Comfort level around unvaxxed family

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As other PPs have said, you are overthinking this. If you were that worried about getting/spreading Covid, you wouldn’t be flying on a plane, going through airports, etc. in a huge surge. If you are willing to take that risk, then sleepovers, etc. wouldn’t be any worse. However, you could potentially be putting your unvaccinated family members at risk.

Exactly.

At this point, people are more interested in punishing people who didn't get vaccinated. Which is fine, I get it. I'm livid that my sister didn't get vaccinated.

But it's also stupid to pretend it's about safety when you're hopping on a plane during Omicron.

[Anonymous]

I agree with the previous posters who say that the risk to your family is the same whether you visit these relatives or not. Yes you can disagree with their choices regarding the vaccine, but if you would otherwise enjoy a visit with them then do it. The only reason to not visit them would be to punish them for not getting vaccinated or to shame them or if you think that this would otherwise convince them to get vaccinated.

[Anonymous]

I would simply do at home testing for unvaxxed family members and my unvaxxed four year old, each day that they plan to socialize together indoors and unmasked. It takes fifteen minutes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I agree with the previous posters who say that the risk to your family is the same whether you visit these relatives or not. Yes you can disagree with their choices regarding the vaccine, but if you would otherwise enjoy a visit with them then do it. The only reason to not visit them would be to punish them for not getting vaccinated or to shame them or if you think that this would otherwise convince them to get vaccinated.

Also, if they already had Covid and felt it was just like a cold, then didn't they make the right decision for themselves? They took the risk they'd get Covid, they got Covid, but it wasn't severe enough to tax the healthcare system. Their outcome is the same as OP's, who is vaxxed and boosted and still caught Covid, but didn't tax the healthcare system.

I just came back from visiting my FIL, who is not vaccinated. I don't even like him that much, but I'm still not willing to skip visits because they're old and who knows how much time we have left with them. Do I think he should get vaccinated? Absolutely. I also think it's a bad message to send to my kids that if they disagree with my choices, they can just cut me off.

FWIW, my FIL lives life very much like OP's dad and has somehow managed to avoid Covid despite multiple close contact exposures with overnight guests. I don't know how I can say with a straight face that he's made the wrong decision for his family when it's clearly been working out for him for almost two years now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with the previous posters who say that the risk to your family is the same whether you visit these relatives or not. Yes you can disagree with their choices regarding the vaccine, but if you would otherwise enjoy a visit with them then do it. The only reason to not visit them would be to punish them for not getting vaccinated or to shame them or if you think that this would otherwise convince them to get vaccinated.

Also, if they already had Covid and felt it was just like a cold, then didn't they make the right decision for themselves? They took the risk they'd get Covid, they got Covid, but it wasn't severe enough to tax the healthcare system. Their outcome is the same as OP's, who is vaxxed and boosted and still caught Covid, but didn't tax the healthcare system.

I just came back from visiting my FIL, who is not vaccinated. I don't even like him that much, but I'm still not willing to skip visits because they're old and who knows how much time we have left with them. Do I think he should get vaccinated? Absolutely. I also think it's a bad message to send to my kids that if they disagree with my choices, they can just cut me off.

FWIW, my FIL lives life very much like OP's dad and has somehow managed to avoid Covid despite multiple close contact exposures with overnight guests. I don't know how I can say with a straight face that he's made the wrong decision for his family when it's clearly been working out for him for almost two years now.

Yeah, I have to agree with this as well. It sends a terrible message to our children that we should avoid people who have different opinions than us, and you cannot realistically say that you are at any greater risk not seeing them if you are already getting on a plane to fly across country. The only reason to not see them is to punish them for a choice that you disagree with, so ask yourself if that is the messaging you want to be sending out or not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m from CA and my parents are not vaccinated. We have flown out for extended visits to see them during covid. They are very careful and don’t go in large groups etc. But they feel like the risk is mostly to them and they would rather see us than not. I get the fear of covid but older parents are also on a limited timeframe and I’m not going to wait until covid is over to see my unvaccinated family. No issues whatever so far.

Great, you've been lucky. But don't pretend it's anything more than that.

My extended family all got Covid in March 2020 and we had 5 hospitalizations and two deaths. OP is right to be concerned about both her dad/stepmom giving it to them and vice versa. We don't know who gave whom Covid--and thank goodness we don't. The guilt of even the "what if it was me?" causes the few of us who are the likely candidates to lose plenty of sleep.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m from CA and my parents are not vaccinated. We have flown out for extended visits to see them during covid. They are very careful and don’t go in large groups etc. But they feel like the risk is mostly to them and they would rather see us than not. I get the fear of covid but older parents are also on a limited timeframe and I’m not going to wait until covid is over to see my unvaccinated family. No issues whatever so far.

Great, you've been lucky. But don't pretend it's anything more than that.

My extended family all got Covid in March 2020 and we had 5 hospitalizations and two deaths. OP is right to be concerned about both her dad/stepmom giving it to them and vice versa. We don't know who gave whom Covid--and thank goodness we don't. The guilt of even the "what if it was me?" causes the few of us who are the likely candidates to lose plenty of sleep.

That is sad, and I am sorry for your family. But it's not relevant to the current situation for OP. Hospitalization and death are not likely right now (sure, still possible, but not at all likely since everyone is vaxxed or already had covid except her 4 year old). Holding on to that fear of March 2020 doesn't do us any good in 2022.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We would only see the unvaccinated relatives outdoors with masks on, and explain to the kids why they can’t do the sleepover tradition this trip. “Ask Grandpa why he won’t get vaccinated to protect himself and everyone around him.”

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is OP. Thanks for the two replies above, but does this mean you would just never see your parents again? I can’t fly out there and just see them for 15 mins outside. Plus if something did happen to them and I never saw them again since before COVID I would have major regrets.

Uh yeah you can restrict visits to outside only. Why “can’t “ you?

Family does not mean much to some of the PPs.

OP, Dr. Fauci himself has stated that once someone has omicron, they will most likely be protected by their natural immunity against BOTH omicron and delta for 3 months.

Can you wait until your family has gotten omicron and then restart your normal family visits again?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-01-21/omicron-reinfections-unlikely-over-several-months-fauci-says

On the contrary, it means so much we are willing to forego visits with unvaccinated relatives to preserve everyone's families.

We are doctors and scientists, and see first hand the unconscionable consequences that vaccination refusal puts on our healthcare systems, the valuable, courageous people that save lives every day, as well as the innocent patients who are seriously ill with other diseases or injuries and who cannot receive adequate and timely care.

We CANNOT socialize with the unvaccinated as if nothing had happened. It's a question of ethics, morals, conscience... call it what you want, but the unvaccinated are collectively responsible for killing hundreds of thousands of people.

No.

Me again. And to put this in context, we believe there will be at least one more dangerous variant like Delta and Omicron that will sweep the world. So this isn't about punishment for past irresponsible behavior. It's action to prevent more deaths in the future, by making clear that vaccine refusal is profoundly reprehensible.

No, you just made it very clear that it's about ethics and morals. Not actual science.

DP: Ethics and morals tied to science. Has nothing to do with politics.

[Anonymous]

I have never even asked is someone was vaccinated. Can’t you just have everyone take a test if you’re concerned?

People who won’t socialize with the untaxed are choosing a hill to die on for no reason. Testing exists.

Passing moral judgment on others/throwing stones rarely ages well

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m from CA and my parents are not vaccinated. We have flown out for extended visits to see them during covid. They are very careful and don’t go in large groups etc. But they feel like the risk is mostly to them and they would rather see us than not. I get the fear of covid but older parents are also on a limited timeframe and I’m not going to wait until covid is over to see my unvaccinated family. No issues whatever so far.

Great, you've been lucky. But don't pretend it's anything more than that.

My extended family all got Covid in March 2020 and we had 5 hospitalizations and two deaths. OP is right to be concerned about both her dad/stepmom giving it to them and vice versa. We don't know who gave whom Covid--and thank goodness we don't. The guilt of even the "what if it was me?" causes the few of us who are the likely candidates to lose plenty of sleep.

That is sad, and I am sorry for your family. But it's not relevant to the current situation for OP. Hospitalization and death are not likely right now (sure, still possible, but not at all likely since everyone is vaxxed or already had covid except her 4 year old). Holding on to that fear of March 2020 doesn't do us any good in 2022.

Saying death is not likely right now--when we're at 2,500+ deaths a day--is ridiculous. And that number would be much higher if it weren't for all the vaccinated folks out there. The risk to unvaccinated individuals is still very real.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m from CA and my parents are not vaccinated. We have flown out for extended visits to see them during covid. They are very careful and don’t go in large groups etc. But they feel like the risk is mostly to them and they would rather see us than not. I get the fear of covid but older parents are also on a limited timeframe and I’m not going to wait until covid is over to see my unvaccinated family. No issues whatever so far.

Great, you've been lucky. But don't pretend it's anything more than that.

My extended family all got Covid in March 2020 and we had 5 hospitalizations and two deaths. OP is right to be concerned about both her dad/stepmom giving it to them and vice versa. We don't know who gave whom Covid--and thank goodness we don't. The guilt of even the "what if it was me?" causes the few of us who are the likely candidates to lose plenty of sleep.

That is sad, and I am sorry for your family. But it's not relevant to the current situation for OP. Hospitalization and death are not likely right now (sure, still possible, but not at all likely since everyone is vaxxed or already had covid except her 4 year old). Holding on to that fear of March 2020 doesn't do us any good in 2022.

Saying death is not likely right now--when we're at 2,500+ deaths a day--is ridiculous. And that number would be much higher if it weren't for all the vaccinated folks out there. The risk to unvaccinated individuals is still very real.

The only unvaccinated person in her immediate family is 4 years old. Yes, death is extremely unlikely.

Now, if her fear is BRINGING covid to her unvaccinated older father, than maybe you would have a case, but since he already had covid, you don't. In this particular scenario I would be very willing to bet that no one will die.

[Anonymous]

I have unvaxxed family members and will not hang out with them until they get vaxxed or until the numbers go WAY down. But they are not my father so for a parent, I might make an exception. But I would require a negative PCR test and limit to outdoor only. If we went inside, masks on.

[Anonymous]

Sorry I would not allow any of those things. Make stupid choices suffer the consequences. I’d meet them outdoors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We have not seen my family on the west coast for over 2 years now and finally plan to visit in a few weeks. My parents are divorced and my mom and step father are fully vaccinated and boosted and very COVID cautious (more than we are), as is nearly all of the rest of the family. However, my dad and step mom are not vaccinated, along with my 25 year old half sibling who lives at home. They all had COVID in 2020 and strongly believe it was nothing but a cold so they don’t need to be vaccinated. They also take no precautions unless required by law - so they aren’t really wearing masks, they eat at restaurants indoors all the time, my half sibling frequents crowded bars and clubs, etc.

We are staying with my mom during the trip, but normally spend a lot of time with my dad as well since they live very close to one another. My kids also love doing a slumber party at grandpa’s which is a tradition they really look forward to. Now that we are getting close to the trip I am getting a little nervous about spending so much time with them since the Omicron surge has not yet died down where they live. DH and I are both vaccinated and boosted and have had COVID. One of our kids is fully vaccinated as of early December, and the other is 4 so not vaccinated at all.

Curious for those who are middle of the road cautious (not extreme on either side) what you would allow and be comfortable with based on the below:

1. Hanging out unmasked at my dad’s house for a couple hours here and there. Would likely include eating a meal while there. While I know we could wear masks to be safe I think that will be really annoying for my kids and make things uncomfortable since they think we are “extreme”.

2. Letting just my older, vaccinated child do a sleepover at their house one time. Would mean multiple hours of unmasked time together.

3. Letting my dad/stepmom take the kids to do a couple special activities which would mean driving in their car for 30+ mins unmasked and spending the day with them (would be something like the zoo, going to the American Girl store, etc). Again, my kids will just be annoyed if I make them wear masks in the car and my 4 year old will very likely just take it off, and she is the most vulnerable.

I already told them we will only eat at restaurants outdoors so they can either choose to join or not if we eat out. I can certainly ask them to get tested before we come, and they will do it reluctantly, but if they are still engaging in risky behavior like going to the gym or stores unmasked, not sure what the point is in confirming they don’t have COVID at one specific moment in time.

How would others handle this? Flying across the country and only seeing them for short periods of time outdoors just isn’t going to happen.

It's actually the opposite. the vaccinated folks, myself included, have a greater chance to be asymptomatic. Kids too. So unvaxed family members are facing greater risk socializing with you in close distance than the other way around.