Tenley Chick Filet takes measures against loitering after school by students, including Wilson

[Anonymous]

A recap:

Apparently, the new and very popular Tenleyown Chick Filet has instituted a carry-out only policy for the period after school, 3:30 to 4:30 (roughly--I don't have every fact, just what I've gleaned so please speak up if you know better).

The neighborhood list serve is blowing up with people arguing that the policy is draconian and others arguing that it is the right of area businesses to look out for their own well-being, avoid nuisance situations (a full table with one drink purchased) or fire code violations (too many customers in the store). What is interesting is this policy has touched the nerve of how much area residents and businesses should accommodate the through traffic of 1,000s of young people while turning a blind eye to some behaviors such as rowdiness by or in metro, or being attacked (iceballs, thrown drinks) by said students.

Many people who live in the neighborhood detail altering their shopping routines to avoid this crowd (kind of like Chick Filet is altering its business plan). Obviously, this is mainly a Wilson let out issue as that is the main stream of students that hit Tenley every day at school dismissal time, though the area supports a vast group of students and young adults in transit.

Some calls for more policing coordination on the list serve have led to an equal amount of hand wringing ("in this climate we can't respond with more police which could lead to violence"). This defies logic, as more police presence can also lessen violence. It just depends how its deployed. Anyhow, noticeably silent on the brewing debate (as well as historically silent when concerns have been brought up in the past) are the school's principal as well as Ward 3 rep Mary Cheh as well as the police or Bowser.

The ANC rep poked his head out to comment on the need for reasonable dialogue, but no meeting date on this issue has been provided.

My take:

It's time for a full discussion, involving elected politicians, police and school leaders, about the impact of Wilson High School on the locale: metro, local businesses and quality of life. They need to talk to each other and talk to the neighborhood. It may be there is also good that comes from the school (vibrancy, money spent at businesses) and that could be discussed too. As long as there is resounding silence, I personally support local businesses right to do as they see fit as long as it's one size fits all. As a local resident, I have to carry out my food just like every one else under this policy--yet another impact.

It would be good to get past this, and coordinate.

[Anonymous]

And I'm sorry - I should have titled this "Local Business takes measures against overcrowding after school", as my understanding is that Chick Filet is not the only business in DC to take measures like this and part of the issue is preventing code violations. It has just sparked an interesting neighborhood discussion about the overall impact on Tenleytown specifically during the after-school let out period that I think should get a full hearing from educational, political and policing governing bodies. Jeff, if you are able to change thread titles please do as this goes beyond Chick Filet. It was just the catalyst.

[Anonymous]

I went to AU and clearly remember the hassle of being in Tenley when Wilson let out. The kids were awful, clogging up sidewalks and harassing people. I always felt like I needed a shower after the shit those kids would say to women. I don't blame businesses for encouraging them to go elsewhere

[Anonymous]

Which neighborhood list Serv? I didn't see anything yet, but I get the digest edition, not one post at a time.

[Anonymous]

I'm not in the neighborhood but have to eyeroll. If businesses are trying to taking steps to avoid congestion at a high traffic period of time and residents are "altering their shopping routines to avoid this crowd," why is this a problem? Individuals have the right to shop when it suits them best, business have the right to configure their customer service setup in the most effective way.

Why is this some kind of emergency that requires government intervention? I live in MoCo and I can assure you that lots of us plan around rush hour traffic etc.

OP, you seem to think the policy should apply only to "this crowd" from Wilson. Oh, the horror, for an hour each day, you can only get takeout from Chick Fil A...I never understand why people who clearly don't want to live in a city choose to live in the city. If you want bucolic suburbia, all you have to do is move.

[Anonymous]

This isn't just Wilson and it surely isn't a new problem.

Anywhere there is an adjacent business district to any high school (and some middle schools) in the city, neighbors and neighboring businesses have the same issues and complaints.

Wilson is just larger and Deal is there too. And yes some of the middle schoolers are just as noisy and disruptive as the high school kids.

Where I grew up the nearby neighbors complained about the dangerous way the high school kids drove to school and parked everywhere.

[Anonymous]

Cleveland park listserve has this convo going on now.

[Anonymous]

Sure there's some issues relating to the sheer number of people during the crunch time. The reason people are altering whether they go to these businesses, though, is that a significant portion of the kids harass people, throw things (no, I'm not injured by having straws or cups thrown at me or directly in my walking path, but why set myself up for that if I can shop elsewhere?), and try to intimidate people. It's not an "urban living" issue. It's an issue with those particular kids behaving in ways that are totally unacceptable and that injures the lifestyle of those around them. These kids, with their aggressive, disarming behavior, take away money from business owner and make others have irritating experiences. It's not about the volume of people.

[Anonymous]

I too have been menaced by these rowdy, intimidating and nasty kids. the businesses are right in taking measures to make for a more peaceful experience.

What bothers me more though is people, especially mostly African Americans, who just can't seem to call it for what it is. They cry racism at every turn, trying to silence the voices of concern among citizens for what IS clearly a group of mostly African American kids who mostly DO NOT live in the neighborhood but who attend Wilson, who clearly WANT to rile up racial tensions and don't give a damn about it.

No one has stood up and said, yes, it is mostly this group, and we are working to address this. No one. Not even the kids themselves. What are they learning anyway at school and at home? No one ever talks to them about the fact that they belong to a society and need to beware of how they speak, act, dress, address people so as to not call them into question?

The blame always falls on the victims, not the perpetrators.

This is another good example, by the way, as to why the homeless shelter should not be built near McLean Gardens. More of the same will happen and even worse. Those idealists out there of a cumbaya existence are only dreaming.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm not in the neighborhood but have to eyeroll. If businesses are trying to taking steps to avoid congestion at a high traffic period of time and residents are "altering their shopping routines to avoid this crowd," why is this a problem? Individuals have the right to shop when it suits them best, business have the right to configure their customer service setup in the most effective way.

Why is this some kind of emergency that requires government intervention? I live in MoCo and I can assure you that lots of us plan around rush hour traffic etc.

OP, you seem to think the policy should apply only to "this crowd" from Wilson. Oh, the horror, for an hour each day, you can only get takeout from Chick Fil A...I never understand why people who clearly don't want to live in a city choose to live in the city. If you want bucolic suburbia, all you have to do is move.

Great thoughts. To clarify: residents are altering their routine because they feel (or have been) physically and verbally violated. It ranges from jostling, shouted bad language (near them, sometimes at them), to projectile throwing. I have personally witnessed students throwing rocks at cars and also hitting a pedestrian; when safely distanced, I pointed them out to a police officer at 7-11. There have also been (hopefully this will not be repeated this year) after school brawls including knifings on the area where people enter the metro. There is also shoplifting.

I have not eaten at Chick Filet and I am not asking that the policy apply only to Wilson. You did not read closely. I am making the point that it affects all of us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This isn't just Wilson and it surely isn't a new problem.

Anywhere there is an adjacent business district to any high school (and some middle schools) in the city, neighbors and neighboring businesses have the same issues and complaints.

Wilson is just larger and Deal is there too. And yes some of the middle schoolers are just as noisy and disruptive as the high school kids.

Where I grew up the nearby neighbors complained about the dangerous way the high school kids drove to school and parked everywhere.

So that makes it OK? Then throw the principal of Deal in the mix. Neighborhood and business concerns should be reasonably addressed. Think of this as a house on your street where the parents (principal, ANC, Cheh, police, Bowser) routinely check out and the teens throw a rowdy party. Does that analogy help?

[Anonymous]

I went to HS in the Tenley area in the 1980's and many stores would not let us in with backpacks and limited us to 5 teens at a time. One would have to stand outside with the backpacks and only 5 could go in at a time.

Of course we were obnoxious teenagers. They took measures to protect their business. No big deal.

[Anonymous]

everyone just relax, give it a few years. the wilson boundary has shrunk a lot and there are fewer and fewer OOB spots in the feeder schools. i don't spend enough time around tenley to know how serious this issue is versus pearl clutching, but regardless i can assure you that wilson demographics will be very different and much more local in a few years, that much is clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:everyone just relax, give it a few years. the wilson boundary has shrunk a lot and there are fewer and fewer OOB spots in the feeder schools. i don't spend enough time around tenley to know how serious this issue is versus pearl clutching, but regardless i can assure you that wilson demographics will be very different and much more local in a few years, that much is clear.

For part of the day, it is quite serious. It makes me sad because I for one welcome OOB students in any DC school. I don't welcome horrifying behavior, and when adults give it a pass they are abdicating their role in helping children grow well. That is why the head in the sand is so irritating. They are really doing these kids a disservice, as well as the neighborhood.

[Anonymous]

This is typical obnoxious teenage behavior. All that makes it urban is that 50% of kids aren't ferried away via school bus each day.

Teenagers are loud and like to hang out. Non teenagers find them annoying and intimidating. Unless it escalates to criminal behavior all you can do is implore their parents to try and get them to be more mindful of others.

In other areas of the city kids are flat out profiled - eg no more than 2 allowed in the corner market at a time and so forth. The uniforms make them easy to spot and profile.

Kids love Chikfila - and they will make plenty of money even if the kids have to eat it on the sidewalk.