Big 3 (or thereabouts) College Results - Class of 2021

[Anonymous]

But parents send their kids to a Big Whatever for educational experience, not to get into a good university!

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I wonder where the spots are going. Are colleges taking more full pay students from less populated states who have good grades at ok schools but no test scores to compare them to students from major cities? or are they taking more underrepresented (by any socioeconomic demographic) students who need financial assistance? It's hard to imagine that colleges would significantly increase their share of scholarship students.

I get the sense that increasingly the early admits to top schools is populated by athletes, URM and donors. Not sure if the increased representation from local publics is accurate. I think the college reps can discern the difference between and A student at Whitman vs a B+ student at NCS if all else is equal. But who knows what’s really happening this year.

but that A student from Whitman has a pile of AP scores to back up the A. A ton of name privates have either limited or eliminated APs

+2 I suspect lack of APs is hindering private school kids. Many top students at public schools will have 8 AP classes!

I don’t think this is the case. You can always take the AP exam even if the classes are not labeled AP. A lot of kids do this. My own kid will have 7 AP exams by the time he graduates from a big 3. As for higher GPAs at public schools, it doesn’t matter what GPA p

Comparing GPA from public to private schools is apple to oranges. Each school is being compared to his own peers at his own school.

except that most publics will have a certain percentage not going to college or not going to a competitive college. Publics don't expel kids for barely showing up or not bothering to do the work. That's free class rank for all of the public school kids who want to go to competitive schools. Put another way, the bottom 10% of students at NCS or Sidwell are absolutely expect to go to college and at least try to do the work, the bottom 10% at Whitman likely aren't and don't

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid is at a Big 3 also. We have one solid EA acceptance which we thought was a borderline safety school but is looking better and better to attend with all the deferrals my kid has gotten (and to schools where the kid fell squarely within the Naviance acceptance range). And we are full-pay so that has not made a difference.

I do think the public school students with 4.5 GPAs and 10 AP classes are winning out this year compared to the top one-third of students at private schools that have a 3.5 - 3.7 GPA and no AP classes. My kid has a GPA in this range and solid ACT results (34-36) but with test scores becoming increasingly irrelevant, all that stands out is a deflated 3.5 against an inflated 4.5.

All I can hope is that this is a long process that will continue to unfold until June 1. The public school kids are applying to a lot more schools and getting into to places. However, they can only attend one college so I'm hoping the deferrals turn into acceptances or waitlists which then turn into acceptances.

High School counselors at our Big 3 are MIA and seem to be unaccountable and untouchable. If they are feeling panicked, they are definitely not showing it. Plus, they never guarantee results. They always say, "it looks like", "we hope" or "Naviance shows." So with that vague language, they effectively hedge their bets.

+100 I keep expecting a college guidance to send a letter addressing the surprising EA/ED results, but we have heard nothing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is at a Big 3 also. We have one solid EA acceptance which we thought was a borderline safety school but is looking better and better to attend with all the deferrals my kid has gotten (and to schools where the kid fell squarely within the Naviance acceptance range). And we are full-pay so that has not made a difference.

I do think the public school students with 4.5 GPAs and 10 AP classes are winning out this year compared to the top one-third of students at private schools that have a 3.5 - 3.7 GPA and no AP classes. My kid has a GPA in this range and solid ACT results (34-36) but with test scores becoming increasingly irrelevant, all that stands out is a deflated 3.5 against an inflated 4.5.

All I can hope is that this is a long process that will continue to unfold until June 1. The public school kids are applying to a lot more schools and getting into to places. However, they can only attend one college so I'm hoping the deferrals turn into acceptances or waitlists which then turn into acceptances.

High School counselors at our Big 3 are MIA and seem to be unaccountable and untouchable. If they are feeling panicked, they are definitely not showing it. Plus, they never guarantee results. They always say, "it looks like", "we hope" or "Naviance shows." So with that vague language, they effectively hedge their bets.

+100 I keep expecting a college guidance to send a letter addressing the surprising EA/ED results, but we have heard nothing.

it would be embarrassing if someone put it on Facebook. Right now they are pouring though applications and then will be informing families that they have been selected to pay 50k a year for DC's high school education. The last thing they want is those parents and kids being bombarded with information about a brutal college year

[Anonymous]

It is wrong to assume that public school students are doing better than normal while only private school students are doing worse than normal. TJ students are doing much worse than normal as well! A education/application agency I know says that their students’ EA application results (all public) are much worse than normal as well. The first primary reasons they offered are: the big, big jump in # of applicants for very competitive colleges. In years past, many students with special qualifications/attributes/characteristics/achievements/talents did not apply to the very selective colleges because of very bad SAT scores. With SAT scores optional, these no traditional applicants took away many spots. The second reason is that colleges are reluctant to hand out EAs because of the many uncertainties.

Implication: Test scores will become less and less important, and special talents more and more important.

[Anonymous]

This is pretty odd compared to other countries. Shouldn’t some universities still keep academics at the fore?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is pretty odd compared to other countries. Shouldn’t some universities still keep academics at the fore?

if we had a levels, the people who complain about teaching to the test would have a collective aneurysm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is wrong to assume that public school students are doing better than normal while only private school students are doing worse than normal. TJ students are doing much worse than normal as well! A education/application agency I know says that their students’ EA application results (all public) are much worse than normal as well. The first primary reasons they offered are: the big, big jump in # of applicants for very competitive colleges. In years past, many students with special qualifications/attributes/characteristics/achievements/talents did not apply to the very selective colleges because of very bad SAT scores. With SAT scores optional, these no traditional applicants took away many spots. The second reason is that colleges are reluctant to hand out EAs because of the many uncertainties.

Implication: Test scores will become less and less important, and special talents more and more important.

What are those "special qualifications/attributes/characteristics/achievements/talents"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is wrong to assume that public school students are doing better than normal while only private school students are doing worse than normal. TJ students are doing much worse than normal as well! A education/application agency I know says that their students’ EA application results (all public) are much worse than normal as well. The first primary reasons they offered are: the big, big jump in # of applicants for very competitive colleges. In years past, many students with special qualifications/attributes/characteristics/achievements/talents did not apply to the very selective colleges because of very bad SAT scores. With SAT scores optional, these no traditional applicants took away many spots. The second reason is that colleges are reluctant to hand out EAs because of the many uncertainties.

Implication: Test scores will become less and less important, and special talents more and more important.

What are those "special qualifications/attributes/characteristics/achievements/talents"?

The ones the students lie about in the essays.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid is at a Big 3 also. We have one solid EA acceptance which we thought was a borderline safety school but is looking better and better to attend with all the deferrals my kid has gotten (and to schools where the kid fell squarely within the Naviance acceptance range). And we are full-pay so that has not made a difference.

I do think the public school students with 4.5 GPAs and 10 AP classes are winning out this year compared to the top one-third of students at private schools that have a 3.5 - 3.7 GPA and no AP classes. My kid has a GPA in this range and solid ACT results (34-36) but with test scores becoming increasingly irrelevant, all that stands out is a deflated 3.5 against an inflated 4.5.

All I can hope is that this is a long process that will continue to unfold until June 1. The public school kids are applying to a lot more schools and getting into to places. However, they can only attend one college so I'm hoping the deferrals turn into acceptances or waitlists which then turn into acceptances.

High School counselors at our Big 3 are MIA and seem to be unaccountable and untouchable. If they are feeling panicked, they are definitely not showing it. Plus, they never guarantee results. They always say, "it looks like", "we hope" or "Naviance shows." So with that vague language, they effectively hedge their bets.

This is utterly laughable. If a public school kid with 10 APs and a 4.5 GPA is "winning out" over a top 1/3 private school kid with a 3.5 it's because the public school kid is objectively a stronger applicant. That public school kid would be at or near the very top of the class, and you're deluding yourself if you think that the very top students in the DMV's public school systems -- which are among the best in the country -- don't compare well with a top 1/3 student at a Big 3.

There also appears to be this misconception among private school parents that every public school kid has 10 APs and a 4.5 GPA. That's simply not the case. You all need to get off your high horses.

I never thought I'd see the day where Big 3 parents would be complaining that they're at an unfair disadvantage over public high schools. Wow.

[Anonymous]

PP - the reason why private school kids don't have 10 APs is because their school does not offer AP classes or encourage students to necessarily sign up for the exams. But at publics, the AP system is the way to distinguish yourself and that's why students pile them on. And it looks like colleges still like AP coursework.

Big 3 parents are complaining about how the school administration has put them at a disadvantage. They are not complaining or claiming that their kids are smarter than public school kids.

And I don't think a 4.5 GPA public student is "objectively" better than a 3.5 - 3.7 student at a Big 3. Believe it or not, those A- and even B+s are hard to come by when the teachers are deflating grades and there are no retakes or second chances or quarter grades being dropped in favor of the highest grade.

[Anonymous]

Private school kids can take AP exams, right?

[Anonymous]

These are all early action deferrals? What kind of schools are these kids getting deferred from? If it makes you all feel better my kid applied to no schools early. I’m not panicked - yet! I don’t think there’s any magic to AP classes, the colleges know all of our schools well and know the curriculum. I expect there will be a lot of wait list action this year, like there was last year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP - the reason why private school kids don't have 10 APs is because their school does not offer AP classes or encourage students to necessarily sign up for the exams. But at publics, the AP system is the way to distinguish yourself and that's why students pile them on. And it looks like colleges still like AP coursework.

Big 3 parents are complaining about how the school administration has put them at a disadvantage. They are not complaining or claiming that their kids are smarter than public school kids.

And I don't think a 4.5 GPA public student is "objectively" better than a 3.5 - 3.7 student at a Big 3. Believe it or not, those A- and even B+s are hard to come by when the teachers are deflating grades and there are no retakes or second chances or quarter grades being dropped in favor of the highest grade.

Give me some credit. I know the major privates in the DC area banned together and announced they were doing away with APs. They did it with great fanfare. They also said they were highly confident that this wouldn't hurt them in college admissions because all of the top colleges know how rigorous their educations are.

In any event, you're missing my point. I'm sure those A-minuses and B-plusses are "hard to come by." But they're not handing out 4.5 GPAs in public schools either. Kids were 4.5s are at the very top of their public high classes. And the very top students in this area's public high schools are absolutely better than a top 1/3 at an area private. In fact, they're probably among the top high school students in the country.

And all this business about re-takes and second chances? Please. Less common than you think, but even if true, it doesn't change the fact that in the end some public school kids in their public school systems -- re-takes and all -- rise to the top of huge classes. And those top kids are better than a Big 3 top 1/3.

[Anonymous]

PP, you are right. Top students are top students anywhere.

Also keep in mind, though, that a kid who is the top 1/3 of a small class (around here most are 40-125) might be ranked 15th- 40th in the small class (which is why they don't rank in small schools). The 15th ranked student in a large public class of 600 is in the top 2% of the class, and the 40th is top 6%.