Confused about all the gender bending

[Anonymous]

I’m mostly straight (which I’ve never discussed with my kids), but they often note that I think more like a dad than a mom and tend to be more interested in typically male hobbies. I attribute this to growing up in an overwhelmingly male family. I have had more long term friendships with males than women, but never questioned whether my biological sex matched my internal gender. So I can’t judge someone else for not conforming to the majority culture’s perception of what it means to be female. These girls are finding how to be comfortable in a society that is very hostile to females no matter what your third wave Pinterest feminism tells you. If 2/3 of them spend their teens through twenties avoiding relationships with makes, I would not be surprised. Those are dangerous years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Our generation worked so hard to expand the notion of what it means to be female--you can be strong, ambitious, loud, athletic, aggressive, whatever--and now it seems like kids are putting "female" in this small, weak box and identifying anything outside that stereotype as something other.”

OP here. This! It makes me so sad. Womanhood is so powerful, and I know I have set an empowering example. That is partly why I am confused.

+1. Don’t stand for this OP. Please have some serious conversations with your DD about where she’s getting this and why it’s so attractive to her now. She needs guidance and moral clarity from her parents. Please do not leave this for her to “figure out” on her own. She’s entered a cesspool and needs help before she is completely sucked in.

Do you have recommendations for conversion therapy?

Don’t be an ass. “Conversion therapy” is not an issue because there is nothing to convert. OPs young tween is “experimenting.”

why do you need serious conversations and moral clarity about experimenting?

PP here and excuse me, I misspoke. OP did not say that her child is experimenting. She said that she is “confused.” Are you seriously telling me that parents should not step in with mature guidance and moral clarity when their child expresses confusion, especially about an issue this fundamental to their very nature?

DP. OP said that she (OP) is confused. It seems like the daughter isn't; she knows she's pansexual.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Our generation worked so hard to expand the notion of what it means to be female--you can be strong, ambitious, loud, athletic, aggressive, whatever--and now it seems like kids are putting "female" in this small, weak box and identifying anything outside that stereotype as something other.”

OP here. This! It makes me so sad. Womanhood is so powerful, and I know I have set an empowering example. That is partly why I am confused.

+1. Don’t stand for this OP. Please have some serious conversations with your DD about where she’s getting this and why it’s so attractive to her now. She needs guidance and moral clarity from her parents. Please do not leave this for her to “figure out” on her own. She’s entered a cesspool and needs help before she is completely sucked in.

Do you have recommendations for conversion therapy?

Don’t be an ass. “Conversion therapy” is not an issue because there is nothing to convert. OPs young tween is “experimenting.”

why do you need serious conversations and moral clarity about experimenting?

PP here and excuse me, I misspoke. OP did not say that her child is experimenting. She said that she is “confused.” Are you seriously telling me that parents should not step in with mature guidance and moral clarity when their child expresses confusion, especially about an issue this fundamental to their very nature?

The child doesn’t sound confused. The parent sounds confused by the child. It’s like when the kid pays attention during school and then the parent tries to fit e them to do the math problem a different way so that the parent understands it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An awful lot of people in this discussion, including OP, need to learn the difference between gender and sexuality.

Yes this is such a problem.

Sexuality is who you’re attracted to (and not necessarily in a sexual way, it can just refer to crushes).

Gender is more complicated but we can think about it by exploring how we would feel if somebody called “sir” if we are a woman or “ma’am” if we are a man. We might not be able to put a finger on why it is inappropriate but we all know that it feels wrong.

Gender and sexuality are not binary (there aren’t just two), they are bimodal. which is a statistical term where you can look at the spectrum of how people identity with their gender and you will see two humps where most people identify as a man or woman (with some being Uber-men and some super-(feminine) and then some are in between those two bigger curves.

Technically, this is incorrect. There are two genders, as determined by the XY or XX chromosomes. How someone feels is a completely different discussion.

Technically, you’re wrong. Neither sex nor gender are binary.

https://cadehildreth.com/gender-spectrum/

https://slate.com/technology/2018/11/sex-binary-gender-neither-exist.html

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/voices/stop-using-phony-science-to-justify-transphobia/

https://www.realclearscience.com/2018/10/29/human_sex_isn039t_binary_but_it_is_bimodal_283395.html

I would think this would be particularly obvious in the case of sex, since we all know that some people have XXY chromosomes and other combinations outside of your usual XX or XY.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An awful lot of people in this discussion, including OP, need to learn the difference between gender and sexuality.

Yes this is such a problem.

Sexuality is who you’re attracted to (and not necessarily in a sexual way, it can just refer to crushes).

Gender is more complicated but we can think about it by exploring how we would feel if somebody called “sir” if we are a woman or “ma’am” if we are a man. We might not be able to put a finger on why it is inappropriate but we all know that it feels wrong.

Gender and sexuality are not binary (there aren’t just two), they are bimodal. which is a statistical term where you can look at the spectrum of how people identity with their gender and you will see two humps where most people identify as a man or woman (with some being Uber-men and some super-(feminine) and then some are in between those two bigger curves.

Technically, this is incorrect. There are two genders, as determined by the XY or XX chromosomes. How someone feels is a completely different discussion.

You are talking about sex not gender and not sexuality... and there are 5 not 2, male, female, herms, merms, and ferms.

hermaphrodites, whom I call herms, who possess one testis and one ovary (the sperm- and egg-producing vessels, or gonads); the male pseudohermaphrodites (the "merms"), who have testes and some aspects of the female genitalia but no ovaries; and the female pseudohermaphrodites (the "ferms"), who have ovaries and some aspects of the male genitalia but lack testes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Our generation worked so hard to expand the notion of what it means to be female--you can be strong, ambitious, loud, athletic, aggressive, whatever--and now it seems like kids are putting "female" in this small, weak box and identifying anything outside that stereotype as something other.”

OP here. This! It makes me so sad. Womanhood is so powerful, and I know I have set an empowering example. That is partly why I am confused.

+1. Don’t stand for this OP. Please have some serious conversations with your DD about where she’s getting this and why it’s so attractive to her now. She needs guidance and moral clarity from her parents. Please do not leave this for her to “figure out” on her own. She’s entered a cesspool and needs help before she is completely sucked in.

Do you have recommendations for conversion therapy?

Don’t be an ass. “Conversion therapy” is not an issue because there is nothing to convert. OPs young tween is “experimenting.”

why do you need serious conversations and moral clarity about experimenting?

PP here and excuse me, I misspoke. OP did not say that her child is experimenting. She said that she is “confused.” Are you seriously telling me that parents should not step in with mature guidance and moral clarity when their child expresses confusion, especially about an issue this fundamental to their very nature?

The child doesn’t sound confused. The parent sounds confused by the child. It’s like when the kid pays attention during school and then the parent tries to fit e them to do the math problem a different way so that the parent understands it.

Pp again. OP states that neither she nor her DH have ever been “confused about their heterosexuality” as her daughter now is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Our generation worked so hard to expand the notion of what it means to be female--you can be strong, ambitious, loud, athletic, aggressive, whatever--and now it seems like kids are putting "female" in this small, weak box and identifying anything outside that stereotype as something other.”

OP here. This! It makes me so sad. Womanhood is so powerful, and I know I have set an empowering example. That is partly why I am confused.

+1. Don’t stand for this OP. Please have some serious conversations with your DD about where she’s getting this and why it’s so attractive to her now. She needs guidance and moral clarity from her parents. Please do not leave this for her to “figure out” on her own. She’s entered a cesspool and needs help before she is completely sucked in.

Do you have recommendations for conversion therapy?

Don’t be an ass. “Conversion therapy” is not an issue because there is nothing to convert. OPs young tween is “experimenting.”

why do you need serious conversations and moral clarity about experimenting?

PP here and excuse me, I misspoke. OP did not say that her child is experimenting. She said that she is “confused.” Are you seriously telling me that parents should not step in with mature guidance and moral clarity when their child expresses confusion, especially about an issue this fundamental to their very nature?

The child doesn’t sound confused. The parent sounds confused by the child. It’s like when the kid pays attention during school and then the parent tries to fit e them to do the math problem a different way so that the parent understands it.

Pp again. OP states that neither she nor her DH have ever been “confused about their heterosexuality” as her daughter now is.

Not everyone is heterosexual. Non-straight people aren't confused about their heterosexuality anymore than I'm "confused about my homosexuality" because I'm straight. The daughter doesn't sound confused in the least, only the parent.

[Anonymous]

The answer?

Just let her be and don't worry too much about it. She'll figure it out. Support her when she needs support. Don't stress if she changes course, in any direction. Listen to her when she talks.

That's it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The answer?

Just let her be and don't worry too much about it. She'll figure it out. Support her when she needs support. Don't stress if she changes course, in any direction. Listen to her when she talks.

That's it.

Disagree. She is a child and needs help and guidance. The last thing I would do is leave her alone to figure this out, under the influence of LGBTQ sites on the internet

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The answer?

Just let her be and don't worry too much about it. She'll figure it out. Support her when she needs support. Don't stress if she changes course, in any direction. Listen to her when she talks.

That's it.

Disagree. She is a child and needs help and guidance. The last thing I would do is leave her alone to figure this out, under the influence of LGBTQ sites on the internet

Then send her to a counselor that understands LGBTQ... but don't leave it to a parent that thinks there is only XX and XY.

[Anonymous]

Parent of a trans female child here.

Having seen thread titles like this in the past, I steeled myself before reading because I’m often so disheartened by the comments/replies.

I have to say, I am near tears seeing all the supportive “live and let live” comments here, both with respect to gender and sexuality. Thank you, DCUM peeps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Girls like attention and claiming to be different in a fundamental way, especially a socially acceptable one for the time period, is a GREAT way to get attention and kudos in your social circles. In the 90s, a WHOLE bunch of girls claimed to be "depressed and suicidal" a la Kurt Cobain and would walk around literally talking all day about how sad and depressed they were. Magically this mostly went away in the 2000s when it was no longer en vogue to act like a crazy suicidal person. Bisexual was all the rage in the 2000s and all the girls were flaunting that they kissed their best female friend or whatever. Now it's parasexual transfluid whatever. I have no doubt that some people are literally gender nonconforming for valid biological or psychological reasons but I guarantee you 95% of these girls are just attention seeking. I have a colleague whose daughter claimed to start living her life as a man when she was 13, changed her name and everything. By 17 she was done with it. "just a phase bro"

+1 For many of these girls, it is just a phase. I don't see any harm in it... just continue to be supportive and loving. As an interesting side note, from my experience as a high school teacher in FCPS (so I've taught about 2200 students over the past 15 years), most of these girls are white. FWIW, our school population is about 30-35% white. This also makes me think it is a trend rather than truly biological or psychological.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Girls like attention and claiming to be different in a fundamental way, especially a socially acceptable one for the time period, is a GREAT way to get attention and kudos in your social circles. In the 90s, a WHOLE bunch of girls claimed to be "depressed and suicidal" a la Kurt Cobain and would walk around literally talking all day about how sad and depressed they were. Magically this mostly went away in the 2000s when it was no longer en vogue to act like a crazy suicidal person. Bisexual was all the rage in the 2000s and all the girls were flaunting that they kissed their best female friend or whatever. Now it's parasexual transfluid whatever. I have no doubt that some people are literally gender nonconforming for valid biological or psychological reasons but I guarantee you 95% of these girls are just attention seeking. I have a colleague whose daughter claimed to start living her life as a man when she was 13, changed her name and everything. By 17 she was done with it. "just a phase bro"

+1 For many of these girls, it is just a phase. I don't see any harm in it... just continue to be supportive and loving. As an interesting side note, from my experience as a high school teacher in FCPS (so I've taught about 2200 students over the past 15 years), most of these girls are white. FWIW, our school population is about 30-35% white. This also makes me think it is a trend rather than truly biological or psychological.

Couldn't it also be that gender nonconformity has more of a stigma generally among nonwhites?

[Anonymous]

I have a teen who has told us she is bisexual. She hasn't had any sexual experiences with either gender yet. We've basically said, thanks for sharing this with us, we love you no matter who or what you love, and we will always support you but what you decide to do in your love life is your decision, we want you to be safe and responsible. That's really all there is to it. She'll decide what all this means to her and how it will play out and I'm just here to be her parent and guide her to be a good person. We haven't discussed it at length or debated it with her the same that we haven't debated her brother's assertions that he is heterosexual and attracted to girls.

[Anonymous]

Parents are right to be concerned about internet rabbit holes, be they LGBTQ affirmative or not. But that’s more an issue of the dangers of screen time and the importance of media literacy. Kids need to know the difference between a good source and a bad one.

My child came to me with issues of gender dysphoria she had learned, and I asked her where she learned about it. She showed me her browsing history and it was Mayo Clinic, Wikipedia, webmd, the family acceptance project, etc. there were some YouTube videos she watched but they were fine. She only has an out of internet time a day and I am glad she put in practice what I taught her about finding good sources and fact-checking.

She knows the difference between a good source and Reddit. All kids should learn this.