When your teen DS listens to vile rap

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ OP here and, sorry, but I disagree with the two previous PPs. Adult women listening to rap is one thing - you do you. It's not my cup of tea, but whatever.

It's very different when 15 year old boys, who have no life experience, no perspective, no frame of reference about women, no real experience in dealing with racism, etc etc, are enamored with this music that glorifies violence, misogyny and racism. Another PP mentioned the importance of making sure that he knows it's only "art," and that the message is to stop when he turns the music off.

I think that's a hell of a lot to expect from kids.

Um, are your kids listening to some kind of alt-right hip hop? Because if not and you are talking about black artists using the n-word in their lyrics, that's not racism. If you think it is, then I think you don't know many black teenagers. I'm no authority, but in my limited experience as a middle aged white Jew (but parent of a kid that's in a majority black school and whose friends are mostly black), it seems like black young people using the n-word is about identity and unity and standing up to racism.

It's not really a good analogy, but growing up in the south, my Jewish friends and I would use certain particularly ridiculous epithets for Jews toward each other, but we would fight any non-Jew that said something overtly anti-Semitic. It was a way of sharing some unity in an environment where anti-Semitism was pretty common and considered acceptable.

Nice try, but sorry. It's extremely racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ OP here and, sorry, but I disagree with the two previous PPs. Adult women listening to rap is one thing - you do you. It's not my cup of tea, but whatever.

It's very different when 15 year old boys, who have no life experience, no perspective, no frame of reference about women, no real experience in dealing with racism, etc etc, are enamored with this music that glorifies violence, misogyny and racism. Another PP mentioned the importance of making sure that he knows it's only "art," and that the message is to stop when he turns the music off.

I think that's a hell of a lot to expect from kids.

I think you are selling both 15 year old boys and rap music very short.

I’m a teacher and parent of teens. That poster is not selling them short. It’s science. The brain is not fully developed until around 23. You’re being idealistic to a detriment.

I hear you, but my kids will be finished college by the time they are 23. I would rather have the exposure (limited as much as possible) and dialogue now when I have more access, than later.

I get it. Teenage boys are really, really stupid. I have two.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m at my wits end with this. I am literally sickened by the lyrics in some of these “songs.” Please, BTDT parents- how to get him past this? The bigger deal we make of it, of course, the more we hear.

Hook him up with a hot teen girl who loves wholesome country music.
His playlist will change OVERNIGHT.

OP here. That's the best idea yet!

I'm on it....

Shaking my head at this. What do you consider "wholesome" country music? If you don't like the misogyny in rap, why are you ok with the misogyny and sexism you find in most popular country music? And also, why are you talking about finding your teen son a "hot teen girl" if you care about these things?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I listen to vile rap and I am a 42 yo woman. Your son will be fine.

It's narcissistic to think everybody wants their child to end up like you. Maybe you are that way because of all the vile rap.

That's not what I said at all. I am saying that listening to rap music does not mean you are going to be a gangster. But I think everyone else understands that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ OP here and, sorry, but I disagree with the two previous PPs. Adult women listening to rap is one thing - you do you. It's not my cup of tea, but whatever.

It's very different when 15 year old boys, who have no life experience, no perspective, no frame of reference about women, no real experience in dealing with racism, etc etc, are enamored with this music that glorifies violence, misogyny and racism. Another PP mentioned the importance of making sure that he knows it's only "art," and that the message is to stop when he turns the music off.

I think that's a hell of a lot to expect from kids.

Um, are your kids listening to some kind of alt-right hip hop? Because if not and you are talking about black artists using the n-word in their lyrics, that's not racism. If you think it is, then I think you don't know many black teenagers. I'm no authority, but in my limited experience as a middle aged white Jew (but parent of a kid that's in a majority black school and whose friends are mostly black), it seems like black young people using the n-word is about identity and unity and standing up to racism.

It's not really a good analogy, but growing up in the south, my Jewish friends and I would use certain particularly ridiculous epithets for Jews toward each other, but we would fight any non-Jew that said something overtly anti-Semitic. It was a way of sharing some unity in an environment where anti-Semitism was pretty common and considered acceptable.

There is a genre of alt-right hick-hop. I stumbled on it when I was on spotifying trying to figure out who was including Lil Nas X on their country mixes (spoiler alert, these artists were not).

And to answer the question: listen to whatever you want, read whatever you want, and enjoy my intersectional critique. I've ruined a lot of good music for people including myself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m at my wits end with this. I am literally sickened by the lyrics in some of these “songs.” Please, BTDT parents- how to get him past this? The bigger deal we make of it, of course, the more we hear.

Hook him up with a hot teen girl who loves wholesome country music.
His playlist will change OVERNIGHT.

OP here. That's the best idea yet!

I'm on it....

Shaking my head at this. What do you consider "wholesome" country music? If you don't like the misogyny in rap, why are you ok with the misogyny and sexism you find in most popular country music? And also, why are you talking about finding your teen son a "hot teen girl" if you care about these things?

Oh for Pete’s sake lighten up. People like you are so tiresome; don’t you ever bore yourself with your wokeness?

Fairly certain OP meant this as a joke. If you’ve ever been around teenage boys (probably not), you’d get it.

And BTW most country music is far more wholesome than most rap music. At least it is laden with vile slang and curse words.

[Anonymous]

^^NOT laden with

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ OP here and, sorry, but I disagree with the two previous PPs. Adult women listening to rap is one thing - you do you. It's not my cup of tea, but whatever.

It's very different when 15 year old boys, who have no life experience, no perspective, no frame of reference about women, no real experience in dealing with racism, etc etc, are enamored with this music that glorifies violence, misogyny and racism. Another PP mentioned the importance of making sure that he knows it's only "art," and that the message is to stop when he turns the music off.

I think that's a hell of a lot to expect from kids.

Um, are your kids listening to some kind of alt-right hip hop? Because if not and you are talking about black artists using the n-word in their lyrics, that's not racism. If you think it is, then I think you don't know many black teenagers. I'm no authority, but in my limited experience as a middle aged white Jew (but parent of a kid that's in a majority black school and whose friends are mostly black), it seems like black young people using the n-word is about identity and unity and standing up to racism.

It's not really a good analogy, but growing up in the south, my Jewish friends and I would use certain particularly ridiculous epithets for Jews toward each other, but we would fight any non-Jew that said something overtly anti-Semitic. It was a way of sharing some unity in an environment where anti-Semitism was pretty common and considered acceptable.

I'm the 41yo PP who grew up listening to rap. I'm also AA, and agree with this characterization. Using the "n" word as a teen is more about members of an oppressed group taking a racial epithet and turning it on its head in order to regain some control over it, imo. I think some gay men have done this with the "f" word.

OP, the PP who talks about differentiating your family's values from that of the music is onto something. I think it's more of a danger for poor kids in SE than middle/UMC white kids, for whom the differentiation is probably a lot easier. Your kids will be fine; just keep the dialogue going and show that you're at least partly open to discussing the music--what does he like about it? Is it the beat? Which is his favorite? What does he think about the lyrics? Which does he think you might like? Etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ OP here and, sorry, but I disagree with the two previous PPs. Adult women listening to rap is one thing - you do you. It's not my cup of tea, but whatever.

It's very different when 15 year old boys, who have no life experience, no perspective, no frame of reference about women, no real experience in dealing with racism, etc etc, are enamored with this music that glorifies violence, misogyny and racism. Another PP mentioned the importance of making sure that he knows it's only "art," and that the message is to stop when he turns the music off.

I think that's a hell of a lot to expect from kids.

Um, are your kids listening to some kind of alt-right hip hop? Because if not and you are talking about black artists using the n-word in their lyrics, that's not racism. If you think it is, then I think you don't know many black teenagers. I'm no authority, but in my limited experience as a middle aged white Jew (but parent of a kid that's in a majority black school and whose friends are mostly black), it seems like black young people using the n-word is about identity and unity and standing up to racism.

It's not really a good analogy, but growing up in the south, my Jewish friends and I would use certain particularly ridiculous epithets for Jews toward each other, but we would fight any non-Jew that said something overtly anti-Semitic. It was a way of sharing some unity in an environment where anti-Semitism was pretty common and considered acceptable.

I'm the 41yo PP who grew up listening to rap. I'm also AA, and agree with this characterization. Using the "n" word when I was a teen is more about members of an oppressed group taking a racial epithet and turning it on its head in order to regain some control over it, imo. I think some gay men have done this with the "f" word.

OP, the PP who talks about differentiating your family's values from that of the music is onto something. I think it's more of a danger for poor kids in SE than middle/UMC white kids, for whom the differentiation is probably a lot easier. Your kids will be fine; just keep the dialogue going and show that you're at least partly open to discussing the music--what does he like about it? Is it the beat? Which is his favorite? What does he think about the lyrics? Which does he think you might like? Etc.

PP again. Just clarifying in italics.

[Anonymous]

How old is he? What grade?
And how much spare time does he have for this every day?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m at my wits end with this. I am literally sickened by the lyrics in some of these “songs.” Please, BTDT parents- how to get him past this? The bigger deal we make of it, of course, the more we hear.

Hook him up with a hot teen girl who loves wholesome country music.
His playlist will change OVERNIGHT.

OP here. That's the best idea yet!

I'm on it....

Shaking my head at this. What do you consider "wholesome" country music? If you don't like the misogyny in rap, why are you ok with the misogyny and sexism you find in most popular country music? And also, why are you talking about finding your teen son a "hot teen girl" if you care about these things?

Oh for Pete’s sake lighten up. People like you are so tiresome; don’t you ever bore yourself with your wokeness?

Fairly certain OP meant this as a joke. If you’ve ever been around teenage boys (probably not), you’d get it.

And BTW most country music is far more wholesome than most rap music. At least it is laden with vile slang and curse words.

You know nothing about me, and I do get it, because I have had teenage boys (and girls) in my house for close to a decade now. Clearly, you and OP know nothing about rap and are not actually interested in the question of whether it makes any sense to try to keep teens from listening to it. But that's ok. Those of us who love music and understand teen psychology are having an interesting discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ OP here and, sorry, but I disagree with the two previous PPs. Adult women listening to rap is one thing - you do you. It's not my cup of tea, but whatever.

It's very different when 15 year old boys, who have no life experience, no perspective, no frame of reference about women, no real experience in dealing with racism, etc etc, are enamored with this music that glorifies violence, misogyny and racism. Another PP mentioned the importance of making sure that he knows it's only "art," and that the message is to stop when he turns the music off.

I think that's a hell of a lot to expect from kids.

I think you are selling both 15 year old boys and rap music very short.

I’m a teacher and parent of teens. That poster is not selling them short. It’s science. The brain is not fully developed until around 23. You’re being idealistic to a detriment.

I hear you, but my kids will be finished college by the time they are 23. I would rather have the exposure (limited as much as possible) and dialogue now when I have more access, than later.

I get it. Teenage boys are really, really stupid. I have two.

I'm the PP you're responding to, and totally understand your point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m at my wits end with this. I am literally sickened by the lyrics in some of these “songs.” Please, BTDT parents- how to get him past this? The bigger deal we make of it, of course, the more we hear.

Hook him up with a hot teen girl who loves wholesome country music.
His playlist will change OVERNIGHT.

OP here. That's the best idea yet!

I'm on it....

Shaking my head at this. What do you consider "wholesome" country music? If you don't like the misogyny in rap, why are you ok with the misogyny and sexism you find in most popular country music? And also, why are you talking about finding your teen son a "hot teen girl" if you care about these things?

Oh for Pete’s sake lighten up. People like you are so tiresome; don’t you ever bore yourself with your wokeness?

Fairly certain OP meant this as a joke. If you’ve ever been around teenage boys (probably not), you’d get it.

And BTW most country music is far more wholesome than most rap music. At least it is laden with vile slang and curse words.

Oh please, not true.

Country music is known for objectifying women, lynchings (Beer for my horses Toby Keith & Willie Nelson), Mile High Club is awesome (Drunk on a Plane), Get Your Shine on (Guys encouraging women to dance sexually for their benefit), Lyrics like, "I kept her barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen". I could go on and on.

[Anonymous]

The turn this discussion has taken is very interesting, because to the average suburban/urban middle class or UMC teenage boy, the country music and rap music are more similar that you would think. Both reflect a culture that differs from the one they are growing up in. Both have aspects that are extremely offensive, including the extreme glorification of alcohol in country music, as well as sexist messages. Both genres appeal to disenfranchised groups and hold allure for interested outsiders. Both often glorify undesirable aspects of the culture,including criminality and violence. I never really thought about be before, but the genres share many characteristics, yet country music is not considered as threatening as rap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ OP here and, sorry, but I disagree with the two previous PPs. Adult women listening to rap is one thing - you do you. It's not my cup of tea, but whatever.

It's very different when 15 year old boys, who have no life experience, no perspective, no frame of reference about women, no real experience in dealing with racism, etc etc, are enamored with this music that glorifies violence, misogyny and racism. Another PP mentioned the importance of making sure that he knows it's only "art," and that the message is to stop when he turns the music off.

I think that's a hell of a lot to expect from kids.

Um, are your kids listening to some kind of alt-right hip hop? Because if not and you are talking about black artists using the n-word in their lyrics, that's not racism. If you think it is, then I think you don't know many black teenagers. I'm no authority, but in my limited experience as a middle aged white Jew (but parent of a kid that's in a majority black school and whose friends are mostly black), it seems like black young people using the n-word is about identity and unity and standing up to racism.

It's not really a good analogy, but growing up in the south, my Jewish friends and I would use certain particularly ridiculous epithets for Jews toward each other, but we would fight any non-Jew that said something overtly anti-Semitic. It was a way of sharing some unity in an environment where anti-Semitism was pretty common and considered acceptable.

I'm the 41yo PP who grew up listening to rap. I'm also AA, and agree with this characterization. Using the "n" word as a teen is more about members of an oppressed group taking a racial epithet and turning it on its head in order to regain some control over it, imo. I think some gay men have done this with the "f" word.

OP, the PP who talks about differentiating your family's values from that of the music is onto something. I think it's more of a danger for poor kids in SE than middle/UMC white kids, for whom the differentiation is probably a lot easier. Your kids will be fine; just keep the dialogue going and show that you're at least partly open to discussing the music--what does he like about it? Is it the beat? Which is his favorite? What does he think about the lyrics? Which does he think you might like? Etc.

I’m the PP you mention, and I completely agree that you need to take into account which group of kids are listening to, and potentially influenced by, the music. I am assuming OP is a UMC (probably white) person who is almost completely unfamiliar with the genre.