“Colleges That Change Lives”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Went to Reed. Intense and wonderful academics. Subsequent T14 law school was a breeze in comparison. Have nothing to compare it to, as I never went elsewhere, but definitely saw some kids from some very fancy undergrads who seemed like they were struggling to adjust to the intensity of law school.

People are a little weird, but that suited me fine.

Reed is first tier. It doesn't even belong in the book.

Agreed

Honestly, I don’t know why some of the more successful CTCL school want to still be associated with it when there are schools on the list with graduation rates under 50%. How can that possibly be a good school for anyone?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Went to Reed. Intense and wonderful academics. Subsequent T14 law school was a breeze in comparison. Have nothing to compare it to, as I never went elsewhere, but definitely saw some kids from some very fancy undergrads who seemed like they were struggling to adjust to the intensity of law school.

People are a little weird, but that suited me fine.

I looked Reed up in the Fiske guide after seeing this thread. I was appalled by the low graduation rate!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is my issue with the CTCL organization: Its board is made up of mostly of reps from the schools it promotes. Its income consists of membership (marketing) fees from the schools it promotes. As a non-profit organization, its “services” consist of paying one person to go around the country and promote these schools. There is nothing amazingly different about most of these schools from the hundreds of other schools out there. Some are quite good but many are struggling financially and there are many with horrible graduation rates. Schools should be considered on an individual basis, not because they are part of an irrelevant list.

+1. CTCL feeds into the insecurity of parents whose kids can't get into Tier 1.

Another way to look at this: it lets people know there are more than 20 good colleges on the planet.

It's just a marketing gimmick now

All schools market themselves. Why hate on this small group? Their message is: We are great colleges that are easier to get into and possibly far less money, and we will still position your kid for success.

Because they're NOT a small group at all. They're separate institutions with nothing in common other than that they're all small schools and in the same book. That doesn't make them special.

From the website:

CTCL is dedicated to the advancement and support of a student-centered college search process.

The Colleges That Change Lives, Inc. (CTCL) story begins in 1996 when a book by the same name — Colleges That Change Lives — was published by retired New York Times education editor and journalist Loren Pope. A longtime student advocate and independent college counselor, Mr. Pope sought to change the way people thought about colleges by dispelling popularly held myths and challenging the conventional wisdom about college choice. His groundbreaking ideals were welcomed by students and the college counseling community alike. As a result, many of the colleges featured in the book began working together to further promote this philosophy of a student-centered college search.

Doesn't sound like they claim they are special. Sounds like they claim they are right for some kids and all the other college search materials focus on rankings and the like. That's a weird thing to hate IMHO.

Yes - this poster has an ax to grind for some reason with these schools. Not sure why she picks on them or their marketing. A number of schools group themselves together and go on the road to market themselves when they feel there's a similar audience. We just recently went to "8 of the Best" which consisted of Kenyon, Grinnell, Sarah Lawrence, and some others.

The difference is that they ARE "8 of the best." CTCL are not.

That's why it's not the CTCL slogan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

From the website:

CTCL is dedicated to the advancement and support of a student-centered college search process.

The Colleges That Change Lives, Inc. (CTCL) story begins in 1996 when a book by the same name — Colleges That Change Lives — was published by retired New York Times education editor and journalist Loren Pope. A longtime student advocate and independent college counselor, Mr. Pope sought to change the way people thought about colleges by dispelling popularly held myths and challenging the conventional wisdom about college choice. His groundbreaking ideals were welcomed by students and the college counseling community alike. As a result, many of the colleges featured in the book began working together to further promote this philosophy of a student-centered college search.

Doesn't sound like they claim they are special. Sounds like they claim they are right for some kids and all the other college search materials focus on rankings and the like. That's a weird thing to hate IMHO.

Working together to promote THEMSELVES, that is.

What promotion is done for organizations other than "themselves"? Your argument makes no sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:went to Wooster; it is a fantastic school. Not hard to get into but amazing teaching. one of the few liberal arts colleges that require a thesis during senior year. Very high rates of getting students into grad schools. definitely feels midwestern versus new england... a bit kinder/less edgy, less preppy, overall an excellent education, especially for kids who can't or don't want a rat race but want to be challenged and be in classses with other students who want to engage.

sorry. same poster... forgot to say I was changed because I fell in love with learning for learning's sake. I went to a big local area high school and was in advanced track classes but was really social and more interested in parties than in class. The big classes were too easy for me to disappear and not be engaged. I went to Wooster and just lit up because of the amazing teachers and awesome courses. Came out the other side really ready to tackle adulthood in a way that I don't think i would have had i gone to a huge university.

You have no way of knowing that you would have been "ready to tackle adulthood" had you gone to any one of 100 other colleges the size of Wooster. That's the point.

wow... you have a serious chip on your shoulder. its a little odd. The poster asked for those with experience to share those experiences. that is what I diid. It is so strange that you feel the need to delegitimize others' experiences. perhaps you would have benefited from attending a CTCL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is with the poster that has a vitriolic reaction every time some one asks about the CTCL schools ?

I suspect they’re a graduate of a “first tier” college who is very insecure.

Probably my brother

[Anonymous]

I had a family member attend Guildford. It absolutely changed his life. Came out a different (better) person.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is my issue with the CTCL organization: Its board is made up of mostly of reps from the schools it promotes. Its income consists of membership (marketing) fees from the schools it promotes. As a non-profit organization, its “services” consist of paying one person to go around the country and promote these schools. There is nothing amazingly different about most of these schools from the hundreds of other schools out there. Some are quite good but many are struggling financially and there are many with horrible graduation rates. Schools should be considered on an individual basis, not because they are part of an irrelevant list.

+1. CTCL feeds into the insecurity of parents whose kids can't get into Tier 1.

Another way to look at this: it lets people know there are more than 20 good colleges on the planet.

It's just a marketing gimmick now

I'll remember that the next time (or 200) my daughter gets a letter or card from an Ivy League college asking her to apply.

[Anonymous]

These schools share and work to instill similar VALUES.
That may be something hardcore status-seekers don't "get."

For example, at the parent orientation for my child's college (a CTCL), they posted the traits they want to see in their graduates. One of them was kindness.

I was happy to see that and wonder how many big name, competitive (cut throat?), ivy league schools share that goal.

I feel that the CTCL's embrace the values that our family espoused, so I am happy to pay them tuition to educate my child well while providing a nurturing community.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These schools share and work to instill similar VALUES.
That may be something hardcore status-seekers don't "get."

For example, at the parent orientation for my child's college (a CTCL), they posted the traits they want to see in their graduates. One of them was kindness.

I was happy to see that and wonder how many big name, competitive (cut throat?), ivy league schools share that goal.

I feel that the CTCL's embrace the values that our family espoused, so I am happy to pay them tuition to educate my child well while providing a nurturing community.

If "kindness" is a primary trait that CTCL schools want to see in their graduates, then virtually every Catholic school in America belongs on the CTCL list.

Face it, you're just looking to justify your kid having to go second tier. Really, it's ok. Embrace it. Don't be defensive about it.

Hi dummy!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Went to Reed. Intense and wonderful academics. Subsequent T14 law school was a breeze in comparison. Have nothing to compare it to, as I never went elsewhere, but definitely saw some kids from some very fancy undergrads who seemed like they were struggling to adjust to the intensity of law school.

People are a little weird, but that suited me fine.

I looked Reed up in the Fiske guide after seeing this thread. I was appalled by the low graduation rate!

80% ... it's the same as VA Tech and JMU and better than George Mason.

[Anonymous]

But some of the Colleges That Change Lives have much lower graduations rates. Be careful. And check carefully. Plus some will not make that info easy to find because some may not choose to participate in the Common Data Set, an important standardized tool in comparing colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But some of the Colleges That Change Lives have much lower graduations rates. Be careful. And check carefully. Plus some will not make that info easy to find because some may not choose to participate in the Common Data Set, an important standardized tool in comparing colleges.

I agree that you should look at graduation rates as one data point in your decision. But, I don't think you can assume that a lower graduation rate means that it's a "bad" school. One of the reasons that these schools are part of the CTCL is that they are schools that are more open to a variety of learners. But, there are a lot of benefits to attending these schools as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I like the idea of these schools, but when I looked some of them up, their graduation rates are quite low. Not all of them, but some of them have very low graduation rates and high tuition.

+1 I think it may be because there are more first gen and low income students at CTCL schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is my issue with the CTCL organization: Its board is made up of mostly of reps from the schools it promotes. Its income consists of membership (marketing) fees from the schools it promotes. As a non-profit organization, its “services” consist of paying one person to go around the country and promote these schools. There is nothing amazingly different about most of these schools from the hundreds of other schools out there. Some are quite good but many are struggling financially and there are many with horrible graduation rates. Schools should be considered on an individual basis, not because they are part of an irrelevant list.

+1. CTCL feeds into the insecurity of parents whose kids can't get into Tier 1.

Another way to look at this: it lets people know there are more than 20 good colleges on the planet.

It's just a marketing gimmick now

All schools market themselves. Why hate on this small group? Their message is: We are great colleges that are easier to get into and possibly far less money, and we will still position your kid for success.

+1