Moderate conservative immigrant family moving from Fairfax VA to Mountain View CA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
PP again. I'm not super familiar with Monterey. My impression is that it is pretty bifurcated. Lots of very, very poor farmworkers in Salinas and the Carmel/Pebble Beach crowd at the other end of the spectrum. The commute will be very, very long. That 101/1 corridor through Gilroy is total misery to drive. As with anywhere, the best schools are going to be in the wealthier areas. Housing might be moderately more affordable overall? The weather would not appeal to me at all. Lots of gray days. Politically, it's one of the more conservative of our coastal areas, but that's still going to be primarily in the libertarian sense (at least in the wealthy parts). The farmworker crowd tends to be very strong Catholic, strong family ties with traditional values overall, but a lot of the dysfunction of poverty. You could probably find a Maga crowd in Monterey, but you will also have a Gay Pride parade too.

As for kids who don't want to do their pronouns, they will be welcome in in some crowds and ostracized in others, just as happens in any group in any school. It won't be a result of any official school policy, but as I've been saying, the other kids and their interests are going to be where these issues come up. Kids start getting into their cliques in late elementary school. Some join the environmental clubs, others go to church groups, others are in band. Whatever.

Yes I've traveled that 101/1 corridor, that commute would be a pain but still within my limits if I wanted to get a life that is better suited for my income and my family. I've heard about Salinas being totally unsafe (a friend of mine described it as a "warzone") so I would have to consider the coastal areas even if Salinas has more traditional values. I don't care about the Maga crowds or the Gay pride crowds - just to see if life is affordable with a decent home and private school that does not have too much of those progressive stuff that my family would not tolerate.

Sure kids get into cliques, but I don't want all the progressive stuff "in my kid's face".

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
OP, you've got 3 pages of people telling you not to move to CA.

1. The money will not go as far as you think.
2. The public schools are not good, even in wealthy areas. Great Schools is relative within a state, so a school that is a "9" in CA would not be a "9" here.
3. You are looking for a community that hates the things you hate but doesn't hate you: you aren't going to find it there.

This is it exactly.

For their particular situation, there are probably areas they will fit in, but social conservatism in California is heavily anti immigrant, probably more than its anti lgbt

I am not looking for an area that is anti-lgbt anti-BLM blah blah which as you say would also be anti-immigrant. I'm just looking for an area that is more "neutral" w.r.t. these issues, especially within schools. And as schools there seem to be much lower education quality than those in Fairfax, it looks like private school is the only reasonable option for me.

Anonymous wrote:
Prepare to spend 4+ hours commuting.

To get to SV from Monterey you have to get through the Santa Cruz mountains.

One day, around 10am on a weekday, go onto google maps, and map from Monterey to SV. See how long google maps is telling you it would take.

A PP had it right.. if you want less liberal, you need to move way further out, which means it's not only cheaper, but the commute will be hell.

Also, CA is looking to slow down math progression which prevents students from taking Alg 1 until they reach HS, so if that's important to you, then be aware. They like to frame it as "harder Algebra 1" in 9th, but this leads to kids doubling math (Alg and Geometry) in order to reach Calc by 12th grade. And yep, it's all in the name of equity.

https://edsource.org/2021/california-math-guidance-sparks-new-curriculum-controversy-among-parents/655272


https://calmatters.org/education/k-12-education/2021/11/california-math/

Re commute: I thought 1/101 is more like 1 - 1.5 hours? 4 hours you mean roundtrip? Yes that's brutal but still within my limits if I only have to do it twice per week.

Wow that information about math is so dissappointing.. Looks like this would be a huge difference from FCPS AAP! I've heard about the CA exodus and this explains a lot.. Does it "dumbed-down math" thing apply also to private schools?

Anonymous wrote:There’s not as much overt anti-immigrant sentiment on Peninsula but there’s one difference that might fly below your radar —homelessness is visible and a part of every day life. If you lived in DC now you might be used to it but coming out of the Virginia suburbs it may be a surprise. Your kids will see it in SF and in the Peninsula suburbs like downtown San Mateo, MV. Mostly harmless but still something that has to be discussed (both in terms of helping others/inequality and also public safety/a child’s anxiety) especially with younger kids. This isn’t a commentary on social policy but a decision for parents on how much you want to shelter your kids.

A suggestion — I’d go out and visit different town to get a feel before making a decision. You’ll get more first hand data. Walk in San Carlos or Burlingame or Pleasanton etc. Also in case you are looking at East Bay, Berkeley is not going to be your cup of tea politically.

The homelessness issue is not a problem itself for me, but I guess this goes hand-in-hand with overall community safety, which is important.

Anonymous wrote:OP- I make significantly more than you do but am far from rich and am moderate politically but seem more liberal than you are (rainbow flag wouldn’t bother me, making my kids choose pronouns would) and there is no way I would consider this move. From a financial and political comfort level standpoint, this isn’t even a close call.

Thanks for your input - increasingly getting convinced to pass the offer unless I can find an area within my commutable limits that would be fitting and tolerable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP- I make significantly more than you do but am far from rich and am moderate politically but seem more liberal than you are (rainbow flag wouldn’t bother me, making my kids choose pronouns would) and there is no way I would consider this move. From a financial and political comfort level standpoint, this isn’t even a close call.

Again, honest question - what is so bad about “what pronouns do you use?”, “I use she/her”.

I truly don’t get the objection.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The PP who talked about private schools being more like NY is spot on. It’s late in the year to position your kids for good privates. For many Catholic schools you have to join the parish first for priority admissions so it depends on when you’ll be moving and if you know what church you want to attend.

Unless OPs kids are exceptional, I doubt he has any chance at admissions at the good private schools.

He could probably get his kid into a parochial school in a place like Salinas though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
PP again. I'm not super familiar with Monterey. My impression is that it is pretty bifurcated. Lots of very, very poor farmworkers in Salinas and the Carmel/Pebble Beach crowd at the other end of the spectrum. The commute will be very, very long. That 101/1 corridor through Gilroy is total misery to drive. As with anywhere, the best schools are going to be in the wealthier areas. Housing might be moderately more affordable overall? The weather would not appeal to me at all. Lots of gray days. Politically, it's one of the more conservative of our coastal areas, but that's still going to be primarily in the libertarian sense (at least in the wealthy parts). The farmworker crowd tends to be very strong Catholic, strong family ties with traditional values overall, but a lot of the dysfunction of poverty. You could probably find a Maga crowd in Monterey, but you will also have a Gay Pride parade too.

As for kids who don't want to do their pronouns, they will be welcome in in some crowds and ostracized in others, just as happens in any group in any school. It won't be a result of any official school policy, but as I've been saying, the other kids and their interests are going to be where these issues come up. Kids start getting into their cliques in late elementary school. Some join the environmental clubs, others go to church groups, others are in band. Whatever.

Yes I've traveled that 101/1 corridor, that commute would be a pain but still within my limits if I wanted to get a life that is better suited for my income and my family. I've heard about Salinas being totally unsafe (a friend of mine described it as a "warzone") so I would have to consider the coastal areas even if Salinas has more traditional values. I don't care about the Maga crowds or the Gay pride crowds - just to see if life is affordable with a decent home and private school that does not have too much of those progressive stuff that my family would not tolerate.

Sure kids get into cliques, but I don't want all the progressive stuff "in my kid's face".

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
OP, you've got 3 pages of people telling you not to move to CA.

1. The money will not go as far as you think.
2. The public schools are not good, even in wealthy areas. Great Schools is relative within a state, so a school that is a "9" in CA would not be a "9" here.
3. You are looking for a community that hates the things you hate but doesn't hate you: you aren't going to find it there.

This is it exactly.

For their particular situation, there are probably areas they will fit in, but social conservatism in California is heavily anti immigrant, probably more than its anti lgbt

I am not looking for an area that is anti-lgbt anti-BLM blah blah which as you say would also be anti-immigrant. I'm just looking for an area that is more "neutral" w.r.t. these issues, especially within schools. And as schools there seem to be much lower education quality than those in Fairfax, it looks like private school is the only reasonable option for me.

Anonymous wrote:
Prepare to spend 4+ hours commuting.

To get to SV from Monterey you have to get through the Santa Cruz mountains.

One day, around 10am on a weekday, go onto google maps, and map from Monterey to SV. See how long google maps is telling you it would take.

A PP had it right.. if you want less liberal, you need to move way further out, which means it's not only cheaper, but the commute will be hell.

Also, CA is looking to slow down math progression which prevents students from taking Alg 1 until they reach HS, so if that's important to you, then be aware. They like to frame it as "harder Algebra 1" in 9th, but this leads to kids doubling math (Alg and Geometry) in order to reach Calc by 12th grade. And yep, it's all in the name of equity.

https://edsource.org/2021/california-math-guidance-sparks-new-curriculum-controversy-among-parents/655272


https://calmatters.org/education/k-12-education/2021/11/california-math/

Re commute: I thought 1/101 is more like 1 - 1.5 hours? 4 hours you mean roundtrip? Yes that's brutal but still within my limits if I only have to do it twice per week.

Wow that information about math is so dissappointing.. Looks like this would be a huge difference from FCPS AAP! I've heard about the CA exodus and this explains a lot.. Does it "dumbed-down math" thing apply also to private schools?

Anonymous wrote:There’s not as much overt anti-immigrant sentiment on Peninsula but there’s one difference that might fly below your radar —homelessness is visible and a part of every day life. If you lived in DC now you might be used to it but coming out of the Virginia suburbs it may be a surprise. Your kids will see it in SF and in the Peninsula suburbs like downtown San Mateo, MV. Mostly harmless but still something that has to be discussed (both in terms of helping others/inequality and also public safety/a child’s anxiety) especially with younger kids. This isn’t a commentary on social policy but a decision for parents on how much you want to shelter your kids.

A suggestion — I’d go out and visit different town to get a feel before making a decision. You’ll get more first hand data. Walk in San Carlos or Burlingame or Pleasanton etc. Also in case you are looking at East Bay, Berkeley is not going to be your cup of tea politically.

The homelessness issue is not a problem itself for me, but I guess this goes hand-in-hand with overall community safety, which is important.

Anonymous wrote:OP- I make significantly more than you do but am far from rich and am moderate politically but seem more liberal than you are (rainbow flag wouldn’t bother me, making my kids choose pronouns would) and there is no way I would consider this move. From a financial and political comfort level standpoint, this isn’t even a close call.

Thanks for your input - increasingly getting convinced to pass the offer unless I can find an area within my commutable limits that would be fitting and tolerable.

Just to answer the question about dumbed down math in private schools: the answer is no. Bay Area private schools are generally more rigorous in STEM than DC schools, both public and private. Remember that the population that sends their kids to private schools in the Bay Area are heavily employed in STEM and they both understand what a good STEM education is and expect it from the private schools they pay for. This is different than the DC area where there are a lot of lawyers and lobbyists, who understand a good humanities education but not as much a good STEM education.

[Anonymous]

Re Monterey: it is very bifurcated, as the other poster observed. Terrible public schools unless you are in Carmel, but Carmel makes Mountain View look cheap.

There are a few excellent private schools in the Monterey area, but they are very competitive for admissions and also, you will absolutely be laughed out of the room if you demanded the removal of a rainbow flag.

There are also some smaller conservative Christian schools with shoddy education standards, but you could get into those and you won’t see a rainbow flag anywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Re commute: I thought 1/101 is more like 1 - 1.5 hours? 4 hours you mean roundtrip? Yes that's brutal but still within my limits if I only have to do it twice per week.

Monterey to SV will be 2 hours, one way. It takes an hour just from South SJ to MV.

I live in southern Moco, about 8 miles from the Legion Bridge.

I get recruiters call me from out of the area asking if I would be interested in a job. When I ask them where it is, and they say that it's really close, like 15 miles from me, and then I find out it's in Tyson's, I decline saying the commute would be too much (one hour+). They say, "How can that be.. it's only 15 miles from you." And I say, "That's exactly why I'm declining".

I feel like you are like those recruiters. I don't think you appreciate how hellish Bay Area traffic is. On a good day on a weekend Monterey to MV is over an hour.

Maybe try Morgan Hill. I have a coworker who does the MH to MV commute. Takes over an hour, but at last it's not 2 hours. You could also try to carpool.

However, the schools down that way aren't that great. Much like here, you get what you pay for. The cheaper it is, the worse the schools.

[Anonymous]

OP here. So this is what I have based on all your information (thank you all again for your inputs).
1. Public schools throughout CA are terrible compared those in Fairfax (dumbed-down "equitable" math, low scores nationwide etc.) So getting my kids into a private school with a decent curriculum is a hard requirement (and hopefully pick one with as less as progressive stuff as possible).
2. Assuming my kids got admitted into a good private school, I am looking at roughly $80K tuition for both. Which leaves me with $150K-$170K-ish (pre-tax) assuming my spouse works. Looks like areas in or near SV are out of the question just because my income is not sufficient. Commuting 1.5 - 2hrs twice a week would be barely tolerable for me. That area should be as safe as Fairfax. Is there such an area? (If not, I guess the discussion ends here and I just decline the offer).

[Anonymous]

And when I say "1.5 - 2hrs commute" I mean one-way

[Anonymous]

I live in MV CA and have a 6th grader. CA schools are prohibited from going online (which causes a ruckus during omicron surge because so many people wanted to do a repeat of 2020). I am still baffled how CA finally adopted some helpful legislation but here we are!
I have heard from a teacher friend that starting about 7th grade teachers have to dedicate a certain percentage of their time promoting LGBTQ values. But I think if your kids aren’t into pride club and don’t fall to the fad of identifying as someone else other than their gender it should be fine.
There are also parochial schools that are relatively secular and relatively inexpensive.
The COL is horrible but I assure you you won’t starve on 200k+. You will get a modest 2 bedroom and will be fine.
There is a FB group called Mountain View moms you may want to join.
As for the school districts, Los Altos is great, Palo Alto used to be great but is now falling victim to affordable housing on one end and pressure cooker/cram school culture on the other. Mountain View is ok, truly diverse, but has 30% farms across the board.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. So this is what I have based on all your information (thank you all again for your inputs).
1. Public schools throughout CA are terrible compared those in Fairfax (dumbed-down "equitable" math, low scores nationwide etc.) So getting my kids into a private school with a decent curriculum is a hard requirement (and hopefully pick one with as less as progressive stuff as possible).
2. Assuming my kids got admitted into a good private school, I am looking at roughly $80K tuition for both. Which leaves me with $150K-$170K-ish (pre-tax) assuming my spouse works. Looks like areas in or near SV are out of the question just because my income is not sufficient. Commuting 1.5 - 2hrs twice a week would be barely tolerable for me. That area should be as safe as Fairfax. Is there such an area? (If not, I guess the discussion ends here and I just decline the offer).

Have then go to St Francis in MV (great records from my secular mom friends) and live in good parts of MV and you will have a nice life. Don’t decline! CA is horribly run but it’s a great place to spend a few years because even the most horrible management can’t extinguish the nature and weather! And smartest people around you!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. So this is what I have based on all your information (thank you all again for your inputs).
1. Public schools throughout CA are terrible compared those in Fairfax (dumbed-down "equitable" math, low scores nationwide etc.) So getting my kids into a private school with a decent curriculum is a hard requirement (and hopefully pick one with as less as progressive stuff as possible).
2. Assuming my kids got admitted into a good private school, I am looking at roughly $80K tuition for both. Which leaves me with $150K-$170K-ish (pre-tax) assuming my spouse works. Looks like areas in or near SV are out of the question just because my income is not sufficient. Commuting 1.5 - 2hrs twice a week would be barely tolerable for me. That area should be as safe as Fairfax. Is there such an area? (If not, I guess the discussion ends here and I just decline the offer).

Try far out East Bay - Walnut Creek, Livermore (someone I know who lives there called it "Live No More" because it's so far and boring suburbia), Pleasanton, San Ramon. I don't know if you can afford the rent there but the schools are "decent".

IMO far out East Bay seems more moderate than places like Oakland or SJ.

[Anonymous]

I am the poster from MV and I have lived in DC before. I find people in CA to be generally friendlier fwiw.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am the poster from MV and I have lived in DC before. I find people in CA to be generally friendlier fwiw.

Oh and no, you don’t want to commute from east bay! Stay local

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I live in MV CA and have a 6th grader. CA schools are prohibited from going online (which causes a ruckus during omicron surge because so many people wanted to do a repeat of 2020). I am still baffled how CA finally adopted some helpful legislation but here we are!
I have heard from a teacher friend that starting about 7th grade teachers have to dedicate a certain percentage of their time promoting LGBTQ values. But I think if your kids aren’t into pride club and don’t fall to the fad of identifying as someone else other than their gender it should be fine.
There are also parochial schools that are relatively secular and relatively inexpensive.
The COL is horrible but I assure you you won’t starve on 200k+. You will get a modest 2 bedroom and will be fine.
There is a FB group called Mountain View moms you may want to join.
As for the school districts, Los Altos is great, Palo Alto used to be great but is now falling victim to affordable housing on one end and pressure cooker/cram school culture on the other. Mountain View is ok, truly diverse, but has 30% farms across the board.

this?

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/california-budget-includes-3-million-train-teachers-lgbtq-issues-rcna1423

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am the poster from MV and I have lived in DC before. I find people in CA to be generally friendlier fwiw.

Oh and no, you don’t want to commute from east bay! Stay local

OP can't afford local and is willing to commute 1.5 hours one way, 2x/week.