St. Ann’s (NYC) - Private School Horror Show

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This seems like a tragic case of misplaced grief. The school is damned if they do/don’t. If they kept him on and he starts failing all classes he’s obviously going to struggle mentally as well. I think the parents feel massive guilt and need to find someone to blame. It’s a tragic situation but I dont think a school can be expected to convert itself to one that caters to special needs because of a single student. There are multiple privates that support kids with learning disabilities that he could have thrived at.

Agree completely. I have a hard time with parents who feel like they're entitled to this at our private.

I have a hard time with parents who feel like they’re entitled to an educational environment that excludes and discriminates against neurodivergent children. Y’all talk about DEI but you don’t walk the walk.

Look, this is an exclusive school. The parents are making a choice of sending their kids to an exclusive school. So, who do they think the school is going to exclude and what makes them sure it's not going to be their child? I am always curious as to how people answer these questions for themselves.

I mean, I think their point would be that once you admit a student, then the assumption would be that the student is included/not excluded, unless the student does something egregious (physically harming, bullying, academic dishonesty). It’s hard to get behind excluding a child who is just being himself and causing no harm. Also, yes the school is “exclusive” like all private schools are, but it’s really artsy and known more for its creativity and whatnot over a focus on academic rigor. They want “cool” people like artists and children of actors, etc. It’s a different town from DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is one reason why we went the Beauvoir route rather than Sidwell. A lot of LDs can be caught by third grade. Would rather my kid go to a better fit in fourth grade than be counseled out and have to leave their friends.

I have a friend who taught at another top private NYC middle school. She said the process of figuring out who should be counseled out before high school is hard. On the one hand, the kid doesn't want to leave his friends. But on the other hand, you don't want to set a kid up for failure by sending him to a rigorous high school when he could go to an easier high school and feel better about himself academically.

I mean, the question is, how does anyone know he would “fail” and does everyone need to succeed in all subjects at all times? There are plenty of students with his exact diagnoses who are above grade level or 2e. There are plenty of kids at plenty of private schools who aren’t gifted or especially bright. Why does any of this matter?

Because some private schools make clear they cater to the exceptionally bright and gifted. If you aren’t ok with that philosophy don’t send your kid there. Don’t send your kid to such a school and the demand that the school change for your kid. Send your kid to the appropriate school for his level.

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]This is such a horrible and sad situation - no black and white answers here.

One thing the school could and should have done differently - according to the parents, the child was counseled out in February of 8th grade. At that point, it’s very tough to find another spot. Additionally, it sounds like the child was twice exceptional - very bright with learning differences. It can be very hard to find the right fit for a student with that profile, much less in February.

Counseling a student out can absolutely be the right thing to do but the true test of whether a school is genuinely committed and compassionate to its students is *how* it counsels the student out. Schools can and do help families move on - they make calls, etc. and it leaves everyone feeling positive about the process. Don’t know whether that happened here.
[/quote]

If he was counseled out midyear, something major happened. That is not normal. That would require a precipitating event. Normal is not renewing a contract. [/quote]m

I thought that’s what happened-they were told in February that he couldn’t come back for 9th grade next year or did I misread? [/quote]

Yes but the point is, they should have told them sooner. February of eight grade is tool late because you have missed application deadlines

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]This is such a horrible and sad situation - no black and white answers here.

One thing the school could and should have done differently - according to the parents, the child was counseled out in February of 8th grade. At that point, it’s very tough to find another spot. Additionally, it sounds like the child was twice exceptional - very bright with learning differences. It can be very hard to find the right fit for a student with that profile, much less in February.

Counseling a student out can absolutely be the right thing to do but the true test of whether a school is genuinely committed and compassionate to its students is *how* it counsels the student out. Schools can and do help families move on - they make calls, etc. and it leaves everyone feeling positive about the process. Don’t know whether that happened here.
[/quote]

If he was counseled out midyear, something major happened. That is not normal. That would require a precipitating event. Normal is not renewing a contract. [/quote]m

I thought that’s what happened-they were told in February that he couldn’t come back for 9th grade next year or did I misread? [/quote]

Yes but the point is, they should have told them sooner. February of eight grade is tool late because you have missed application deadlines[/quote]

Oh I agree! I just thought you meant he actually had to leave the school in Feb.

[Anonymous]

If they told him in February that he couldn’t come back the following year for high school, that is genuinely appalling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If they told him in February that he couldn’t come back the following year for high school, that is genuinely appalling.

I bet that’s when re-enrollment contracts went out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they told him in February that he couldn’t come back the following year for high school, that is genuinely appalling.

I bet that’s when re-enrollment contracts went out.

But completely agree it’s appalling!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they told him in February that he couldn’t come back the following year for high school, that is genuinely appalling.

I bet that’s when re-enrollment contracts went out.

But completely agree it’s appalling!

I'm sure it has to do with reenrollment contracts. But the parents also said they have been trying to counsel him out since 4th grade. So it's not like it came out of left field.

Totally agree that the school needed to have a come to Jesus talk with the family at the end of 7th, but we don't know if that happened or not. But we do know from the parents' own admission that this seems to have been an ongoing conversation for many years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This seems like a tragic case of misplaced grief. The school is damned if they do/don’t. If they kept him on and he starts failing all classes he’s obviously going to struggle mentally as well. I think the parents feel massive guilt and need to find someone to blame. It’s a tragic situation but I dont think a school can be expected to convert itself to one that caters to special needs because of a single student. There are multiple privates that support kids with learning disabilities that he could have thrived at.

Agree completely. I have a hard time with parents who feel like they're entitled to this at our private.

I have a hard time with parents who feel like they’re entitled to an educational environment that excludes and discriminates against neurodivergent children. Y’all talk about DEI but you don’t walk the walk.

Look, this is an exclusive school. The parents are making a choice of sending their kids to an exclusive school. So, who do they think the school is going to exclude and what makes them sure it's not going to be their child? I am always curious as to how people answer these questions for themselves.

Lots going on here, when neurodivergent or DEI also becomes code speak for not being able to have a real conversation about someone’s scholastic aptitude and academic fit in a school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This seems like a tragic case of misplaced grief. The school is damned if they do/don’t. If they kept him on and he starts failing all classes he’s obviously going to struggle mentally as well. I think the parents feel massive guilt and need to find someone to blame. It’s a tragic situation but I dont think a school can be expected to convert itself to one that caters to special needs because of a single student. There are multiple privates that support kids with learning disabilities that he could have thrived at.

Agree completely. I have a hard time with parents who feel like they're entitled to this at our private.

I have a hard time with parents who feel like they’re entitled to an educational environment that excludes and discriminates against neurodivergent children. Y’all talk about DEI but you don’t walk the walk.

Look, this is an exclusive school. The parents are making a choice of sending their kids to an exclusive school. So, who do they think the school is going to exclude and what makes them sure it's not going to be their child? I am always curious as to how people answer these questions for themselves.

Lots going on here, when neurodivergent or DEI also becomes code speak for not being able to have a real conversation about someone’s scholastic aptitude and academic fit in a school.

^ This is agreeing with the PP above!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is one reason why we went the Beauvoir route rather than Sidwell. A lot of LDs can be caught by third grade. Would rather my kid go to a better fit in fourth grade than be counseled out and have to leave their friends.

I have a friend who taught at another top private NYC middle school. She said the process of figuring out who should be counseled out before high school is hard. On the one hand, the kid doesn't want to leave his friends. But on the other hand, you don't want to set a kid up for failure by sending him to a rigorous high school when he could go to an easier high school and feel better about himself academically.

I mean, the question is, how does anyone know he would “fail” and does everyone need to succeed in all subjects at all times? There are plenty of students with his exact diagnoses who are above grade level or 2e. There are plenty of kids at plenty of private schools who aren’t gifted or especially bright. Why does any of this matter?

Because some private schools make clear they cater to the exceptionally bright and gifted. If you aren’t ok with that philosophy don’t send your kid there. Don’t send your kid to such a school and the demand that the school change for your kid. Send your kid to the appropriate school for his level.

No they don’t. They cater to the exceptionally wealthy and connected. Sure there are some bright kids at all schools, but no, this school didn’t make clear at any point that it caters to exceptionally gifted students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do agree with the vast majority of posters that this child should have been enrolled much earlier in a school that could have accommodated his needs.

However, the schtick that so many of these elite privates promote -- we meet each child where they're at! We provide individualized instruction! We prize diversity (what about neurodiversity?)! Each child has their own gifts that we nurture! -- is such b.s. Ultimately they cannot and will not accommodate kids who do not fit into the mold of a high-achieving, neurotypical kid who will get into the elite college these schools will get to brag about.

The whole episode is awful and sad.

+1 this.

+1

It’s hard to blame the parents for believing the words the school itself uses.

Yep. These elite private schools cannot have it both ways. Either you actually "meet each kid where they are at," as the marketing and admissions materials constantly trumpet, or you don't.

It sounds like the school tried to counsel this child out in elementary but the parents insisted on staying there. They sent the child for a evaluation and the evaluator put it back on the school to provide more support, that the school said they could not provide.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do agree with the vast majority of posters that this child should have been enrolled much earlier in a school that could have accommodated his needs.

However, the schtick that so many of these elite privates promote -- we meet each child where they're at! We provide individualized instruction! We prize diversity (what about neurodiversity?)! Each child has their own gifts that we nurture! -- is such b.s. Ultimately they cannot and will not accommodate kids who do not fit into the mold of a high-achieving, neurotypical kid who will get into the elite college these schools will get to brag about.

The whole episode is awful and sad.

+1 this.

+1

It’s hard to blame the parents for believing the words the school itself uses.

Yep. These elite private schools cannot have it both ways. Either you actually "meet each kid where they are at," as the marketing and admissions materials constantly trumpet, or you don't.

It sounds like the school tried to counsel this child out in elementary but the parents insisted on staying there. They sent the child for a evaluation and the evaluator put it back on the school to provide more support, that the school said they could not provide.

And then it turned out they had about half the support staff of peer schools, and they could provide! So they added support staff but it was too late

[Anonymous]

One takeaway I had from the article: it seems like it’s really the grandfather who has the wealth and was probably their entre into the school—and is likely to be footing the bill for the lawsuit.

Also I just love how every single time the Times or New Yorker mentions St Ann’s, they always mention Lena Dunham as an alum. As if she is relevant to anyone in except a certain readership in LA or NYC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When a school tells you your kid is not a fit, you should leave. Full stop. Even if you disagree with their assessment. Put your kid somewhere where they are wanted.

+1 million. I would be out of there in a heartbeat.

God, yes. Why would you pay through the nose and beg to keep your kid in a place where they aren’t thriving? They had money and choices. They made a tragic mistake.

I don't blame the parents. It is such a sad situation. I don't think the school is at fault, but I can also understand how the parents did what they thought was the best for their son. He was probably happy there and probably didn't want to leave all his friends. Hindsight is always 20/20.

I can understand the child wanting to stay despite problems and it being a horrible event for him to have to leave the school. It's an awful situation.