student admissions and TJ lawsuit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:
You are so mistaken. There is no war at all against Hispanics and Blacks. In fact Asians understand aspiring for opportunity and self betterment very well. It is just that whites are using Hispanics and Blacks as an excuse to beat up Asians who they think are becoming too uppity. No one likes being taken for granted and discriminated against.

I thought the Asians were complaining that Blacks and Hispanics were taking spots at schools like TJ and Ivy’s when Asian kids are more qualified. Is my interpretation incorrect?

I don't think that too many Asian families would have a problem with admitting more Black and Hispanic students - assuming that it was due to doing a better job of identifying and enticing talented URMs. On the other hand, if it's simply because the school system suddenly decides to play with the numbers because there are "too many Asians," a lot of people would have a problem with that. You don't have to be Asian for that to bother you.

If that were the case these parents would all be angry at universities which give preference to legacy students; however, no one seems upset about that. Presumably because white students are the main beneficiaries.

Plenty of people are upset about that of all races.

The Asians aren’t doing that because if they did, that would put them up against white mommy and daddy. That’s the last thing they want us to do. As an earlier poster said, they want to assimilate.

It's more than that - given the relatively high % of Asians in elite colleges, they figure that their own children will benefit from legacy preferences. The reason that white and asian people hate affirmative action is because they do not benefit. They have no problem with preferential admissions policies as long as it helps them (and also don't help groups they deem undesirable).

This is important. There is an undercurrent at TJ of parents who have no future potential TJ applicants but who are displeased with the admissions changes because part of the appeal of TJ was that their students would not have to attend a school with Black kids and would therefore "be safe".

How shameless can you be? How do you sleep at night? Do you always project this hard onto others? You're exploiting one racial group that you've already damaged in order to attack a different racial group that you don't like. Using an accusation that has no basis in rational fact.

Don't pretend like we don't all know that the TJ changes happened at the behest of a rich White Savior who sends his own kids to private schools. Or that he literally used a fudge factor in his admissions number just to make sure there'd be fewer Asians.

That isn't accurate. The changes were done to give all students a fair chance not just those whose parents spend $10k on prep classes.

Please, we all know that's a liberal lie.

Hold your own nuts.

Your momma is doing a fine job of it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
You are so mistaken. There is no war at all against Hispanics and Blacks. In fact Asians understand aspiring for opportunity and self betterment very well. It is just that whites are using Hispanics and Blacks as an excuse to beat up Asians who they think are becoming too uppity. No one likes being taken for granted and discriminated against.

I thought the Asians were complaining that Blacks and Hispanics were taking spots at schools like TJ and Ivy’s when Asian kids are more qualified. Is my interpretation incorrect?

I don't think that too many Asian families would have a problem with admitting more Black and Hispanic students - assuming that it was due to doing a better job of identifying and enticing talented URMs. On the other hand, if it's simply because the school system suddenly decides to play with the numbers because there are "too many Asians," a lot of people would have a problem with that. You don't have to be Asian for that to bother you.

If that were the case these parents would all be angry at universities which give preference to legacy students; however, no one seems upset about that. Presumably because white students are the main beneficiaries.

Plenty of people are upset about that of all races.

The Asians aren’t doing that because if they did, that would put them up against white mommy and daddy. That’s the last thing they want us to do. As an earlier poster said, they want to assimilate.

It's more than that - given the relatively high % of Asians in elite colleges, they figure that their own children will benefit from legacy preferences. The reason that white and asian people hate affirmative action is because they do not benefit. They have no problem with preferential admissions policies as long as it helps them (and also don't help groups they deem undesirable).

This is important. There is an undercurrent at TJ of parents who have no future potential TJ applicants but who are displeased with the admissions changes because part of the appeal of TJ was that their students would not have to attend a school with Black kids and would therefore "be safe".

How shameless can you be? How do you sleep at night? Do you always project this hard onto others? You're exploiting one racial group that you've already damaged in order to attack a different racial group that you don't like. Using an accusation that has no basis in rational fact.

Don't pretend like we don't all know that the TJ changes happened at the behest of a rich White Savior who sends his own kids to private schools. Or that he literally used a fudge factor in his admissions number just to make sure there'd be fewer Asians.

That isn't accurate. The changes were done to give all students a fair chance not just those whose parents spend $10k on prep classes.

Please, we all know that's a liberal lie.

Hold your own nuts.

Your momma is doing a fine job of it.

Now your trolling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

The word “many” here is correct, but it’s still a very, VERY small percentage of the Asian population at TJ.

Indeed, those student are probably HELPED by the admissions changes as I indicated in an earlier post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The bolded is the type of Asian student that many people think of when they think of TJ. This is an inspiring story and one that certainly exists in the TJ community - but it is a very small percentage of the "Asian" TJ demographic. Additionally, these families - while there is a population center in Annandale - are relatively well-spread out amongst Northern Virginia and are not targeted by the TJ admissions changes. Indeed, they may benefit from them because of the impact on other demographics.

The far larger portion of the "Asian" TJ demographic consists of very affluent, well-educated, and relatively recent immigrants, mostly from India. These families came to the Northern Virginia area specifically for the combination of access to TJ and the Dulles tech boom about 10-15 years ago. They quickly consolidated into housing and worship communities and are concentrated heavily in Herndon, Chantilly, Ashburn, and South Riding. It is a matter of common understanding at TJ that these communities are extremely invested in TJ and academic prestige as a whole and work very hard to position themselves and their friends' children for the TJ admissions process from an early age - even during pregnancy.

I am in the camp of the reform having gone too far since DD just did the process and it was ridiculous how the “test” does nothing to show math aptitude ag all now.
That said, I 100% agree that reforms were needed to address the issue of people strategizing for years on how to get their kid into TJ and doing all the test prep along with it. It’s ridiculous and disadvantages plenty of really smart kids whose parents chose not to structure their entire lives around TJ.

This is the correct take. For me, the most important part of the reforms was to remove the incentive to make every decision in elementary and middle school with an eye towards TJ - which is even more damaging than making every high school decision with an eye toward college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

I'm willing to say that by middle school, if the parents don't value education but the kid wants to go to TJ, the kid needs to show some initiative. Every single middle school has some STEM extracurriculars. Any kid can sign up for math contests. For the kids who are unaware of the opportunities, surely they could talk to a math teacher or counselor at the school for advice. I don't buy the notion that a kid who has done absolutely nothing in middle school, aside from getting good grades, belongs at TJ. I also think the handful of brilliant, disadvantaged kids in the county were more likely to be detected in the old system than the new system.

I am willing to say that TJ is for the kids who are enough beyond the regular AP/IB offerings at their base school that they need more. If you're going to attend TJ and largely take the same classes that were available at your base school, there's no point in being at TJ. The only thing kids in that situation would have accomplished is that they would completely sabotage their college admissions by being in the bottom half at TJ rather than the top 5% of their base school.

Every student at TJ, by virtue of the tech requirements, takes several courses during their TJ careers that are not available at their base school.

An attractive argument if you don’t understand TJ, but invalid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

I'm willing to say that by middle school, if the parents don't value education but the kid wants to go to TJ, the kid needs to show some initiative. Every single middle school has some STEM extracurriculars. Any kid can sign up for math contests. For the kids who are unaware of the opportunities, surely they could talk to a math teacher or counselor at the school for advice. I don't buy the notion that a kid who has done absolutely nothing in middle school, aside from getting good grades, belongs at TJ. I also think the handful of brilliant, disadvantaged kids in the county were more likely to be detected in the old system than the new system.

I am willing to say that TJ is for the kids who are enough beyond the regular AP/IB offerings at their base school that they need more. If you're going to attend TJ and largely take the same classes that were available at your base school, there's no point in being at TJ. The only thing kids in that situation would have accomplished is that they would completely sabotage their college admissions by being in the bottom half at TJ rather than the top 5% of their base school.

Every student at TJ, by virtue of the tech requirements, takes several courses during their TJ careers that are not available at their base school.

An attractive argument if you don’t understand TJ, but invalid.

DP. I am well familiar with TJ and someone who doesn’t take any advanced courses do not belong at TJ. Design and Tech is a joke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

I wasn’t referring to income in the post you’re replying to. The advantage of having parents who prioritize providing a lot of educational extras is what I am referencing here. That advantage has nothing to do with income level.

Children cannot choose their parents. Kids should not get a leg up in admissions because they happened to be born to parents who started thinking about TJ and how to best position their child to be accepted there from the time their child entered elementary school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

I'm willing to say that by middle school, if the parents don't value education but the kid wants to go to TJ, the kid needs to show some initiative. Every single middle school has some STEM extracurriculars. Any kid can sign up for math contests. For the kids who are unaware of the opportunities, surely they could talk to a math teacher or counselor at the school for advice. I don't buy the notion that a kid who has done absolutely nothing in middle school, aside from getting good grades, belongs at TJ. I also think the handful of brilliant, disadvantaged kids in the county were more likely to be detected in the old system than the new system.

I am willing to say that TJ is for the kids who are enough beyond the regular AP/IB offerings at their base school that they need more. If you're going to attend TJ and largely take the same classes that were available at your base school, there's no point in being at TJ. The only thing kids in that situation would have accomplished is that they would completely sabotage their college admissions by being in the bottom half at TJ rather than the top 5% of their base school.

Every student at TJ, by virtue of the tech requirements, takes several courses during their TJ careers that are not available at their base school.

An attractive argument if you don’t understand TJ, but invalid.

DP. I am well familiar with TJ and someone who doesn’t take any advanced courses do not belong at TJ. Design and Tech is a joke.

How about the semester courses that introduce the students to the labs - and then the tech lab research requirement?

Although I will agree with you that unless you have the right teacher, design and tech is pretty much crap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

I wasn’t referring to income in the post you’re replying to. The advantage of having parents who prioritize providing a lot of educational extras is what I am referencing here. That advantage has nothing to do with income level.

Children cannot choose their parents. Kids should not get a leg up in admissions because they happened to be born to parents who started thinking about TJ and how to best position their child to be accepted there from the time their child entered elementary school.

Same thing happens with sports, dancing, singing etc. Those are all areas where children who receive training and education early on and develop interests have advantages - this apples to almost everything. How come there is no complaint about those areas? Could it be because certain group already is doing very well in those areas?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

I wasn’t referring to income in the post you’re replying to. The advantage of having parents who prioritize providing a lot of educational extras is what I am referencing here. That advantage has nothing to do with income level.

Children cannot choose their parents. Kids should not get a leg up in admissions because they happened to be born to parents who started thinking about TJ and how to best position their child to be accepted there from the time their child entered elementary school.

Same thing happens with sports, dancing, singing etc. Those are all areas where children who receive training and education early on and develop interests have advantages - this apples to almost everything. How come there is no complaint about those areas? Could it be because certain group already is doing very well in those areas?

Not always, some people are gifted athletically, some have gifted voices, some gifted with rhythm to dance. Those people who are too poor to pay for test prep are usually also too poor to pay for professional training in the above mentioned areas as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

I wasn’t referring to income in the post you’re replying to. The advantage of having parents who prioritize providing a lot of educational extras is what I am referencing here. That advantage has nothing to do with income level.

Children cannot choose their parents. Kids should not get a leg up in admissions because they happened to be born to parents who started thinking about TJ and how to best position their child to be accepted there from the time their child entered elementary school.

Same thing happens with sports, dancing, singing etc. Those are all areas where children who receive training and education early on and develop interests have advantages - this apples to almost everything. How come there is no complaint about those areas? Could it be because certain group already is doing very well in those areas?

Not always, some people are gifted athletically, some have gifted voices, some gifted with rhythm to dance. Those people who are too poor to pay for test prep are usually also too poor to pay for professional training in the above mentioned areas as well.

Some people are gifted academically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

I wasn’t referring to income in the post you’re replying to. The advantage of having parents who prioritize providing a lot of educational extras is what I am referencing here. That advantage has nothing to do with income level.

Children cannot choose their parents. Kids should not get a leg up in admissions because they happened to be born to parents who started thinking about TJ and how to best position their child to be accepted there from the time their child entered elementary school.

Same thing happens with sports, dancing, singing etc. Those are all areas where children who receive training and education early on and develop interests have advantages - this apples to almost everything. How come there is no complaint about those areas? Could it be because certain group already is doing very well in those areas?

Because those are all activities. Why do you think there is a comparison?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

I wasn’t referring to income in the post you’re replying to. The advantage of having parents who prioritize providing a lot of educational extras is what I am referencing here. That advantage has nothing to do with income level.

Children cannot choose their parents. Kids should not get a leg up in admissions because they happened to be born to parents who started thinking about TJ and how to best position their child to be accepted there from the time their child entered elementary school.

Same thing happens with sports, dancing, singing etc. Those are all areas where children who receive training and education early on and develop interests have advantages - this apples to almost everything. How come there is no complaint about those areas? Could it be because certain group already is doing very well in those areas?

Because those are all activities. Why do you think there is a comparison?

Why do you think there isn't?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope not buying this at all. What you see today - lots of successful Asian students who come from successful Asian families - is the result of those families having grown up with parents who came here from Asian countries and were poor. They had parents who worked at menial and low income jobs and were often the subject of ridicule and taunts because they spoke poor English and looked different. That was Fairfax county in the 70s/80s. All those parents knew was go to school, work hard, get the best grades, go to the best school, education is the way up. Over time their kids success translated into opportunities and more families saw this and told their kids this was the ticket to a better future.

We keep creating programs to help students and we keep insisting that the problem is their parents job, their background, the achievement gap, the way the tests are worded, minimum wage, not enough wages, the police, and every single other thing and the answer isn't in any of those things. Families and the communities those families live in have to value education so much and value the chance for a better future, that they put education as the biggest and most important value in their everyday life. The resources are there. The opportunities are there. But to see them and realize them one has to be willing to look for them at the sake of other things like sports, shopping, beauty, recreation, tv, video games,

So you’re saying that children born to families that do not have the advantage of being able to put education above all else are just out of luck? Just too bad for you kids born to uneducated or lower income parents (who didn’t have any advantages when they grew up either)?

You’re willing to say that only children who win the lottery of being born to parents who prioritize education should have the opportunity to go to a school like TJ? Do you even hear how the the paragraph quoted above sounds?

Many Asian students that attend TJ or apply to TJ are lower/middle class who prioritize education above consumer products, vacations, expensive cars, eating out etc. etc. to buy things related to education such as computers, extra classes, EC activities etc. HHI of about 45,000 - 85,000 does not equal privileged.

Also, 50,000 income may not qualify for FARMs but do not equate non-farms status with wealthy.

I wasn’t referring to income in the post you’re replying to. The advantage of having parents who prioritize providing a lot of educational extras is what I am referencing here. That advantage has nothing to do with income level.

Children cannot choose their parents. Kids should not get a leg up in admissions because they happened to be born to parents who started thinking about TJ and how to best position their child to be accepted there from the time their child entered elementary school.

Same thing happens with sports, dancing, singing etc. Those are all areas where children who receive training and education early on and develop interests have advantages - this apples to almost everything. How come there is no complaint about those areas? Could it be because certain group already is doing very well in those areas?

Not always, some people are gifted athletically, some have gifted voices, some gifted with rhythm to dance. Those people who are too poor to pay for test prep are usually also too poor to pay for professional training in the above mentioned areas as well.

Some people are gifted academically.

And if so all this prep isn’t necessary than is it?

[Anonymous]

“I think the Vern Williams experiment would have led to the inconvenient truth - Asians would dominate admissions again in the 80-85% range. We do not like to have to admit that outcome, but we all know it's true.”

If there was a test that was actually measuring math aptitude and not just whether kids had done the test prep - Plus the county dropped the plus factors for doing pricey or not widely available STEM outside activities - then fine. You should be able to go through what FCPS offers and have a realistic shot at getting in if you are really gifted in math. Kids don’t do another science in pre HS grades in FCPS to know if they have a gift for that