Has Duran gone mad? (APS)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok so back to the real question (though the debates about how teachers deserve/don’t deserve respect are remarkably entertaining in that they are so ludicrous)...
No one thinks going back in the height of the pandemic is a good idea. The metrics are all red.
How do we get aps to see that there is a silent majority that does want to go back but not until metrics are met?

Well, you could start by finding the science that supports that. The most up to date research and recommendations support going back and have lambasted the arbitrary metrics crafted by politicians and teachers unions (e.g., NYC’s 3% rate). Masks and cohorts have demonstrated to be more than sufficient across the county to significantly mitigate the risk of transmission. https://globalepidemics.org/2020/12/18/schools-and-the-path-to-zero-strategies-for-pandemic-resilience-in-the-face-of-high-community-spread/

Oh for God’s sake. I am sick to death of people referring to “the science” or “the studies” as some monolithic set of proofs that don’t need critical examination and evaluation. How many of your sources are from peer-reviewed scientific journals? Let me guess. None.

Lol, not the PP but that link is a joint guidance document from Harvard and Brown's public health schools.

Things have changed since March. Catch up.

In other words, NOT scientific journals. See, this is what I mean? People don’t read carefully or critically anymore. You can’t even accurately read my 5 sentence posting.

And yes, I am familiar with the Brown University study. It is a great example of why economists should not play at being epidemiologists.

The entire document is an explainer on how and why things are different than they were four to six months ago, and it cites to lots of peer reviewed data. It really would be good for you to read it because, again, things look a lot different now than when your worldview was apparently locked in.

[Anonymous]

That Brown document is an educational policy document. Not a medical or epidemiological report. It speaks in aggregate terms. I wouldn’t pin my kids’ safety on it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok so back to the real question (though the debates about how teachers deserve/don’t deserve respect are remarkably entertaining in that they are so ludicrous)...
No one thinks going back in the height of the pandemic is a good idea. The metrics are all red.
How do we get aps to see that there is a silent majority that does want to go back but not until metrics are met?

Well, you could start by finding the science that supports that. The most up to date research and recommendations support going back and have lambasted the arbitrary metrics crafted by politicians and teachers unions (e.g., NYC’s 3% rate). Masks and cohorts have demonstrated to be more than sufficient across the county to significantly mitigate the risk of transmission. https://globalepidemics.org/2020/12/18/schools-and-the-path-to-zero-strategies-for-pandemic-resilience-in-the-face-of-high-community-spread/

Oh for God’s sake. I am sick to death of people referring to “the science” or “the studies” as some monolithic set of proofs that don’t need critical examination and evaluation. How many of your sources are from peer-reviewed scientific journals? Let me guess. None.

Lol, not the PP but that link is a joint guidance document from Harvard and Brown's public health schools.

Things have changed since March. Catch up.

In other words, NOT scientific journals. See, this is what I mean? People don’t read carefully or critically anymore. You can’t even accurately read my 5 sentence posting.

And yes, I am familiar with the Brown University study. It is a great example of why economists should not play at being epidemiologists.

The entire document is an explainer on how and why things are different than they were four to six months ago, and it cites to lots of peer reviewed data. It really would be good for you to read it because, again, things look a lot different now than when your worldview was apparently locked in.

A great explainer that cites “lots of peer reviewed data?” Wow, you really convinced me to give that study a careful re-read.

By the way, do you even know what the peer review process is?

It seems appropriate to quote Isaac Asimov at this juncture...
“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.’”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There’s no good data on spread because schools that are open (other than private) aren’t testing their populations. If lack of reported deaths is your metric, though, you are good. Some of us are a little wary of that. 🙄

Exactly.

So there is no data on spread in schools? How about teacher infection rates or something?

There is plenty of data about spread in schools (and lack there of). But people choose not to believe it.
https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/covid-19-data-insights/covid-19-outbreaks-by-selected-exposure-settings/

Yep, also: http://arlingtonparentsforeducation.org/research/why-cant-aps/

Did all those school districts cited stay open?

Some did, some had smart plans to close over thanksgiving-January. A school moving to virtual is not a failure. Folks that elect to go back to school will need to flexible and understand that there may be temporary shifts to DL. Failure is not opening at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There’s no good data on spread because schools that are open (other than private) aren’t testing their populations. If lack of reported deaths is your metric, though, you are good. Some of us are a little wary of that. 🙄

Exactly.

So there is no data on spread in schools? How about teacher infection rates or something?

There is plenty of data about spread in schools (and lack there of). But people choose not to believe it.
https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/covid-19-data-insights/covid-19-outbreaks-by-selected-exposure-settings/

Yep, also: http://arlingtonparentsforeducation.org/research/why-cant-aps/

You cited APE lmao

What’s the saying? When you can’t fight the message, fight the messenger?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Check out School Personnel Lost To Covid on Twitter.

It's heartbreaking. There are so many that you wonder how the hell schools are open.

That Twitter account is a good amount of emotional manipulation. When you include as purported school-related covid deaths private music instructors who didn’t work for any schools and a woman who most likely caught it from her elderly father, you’re being pretty disingenuous.

sure go ahead and minimize the teacher deaths. Go through the feed, if you can. A lot of them were working in person in schools. Or just google.

or just keep going and minimize the teacher deaths....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That Brown document is an educational policy document. Not a medical or epidemiological report. It speaks in aggregate terms. I wouldn’t pin my kids’ safety on it.

Great! No one wants to take away virtual.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They did not divide APS middle and high into cohorts. They could have. They had all summer to do it. They didn’t. And they didn’t resort them. So they are not cohort of our kids and are not coming anything close to best practices. That’s why they shouldn’t open middle and high. They are also not doing testing. Read articles in today’s NYT article about England and secondary students. They are doing MASSIVE AMOUNTS of surveillance testing and they are STILL debating whether to open.

Agree. Get elementary back 5 days a week NOW and hybrid for MS/HS when rates go down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you teachers so special again? 50 percent of our country’s teachers are back in the classroom. You teachers who want to stay home despite seeing the mental health and educational harms to kids are a disgrace. You all should just resign and let the dedicated lot of young teachers start helping them kids recover from this tragedy

Here in Arlington, dozens of schools been open in person since August. Those teachers have gone back to the classroom to teach. No issues.

No issues? LMAO here. Tell them to my friend whose daycare has opened and closed, opened and closed due to cases. Right here in ARLINGTON.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They did not divide APS middle and high into cohorts. They could have. They had all summer to do it. They didn’t. And they didn’t resort them. So they are not cohort of our kids and are not coming anything close to best practices. That’s why they shouldn’t open middle and high. They are also not doing testing. Read articles in today’s NYT article about England and secondary students. They are doing MASSIVE AMOUNTS of surveillance testing and they are STILL debating whether to open.

Agree. Get elementary back 5 days a week NOW and hybrid for MS/HS when rates go down.

They can’t do 5 day a week with physical distancing. Physical distancing and masks are the 2 main mitigation strategies. No district will see 5 days til fall 2021.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Check out School Personnel Lost To Covid on Twitter.

It's heartbreaking. There are so many that you wonder how the hell schools are open.

That Twitter account is a good amount of emotional manipulation. When you include as purported school-related covid deaths private music instructors who didn’t work for any schools and a woman who most likely caught it from her elderly father, you’re being pretty disingenuous.

sure go ahead and minimize the teacher deaths. Go through the feed, if you can. A lot of them were working in person in schools. Or just google.

or just keep going and minimize the teacher deaths....

It’s not minimizing teacher deaths, it’s refusing to make policy decisions based on a misleading and manipulative Twitter account. That account doesn’t provide any data, it doesn’t even provide evidence to suggest the teachers contracted the virus at schools (if anything, the stories that had some indication o go where it was likely caught indicates it was somewhere other than the school). All you’re doing by citing to this is to try to shame people into adopting your opinion because you don’t have actual evidence to support it. Those individuals were real people, not just tools for your agenda.

Also, if you’d actually read the feed yourself, you’d see that a lot of them weren’t teachers. But I guess bus drivers aren’t as compelling to you, they’re fungible in your world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you teachers so special again? 50 percent of our country’s teachers are back in the classroom. You teachers who want to stay home despite seeing the mental health and educational harms to kids are a disgrace. You all should just resign and let the dedicated lot of young teachers start helping them kids recover from this tragedy

Here in Arlington, dozens of schools been open in person since August. Those teachers have gone back to the classroom to teach. No issues.

No issues? LMAO here. Tell them to my friend whose daycare has opened and closed, opened and closed due to cases. Right here in ARLINGTON.

DP. Daycare is different from school.

[Anonymous]

Hey, late to the party and can’t scroll through 33 pages- is the rumor that there will be some kids going back in Jan and Feb? I’ve got a 2nd grader who was floundering with DL, and am trying to figure out if I have to send him away again to his grandparents to facilitate his DL. I had brought him home for the holidays.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Staff was told verbally (guessing this was intentional). Only know of ES phases: PK-K go back in January; 1st and 2nd February; 3rd through 5th in March.

I don't know if you are APS, but this time line is completely inaccurate now. All will be back in mid Februrary.

I was regretting picking DL and foreclosing any hybrid for the year til I saw this. I hope for the sake of those who did choose hybrid that this isn’t true. This is basically APS caving to APE and the Wash Post. Drama and fear of publicity over science and safety for staff and students. I hope they start to have fully staffed live school board meetings BEFORE they send teachers back to the classroom.

This. AND that all of central office is working in the office, not from home, before they tell us it is "safe" to send our kids into school.

I think they should have to work in schools, with children, first.

Agree 100%. No one should be sent into a classroom until the school board, central offices, and BOS resume all meetings in person. And they have to have lunch together in those same meeting rooms, too.

Again, lunch in a classroom with 12 kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Staff was told verbally (guessing this was intentional). Only know of ES phases: PK-K go back in January; 1st and 2nd February; 3rd through 5th in March.

I don't know if you are APS, but this time line is completely inaccurate now. All will be back in mid Februrary.

I was regretting picking DL and foreclosing any hybrid for the year til I saw this. I hope for the sake of those who did choose hybrid that this isn’t true. This is basically APS caving to APE and the Wash Post. Drama and fear of publicity over science and safety for staff and students. I hope they start to have fully staffed live school board meetings BEFORE they send teachers back to the classroom.

This. AND that all of central office is working in the office, not from home, before they tell us it is "safe" to send our kids into school.

I think they should have to work in schools, with children, first.

Agree 100%. No one should be sent into a classroom until the school board, central offices, and BOS resume all meetings in person. And they have to have lunch together in those same meeting rooms, too.

I realize (hope?) you are all being facetious, it this is just stupid. If we’re going to open schools, we need everyone else taking every measure possible to minimize the risk of transmission so no one catches it at home or at a school board meeting and then brings it into the schools. I support opening schools (hybrid, masks, distancing, etc.), but am also willing to otherwise lock down as much as possible to help keep schools safe (and have been doing so all along so as to not risk contributing to virus spread that would make it more dangerous).