Gaza war and College Campus Protests

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:As you can see from the last several responses the anger towards Israel is just increasing. If that’s happening in an anonymous message message board with posters safe from any harm just imagine the hatred on the ground and’s throughout the ME region that Israel is stirring up. I can’t say I blame them - I look at the photos and read the stories and it’s horrible. I don’t see how this ends well for Israel. Sure they have the military upper hand but to live in peace long term they need to win hearts and minds.

People have justified all the killing based n what the US did to Afghanistan and Iraq post 9-11. The key difference is that we could leave the region. Assuming that Israel does want to remain a country, it doesn’t have that luxury.

Those responses are all from the same poster. And this one might be as well.

I don't think one need assume those responses are from a single poster. Anger toward Israel is burgeoning throughout the world, and there's plenty to go round. The recent scenes of hospital patients in tents outside Al-Aqsa Hospital, some of them attached to IVs, being burned to death as the result of an Israeli airstrike are so horrifying that they have magnified the outrage. The stories of innocent Palestinians being killed or injured and evicted, in contradiction of international law, from homes in the WB where their families have lived for generations, are also stirring up outrage. Israel has become a rogue state with many similarities to Nazi Germany. It's taking an unconscionably long time for the international community to react, but genocide won't be tolerated forever.

In terms of similarities to Nazi Germany, consider Hitler's plans for "lebensraum" included colonizing areas to the east of Germany and either evicting or exterminating the Slavs who lived there. This is exactly what Israel is doing and has done for decades to the Palestinians.

Just curious. If Israel wasn’t the only Jewish country in the world would you be using Nazis as the comparison point? Because very little about Israel resembles the actions of the Nazi Party if we want to go point-by-point. And also there are players in the region (Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthis) that do resemble the Nazis in terms of sworn ideology, actions, explicit commitment to eradicate Jews from the world, and who have actually ethnically cleansed Jews from the MENA region - very much what Hitler hoped to do in Europe.

So is that you find the best way to degrade and debase a country of Jews is to summon the accusation of Nazi?

Israel's similarities to Nazi Germany have nothing at all to do with the religion of most Israelis and everything to do with their behavior. It is a red herring to bring the specific religion into the equation. Behavior must be judged by its motives and consequences rather than by the ethnicity of the perpetrators. In the comparison, it is only relevant that a particular religious or ethnic group demands asymmetrical power and status.

Imagine that the Druze decided they wanted their own country, a special Druze state in what is now Israel, and took it by force by killing and expelling the majority of non-Druze occupants of the region (which is exactly what happened during the Nakba and continues in the West Bank). Oh, they might let a few remain, as long as they can be kept to a minority so they can't threaten the theocratic dominance of the Druze state. Or imagine that a group of U.S. citizens decided they wanted to create their own theocratic and predominantly white Baptist state, so they invaded part of Mexico, ethnically cleansed most of the inhabitants, and declared the region a sovereign Baptist nation. This is exactly what Zionist terrorist gangs and the nascent IDF did during the Nakba and continue to do in Gaza and the West Bank. Are you suggesting that the religion of most Zionists gives them a pass on fascism, genocide, and ethnic cleansing?

There are strong parallels between Israeli extremists such as Daniella Weiss, Bezalel Smotrich, and Itamar Ben-Gvir, on the one hand, and Nazis on the other. The afore-mentioned people, and other members of the Israeli hard right, lack all humanity. They regard Palestinians as an inconvenience at best and a plague at worst. Hitler, in Mein Kampf, opined that Germany should expand eastward to gain "Lebensraum," evicting, enslaving, or exterminating the Slavs in the process. How can you deny that many Israelis want to do exactly the same to the Palestinians? Or that they have in fact evicted and exterminated them in the past and continue to do the same today? Or that Jewish Israeli schoolchildren in some cases gain approval from their teachers when they talk about blowing up mosques and making Palestinians their slaves? Or sing, "Burn their villages"? Consider that the Nazis considered relocating Jews to Madagascar to get rid of them, while Netanyahu-not some fringe radical but Netanyahu, the prime minister of Israel-has been in talks with the Congo and other countries about dumping Palestinians there once Gaza has been made uninhabitable. Just as the Nazis planned to expand the Reich, Smotrich would like to expand Israel to include all or parts of Gaza, the West Bank, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt, Syria, Iraq, and Saudi Arabia. How is this NOT similar to Nazi policy?

As for Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Houthis, it is inevitable that resistance movements will arise in the face of enormous injustice. One cannot approve of their methods, but one also has to consider that the world has for decades allowed terrible injustices against the Palestinians, and diplomacy has been ineffective.

Zionist ideology privileges one ethnic group at the expense of others, just as Nazism privileged "Aryans" over Jews, Slavs, Romany, etc. It's important to make a distinction between Jewish people in general and Zionists, just as one should distinguish between Germans and Nazis. Many Jewish people, including those in my family, are sickened and disgusted by what Israel is doing. They do not want to be associated with it in any way. It is deeply wrong to suggest all Jews are Zionists, or even that all Zionists approve of Israel's genocide in Gaza and ethnic cleansing in the West Bank. The people in power in Israel at the moment are, sad to say, emulating Nazism. I don't see how one can avoid that conclusion, whatever one's preconceptions.

So, in answer to your question, nobody is trying to "degrade and debase a country of Jews." Please don't play the race card in an effort to excuse genocide or shut down criticism of Israel. Most of us want Israel to be held accountable for its atrocities and to be forced to comply with international law. Israel should make reparations to Palestinians as demanded by UN Resolution 194. We also want to stop arming the Israeli regime. As an American taxpayer, I am horrified that I am contributing financially to Israel's obscene savagery and ethnosupremacist ideals.

+1. And I would just add for anyone who doesn’t believe your points, please speak to a Palestinian. I know a few and they are crystal clear things not about religion.

Iran’s policies and the way it treats women are far closer to Nazi Germany than the way Israel treats Palestinians.

Israel and Hamas are in a war. Despite you trying to oversimplify and act like Hamas and other “resistance fighters” are a product that exists solely due to Israel’s mistreatment, the facts belie your conclusion. Hamas is a terrorist organization, not a group of freedom or resistance fighters. Hamas only exists to destroy Israel, Jews, and take the land.

It’s so disappointing to see people like you. This is not genocide on the part of Jews. It’s self protection. And screaming from the roof tops about genocide only prevents productive conversations from happening.

I'm going to ignore the personal jap ("disappointing to see people like you") and will ask: have you ever met a Palestinian, Lebanese, Iranian, or Syrian? Or is your view solely based on reading coverage that portrays them as religious fanatics that seek to destroy Israel?

DP.

Have you seen the polling on Palestinian attitudes towards Israel?

A clear majority favors the destruction of Israel over a 2-state solution (or any other peaceful resolution).

And these polls were conducted before 10/7.

I don’t understand the Israeli position that despite everything, EVERYTHING they are doing to every palestinian they can touch, that the Palestinians somehow owe them deference , respect and validation.

It’s perplexing. Zionists argue that Palestinians seek to kill all Jews and to form an ethno-state where Israel exists today. Palestinians have actually experienced - for over 80 years now - the Zionists doing exactly that - except to them.

It must be maddening to endure your abusive oppressor accusing you of the exact actions they have violently imposed on you for decades. Might be cause for some of the hostility in the Palestinian camp, but I’m not sure.

+1. And we keep hearing that "Israel has a right to defend itself." Are the Palestinians allowed to defend themselves? Or should they just quietly accept the massacres, rapes, torture, evictions, land theft, and violations of international law and humbly shuffle off to ... where exactly?

Every Palestinian has as much character and courage as 100 Israelis. All the Zionists have is money and weapons. Otherwise they are cowards.

I just wish, as an American taxpayer, that they didn’t have MY money and that I wasn’t funding their weapons😥

[Anonymous]

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Is this fake? I don't see it anywhere on mainstream media

[Anonymous]

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Is this fake? I don't see it anywhere on mainstream media

Not fake. These stories and pics are all over twitter.

Mainstream media is not really reporting the atrocities going on in northern Gaza, but the stories are out there. IDF is forcing people to leave or be killed, then razing the entire home/shelter. Rounding up the men/boys. Really awful stories coming out of northern Gaza right now.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-forces-storm-shelters-detain-men-north-gaza-raid-deepens-2024-10-21/

[Anonymous]

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Is this fake? I don't see it anywhere on mainstream media

Craziness, I think I can pick out a kid in the middle of the line. I wonder if they are going to be executed or sent to prisons

[Anonymous]

“Sources on the ground say Israeli quadcopter drones equipped with loudspeakers ordered families trapped inside these shelters to flee. Once people gathered at the front gate, Israeli artillery fire struck the crowd, killing at least seven Palestinians.“

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“Sources on the ground say Israeli quadcopter drones equipped with loudspeakers ordered families trapped inside these shelters to flee. Once people gathered at the front gate, Israeli artillery fire struck the crowd, killing at least seven Palestinians.“

That’s so cruel.

[Anonymous]

Why should they trust a word Israel says? I wonder how many hostages they killed unknowingly in the same manner

[Anonymous]

And the toll this is taking on Israeli solders is also enormous. Suicides rates are up among IDF soldiers:

From CNN: The former soldier has spoken publicly about the psychological trauma endured by Israeli troops in Gaza. In a testimony to the Knesset, Israel’s parliament, in June, Zaken said that on many occasions, soldiers had to “run over terrorists, dead and alive, in the hundreds.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why should they trust a word Israel says? I wonder how many hostages they killed unknowingly in the same manner

They've killed more of their own than they rescued because of the Hannibal directive

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And the toll this is taking on Israeli solders is also enormous. Suicides rates are up among IDF soldiers:

From CNN: The former soldier has spoken publicly about the psychological trauma endured by Israeli troops in Gaza. In a testimony to the Knesset, Israel’s parliament, in June,Zaken said that on many occasions, soldiers had to “run over terrorists, dead and alive, in the hundreds.”

This is such bullsh#t. They did not have to run over dead and alive people, they wanted to run them over. Also these were not terrorists but civilians the majority being women and kids. Could you imagine running over women and children alive? This tell you all you need to know about Israelis.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It looks like the IDF were able to kill Sinwar in a firefight today. I've seen the pictures. I'd be very surprised if it's not him. Looks like him. Same teeth. Even wearing a Rolex. Since Sinwar did spend time in an Israeli prison, the IDF should be able to confirm it's him soon. Now if the Palestinians would just release the remaining 97 unaccounted hostages, this war will be all over. Let's hope.

This campaign may be over, but Israel has ensured the larger war will continue. By killing so many innocent people, Israel has ensured future generations committed to the destruction of Zionism and all it stands for - ethno-religious supremacy, violence, apartheid, and genocide. Many Zionists will die in the future to atone for what Netanyahu and his henchmen have done, and if that prospect bothers some Jews they are Zionists first and Jews second. Because these thugs have made a complete mockery of Judaism as well and rendered it synonymous with terror, death, and the slaughter of innocents for many decades if not centuries to come. The students know this better than anyone else, and the sense of overriding shame among many Jewish-American students is part of what drives their movement.

This is a pervasive and profoundly silly talking point.

The "larger" war will continue until (a) someone "wins", or (b) a durable peace agreement is reached.

What has happened in the last year doesn't change this calculus in any way, shape or form.

The silliness is Israel thinking it can “win” when everything it’s done for years just makes it more of a global pariah, especially among the young. Again, they win battles and lose the larger war. Most of the world would now love to see Israel wiped off the map.

NP. The only people who harbor that hope are antisemitic LWNJs, to include you. The rest of the world is rooting for Israel as it is the ONLY democracy in the middle east.

Please name the countries? Also no Israel is not a democracy. It is a theocratic state.

Really- name the countries that did not side AGAINST Israel? other than germany and USA, every country voted for a ceasefire, Macron is getting sued, Melloni is what she is, putin is what he is, the Chinese need to be pro-palestine b/c that gives them cover re:Uighars and they need to court the sizable muslim asian population that increasingly hates the US. Brazil and chile and japan are pro-palestine, who else. what country is for Israel?? you can just admit that teh only country that matters is the USA but a lot of countries would love to see the US fail and siding with a global greedy guts who isnt satisfied and is a weird religious ethno state is not going to help the USA.

As they see it -in ww2 the US sided with the communists against the fascists- in all of the subsequent wars in the developing world the US has backed the fascists against the communists. The US doesnt fight on the side of the morally righteous- it fights on the side of the anglospere and most times that is the good guys but not always. in WW1 the brits were the evil empire and the Germans were the good guys by the way. Colonised people from tanzania to Malaysia didnt so much want the axis to win, they actually just wanted the Allies to lose b/c the allies had been raping them and stealing from them for centuries. Of course they soon found out the axis were worse but as your mama says- two wrongs dont make a right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the toll this is taking on Israeli solders is also enormous. Suicides rates are up among IDF soldiers:

From CNN: The former soldier has spoken publicly about the psychological trauma endured by Israeli troops in Gaza. In a testimony to the Knesset, Israel’s parliament, in June,Zaken said that on many occasions, soldiers had to “run over terrorists, dead and alive, in the hundreds.”

This is such bullsh#t. They did not have to run over dead and alive people, they wanted to run them over. Also these were not terrorists but civilians the majority being women and kids. Could you imagine running over women and children alive? This tell you all you need to know about Israelis.

They’re running over their own hostages that are temporarily Gazan citizens. All released hostages were highly critical of Israel and are now forced to sign gag orders to not go complete interviews with media, gee wonder why. The captives came to fear Israel more than Hamas the longer they stayed in Gaza

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And the toll this is taking on Israeli solders is also enormous. Suicides rates are up among IDF soldiers:

From CNN: The former soldier has spoken publicly about the psychological trauma endured by Israeli troops in Gaza. In a testimony to the Knesset, Israel’s parliament, in June, Zaken said that on many occasions, soldiers had to “run over terrorists, dead and alive, in the hundreds.”

Suicide rates are also up in Gaza. 4 year olds are attempting suicide to join their dead families .

[Anonymous]

I don't think Hamas and Hezbollah are the terrorists here. The pictures are all I need to see.

I wish our US Jewish friends would grow a spine and stand up to Israel too along with the rest of the world. Zionists are not on the right side of history here. Bombing women and children indiscriminately is not a good look.

And the US government needs to take a hard look at themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think Hamas and Hezbollah are the terrorists here. The pictures are all I need to see.

I wish our US Jewish friends would grow a spine and stand up to Israel too along with the rest of the world. Zionists are not on the right side of history here. Bombing women and children indiscriminately is not a good look.

And the US government needs to take a hard look at themselves.

You should also read and try thinking.