Why do women compete with their friends?

[Anonymous]

I try to be a friend who lets other people feel comfortable expressing the imperfections of their lives to. I don't judge - just try to listen and say supportive things. it's very disarming to others. It works for me.

Good luck.

[Anonymous]

My secret to maintaining friendships is to keep a level of distance. I know it sounds counterintuitive, but my preferred adult relationships are all at arm's length. I intentionally stopped talking to a dear friend of mine biweekly because I started to dislike her. Now, we speak for an hour or so every two to three weeks. It gives us more things to catch up on, and the distance serves to maintain the needed balance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had this dynamic with a long time childhood friend. She was upset I had a family before she did and made a few hurtful comments about my husband and kids. When she finally got married and she and her husband made more money than us and lived in a fancier zip code- she was insufferable- she acted like we were less than her. We both mutually ended the friendship when she became pregnant. I couldn't stomach the thought of having to listen to endless stories/pics about how her awesome her kids were when she had disparaged mine.

+1 for only having this problem with a long time childhood friend. None of the friends I have made from college through adulthood are like this - they happy for my wins, empathetic for the losses, and I feel like they're on my side. We support and love each other.

Childhood friend got very mean when I had professional success right out of college, and took it personally when I wouldn't go out drinking or travel because of work obligations. Every conversation was about how I was such a loser for working long hours, and how I was going to die alone and never have fun again.

Then I got married in late 20s (she is/was single), took a big step back to go back to school and try something new and she would always comment about how sad it is that I'll never have the excitement of dating again, how boring it must be to only have sex with one person, faux-empathy about how difficult it must be to start a new career just dripping with condescension, about how her job is more important than mine, better paid, and how she works harder than me.

I stopped drinking after the kids came for health and mental reasons. I wasn't a messy/problem drinker other than occasionally in college, but she was there for it and now takes every opportunity possible to bring up this one specific night (10+ years ago!) where I threw up after drinking too much on a post-heartbreak/breakup bender. WTF lady, this was a decade ago and my poor, stupid little 20 year old heart was broken. Is it really that funny? BUT she also has to talk about how much more fun I was when I drank.

We don't see her often now because COVID, but before that also because her social life revolves around drinking and it's awkward for me. When we do see her it's just constant belittling for the strangest things (I'm wearing clothes I had a decade ago, how she would 'rather die' than live in my UMC 'boring' suburb, I am pathetic because we have the same vacations every year, I go to bed too early because I don't respond to texts after 10pm, most recently mocking me for being a 'basement dwelling loser' for not wanting to come over to her indoor wine and cheese night during COVID, which she held 3 days after being in the UK, etc.).

I want to ditch her permanently but she is close with a group of girls I've known my whole life and it would be really impossible without cutting them all off, which I don't want to do. She is not nearly as catty and mean with them, but was not as close growing up and had less in common with them from ~12-21 years old so I suspect she's hurt and/or angry that my priorities changed as I got older compared to hers. I never initiate contact but I am just dying to respond to the next text with 'if you think I'm such an insufferable loser, why do you keep messaging me?'.

PP here..you friend sounds worse/more frequently belittling than my friend who I cut off. I agree with the poster who said to set your boundaries and hold your ground. A lot of times a "why would you say something like that?" can really shut a person up. I feel for your situation in not bring able to excommunicate her due to your friend group. In my case, I held onto the toxic friend longer than I should of because of our very long history and mourning the awesome person she used to be when we were young

[Anonymous]

My friends and I don’t do that.

Either you’re hypersensitive or you need new friends.

[Anonymous]

There is only one woman like that in my circle, but she is not a friend, she is the wife of a friend, so I tolerate her. Never had any competitive vibes from my real friends or even my book club crowd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My secret to maintaining friendships is to keep a level of distance. I know it sounds counterintuitive, but my preferred adult relationships are all at arm's length. I intentionally stopped talking to a dear friend of mine biweekly because I started to dislike her. Now, we speak for an hour or so every two to three weeks. It gives us more things to catch up on, and the distance serves to maintain the needed balance.

Lol. I was telling someone awhile ago that my goal with the neighborhood moms is staying in that nice grey area of not being in the inner circle but not being an outcast. They really like to compete with each other and gossip. I have had good female friends that do no compete at all, but it can be hard to find.

[Anonymous]

GrannyGeorgianne wrote:I'm a Boomer and used to believe that intense female competition was a bit anachronistic. My own mother was fiercely competitive, and it frightened me. I assumed that a lot of it had to do with her generation being conditioned that way, along with limited professional and personal options for women. But after decades of observation, it seems like there isn't a whole lot of empathy and 'sisterhood' in the younger generations, although most of them don't have the level of desperation about limited opportunities.

I was always homely and socially inept, so I was able to cancel myself out of the social competition, but I did observe it. It's easy to be an observer when you fade into the background. Obviously, most competition is based primarily on looks, and what's interesting about that is that it's not the men who 'police' women's looks, it's other women.

This is so true. I have one feature that is very attractive to men- long, wavy and very thick auburn hair. Women like to make comments saying I need to do x,y and z about it so it's more acceptable to them- cut it, thin it out, get it straightened etc. My own mother thinks I should cut it and get a short "I need to speak to your manager" style. After all these comments over the years I have to assume they are envious.

[Anonymous]

These women described don't sound competitive--they sound like they have a lot of unresolved emotional issues.

I like to think I'm competitive... at Scrabble and volleyball. I never let my kids win at any games we play together just because. And as a kid, I loved winning various academic competitions. I also enjoy getting PRs on my Peloton rides even though I'm consistently in the bottom third of total cyclists.

Interesting that some PPs use the word "competitive" to describe unhealthy behaviors in women who obviously have some issues going on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My secret to maintaining friendships is to keep a level of distance. I know it sounds counterintuitive, but my preferred adult relationships are all at arm's length. I intentionally stopped talking to a dear friend of mine biweekly because I started to dislike her. Now, we speak for an hour or so every two to three weeks. It gives us more things to catch up on, and the distance serves to maintain the needed balance.

Lol. I was telling someone awhile ago that my goal with the neighborhood moms is staying in that nice grey area of not being in the inner circle but not being an outcast. They really like to compete with each other and gossip. I have had good female friends that do no compete at all, but it can be hard to find.

This is my goal, too. It didn't used to be. But I learned that being too involved in the "inner circle" just mean drama. Even when you try to stay out of it. The most common issue I've come across is that women can be jealous and competitive of friendships. If a woman perceives one member of the group to be her "best friend" and that BF starts spending time with a new person, that can cause huge problems.

Also, sometimes people are jealous of the weirdest stuff because of some specific issue they have. I once met a woman who was very competitive about being seen as the woman in our group with mental health issues. Like that's how she defined herself, and she considered herself an expert on mental health because of her own experience. And if someone talked about feeling depressed, dealing with anxiety, or seeing a therapist, she'd jump in and start telling them what to do. She'd even sometimes express skepticism about it and say things like "Oh, she's not really depressed, I can tell." It was really weird. Why would you compete over being depressed? It seems like normally you'd be glad to have a friend with a shared experience. But for her, it was her "thing" and she didn't want anyone encroaching not hat territory.

Anyway, yes, it's better to stay more on the edge of a group like that because you are much less likely to attract the attention of someone with those issues. I have my two really close friends from forever who I video chat with once a week, and with whom there is no real competition. And in any other friend group, I'm the one you don't think about at all but then when I show up to things you're like "Oh yeah, you're fun!" And I'm extremely happy with this role.

[Anonymous]

I feel sad for so many of you. And, you need new friends. I don't compete with my friends - I treasure them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My secret to maintaining friendships is to keep a level of distance. I know it sounds counterintuitive, but my preferred adult relationships are all at arm's length. I intentionally stopped talking to a dear friend of mine biweekly because I started to dislike her. Now, we speak for an hour or so every two to three weeks. It gives us more things to catch up on, and the distance serves to maintain the needed balance.

Lol. I was telling someone awhile ago that my goal with the neighborhood moms is staying in that nice grey area of not being in the inner circle but not being an outcast. They really like to compete with each other and gossip. I have had good female friends that do no compete at all, but it can be hard to find.

This is my goal, too. It didn't used to be. But I learned that being too involved in the "inner circle" just mean drama. Even when you try to stay out of it. The most common issue I've come across is that women can be jealous and competitive of friendships. If a woman perceives one member of the group to be her "best friend" and that BF starts spending time with a new person, that can cause huge problems.

Also, sometimes people are jealous of the weirdest stuff because of some specific issue they have. I once met a woman who was very competitive about being seen as the woman in our group with mental health issues. Like that's how she defined herself, and she considered herself an expert on mental health because of her own experience. And if someone talked about feeling depressed, dealing with anxiety, or seeing a therapist, she'd jump in and start telling them what to do. She'd even sometimes express skepticism about it and say things like "Oh, she's not really depressed, I can tell." It was really weird. Why would you compete over being depressed? It seems like normally you'd be glad to have a friend with a shared experience. But for her, it was her "thing" and she didn't want anyone encroaching not hat territory.

Anyway, yes, it's better to stay more on the edge of a group like that because you are much less likely to attract the attention of someone with those issues. I have my two really close friends from forever who I video chat with once a week, and with whom there is no real competition. And in any other friend group, I'm the one you don't think about at all but then when I show up to things you're like "Oh yeah, you're fun!" And I'm extremely happy with this role.

This actually may be a manifestation of her mental illness. My ex sister in law is like that. Whatever she has experienced, she is the expert because everyone’s experience must be the same as hers, and she doesn’t let go. It’s a part of her issues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dude, do you get that men have literally started wars to compete with family and friends? Stop acting like only women do this. Men still out here killing friends aver video games. A son recent,y killed his dad in a fight that started over $5.

This is where I usually end up...HUMANS are competitive. Men seem to handle it more violently than women do. It’s just sad and myopic to say this is a women problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Because they aren't friends. Friends don't compete.

This. I dropped every woman that was like this early on. And if I meet one like this and she befriends me and I see she's like this...I fade out.

I have a handful of incredibly close and supportive friends from each stage of my life.

You can see fairly soon when a woman is like this. By your 40s/50s, you don't deal with people like that.

It's an insecurity thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here.

I am skeptical of anyone who says that none of their friends ever do this. I think sometimes friends can go through good times where there isn't much competition and where people get along well. But if you have women friends for a long time, I think you inevitably hit patches where rivalry comes up. Again, I've seen it in friends from every era of my life at some point or another. I'll be rolling along great in a friendship and then something will shift -- someone starts a new relationship, work gets stressful, someone's marriage is on the rocks, etc. -- and dynamics change. I am struggling to think of a single female friendship I've had that hasn't had a phase like this.

I'm not saying women are naturally competitive or that all my friends are always insecure and jealous. Far from it -- I love these women. They are funny, accomplished, kind, interesting. But this dynamic always comes up eventually. It is particularly present in my life right now. I wonder if it is a mid-life crisis thing. Most of the women I know are late 30s, early 40s, and I see a lot of people assessing where they are at in life and sometimes lashing out, and other times getting smug. They are both ugly behaviors.

I also don't know if this is unique to women. But I'm a woman and while I have friends with people of all genders, I only notice these dynamics in my female friendships.

NP, and it's not that I don't notice women doing this, it's that I deliberately am close friends with women who do NOT do this or, at least, who do it without realizing they're doing it. I have some very long-standing friendships and make friends easily in various circles. I'm also incredibly picky about whom I choose to spend my time with. And while issues around envy or jealousy inevitably arise, most of my friends acknowledge it, and we can move on. So, yeah, while it's common, it doesn't have to be a friendship-ender if you're both adults about it. It helps if the women in question know that everything comes with trade offs, and have the emotional maturity to tolerate their own envy and also being envied by others. No one's perfect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here.

I am skeptical of anyone who says that none of their friends ever do this. I think sometimes friends can go through good times where there isn't much competition and where people get along well. But if you have women friends for a long time, I think you inevitably hit patches where rivalry comes up. Again, I've seen it in friends from every era of my life at some point or another. I'll be rolling along great in a friendship and then something will shift -- someone starts a new relationship, work gets stressful, someone's marriage is on the rocks, etc. -- and dynamics change. I am struggling to think of a single female friendship I've had that hasn't had a phase like this.

I'm not saying women are naturally competitive or that all my friends are always insecure and jealous. Far from it -- I love these women. They are funny, accomplished, kind, interesting. But this dynamic always comes up eventually. It is particularly present in my life right now. I wonder if it is a mid-life crisis thing. Most of the women I know are late 30s, early 40s, and I see a lot of people assessing where they are at in life and sometimes lashing out, and other times getting smug. They are both ugly behaviors.

I also don't know if this is unique to women. But I'm a woman and while I have friends with people of all genders, I only notice these dynamics in my female friendships.

I absolutely agree with you, but also I believe women are naturally competitive. Why wouldn't we be? Men are competitive with each other in terms of money, sports, status, sex.

While women are innately hive-minded, we also compete to maintain our standing and hold-on to our resources. When we're younger, we tend to focus on our attractiveness and ability to secure a mate, which can impact female friendships if we're hunting at the same watering hole. When we have partners or spouses, we compare them to those of our friends. As we age, we compare our resources--careers, money, homes--and our families. We shouldn't feel bad about entertaining these normal thoughts. It's only negative when we or others in our friendship-circle are insecure, resentful, need to dominate, and sabotage other friends.

As another PP mentioned, I think it is easier to maintain healthy female friendships when there is some diversity in the group. And if there is someone who has any of those negative traits mentioned above, by all means, end it.

If women are so competitive, why are 88% of billionaires men? Why are the majority of CEOs men and why do women drop out of the workforce at the drop of a hat?

Gender bias at all levels.