How many DC residents do not have ID cards of some sort?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have tried to help a couple of homeless people here get IDs and it is HARD. I was not successful. You need a full on social worker to make that happen and that's not always easy to arrange.

It is a big hurdle to getting help for people - many of them are not getting what they need.

When it comes to voting, the local homeless service center can help with that. They can even request vote by mail to that address.

Same with Covid vaccine -- the homeless center coordinated it.

Same with registering kids for school -- you do not need to prove residency if you are homeless -- the homeless center fills out a from to vouch you are a resident.

The percentage of people who are homeless or mentally ill _and_ do not have an ID has to be quite small. How about just making an exception for them, like if the homeless center vouches for them?

[Anonymous]

OP here. I think people are inferring that I am making some sort of voting argument here. I am not. Simply asking about how many DC residents do not have some sort of valid ID. I asked because I have been hearing for months about no ID required to get vaccine, no ID required to do any number of things in DC including voting.

And I just could not think of a good reason why someone might not have an ID card of some sort.

I still have really not heard any on this thread. If you are homeless and have no ID card or Birth Certificate, there are organizations who are paid millions by the DC gov and the Fed to help you get your ID. They will also help you sign up for Medicare and medicaid and social security as well.

And as a black DC resident I just don't buy thousands of disenfranchised black DC residents not having ID.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The people who were born on a kitchen table by kerosene lantern in an unheated, dirt floor shack on a subsistence farm in the middle of nowhere and whose birth was recorded, if at all, in a tattered family Bible somewhere are for the most part dead of old age my now.

The people who claim getting identification is too expensive or complex for them seem for the most part to afford other things, including cigarettes, drugs and booze, and to be able to handle normal transactions, like getting a prepaid cell phone. And if they’re really broke there typically are fee waivers available, and social service organizations to help them get straightened out if they want to.

The chronically disorganized really shouldn’t be setting the standard and even they usually can organize the things they really care about.

The truly mentally ill are unfortunate and it is hard not to sympathize with them, but again they really should not be the standard.

We have become way to much of a “show your papers” society. People with no business having copies of our drivers licenses routinely demand and scan them to keep in perpetuity. Even worse are the “show ID” transactions where possession of something that looks valid is enough.

All this being said, there are times when it is reasonable and important to be able confirm who a person is. The idea that it is oppressive to require people to have identification when they might have some trouble getting or maintaining possession of it is dramatically exaggerated. It comes up most often in the context of voter ID laws. People routinely show ID to visit their kid’s school, enter office buildings, get government services, get medical care, buy booze and cigarettes, and even see movies. But suddenly it’s a wholesale disenfranchisement to want to confirm that voters are who they claim to be? Not a persuasive claim.

I agree. It seems to me one solution is to accept expired IDs for voting also. I realize not everyone may keep their IDs up to date, but most people have them.

And guess what? DC offers FREE non-driver ID cards if you are a senior citizen, homeless, or were recently let out of prison:
https://dmv.dc.gov/node/1120181

Guess what??? You still have to have all the correct documents, which cost money, and transportation to the DMV, and be able to get the time off work.

Life requires effort. Are you hungry? You have to travel to some place to buy food, then cook it or purchase it already cooked. Later you have to do the dishes.

Yes, getting an ID requires some effort, once every few years. What does one do in life that doesn't require effort?

This. Nobody works 24/7/52. Social security cards are easy to get/replace. The birth certificate is $23 in DC but there is a fee waiver program. Honestly, do PP’s dithering about this do any research, actually know anyone in this position, or just hysterically repeat what somebody else told them to show how “caring” they are?

I, personally, have known many people in this position.
My sense reading through this thread and the other one in the Politics section is that at least some people who have never had this problem and who have never tried to help anyone else who had this problem successfully address it are assuming that it could not possibly be a real problem. I’m not clear if it’s politically driven or not. It does stand out that the voices crowing about how easy this is to fix and how ignorant other people just have to be if they don’t see it as easy — without exception, do not describe even one example of their own experience helping anyone without a birth certificate obtain an ID.

My first responses were to what I thought were genuine questions. I know many people in my parents generation who are very much alive, who lack birth certificates. I also made a guess that people whose own experiences include more paperwork than trusting, good faith relationships, might not realize how other communities, or communities a few decades ago functioned, and how many people are grandfathered in to their current situations without additional paperwork.
At this point, any one protesting this reality clearly either doesn’t understand what they’re reading — or doesn’t want to understand.

[Anonymous]

I am black. My dad was born at home on NYE and his birth certificate says 1 Jan because that is when the doctor was sober enough to write it. He still had zero issues getting an ID. His mom, my grandma, thought it was important for him to have an ID so he got one in school. He has had any number of Id's for seventy years. As have I. Though the DMV weird schedule has me carrying an expired driver's license for the first time in my life.

[Anonymous]

I guess this is one of those things where it's a non-issue in metropolitan areas. There are tons of services that help with aquiring stuff like ID's and such in a big city. There's almost no excuse except for having some mental health or physical disability issue. Rural areas of the deep south, Appalachia, and parts of the midwest are a different story I bet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess this is one of those things where it's a non-issue in metropolitan areas. There are tons of services that help with aquiring stuff like ID's and such in a big city. There's almost no excuse except for having some mental health or physical disability issue. Rural areas of the deep south, Appalachia, and parts of the midwest are a different story I bet.

A lot of people have those. Just saying.

[Anonymous]

I am fascinated by the stories of people on this thread. ID or no ID gets tangled into a nasty political topic because it suits the goals of those spinning division based on racism. I don’t think we should approach it like that at all. This handle of stories are educational - which is what we all need - an understanding and appreciation of what others have encountered so that we can identify solutions if needed. In 2021 - nobody in this country should be without a clear route to get an ID.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The people who were born on a kitchen table by kerosene lantern in an unheated, dirt floor shack on a subsistence farm in the middle of nowhere and whose birth was recorded, if at all, in a tattered family Bible somewhere are for the most part dead of old age my now.

The people who claim getting identification is too expensive or complex for them seem for the most part to afford other things, including cigarettes, drugs and booze, and to be able to handle normal transactions, like getting a prepaid cell phone. And if they’re really broke there typically are fee waivers available, and social service organizations to help them get straightened out if they want to.

The chronically disorganized really shouldn’t be setting the standard and even they usually can organize the things they really care about.

The truly mentally ill are unfortunate and it is hard not to sympathize with them, but again they really should not be the standard.

We have become way to much of a “show your papers” society. People with no business having copies of our drivers licenses routinely demand and scan them to keep in perpetuity. Even worse are the “show ID” transactions where possession of something that looks valid is enough.

All this being said, there are times when it is reasonable and important to be able confirm who a person is. The idea that it is oppressive to require people to have identification when they might have some trouble getting or maintaining possession of it is dramatically exaggerated. It comes up most often in the context of voter ID laws. People routinely show ID to visit their kid’s school, enter office buildings, get government services, get medical care, buy booze and cigarettes, and even see movies. But suddenly it’s a wholesale disenfranchisement to want to confirm that voters are who they claim to be? Not a persuasive claim.

I agree. It seems to me one solution is to accept expired IDs for voting also. I realize not everyone may keep their IDs up to date, but most people have them.

And guess what? DC offers FREE non-driver ID cards if you are a senior citizen, homeless, or were recently let out of prison:
https://dmv.dc.gov/node/1120181

Guess what??? You still have to have all the correct documents, which cost money, and transportation to the DMV, and be able to get the time off work.

Life requires effort. Are you hungry? You have to travel to some place to buy food, then cook it or purchase it already cooked. Later you have to do the dishes.

Yes, getting an ID requires some effort, once every few years. What does one do in life that doesn't require effort?

This. Nobody works 24/7/52. Social security cards are easy to get/replace. The birth certificate is $23 in DC but there is a fee waiver program. Honestly, do PP’s dithering about this do any research, actually know anyone in this position, or just hysterically repeat what somebody else told them to show how “caring” they are?

+100

So people can buy booze, rent a car, tour an apartment, etc with an ID just fine, but it's too much to ask for the same when voting? When I went to college in a small, rural town ~10 years ago, I constantly saw a little truck that drove around and offered people ID cards, drivers licenses, etc. I used a similar truck quite often in my yuppie neighborhood in N. Arlington.

[Anonymous]

^*used to see

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would conservatively estimate that probably 75% of AA people over 50 years old lack any form of govt ID at all. It just wasn’t done before the 70’s. And they’ve grown up and lived their whole lives without ever driving or traveling, or being able to get a job. You people live very sheltered lives, and have no idea what life is like in the AA community.

or in the rural areas of the country. It's also true for whites in these areas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would conservatively estimate that probably 75% of AA people over 50 years old lack any form of govt ID at all. It just wasn’t done before the 70’s. And they’ve grown up and lived their whole lives without ever driving or traveling, or being able to get a job. You people live very sheltered lives, and have no idea what life is like in the AA community.

You must be kidding.
Of the over 50 African American crowd I know, have drivers licenses, a few with passports. Yes, there are the homeless and people who have been institutionalized and people who just can't get their $h!t together, but they are not 75%. Even among my southern relatives (AfAm side) they have drivers licenses and some have their military IDs.

You are clueless. There are lots of people who don't have visas and do not have up to date licenses. My mother and the siblings all had a hard time post 9/11 as they had to get their ids updated and none of them had birth certificates. None were born in a hospital.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The people who were born on a kitchen table by kerosene lantern in an unheated, dirt floor shack on a subsistence farm in the middle of nowhere and whose birth was recorded, if at all, in a tattered family Bible somewhere are for the most part dead of old age my now.

The people who claim getting identification is too expensive or complex for them seem for the most part to afford other things, including cigarettes, drugs and booze, and to be able to handle normal transactions, like getting a prepaid cell phone. And if they’re really broke there typically are fee waivers available, and social service organizations to help them get straightened out if they want to.

The chronically disorganized really shouldn’t be setting the standard and even they usually can organize the things they really care about.

The truly mentally ill are unfortunate and it is hard not to sympathize with them, but again they really should not be the standard.

We have become way to much of a “show your papers” society. People with no business having copies of our drivers licenses routinely demand and scan them to keep in perpetuity. Even worse are the “show ID” transactions where possession of something that looks valid is enough.

All this being said, there are times when it is reasonable and important to be able confirm who a person is. The idea that it is oppressive to require people to have identification when they might have some trouble getting or maintaining possession of it is dramatically exaggerated. It comes up most often in the context of voter ID laws. People routinely show ID to visit their kid’s school, enter office buildings, get government services, get medical care, buy booze and cigarettes, and even see movies. But suddenly it’s a wholesale disenfranchisement to want to confirm that voters are who they claim to be? Not a persuasive claim.

I agree. It seems to me one solution is to accept expired IDs for voting also. I realize not everyone may keep their IDs up to date, but most people have them.

And guess what? DC offers FREE non-driver ID cards if you are a senior citizen, homeless, or were recently let out of prison:
https://dmv.dc.gov/node/1120181

Guess what??? You still have to have all the correct documents, which cost money, and transportation to the DMV, and be able to get the time off work.

Life requires effort. Are you hungry? You have to travel to some place to buy food, then cook it or purchase it already cooked. Later you have to do the dishes.

Yes, getting an ID requires some effort, once every few years. What does one do in life that doesn't require effort?

This. Nobody works 24/7/52. Social security cards are easy to get/replace. The birth certificate is $23 in DC but there is a fee waiver program. Honestly, do PP’s dithering about this do any research, actually know anyone in this position, or just hysterically repeat what somebody else told them to show how “caring” they are?

+100

So people can buy booze, rent a car, tour an apartment, etc with an ID just fine, but it's too much to ask for the same when voting? When I went to college in a small, rural town ~10 years ago, I constantly saw a little truck that drove around and offered people ID cards, drivers licenses, etc. I used a similar truck quite often in my yuppie neighborhood in N. Arlington.

Southern Baptists don't do booze and yes, there are a lot of people who don't do those things. I've never, ever seen one of these trucks you mention.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Probably thousands.

There are plenty of older folks who were born in the rural south who are living in DC now and may not have ever had a birth certificate.

How did they get to DC? How do they get a social security check? How do they rent?

Many came to DC in search of educational opportunities for their children. They took the train, the bus, or came with other people by car. Imagine, for example, a SAHM who never drove. Any social security that she has would be based on her husband’s income and SS# . She might still live in the family home — a house that was purchased by her husband. Many people of a certain age were paid in cash and don’t qualify for social security benefits which, originally were deliberately crafted to leave out jobs that were disproportionately held by Black people.

Maybe go read up on the Great Migration.

The Great Migration was 100 years ago. There is no one collecting social security based on their husband who doesn't have their own SS#. Sorry... even in the 30s when Social Security was created and your point was actually true, the government made all sorts of accommodations... you could bring in a church document, you could bring in your mom or a sibling or a friend to verify your birth. They swore an affidavit and they gave you a SS#. We now fall over ourselves to accept documents from every country in the world. There is no one who can't get an ID if they want one.

Are there homeless and mentally ill people who have lost the card, sure? But even most of them receive SSI, so yes, someone is holding their paperwork.

The Great Migration ended around 197O — So widen your range a bit. No one has said that you “can’t” get an ID. Many of us have said that it can be expensive and difficult and a major hurdle for people who do not have birth certificates. The extreme difficulties are less about people who had these documents and lost them and more about people who never had them in the first place.

Post 911 it took 2 years to get my mother a birth certificate including all of us flying to the state she was born in to discuss the issue in person. She could not renew her driver's license without updating her paperwork. She never had a birth certificate and never needed one. Lots of people from the state she was born in had the same problem It affected her medical insurance and caused problems when she needed surgery. Two years. Her family had lived in her birth state for 100 years and was known. She lived in the house I grew up in for 40 years. She wasn't homeless or an immigrant. She was an American citizen who grew up in a time and place where being born at home wasn't unusual. She filled out all the paperwork and had called many times. They would never process her paperwork. Two years from the time she submitted the paperwork and they only completed it after we complained to the representative there.

[Anonymous]

And the woman is 94 and no one will stop her from voting. She's very up on politics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Every time I have showed up at a hospital or doctor's office, they asked for ID.

Only recently historically and most will accept an expired id.