How do you respond to "C" grades? Is this reasonable?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t remember being able to retake tests and quizzes in middle school; is this normal?

This is normal. I think it is good because then the kid learns the material. Which is the whole point of tests.

+1
I know a lot of people don't think kids should be able to retake tests/quizzes, but the whole point is mastery of material. If you do poorly on a test, you need to show that you can master the material, and if that includes a retake, so be it.

Being able to retake tests is a fairly new thing in the schooling system within the last 10-12 years.

I've not been a teacher that long, but from what I hear from my fellow teachers who have taught that long (and longer), it stems from lazy elementary school years. Kids coast through the ES years with parents who allow them to not do homework if it's seen as a waste of time/busy work or just too difficult (causes lots of drama at home in the evenings). They write notes to the teacher that their kid won't be doing this packet or that packet, this nightly reading, etc. in favor of other enrichment activities and family time and they still receive A's on their report cards (or numbers, if that's the system your school uses).

Then came middle school when those notes from mom & dad would no longer fly. Sure, notes were sent in, but instead of getting an A, kids got zeros, which translated into D's and F's on report cards, which upset the parents. Upset parents = complaining to the administration. Upset administration = telling the teachers to make contingency plans for under-performing kids.

I hate giving retests as I see them as unfair, but I have to do them for two reasons: one, it's part of my job now and two, because I don't want my email inbox filled with angry parent emails the week before a semester ends or right after report cards are issued. Teachers are, however, allowed to form their own rules for retests. You don't have to offer the same version of the test to those taking the retest. You can even make it longer or a different form of test (essay/short answer vs. multiple choice, paper vs. online, etc). Anyone who scores a 77 or below (C+) has the opportunity to retake the test (school rule). To retake the test you must get a form signed by a parent and it must be completed within one week of the original test date either before or after school. If your retest score is lower than the original, the original is counted instead. The highest score you can earn on a retest is a 90 (A-) as each retest automatically gets -10 deducted.

If a student who received a B on a tests asks me to retest, I'll allow it so that they can try for the A-. Many teachers don't allow this. I do because as I said above, I see retests as being unfair. If we're going to allow them, everyone who wants to do it should be allowed, regardless of the grade received.

[Anonymous]

^^^^^^

thank goodness we have admins making decision so teacher can't just do what they want even if it does not promote education of the students.

I want an educated society, I don't care which week they learned it.

[Anonymous]

It is middle school, the grades are free, just let them know how it could impact her if she gets them in high school which wouldn't be the end of the world either.

C's get degrees too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here:

Why would I allow the child to have the privilege of a phone with her all the time (including at school) if she isn't showing that she can handle the basic requirements of her job (i.e. passing exams and putting forth the effort to re-take if she doens't pass the first time)? She already has plenty of time on a home laptop. I don't think she is "deprived" by losing phone privileges -- which for her is games/music on the bus and at school -- as well as when she is at home on her laptop.

Anxiety and depression??? Didn't WE all grow up without a personal entertainment device during the school day? Did we all suffer from anxiety and depression as a result of boredom?

Hey OP- it sounds like you have already made up your mind. What is the point of your post?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That poor child. Her first C and you are ready to beat her up over it. Tell her to bring it up next quarter. This is how kids go crazy in school, the parents expect perfection

Wow...enable much?

NP...but I am with OP here. This is not an "I tried my best and my best yielded a C" situation, PP. This is an "I got a C and had a chance to fix it by retaking a test but I couldn't be bothered to be responsible enough to turn in the required paperwork to do it" situation. Lazy. Pure and simple. And yes...in my house that means consequences beyond just the natural one of getting a "C" that you don't want.

The standard in our house is that you put forth your best effort. And, okay, everybody screws up or makes a mistake or fails to understand something even when they try their best. But if you have an opportunity at a second shot and blow it off (even after multiple reminders) that is not putting forth your best effort. So yeah, I'd totally take her phone away for a while.

It might not be "can't be bothered." It might be that her daughter is afraid to communicate with the teachers. I have two kids who are excellent A students. However, if somehow they've missed an assignment, or a teacher mistakenly marked it as missing, they'd rather take a zero than go up and ask the teacher about it. I think middle school is about teaching kids how to communicate with the teachers directly, and supporting them in that. Don't worry about the grade, but check in with your daughter about her real reason for not making up the test. There are lots of dynamics the kids are dealing with at school that feel very real and stressful to them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That poor child. Her first C and you are ready to beat her up over it. Tell her to bring it up next quarter. This is how kids go crazy in school, the parents expect perfection

Wow...enable much?

NP...but I am with OP here. This is not an "I tried my best and my best yielded a C" situation, PP. This is an "I got a C and had a chance to fix it by retaking a test but I couldn't be bothered to be responsible enough to turn in the required paperwork to do it" situation. Lazy. Pure and simple. And yes...in my house that means consequences beyond just the natural one of getting a "C" that you don't want.

The standard in our house is that you put forth your best effort. And, okay, everybody screws up or makes a mistake or fails to understand something even when they try their best. But if you have an opportunity at a second shot and blow it off (even after multiple reminders) that is not putting forth your best effort. So yeah, I'd totally take her phone away for a while.

It might not be "can't be bothered." It might be that her daughter is afraid to communicate with the teachers. I have two kids who are excellent A students. However, if somehow they've missed an assignment, or a teacher mistakenly marked it as missing, they'd rather take a zero than go up and ask the teacher about it. I think middle school is about teaching kids how to communicate with the teachers directly, and supporting them in that. Don't worry about the grade, but check in with your daughter about her real reason for not making up the test. There are lots of dynamics the kids are dealing with at school that feel very real and stressful to them.

Middle school is the time to teach them how to advocate for themselves. It's also a time to reinforce a growth mindset. When there is an issue I focus on why--do you need help from the teacher? From me? The goal is to learn the material and to figure out where the problem is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here:

Why would I allow the child to have the privilege of a phone with her all the time (including at school) if she isn't showing that she can handle the basic requirements of her job (i.e. passing exams and putting forth the effort to re-take if she doens't pass the first time)? She already has plenty of time on a home laptop. I don't think she is "deprived" by losing phone privileges -- which for her is games/music on the bus and at school -- as well as when she is at home on her laptop.

Anxiety and depression??? Didn't WE all grow up without a personal entertainment device during the school day? Did we all suffer from anxiety and depression as a result of boredom?

Hey OP- it sounds like you have already made up your mind. What is the point of your post?

Hey PP-- did you read the original post? I said I was curious what other people thought and how they react to "C"s even though I wasn't looking for advice on what to do. You are right... I have made up my mind.

It's interesting to see how some people view phones as much more integral to a child's life and other see it as a privilege to be earned. I'm in the latter camp. To me, it is largely the same as a hand-held game (like a DS). Yes, it has some value in communicating, but based on my intel, DD is mostly chatting with people from her favorite server. The same server she spends hours on every day (yes, I have an automatic limit set on her computer, but she still gets 3 hrs on it). She almost never says she has any homework -- which is fine if she is doing it during school hours. BUT, when she tells me she has no homework and doesn't need to study and then fails quizzes and tests --- and can't be bothered to re-take the one failed grade that can be rectified.... , I have a problem with that.

Re: timing... the failed quiz (grammar) was several weeks ago. There wasn't anything she could do to change that. The failed test was taken in the week prior to spring break. I saw the failed grade while on spring break. The teacher told me via email that she thought DD didn't read the passage before answering the questions b/c of the time-stamp on when she started and finished the test. We don't know for sure whether that is true. DD says she read it. She has a tendency to pick the easiest answer without really taking her time to think about the options b/c she assumes she is right. Teacher said she could re-take it after spring break. I asked for her suggestions on what we can do or if she recommends any programs or anything the school offers. Teacher didn't offer any options. I said I thought it would be important for DD to review her answer to learn from her mistakes so that she wouldn't make the same ones on the re-take. Teacher did not agree or disagree -- or offer to review the mistakes with DD. In other classes the re-take form sometimes requires the kids to list the questions they got wrong, figure out the right answer, and then reflect on why they picked the wrong answer. I figured I'd let DD follow the teacher's requirements --whatever those were. I waited until the end of spring break to speak to her about it so that it wasn't a cloud over her spring break.

As I stated, I reminded or asked DD about the form and taking the test several times last week. Each time she assured me she had or would be doing whatever was needed to re-take the test (although she seemed to be putting off the actual re-take).

I cannot hold her hand on teaching her whatever her English teacher wants her to know. I can teach math up to a certain level. I do not know what 8th grade English requirements are, nor does my child have an open mind for learning from me at this age. She thinks she is doing just fine. Two failed quizzes (just saw another failed vocab quiz on the gradebook this week) and a failed test suggest that she is not doing as well as she thinks. Frankly, it is pretty amazing to me that a kid's grade can be as high as it is with three F's on the books. I guess they give substantial weight to daily assignments and projects. I have already looked into summer week-long classes at a nearby private school that would help with grammar and writing. FWIW, this is a kid who chose creative writing as an elective, chose Hons English for next year, and when she was in 2nd grade, she scored a 99% on the verbal abilities test. She is a very capable reader. She enjoys writing (what she wants to write).

DH and I actually think this IS the right time to show her the limits of her phone/electronics privileges, b/c things are only going to get harder in high school, and the stakes will be higher (re: GPA/college implications).

If she had re-taken the test and still ended up with a C, I wouldn't have as much of a problem with her effort/grade. If this was calculus or and AP course, or if she was meeting with the teacher or asking for help (from anyone), I would be more inclined to work with her. But, MS seems pretty easy to us... and we have reminded her to take the reigns and improve her score. She has not seen fit to do so. So we have to do the responsible thing as parents and remove distractions... starting with distractions AT school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A C in public school is like an F. I would be pissed and take the phone away.

This. My kids must have As and Bs to have phone privileges. Son had a C 2nd quarter after not doing well on two tests (one test could not be retaken and he did not try to retake the other) and not turning in homework (which is not even graded for content, you just have to turn it in!). While he had a C, he had no phone and no video games. Grade has not dipped that low again and all homework has been turned in. If a child is putting forth their best effort, asking for extra help, doing extra homework, then I would not punish.

That is great but don't assume that all kids are like yours! My kid has a few C's that he has worked hard for..langauges are very difficult for him for example.

[Anonymous]

Focus on the process. It sounds like the C is due, at least in part, to lack of responsibility. I don't think I'd take the phone for the whole quarter, but I'd set specific milestones (3 weeks or so?) with the potential to get it back then. The milestones wouldn't be the grade per se, but the process. Did she turn in all work? Did she study hard for the test? I'd probably even sit down and give her study questions before the test to assess whether she was prepared. If she studied hard and seemed to be ready for the test (based on my study questions) I wouldn't penalize the actual test grade if poor. If she didn't turn in assignments or didn't appear to study hard, I'd continue keeping the phone.

[Anonymous]

Holy crap--the OP and some of these posters ("I only allow As in my house")--you are why parents in this area have a bad reputation and why kids in HS are more stressed out than ever before. Multiple suicides, kids feeling inadequate. Yes, I said it.

Your kid got one C. IN middle school. She is not skipping classes, she is not doing drugs, she is not pregnant. She is not smoking or bullying kids.

Get some perspective.

Kids mess up. People fail tests. People forget to turn things in. Even adults (ever forget a field trip form or medical form). No one is perfect.

Yes, phone privileges are privileges, but think about what you want from your child and how to use this as a learning experience. Think about helping her instead of punishing the first bad grade. You will scare your kid into thinking she needs to be perfect (which no one is) and then she will start hiding things from you. Lay down your expectations (not grades but effort) but why tie one bad test grade to her phone. I have HS and MS kids--smart mostly As-- they have bombed a test just as I did. They learn from their mistakes. They are driven internally-- that is what you want.

I would rather have my kid fail and learn from it then have a kid who is troubled, bullying, unkind, not engaged, not interested. My god.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Only As are acceptable in our house.

My son has a fine motor disability and has gotten two Bs in electives where he had to build things/take photos, and while I am disappointed, I told him that I understood he did his best.

My son also has inattentive ADHD and struggles to remember to hand work on time, etc, so I sympathize with your daughter. With children like this, you need to be more on their case because their brains mature slower. Not saying your child has ADHD, but perhaps tendencies?

As for the punishment, whatever works for your family, OP, keeping in mind what I just wrote above.

How old are your children? What grades?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD is in 8th grade. DD is likely to get a "C" in English. I saw on the gradebook that she had failed one quiz and one test. I noticed this before spring break. I reached out to the teacher (for the first time) to ask what she was seeing. The quiz could not be re-taken. The test could be after spring break. I waited until the end of spring break to talk to DD about needing to re-take the test. I reminded her to fill out some form in order to be eligible for the re-take. I asked her several times in the last week+ when she was going to re-take it or what her plan was or I reminded her that she needed to get it done. She told me she was taking care of it or she's going to do it, or there is still more time, etc.

Now, we are nearing the end of the quarter. She tells me today that she can't retake it b/c she had to turn something in last week. (and it sounds like she didn't do it). I'm pretty sure I asked her last week and she said she did it.

If it's true that she can't retake it anymore, I expect she will keep the C for the quarter. My intention is to keep her phone for the next quarter. I believe we've had this discussion in the past, that she needs to keep her grades up and do the retakes (and complete assignments) if she wants to keep her phone. I've never taken it away.... but she hasn't had a "C" until now (although she has flirted with B- or even lower, but was able to bring lower grades up).

a) how do you respond to C's?
b) is it reasonable to take away the phone (in your opinion)? I'm planning to do it, but I'm just curious how other people think.

FWIW, she communicates a little with her friends with texting or discord. She isn't very social, so the majority of the time, she uses her phone to listen to music and youtube videos. I think she uses it as a crutch and distraction at school.

No punishment for trying and not getting As and Bs. But, for the dishonesty, there would be trouble.

[Anonymous]

Here's one type of response...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKnloiM-0Ns

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Grades earn privileges. Bs and above for whatever she wants.

+1, except that in our house the threshold for nearly "kid gets/does whatever they want" (with exceptions for safety & genuine logistical impracticality) is straight As.

A C would be unacceptable in our household and would earn strong consequences, but I do think a consequence for 1 C lasting an entire quarter is excessive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That poor child. Her first C and you are ready to beat her up over it. Tell her to bring it up next quarter. This is how kids go crazy in school, the parents expect perfection

Wow...enable much?

NP...but I am with OP here. This is not an "I tried my best and my best yielded a C" situation, PP. This is an "I got a C and had a chance to fix it by retaking a test but I couldn't be bothered to be responsible enough to turn in the required paperwork to do it" situation. Lazy. Pure and simple. And yes...in my house that means consequences beyond just the natural one of getting a "C" that you don't want.

The standard in our house is that you put forth your best effort. And, okay, everybody screws up or makes a mistake or fails to understand something even when they try their best. But if you have an opportunity at a second shot and blow it off (even after multiple reminders) that is not putting forth your best effort. So yeah, I'd totally take her phone away for a while.

I agree with this. She was being lazy or irresponsible, or she doesn't have the organizational skills to manage everything she needs to do. If you're certain it isn't the latter, I would remove a time-sucking privilege like the phone until she takes things more seriously. If she got a C after trying, I would not even consider a punishment.