Robert Frost beats Takoma Park in Mathcounts

[Anonymous]

Thank you for sharing OP. Those numbers are interesting but they are not the same thing as identifying the "highly able." The number considered in this scenario represent those tested who are identified as "performing above grade level."

MCPS narrows down this group even further into based on Cogat, report card, etc. and other criteria. This is the group that is reviewed by the selection committee and we would need to see this data to have a fair view.

Anybody else notice that many black students were already applying to Takoma under the old system? Even more than whites despite being a smaller percentage of MCPS. 198 students versus 64 for whites. Undermines part of the argument about many URM families not knowing about the magnet application process or not having time to apply. I do see the number of Latino students being considered went up dramatically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Anybody else notice that many black students were already applying to Takoma under the old system? Even more than whites despite being a smaller percentage of MCPS. 198 students versus 64 for whites. Undermines part of the argument about many URM families not knowing about the magnet application process or not having time to apply. I do see the number of Latino students being considered went up dramatically.

PP who posted the link. I did notice that. I don’t really know MoCo demographics. Are more White kids attending home schools that are generally high performing, so the parents of the bright students aren’t particularly motivated to send them to a different school? Or are there more Black families who live close to Takoma Park, so the bus ride isn’t as big of an issue?

[Anonymous]

From 2017-18, the number of Asian students invited to Takoma went down by 10 but the number of families who have protested or filed DOE complaints seems to imply a far number of outraged families. Wonder if the new system finds other Asians, not necessarily the ones who would have applied under the old system, maybe because of peer cohort or because they want to make sure every elementary is included?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anybody else notice that many black students were already applying to Takoma under the old system? Even more than whites despite being a smaller percentage of MCPS. 198 students versus 64 for whites. Undermines part of the argument about many URM families not knowing about the magnet application process or not having time to apply. I do see the number of Latino students being considered went up dramatically.

PP who posted the link. I did notice that. I don’t really know MoCo demographics. Are more White kids attending home schools that are generally high performing, so the parents of the bright students aren’t particularly motivated to send them to a different school? Or are there more Black families who live close to Takoma Park, so the bus ride isn’t as big of an issue?

Both of those seem reasonable explanations for part of the trend. I was also wondering if black families, probably due to most of them being native English speakers familiar with how the U.S. works, benefited from the outreach by MCPS. I noticed MCPS actually did aggressive outreach under the old system to try to get families to apply. They sent out multiple voice messages, mailed flyers and other communications. At Title I and focus schools they also reached out to teachers to recommend students and had after school enrichment programs where they encouraged families to apply.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow! There is so much prejudice and blatant racism/classism in this thread. Some of the PPs should be ashamed of themselves.

By all accounts it’s tougher to get into this program than ever. All fifth graders are accepted and the top 100 only (out of 11,000 are admitted). These mythical kids who get in with mediocre scores don’t exist. And this view that children of hr directors or non profit administrators are lesser than. WT actual F??!! Which of you think your choice of career makes you superior (or smarter) than others? What about the kids of teachers, firefighters, social workers? Do you look down on your friends and neighbors like this in real life? Wow. I had no idea. As a non scientist I’ve never felt inferior to those who choose different career paths or areas of academic focus — why would that make them “smarter”?!

"Top 100" based on peer cohort, and not the entire county. That is what many are upset about. -signed a non scientist.

It’s the top performers at each school. That’s the top 100 in my book.

Your book seems to be written in crayon.

You have a very simplistic view. The kids who have attended a school with top notch teaching and excellent administration already have an advantage. They should be expected to (and do) perform higher than at schools with less advantages. Therefore students are compared with those who have gone through the same schooling as themselves. This is absolutely the most equitable way to assign spots. The kid who gets into Harvard from a school that has never sent a kid to the Ivy League before has achieved much more than a kid who went to the top schools and has a family legacy.

It’s bizarre how so many posters here deny their own privilege and think they are somehow superior to all and more deserving of a spot at a magnet. This implication that the kids from the east of the county are less deserving or not highly gifted is downright insulting, not to mention racist. You know they all scored 99th percentile too, right?

[Anonymous]

PP, I don't disagree with you but MCPS says, no, they did not all score 99th percentile too. There are kids with 70th percentile scores that got in. It's shocking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anybody else notice that many black students were already applying to Takoma under the old system? Even more than whites despite being a smaller percentage of MCPS. 198 students versus 64 for whites. Undermines part of the argument about many URM families not knowing about the magnet application process or not having time to apply. I do see the number of Latino students being considered went up dramatically.

PP who posted the link. I did notice that. I don’t really know MoCo demographics. Are more White kids attending home schools that are generally high performing, so the parents of the bright students aren’t particularly motivated to send them to a different school? Or are there more Black families who live close to Takoma Park, so the bus ride isn’t as big of an issue?

Both of those seem reasonable explanations for part of the trend. I was also wondering if black families, probably due to most of them being native English speakers familiar with how the U.S. works, benefited from the outreach by MCPS. I noticed MCPS actually did aggressive outreach under the old system to try to get families to apply. They sent out multiple voice messages, mailed flyers and other communications. At Title I and focus schools they also reached out to teachers to recommend students and had after school enrichment programs where they encouraged families to apply.

I think it’s much more likely that there is an error in the charts in that article. Look at the numbers considered for Takoma Park 2017 by race. They don’t add up to the total number, with approx 200 missing from any of the groups. Then look at the number of white kids considered for 2017 at Takoma Park. Compare that with the number of white kids who got in on the next chart. Almost all of them. The number of white kids considered is likely off by 200, regardless the charts are not reliable so I don’t think you can draw any conclusions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, I don't disagree with you but MCPS says, no, they did not all score 99th percentile too. There are kids with 70th percentile scores that got in. It's shocking.

Where? Where are these kids? Where is this evidence? I don’t believe there are students who scored 70th percentile across the board and were considered. Maybe one score but not on all criteria, which is not shocking at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, I don't disagree with you but MCPS says, no, they did not all score 99th percentile too. There are kids with 70th percentile scores that got in. It's shocking.

Where? Where are these kids? Where is this evidence? I don’t believe there are students who scored 70th percentile across the board and were considered. Maybe one score but not on all criteria, which is not shocking at all.

I agree we really need to see evidence of 70th percentile, if it exists. If that is really true then it would definitely change the magnet peer group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anybody else notice that many black students were already applying to Takoma under the old system? Even more than whites despite being a smaller percentage of MCPS. 198 students versus 64 for whites. Undermines part of the argument about many URM families not knowing about the magnet application process or not having time to apply. I do see the number of Latino students being considered went up dramatically.

This number is off by at least 200. There's a mistake on the chart. The numbers don't add up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow! There is so much prejudice and blatant racism/classism in this thread. Some of the PPs should be ashamed of themselves.

By all accounts it’s tougher to get into this program than ever. All fifth graders are accepted and the top 100 only (out of 11,000 are admitted). These mythical kids who get in with mediocre scores don’t exist. And this view that children of hr directors or non profit administrators are lesser than. WT actual F??!! Which of you think your choice of career makes you superior (or smarter) than others? What about the kids of teachers, firefighters, social workers? Do you look down on your friends and neighbors like this in real life? Wow. I had no idea. As a non scientist I’ve never felt inferior to those who choose different career paths or areas of academic focus — why would that make them “smarter”?!

"Top 100" based on peer cohort, and not the entire county. That is what many are upset about. -signed a non scientist.

It’s the top performers at each school. That’s the top 100 in my book.

Your book seems to be written in crayon.

You have a very simplistic view. The kids who have attended a school with top notch teaching and excellent administration already have an advantage. They should be expected to (and do) perform higher than at schools with less advantages. Therefore students are compared with those who have gone through the same schooling as themselves. This is absolutely the most equitable way to assign spots. The kid who gets into Harvard from a school that has never sent a kid to the Ivy League before has achieved much more than a kid who went to the top schools and has a family legacy.

It’s bizarre how so many posters here deny their own privilege and think they are somehow superior to all and more deserving of a spot at a magnet. This implication that the kids from the east of the county are less deserving or not highly gifted is downright insulting, not to mention racist. You know they all scored 99th percentile too, right?

Yes I saw the data the county shared last year most were 99% there were a rare couple whose scores were in the high 90s but I’m willing to believe there were reasons for it. By and large the magnet remains kids with straight 99s. The people staring otherwise are the same ones arguing that magnets are in decline because Frost one a single event despite TOMS crushing them the previous month at the AMC8.

[Anonymous]

Between the 4 ms magnets there are 1000 seats awarded to the top kids from a pool of 12000. By definition not all of them can be in the top 1%. Even just Takoma has 125 seats which is more than 1% of 12k. You people are basically insane.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Between the 4 ms magnets there are 1000 seats awarded to the top kids from a pool of 12000. By definition not all of them can be in the top 1%. Even just Takoma has 125 seats which is more than 1% of 12k. You people are basically insane.

1000 seats per grade at the four test in middle school magnets?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Between the 4 ms magnets there are 1000 seats awarded to the top kids from a pool of 12000. By definition not all of them can be in the top 1%. Even just Takoma has 125 seats which is more than 1% of 12k. You people are basically insane.

1000 seats per grade at the four test in middle school magnets?

DP.. I thought there were only three MS test in magnets -- Clemente, TP and Eastern. And yea, for TP and Eastern, it's more like 125 each (x2 = 250). Not sure about Clemente but I doubt it's 750 kids there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Between the 4 ms magnets there are 1000 seats awarded to the top kids from a pool of 12000. By definition not all of them can be in the top 1%. Even just Takoma has 125 seats which is more than 1% of 12k. You people are basically insane.

I thought there were 500 seats for the 4 magnets (125 each). So that would be about top 4%. Is it possible that top 4% of MCPS is top 1% nationally? Yes, but unlikely. There are multiple measures considered and the same kids aren’t necessarily top 1% in each measure, so it’s possible that most of the accepted kids are 99th %ile nationally in at least 1 measure. But MCPS data show there are kids getting in who are significantly lower on at least one measure.