Removing and Renaming Confederate Statues, Schools, Streets, etc: Why?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:There’s a reason I chose VA as opposed to DC or MD when moving to this area from Arkansas. I felt as if I would feel least home sick and would be able to retain a bit of my culture from my hometown to my second home here. We need to look ahead, not backwards.

+1000

lol "culture"

You wouldn’t understand, bethesda boy.

I definitely don’t appreciate or understand your kind of “culture” *wink wink.*

The culture I refer to isnt any sort of neo confederate nonsense, more so the southern hospitality and family like aspect that is unique to the south.

What do traitors fighting for slavery have do with southern hospitality? I don’t get the connection? Can’t you be nice without the white supremacy?

This. What does a Robert E Lee statue have to do with southern hospitality?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Sorry, OP, but this is really bad trolling. Someone from Fauquier County would not describe themselves as from “southern country Virginia.”

Not sure what to tell you, other than to study the map harder next time.

OP here. I was talking about Fauquier county being culturally southern, as it was growing up and still is today. I just wanted to emphasize that I come from a more conservative part of “Northern Virginia” (if you even consider it a part of) and highlight any bias I may have. Trust me, friends driving through Warrenton tell me they couldn’t tell the difference from a small city in North Carolina or Tennessee.

NP here, thinking about moving to Fauquier in the near future, is it really that southern?

Used to live there years ago, my neighbors had confederate flags porched on their flag poles if that tells you anything.

People fly Confederate flags in NY, PA, OH, too. It's about racism, not southern pride.

+1 Also intimidation. It works, too. They scare the crap out of me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The presumably liberal "good" posters are not covering themselves in glory on this thread. Advocating for splitting up the country, regulating speech, etc.

Smh

Hate speech is not protected.
Read a book than hasn't been banned yet - it was the South that wanted to split the country by leaving the union.

Keeping shaking that head though - may engage and kickstart what is inside it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, OP, but this is really bad trolling. Someone from Fauquier County would not describe themselves as from “southern country Virginia.”

Not sure what to tell you, other than to study the map harder next time.

OP here. I was talking about Fauquier county being culturally southern, as it was growing up and still is today. I just wanted to emphasize that I come from a more conservative part of “Northern Virginia” (if you even consider it a part of) and highlight any bias I may have. Trust me, friends driving through Warrenton tell me they couldn’t tell the difference from a small city in North Carolina or Tennessee.

NP here, thinking about moving to Fauquier in the near future, is it really that southern?

Used to live there years ago, my neighbors had confederate flags porched on their flag poles if that tells you anything.

People fly Confederate flags in NY, PA, OH, too. It's about racism, not southern pride.

+1 Also intimidation. It works, too. They scare the crap out of me.

+2 What weakness is our political "leaders" that symbols of hate allowed to be used like this.

[Anonymous]

What’s your reason for wanting to keep statues of treasonous, traitor, loser, pro-slavery, racist people again, OP?

What do you have against taking them down? Does not seeing the statues or road names or school names anymore affect you negatively in some way?

Really, what is it to you if the names are changed or statues removed?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Because they lost and we won. America has learned a lesson in the last few years about letting racist, fascist losers regroup and we're done doing it.

If the Germans could come to terms with having been actual Nazis, we should be able to come to terms with fact country is blighted by history of slave-owning racists. Tear that stuff down - most of it went up in era 1910-1970 anyway for reasons that are obvious.

The obvious reason for the statutes put in in the early part of the 1900s was not in reaction to desegregation or the civil rights movement. You're conflating two different motivations.

DP: Although you might want to label it something other than the “Civil Rights Movement “, which is usually associated with a time period starting in the 1950’s, there were focused efforts aimed at increasing civil rights for Blacks following the Reconstruction era. One pivotal event was Woodrow Wilson’s election in 1913. Wilson mandated racial segregation throughout the federal government, eroding many of the economic and social gains that many Blacks made following the Reconstruction era. This was also one period when groups like the United Daughters of the Confederacy arranged to put up many statues. A similar peak in these types of activities occurred around the mid-1950’s following the Brown vs Board of Ed decision. So, yes, the increase in statues venerating the Confederacy was a direct response to periods of increased civil rights and other types of gains for Black Americans.

https://newsroom.haas.berkeley.edu/research/how-woodrow-wilsons-racist-segregation-order-eroded-the-black-civil-service/

This is spot on. The United Daughters of the Confederacy also greatly influenced the inclusion of revisionist history/false narratives in textbooks distributed throughout the South for years. To “both sides” this issue is a massive false equivalency. Reading some of these posts shows that their strategy to preserve this warped legacy worked for many. If anyone wants to further educate themselves, this is a good article.

https://birminghamwatch.org/daughters-confederacy-put-statues-indoctrinated-generations-historians-say/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is shameful we ever had statues to those treasonous traitors. The reckoning is long overdue.

They weren't treasonous traitors. Stick to facts.

I don't mind taking down the statues but there's a lot of recent revisionist history from both sides.

Robert Lee was nothing more than an illegal racist warlord who betrayed his country to wage a campaign of racial terror and destruction on half our population. His intentions were pure evil and countless patriots died to defeat this bloody menace. Also, the fact that his racist fan base called him "general" doesn't actually make him one. He led an illegal insurrection. That's like the Oath Keepers giving themselves fake military titles or the KFC guy calling himself "colonel." And you want to put up a statue for THAT GUY?!

[Anonymous]

For the same reason Germany and Italy don’t have Hitler Boulevard or Mussolini Drive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The presumably liberal "good" posters are not covering themselves in glory on this thread. Advocating for splitting up the country, regulating speech, etc.

Smh

Hate speech is not protected.
Read a book than hasn't been banned yet - it was the South that wanted to split the country by leaving the union.

Keeping shaking that head though - may engage and kickstart what is inside it.

So you are just skipping over all the embarrassing -for-liberals posts. I get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There’s a reason I chose VA as opposed to DC or MD when moving to this area from Arkansas. I felt as if I would feel least home sick and would be able to retain a bit of my culture from my hometown to my second home here. We need to look ahead, not backwards.

+1000

So your nostalgia outweighs the insult and indignities felt by so many, particularly black people, when we see these street names and statues? My DH’s mother knows a story of a great+ grandmother who had to watch her mother get sold on an auction block. My great+ grandfather escaped slavery, with his brother who went back to rescue someone else, never to be seen again. I was incredibly close with my great grandmother who was raised by former slaves. It was not that long ago and it still hurts and is still raw. Further educate yourselves. Understand the Middle Passage. Read the Slave Narratives. Encourage knowledge though correct (and not always comfortable) history education, museums, articles, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For the same reason Germany and Italy don’t have Hitler Boulevard or Mussolini Drive.

+1000
This is everything. End of thread right there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is shameful we ever had statues to those treasonous traitors. The reckoning is long overdue.

They weren't treasonous traitors. Stick to facts.

I don't mind taking down the statues but there's a lot of recent revisionist history from both sides.

Robert Lee was nothing more than an illegal racist warlord who betrayed his country to wage a campaign of racial terror and destruction on half our population. His intentions were pure evil and countless patriots died to defeat this bloody menace. Also, the fact that his racist fan base called him "general" doesn't actually make him one. He led an illegal insurrection. That's like the Oath Keepers giving themselves fake military titles or the KFC guy calling himself "colonel." And you want to put up a statue for THAT GUY?!

The fact that long, nuanced biographies have been written about Lee, to understand and appraise rather than venerate him, suggests that you might want to shelve your commentary for a while until you can sound like something smarter than an angry teenager.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let's erect statues of southern bells offering guests iced tea and homemade biscuits then, not war traitors.

Southern belles whose entire lifestyle was financed by free labor (as was the economy of large parts of the nation, which we also ignore)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the same reason Germany and Italy don’t have Hitler Boulevard or Mussolini Drive.

+1000
This is everything. End of thread right there.

I want to push back a bit and say there's actually more. The premise of the OP is that these names were once OK but no longer are. These names were never OK. This is not like the town of East Hamburg, NY, deciding to rename itself "Orchard Park" during WWI. Or french fries becoming "Freedom Fries" during the first Gulf War. There was never a time when Robert E. Lee was not a polarizing figure and a symbol of hate and racism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Virginia has a long history of being a southern state and has a deep history with southern culture and ties to the confederacy. Northern Virginia in particular, with the Arlington Cemetery’s connection with Robert E Lee, whom led the Army of Northern Virginia, and the wide spread usage of confederates like Stonewall Jackson High School in PWCS and Robert E Lee High School in FCPS seems to have continually played a part in modern Virginia history throughout the state. Not to mention highways and streets dedicated to Confederates and segregationists like Robert E Lee and Harry Byrd still remain.

This unique attatchment to our history seems to be most or entirely prevalent in Virginia as opposed to DC or Maryland, and has never been a problem for the past century to half a century, through progressive movements and such. However, ever since the slain of George Floyd and the riots in 2020, there seems to have been a new attempt to pit the blame on the “monuments” that apparently glorize these views, and to radically erase them from history and forget about them once and for all. I seem to check google maps and am seemingly forced to learn new road names Like Langston Blvd in Arlington on a weekly basis. From my perspective, being a native of Fauquier county in southern country Virginia and spending lots of time in rural Loudoun and Prince William county, it’s a great change to what I’m used to.

Why the call for action now? Are we really suppose the blame people whom lived in an era where slavery and segregation was an unarguable stance that was unanimous among all politicians? What good does it really do, as it seemingly hasn’t seen a decrease in any sort of statistic that they intended to target. Do you support such action against these historical landmarks? Would love to know what the general consensus is, especially from other Virginians.

You are clearly stupid.

No other country does this. It was a huge mistake. This is part of the reason we are in the mess we are in.

Why in the world would we keep things from the side that lost?