impact. Bottomline, we need more male role models.

How come boys used to thrive in the classroom then? Back in the baby boomer generation.

They were class presidents, leaders, valedictorians. This was in an era when teachers were female and classroom rules were very strict and prescriptive. Today, students are allowed to make noise and roam around in class. Back then they had be still and quiet.

So, how come boys were more successful academically back then?

Easy. Low expectations of girls, and higher expectation of boys. Now, the reverse is true, I guess, even though most of our leaders are still men.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Having a boy really opened my eyes to this issue. My well behaved, introvert, academically inclined DS is completing college a semester early with nearly perfect gpa, and even he ran into the bias against boys in the educational system. He had some wonderful teachers through the years, but he had some that clearly just didn’t like boys. I had friends with boys who were naturally rowdier who really struggled with it.

It has nothing to do with how they do on their academic assignments, but teachers who expect boys to act like girls and penalize them when they don’t and then wonder why they don’t like school. My son has had a great academic career, but I regret not sending him to an all boys school through at least middle school.

I don't have any sons, only daughters but I do agree there is sort if a bias against boys. Lots of teachers are female so that might be one of the reasons. Also I have no doubt that boys raised in divorced families with no fathers or a father figure has had an impact. Bottomline, we need more male role models.

How come boys used to thrive in the classroom then? Back in the baby boomer generation.

They were class presidents, leaders, valedictorians. This was in an era when teachers were female and classroom rules were very strict and prescriptive. Today, students are allowed to make noise and roam around in class. Back then they had be still and quiet.

So, how come boys were more successful academically back then?

Because back then society (and thus teachers, principals, the entire system) assumed that they would become executives, managers, doctors, lawyers, and all of this translated into how boys were treated in the classroom. In the last 15 years things have shifted, we gave girls the same opportunities, the collective expectation of what they could do and could become matched our expectations of boys. Except girls have more work ethic in elementary and middle school. And the expectations + the work ethic = really really strong girls who started believing they could run with and outmatch the boys. In middle school I asked my DD if she thought any boy in her class was smarter than her in math (I asked because studies at the time indicated that once the math got hard, girls started retreating in the STEM classes). She flat out said no. We have never paid attention to the work ethic of boys. Not in the boomer generation (because they could ride the patriarch wave) and not now (because we focused on the girls). But we need to, because the boys are falling way behind the girls.

That's the fault of parents for having low expectation of boys.

-parent of a boy and girl

[Anonymous]

If education is indeed feminized, it would help to get more male teachers. But the pay is crap, so they won’t do it. (How many of you are encouraging your boys to become teachers? How many of you want your daughters to marry a teacher?) And around and around and around the world turns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Having a boy really opened my eyes to this issue. My well behaved, introvert, academically inclined DS is completing college a semester early with nearly perfect gpa, and even he ran into the bias against boys in the educational system. He had some wonderful teachers through the years, but he had some that clearly just didn’t like boys. I had friends with boys who were naturally rowdier who really struggled with it.

It has nothing to do with how they do on their academic assignments, but teachers who expect boys to act like girls and penalize them when they don’t and then wonder why they don’t like school. My son has had a great academic career, but I regret not sending him to an all boys school through at least middle school.

I don't have any sons, only daughters but I do agree there is sort if a bias against boys. Lots of teachers are female so that might be one of the reasons. Also I have no doubt that boys raised in divorced families with no fathers or a father figure has had an impact. Bottomline, we need more male role models.

How come boys used to thrive in the classroom then? Back in the baby boomer generation.

They were class presidents, leaders, valedictorians. This was in an era when teachers were female and classroom rules were very strict and prescriptive. Today, students are allowed to make noise and roam around in class. Back then they had be still and quiet.

So, how come boys were more successful academically back then?

Multiple factors. One, we started ignoring boys in our efforts to prop up girls. That's one mistake. Also unlike the baby boomer generation, we have more broken families with boys being raised in homes without dads. Seriously every boy I know who is struggling comes from divorced parents and living with their mom. I know my world is small but let's not ignore the importance of the male role model in raising a boy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Having a boy really opened my eyes to this issue. My well behaved, introvert, academically inclined DS is completing college a semester early with nearly perfect gpa, and even he ran into the bias against boys in the educational system. He had some wonderful teachers through the years, but he had some that clearly just didn’t like boys. I had friends with boys who were naturally rowdier who really struggled with it.

It has nothing to do with how they do on their academic assignments, but teachers who expect boys to act like girls and penalize them when they don’t and then wonder why they don’t like school. My son has had a great academic career, but I regret not sending him to an all boys school through at least middle school.

I don't have any sons, only daughters but I do agree there is sort if a bias against boys. Lots of teachers are female so that might be one of the reasons. Also I have no doubt that boys raised in divorced families with no fathers or a father figure has had an impact. Bottomline, we need more male role models.

How come boys used to thrive in the classroom then? Back in the baby boomer generation.

They were class presidents, leaders, valedictorians. This was in an era when teachers were female and classroom rules were very strict and prescriptive. Today, students are allowed to make noise and roam around in class. Back then they had be still and quiet.

So, how come boys were more successful academically back then?

Because people didn’t pathologize misbehavior. They set expectations and understood that kids screw up, instead of implying that kids who didn’t meet them were deficient. Back then, you had time and the opportunity to straighten out by mid high school. Kids could struggle early in high school and still make it to very prestigious schools. The entire system now leaves little room for mistakes.

We aren't talking about boys going to elite colleges. They can go to community college or a cheaper lower rated state school (which we have a lot of), and still get an education. They can screw up in MS and still go to college. Heck, I went to a cheap no name state u and did well for myself because I had drive and ambition, and I'm a woman from a lmc family.

It's because these boys have been coddled and have no ambition. Agree with the single mom PP, if boys are taught how hard life is without a good paying job they'd have more ambition. I learned that early on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Having a boy really opened my eyes to this issue. My well behaved, introvert, academically inclined DS is completing college a semester early with nearly perfect gpa, and even he ran into the bias against boys in the educational system. He had some wonderful teachers through the years, but he had some that clearly just didn’t like boys. I had friends with boys who were naturally rowdier who really struggled with it.

It has nothing to do with how they do on their academic assignments, but teachers who expect boys to act like girls and penalize them when they don’t and then wonder why they don’t like school. My son has had a great academic career, but I regret not sending him to an all boys school through at least middle school.

I don't have any sons, only daughters but I do agree there is sort if a bias against boys. Lots of teachers are female so that might be one of the reasons. Also I have no doubt that boys raised in divorced families with no fathers or a father figure has had an impact. Bottomline, we need more male role models.

How come boys used to thrive in the classroom then? Back in the baby boomer generation.

They were class presidents, leaders, valedictorians. This was in an era when teachers were female and classroom rules were very strict and prescriptive. Today, students are allowed to make noise and roam around in class. Back then they had be still and quiet.

So, how come boys were more successful academically back then?

Multiple factors. One, we started ignoring boys in our efforts to prop up girls. That's one mistake. Also unlike the baby boomer generation, we have more broken families with boys being raised in homes without dads. Seriously every boy I know who is struggling comes from divorced parents and living with their mom. I know my world is small but let's not ignore the importance of the male role model in raising a boy.

So, once again, it's the women who have to pick up after men.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If education is indeed feminized, it would help to get more male teachers. But the pay is crap, so they won’t do it. (How many of you are encouraging your boys to become teachers? How many of you want your daughters to marry a teacher?) And around and around and around the world turns.

My DH is a math and science teacher. He says the brightest girls in the class are impressive. And the boys are generally appalling both in their behavior and their lack of preparation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So … basically most boys need DEI to compete with girls. Otherwise the girls blow them out of the water.

Mediocre white boys and men were able to succeed despite their mediocrity for hundreds of years. As soon as the tables started to turn, they went MAGA.

No, the school system is no longer geared toward the way biology enables them to learn and develop. Instead of active learning, athletics, camaraderie, they are forced to sit for 8 straight hours being yelled at and humiliated by purple-haired women who feel like they finally have control over men. It's pathetic.

They are not mistreated by teachers. They are asked to do things they find boring. Like writing feelings journal entries in 9th grade English.

The smart kids need alternatives to book learning cramming (including girls). Like Honors Shop Class/3D Printing. Unfortunately, the tech programs/ alternative high schools seem to still be offramps that don't lead to 4 year college.

DP. My kid never had to write a feelings journal, but she had to analyze Kendrick Lamar’s Super Bowl halftime performance for AP Lang a few weeks ago. And they don’t ever have to finish a whole book at home anymore, because, you know, too boring, I guess. Totally biased towards girls, sure.

PP. Not sure what your point is pro or con analyzing Kendrick Lamar. However, I think in our school district, the writing curriculum is distinctly girly/emotional/navelgazing and one of my sons has been tone policed in multiple grades for being negative in his writing (unhappy endings, arguing against sacred cow topics).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm sorry, but it's not a systemic thing, it's BAD PARENTING. Parents have just assumed for so long that their boys are going to do well that they have been completely ignoring them throughout their entire childhoods, and then they become young men, and boom! Boymoms blame the system instead of themselves for not encouraging independence and providing enrichment for them. Want STEM for your boys? Find clubs for them to join, there are plenty - look at all the First Lego leagues. Want outdoorsmanship for your boys? Surprise! There's Boy Scouts (or whatever it's called now). Want your boy to do track and field? Rec leagues offer a million and five sports options every season! Art classes accept boys, all the math enrichment programs accept boys, all sort of things available to your boys, ladies, STOP IGNORNIG THEM.

You either do not have a son, or you are one of a small minority who has some kind of fall in line, do only as moms and teachers say type. I paid immense amounts of attention to my son. To the OP's point, it was actually to the detriment of my daughter two years younger than him. He required so much attention--and as a college senior limping to the finish line, still does. Our schools went so far in accommodating the learning styles of girls that boys have been left far far behind. My son is objectively (I know, we had to have him tested three times) extremely intelligent. Far more so than my daughter. But he failed at so many things in school that his self-esteem was in the basement. Now that he has matured, he recognizes clearly what happened. He doesn't blame women, fortunately, but he has so much regret that he wasn't able to better advocate for himself, rather than spending his first 18 years of life constantly berated and demeaned by teachers. My husband and I were just noticing last night that of the 6 or so boys who all grew together in our neighborhood, every single one of them has struggled to finish college. Two of them look like they won't make it. They were just so ground down going through school they have nothing left to keep going.

I have the same experience with a boy who gets so much attention from us as parents, but still struggles. He’s in college and is ahead, but at what cost? His self esteem took a hit in high school where teachers make it seem like ADHD or differences in learning for boys reflect their character. So many just write boys off as lazy. My son tries, and he’s objectively smart (99th percentile IQ, SAT, etc.), but has a hard time with rote learning and memorization. I feel like schools try to grind this type of kid down to nothingness and call them lazy. Then there’s the problem that boys have a lot of peers who are in the same boat, which normalizes underachievement.

I don’t have the same struggle with my girls, but I also see how teachers react differently to them. TBH, I’ve never had a teacher imply my daughters are lazy or not trying when they make a mistake.


It’s not a boy mom thing—schools should be set up for most (at least least 80%) of students can really learn.

Oh, same same same. On all of it. They are presumed to be lazy, through no fault of their parents. We pay so much attention that honestly, for me anyway, my son just felt so nagged. We did social skills, executive function, lots of activities. We were the best, attentive parents we could be. And our son is a great young man. I remember walking down the halls with him and his younger sister in their NW DC (N-8--figure it out if you will) DC private and the love shown to my DD by teachers in the hallway while not even acknowledging my son was heartbreaking. I knew how he felt going to that place every day. My husband refused to allow me to pull him out. I noticed in college that he and many of his friends just sort of settled into the state of ennui. It's been sad to watch and I just keep my fingers crossed he will graduate next year, on time, and find a job that suits his high intelligence and capability, while making him happy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If education is indeed feminized, it would help to get more male teachers. But the pay is crap, so they won’t do it. (How many of you are encouraging your boys to become teachers? How many of you want your daughters to marry a teacher?) And around and around and around the world turns.

My DH is a math and science teacher. He says the brightest girls in the class are impressive. And the boys are generally appalling both in their behavior and their lack of preparation.

Sounds pretty biased, generalizing like that. Can't you see that when you run a classroom with that mindset that you'll never recognize the strengths of those boys? That's what's happening. Sounds like your DH could stand to go back to school and stop hurting these developing boys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If education is indeed feminized, it would help to get more male teachers. But the pay is crap, so they won’t do it. (How many of you are encouraging your boys to become teachers? How many of you want your daughters to marry a teacher?) And around and around and around the world turns.

My DH is a math and science teacher. He says the brightest girls in the class are impressive. And the boys are generally appalling both in their behavior and their lack of preparation.

Sounds pretty biased, generalizing like that. Can't you see that when you run a classroom with that mindset that you'll never recognize the strengths of those boys? That's what's happening. Sounds like your DH could stand to go back to school and stop hurting these developing boys.

And yet, every single student in the middle school that has the teachers pulling their hair out, accommodation after accommodation after accommodation, is a boy. He is so fed up he might move to an all girls school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If education is indeed feminized, it would help to get more male teachers. But the pay is crap, so they won’t do it. (How many of you are encouraging your boys to become teachers? How many of you want your daughters to marry a teacher?) And around and around and around the world turns.

My DH is a math and science teacher. He says the brightest girls in the class are impressive. And the boys are generally appalling both in their behavior and their lack of preparation.

I sent my sons to an all male HS. There are lots of very impressive male teachers (graduate degrees- great schools and do dedicated). They have plenty of female teachers too. The boys are all very successful -pre and post graduation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If education is indeed feminized, it would help to get more male teachers. But the pay is crap, so they won’t do it. (How many of you are encouraging your boys to become teachers? How many of you want your daughters to marry a teacher?) And around and around and around the world turns.

My DH is a math and science teacher. He says the brightest girls in the class are impressive. And the boys are generally appalling both in their behavior and their lack of preparation.

Sounds pretty biased, generalizing like that. Can't you see that when you run a classroom with that mindset that you'll never recognize the strengths of those boys? That's what's happening. Sounds like your DH could stand to go back to school and stop hurting these developing boys.

It’s also a generalization to keep boys in the school system when they should be in trade school. That’s a parenting issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If education is indeed feminized, it would help to get more male teachers. But the pay is crap, so they won’t do it. (How many of you are encouraging your boys to become teachers? How many of you want your daughters to marry a teacher?) And around and around and around the world turns.

My DH is a math and science teacher. He says the brightest girls in the class are impressive. And the boys are generally appalling both in their behavior and their lack of preparation.

I sent my sons to an all male HS. There are lots of very impressive male teachers (graduate degrees- great schools and do dedicated). They have plenty of female teachers too. The boys are all very successful -pre and post graduation.

Why didn’t you keep him coed public?……..Annnnnd that’s your answer. Thank you for playing.