Lee HS Enrollment Falls Below 1700

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Of course people are moving into the Lee pyramid to be close to good jobs at NGA, Fort Belvoir, etc. They are educated professionals who expect good neighborhood schools. In addition to the newcomers who are attracted to the Springfield area for their jobs, there are many people who have lived here for years, who grew up here and remember when the schools were decent. To say “you get what you pay for” is morally reprehensible.

So, the truth is now morally reprehensible? If you bought in the Lee pyramid within at least the past 20 years, you either knew what you were getting or you were ignorant about the reputation of the schools. If you bought before that, you’d likely an empty nester by now in which case you only really care about the schools to the extent it affects the value of your house - you’re long done with actually using the schools.

So, yes, by their own decision-making, anyone in the Lee pyramid with kids in school are getting what they paid for. I hope Lee gets better, but that shouldn’t come on the backs of those in West Springfield who paid a premium in the past 20 years for superior schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to keeping Lee as a neighborhood school.

That's insane.

They can fantasize about redistricting 1700 students, or twice that. But it's not going to actually happen.

I really think Lee is just going to lose accreditation and FCPS will just shrug and deal with it. The redistricting proposals were horrible, they make Annandale another Lee in 5-10 years, bring down Hayfield which is already average, and make WS extremely overcrowded even with the expansion. Meanwhile Edison gets another AAP center (SEES), and South County gets Saratoga which it should probably have already, given its proximity.

I really hope you’re right. West Springfield families should NOT be moved to Lee. It simply wouldn’t be fair when we paid a premium to be in the West Springfield pyramid. We deserve the schools we paid for. Those in the Lee pyramid knew what they were getting when they moved there (or at least they should have).

But they didn't all pay the premium. Daventry was at Lee just a few years ago. Even some of Hunt Valley was at Lee. The families remaining at Lee, some who have been here a long time, have seen FCPS dismantle it piece by piece, pupil placement by pupil placement - Lee has been screwed every way you look at it. And you want to talk about fair? Why do you think West Springfield is special and must be protected? Because you paid more for your house? It certainly isn't supposed to work that way. The elitism on this board never ceases to amaze me.

They paid more of a premium than anywhere else in the Lee pyramid because those neighborhoods didn’t have to put up with Key MS or any of the terrible ES feeders in the Lee pyramid. Regardless, anyone else in the Lee pyramid who has bought in the past 20+ years has essentially received a huge discount because of the reputation of the pyramid. They knew what they were getting. Don’t come crying to West Springfield telling us we need to be re-zoned to your poor schools because you now have regrets.

As between West Springfield residents thinking they were guaranteed to remain in that high school district and Lee residents thinking FCPS was committed to maintaining quality at each of its high schools, the Lee residents have the far stronger argument.

I’d simply call it delusional. If you haven’t realized that FCPS is perfectly ok with pyramids having high concentrations of poverty and disadvantaged students, you aren’t in touch with reality. It’s not a new development.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course people are moving into the Lee pyramid to be close to good jobs at NGA, Fort Belvoir, etc. They are educated professionals who expect good neighborhood schools. In addition to the newcomers who are attracted to the Springfield area for their jobs, there are many people who have lived here for years, who grew up here and remember when the schools were decent. To say “you get what you pay for” is morally reprehensible.

So, the truth is now morally reprehensible? If you bought in the Lee pyramid within at least the past 20 years, you either knew what you were getting or you were ignorant about the reputation of the schools. If you bought before that, you’d likely an empty nester by now in which case you only really care about the schools to the extent it affects the value of your house - you’re long done with actually using the schools.

So, yes, by their own decision-making, anyone in the Lee pyramid with kids in school are getting what they paid for. I hope Lee gets better, but that shouldn’t come on the backs of those in West Springfield who paid a premium in the past 20 years for superior schools.

You sound like Marie Antoinette. Let them eat cake, huh? We all know what happened after that!
FCPS should not allow such blatant disparity between high schools that are just a few miles apart, but maybe I would actually prefer Lee so my children wouldn’t have to deal with the snobbery of WS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course people are moving into the Lee pyramid to be close to good jobs at NGA, Fort Belvoir, etc. They are educated professionals who expect good neighborhood schools. In addition to the newcomers who are attracted to the Springfield area for their jobs, there are many people who have lived here for years, who grew up here and remember when the schools were decent. To say “you get what you pay for” is morally reprehensible.

So, the truth is now morally reprehensible? If you bought in the Lee pyramid within at least the past 20 years, you either knew what you were getting or you were ignorant about the reputation of the schools. If you bought before that, you’d likely an empty nester by now in which case you only really care about the schools to the extent it affects the value of your house - you’re long done with actually using the schools.

So, yes, by their own decision-making, anyone in the Lee pyramid with kids in school are getting what they paid for. I hope Lee gets better, but that shouldn’t come on the backs of those in West Springfield who paid a premium in the past 20 years for superior schools.

You sound like Marie Antoinette. Let them eat cake, huh? We all know what happened after that!
FCPS should not allow such blatant disparity between high schools that are just a few miles apart, but maybe I would actually prefer Lee so my children wouldn’t have to deal with the snobbery of WS.

Not exactly. More like, live with the consequences of your own decisions. If you chose to eat cake, then deal with it. Don’t come ask me for my bread because you regret your choice. It isn’t one you were forced to make - you chose to make it.

[Anonymous]

Lee should be renamed Justine. That should take care of it.

[Anonymous]

What if Lee was to change focus and be an ESOL magnet school? It could draw students from Annandale/Edison.

If elementary schools can offer language immersion...FCPS is graduating too many students who don’t have full command of the English language/ 16 and older freshman/legally emancipated.

Lee’s been struggling and faltering for decades now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to keeping Lee as a neighborhood school.

That's insane.

They can fantasize about redistricting 1700 students, or twice that. But it's not going to actually happen.

I really think Lee is just going to lose accreditation and FCPS will just shrug and deal with it. The redistricting proposals were horrible, they make Annandale another Lee in 5-10 years, bring down Hayfield which is already average, and make WS extremely overcrowded even with the expansion. Meanwhile Edison gets another AAP center (SEES), and South County gets Saratoga which it should probably have already, given its proximity.

I really hope you’re right. West Springfield families should NOT be moved to Lee. It simply wouldn’t be fair when we paid a premium to be in the West Springfield pyramid. We deserve the schools we paid for. Those in the Lee pyramid knew what they were getting when they moved there (or at least they should have).

But they didn't all pay the premium. Daventry was at Lee just a few years ago. Even some of Hunt Valley was at Lee. The families remaining at Lee, some who have been here a long time, have seen FCPS dismantle it piece by piece, pupil placement by pupil placement - Lee has been screwed every way you look at it. And you want to talk about fair? Why do you think West Springfield is special and must be protected? Because you paid more for your house? It certainly isn't supposed to work that way. The elitism on this board never ceases to amaze me.

They paid more of a premium than anywhere else in the Lee pyramid because those neighborhoods didn’t have to put up with Key MS or any of the terrible ES feeders in the Lee pyramid. Regardless, anyone else in the Lee pyramid who has bought in the past 20+ years has essentially received a huge discount because of the reputation of the pyramid. They knew what they were getting. Don’t come crying to West Springfield telling us we need to be re-zoned to your poor schools because you now have regrets.

As between West Springfield residents thinking they were guaranteed to remain in that high school district and Lee residents thinking FCPS was committed to maintaining quality at each of its high schools, the Lee residents have the far stronger argument.

I’d simply call it delusional. If you haven’t realized that FCPS is perfectly ok with pyramids having high concentrations of poverty and disadvantaged students, you aren’t in touch with reality. It’s not a new development.

As a general matter, FCPS has left boundaries that result in high ESOL/FARMS concentrations alone, as long as the schools still have a lot of kids.

But, back in 2008, when enrollments were smaller, South Lakes had dropped to below 1400 kids and was seeing increasing ESOL/FARMS rates. FCPS rolled up its sleeves and moved parts of Westfield, Oakton, and Madison to South Lakes. Now South Lakes has over 2400 kids and higher SAT scores than West Springfield.

People complained, however, and since then FCPS has basically capitulated. They've moved kids in single-family neighborhoods out of poorer schools like Annandale to wealthier schools like Lake Braddock and Woodson, and let other poor schools with excess capacity like Lee and Mount Vernon continue to slide. Some may argue this is the new normal, but it's disgraceful, particularly with a School Board that likes to think of itself as forward-looking and a Superintendent who recently appointed a "Chief Academic and Equity Officer."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course people are moving into the Lee pyramid to be close to good jobs at NGA, Fort Belvoir, etc. They are educated professionals who expect good neighborhood schools. In addition to the newcomers who are attracted to the Springfield area for their jobs, there are many people who have lived here for years, who grew up here and remember when the schools were decent. To say “you get what you pay for” is morally reprehensible.

So, the truth is now morally reprehensible? If you bought in the Lee pyramid within at least the past 20 years, you either knew what you were getting or you were ignorant about the reputation of the schools. If you bought before that, you’d likely an empty nester by now in which case you only really care about the schools to the extent it affects the value of your house - you’re long done with actually using the schools.

So, yes, by their own decision-making, anyone in the Lee pyramid with kids in school are getting what they paid for. I hope Lee gets better, but that shouldn’t come on the backs of those in West Springfield who paid a premium in the past 20 years for superior schools.

Since I bought my house hundreds of wealthier students have been moved out of Lee either due to boundary changes or pupil placements. The F/R lunch rate has more than doubled (24% to 55%). So don't tell me what I bought. And I am not done with the schools. And a school with a 24% F/R lunch rate is a lot different than a school with a 55% F/R rate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to keeping Lee as a neighborhood school.

That's insane.

They can fantasize about redistricting 1700 students, or twice that. But it's not going to actually happen.

I really think Lee is just going to lose accreditation and FCPS will just shrug and deal with it. The redistricting proposals were horrible, they make Annandale another Lee in 5-10 years, bring down Hayfield which is already average, and make WS extremely overcrowded even with the expansion. Meanwhile Edison gets another AAP center (SEES), and South County gets Saratoga which it should probably have already, given its proximity.

I really hope you’re right. West Springfield families should NOT be moved to Lee. It simply wouldn’t be fair when we paid a premium to be in the West Springfield pyramid. We deserve the schools we paid for. Those in the Lee pyramid knew what they were getting when they moved there (or at least they should have).

But they didn't all pay the premium. Daventry was at Lee just a few years ago. Even some of Hunt Valley was at Lee. The families remaining at Lee, some who have been here a long time, have seen FCPS dismantle it piece by piece, pupil placement by pupil placement - Lee has been screwed every way you look at it. And you want to talk about fair? Why do you think West Springfield is special and must be protected? Because you paid more for your house? It certainly isn't supposed to work that way. The elitism on this board never ceases to amaze me.

They paid more of a premium than anywhere else in the Lee pyramid because those neighborhoods didn’t have to put up with Key MS or any of the terrible ES feeders in the Lee pyramid. Regardless, anyone else in the Lee pyramid who has bought in the past 20+ years has essentially received a huge discount because of the reputation of the pyramid. They knew what they were getting. Don’t come crying to West Springfield telling us we need to be re-zoned to your poor schools because you now have regrets.

As between West Springfield residents thinking they were guaranteed to remain in that high school district and Lee residents thinking FCPS was committed to maintaining quality at each of its high schools, the Lee residents have the far stronger argument.

I’d simply call it delusional. If you haven’t realized that FCPS is perfectly ok with pyramids having high concentrations of poverty and disadvantaged students, you aren’t in touch with reality. It’s not a new development.

As a general matter, FCPS has left boundaries that result in high ESOL/FARMS concentrations alone, as long as the schools still have a lot of kids.

But, back in 2008, when enrollments were smaller, South Lakes had dropped to below 1400 kids and was seeing increasing ESOL/FARMS rates. FCPS rolled up its sleeves and moved parts of Westfield, Oakton, and Madison to South Lakes. Now South Lakes has over 2400 kids and higher SAT scores than West Springfield.

People complained, however, and since then FCPS has basically capitulated. They've moved kids in single-family neighborhoods out of poorer schools like Annandale to wealthier schools like Lake Braddock and Woodson, and let other poor schools with excess capacity like Lee and Mount Vernon continue to slide. Some may argue this is the new normal, but it's disgraceful, particularly with a School Board that likes to think of itself as forward-looking and a Superintendent who recently appointed a "Chief Academic and Equity Officer."

Who is this new person? I agree. They need to start turning the ship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to keeping Lee as a neighborhood school.

That's insane.

They can fantasize about redistricting 1700 students, or twice that. But it's not going to actually happen.

I really think Lee is just going to lose accreditation and FCPS will just shrug and deal with it. The redistricting proposals were horrible, they make Annandale another Lee in 5-10 years, bring down Hayfield which is already average, and make WS extremely overcrowded even with the expansion. Meanwhile Edison gets another AAP center (SEES), and South County gets Saratoga which it should probably have already, given its proximity.

I really hope you’re right. West Springfield families should NOT be moved to Lee. It simply wouldn’t be fair when we paid a premium to be in the West Springfield pyramid. We deserve the schools we paid for. Those in the Lee pyramid knew what they were getting when they moved there (or at least they should have).

But they didn't all pay the premium. Daventry was at Lee just a few years ago. Even some of Hunt Valley was at Lee. The families remaining at Lee, some who have been here a long time, have seen FCPS dismantle it piece by piece, pupil placement by pupil placement - Lee has been screwed every way you look at it. And you want to talk about fair? Why do you think West Springfield is special and must be protected? Because you paid more for your house? It certainly isn't supposed to work that way. The elitism on this board never ceases to amaze me.

They paid more of a premium than anywhere else in the Lee pyramid because those neighborhoods didn’t have to put up with Key MS or any of the terrible ES feeders in the Lee pyramid. Regardless, anyone else in the Lee pyramid who has bought in the past 20+ years has essentially received a huge discount because of the reputation of the pyramid. They knew what they were getting. Don’t come crying to West Springfield telling us we need to be re-zoned to your poor schools because you now have regrets.

As between West Springfield residents thinking they were guaranteed to remain in that high school district and Lee residents thinking FCPS was committed to maintaining quality at each of its high schools, the Lee residents have the far stronger argument.

I’d simply call it delusional. If you haven’t realized that FCPS is perfectly ok with pyramids having high concentrations of poverty and disadvantaged students, you aren’t in touch with reality. It’s not a new development.

As a general matter, FCPS has left boundaries that result in high ESOL/FARMS concentrations alone, as long as the schools still have a lot of kids.

But, back in 2008, when enrollments were smaller, South Lakes had dropped to below 1400 kids and was seeing increasing ESOL/FARMS rates. FCPS rolled up its sleeves and moved parts of Westfield, Oakton, and Madison to South Lakes. Now South Lakes has over 2400 kids and higher SAT scores than West Springfield.

People complained, however, and since then FCPS has basically capitulated. They've moved kids in single-family neighborhoods out of poorer schools like Annandale to wealthier schools like Lake Braddock and Woodson, and let other poor schools with excess capacity like Lee and Mount Vernon continue to slide. Some may argue this is the new normal, but it's disgraceful, particularly with a School Board that likes to think of itself as forward-looking and a Superintendent who recently appointed a "Chief Academic and Equity Officer."

Who is this new person? I agree. They need to start turning the ship.

Scott Brabrand changed Francisco Duran's title from Chief Academic Officer to Chief Academic and Equity Officer, ostensibly to underscore FCPS's commitment to equity.

[Anonymous]

Lee has a lot of sophomores and juniors that are 18 or older. They are allowed to drop out.

[Anonymous]

Gatehouse insider here. Lee is projecting to be around ~1400 in a few years.

I also have an update about the IB East Center Middle (Key) and High (Lee). I have a few new facts confirmed and can tell you some unknowns.

1. The feeders will be the following pyramids: Edison, West Springfield, Hayfield, South County, Annandale, West Potomac, and Mount Vernon. IB would leave Mount Vernon, Edison and Annandale. So, it's going to be a large part of the eastern/southern part of the county.

2. Facilities is supposed to come up with a budget for the boundary study. There was a preliminary rough study.

3. Politically, there is one SB who loves the idea because they do not like the amount of IB programs. One SB members hates this. And others are either indifferent or oppose it because they'd rather the county push funding the Western FX high school.

4. Even with the changes, Lee is tracking to run into accreditation issues due to its ESOL learners. They shouldn't have defunded that damn night school.

5. It's going to be a lottery like HB Woodlawn. Each pyramid will get a set amount of seats with a waitlist.

6. They are following a model that was used by a different district that consolidated its IB programs (after attempting to dispatch them to poor performing schools). The district who did this saw a 100 percent capacity demand and has a large wait-list for the program. It requires students from middle school to commit to the program/diploma and students who aren't on track have to return to their base schools. It is extremely popular.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course people are moving into the Lee pyramid to be close to good jobs at NGA, Fort Belvoir, etc. They are educated professionals who expect good neighborhood schools. In addition to the newcomers who are attracted to the Springfield area for their jobs, there are many people who have lived here for years, who grew up here and remember when the schools were decent. To say “you get what you pay for” is morally reprehensible.

So, the truth is now morally reprehensible? If you bought in the Lee pyramid within at least the past 20 years, you either knew what you were getting or you were ignorant about the reputation of the schools. If you bought before that, you’d likely an empty nester by now in which case you only really care about the schools to the extent it affects the value of your house - you’re long done with actually using the schools.

So, yes, by their own decision-making, anyone in the Lee pyramid with kids in school are getting what they paid for. I hope Lee gets better, but that shouldn’t come on the backs of those in West Springfield who paid a premium in the past 20 years for superior schools.

Since I bought my house hundreds of wealthier students have been moved out of Lee either due to boundary changes or pupil placements. The F/R lunch rate has more than doubled (24% to 55%). So don't tell me what I bought. And I am not done with the schools. And a school with a 24% F/R lunch rate is a lot different than a school with a 55% F/R rate.

So what year did you buy and what was the reputation of Lee when you bought? Give us some actual numbers - what were the average SAT scores at Lee when you bought and where are they now? Maybe the FARMS rates have gone up, but Lee has never been a bastion of academic excellence in FCPS. Either you knew that when you bought and chose to buy in that pyramid for other reasons or you were ignorant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Gatehouse insider here. Lee is projecting to be around ~1400 in a few years.

I also have an update about the IB East Center Middle (Key) and High (Lee). I have a few new facts confirmed and can tell you some unknowns.

1. The feeders will be the following pyramids: Edison, West Springfield, Hayfield, South County, Annandale, West Potomac, and Mount Vernon. IB would leave Mount Vernon, Edison and Annandale. So, it's going to be a large part of the eastern/southern part of the county.

2. Facilities is supposed to come up with a budget for the boundary study. There was a preliminary rough study.

3. Politically, there is one SB who loves the idea because they do not like the amount of IB programs. One SB members hates this. And others are either indifferent or oppose it because they'd rather the county push funding the Western FX high school.

4. Even with the changes, Lee is tracking to run into accreditation issues due to its ESOL learners. They shouldn't have defunded that damn night school.

5. It's going to be a lottery like HB Woodlawn. Each pyramid will get a set amount of seats with a waitlist.

6. They are following a model that was used by a different district that consolidated its IB programs (after attempting to dispatch them to poor performing schools). The district who did this saw a 100 percent capacity demand and has a large wait-list for the program. It requires students from middle school to commit to the program/diploma and students who aren't on track have to return to their base schools. It is extremely popular.

And this is why this is all a pipe dream. Unless and until Lee loses accreditation, I wouldn’t get my hopes up for any significant change.

[Anonymous]

I tell you what though, I’m way the f*ck out in Burke zoned for Robinson. If they really do go ahead with this IB magnet thing I’m selling my house ASAP and moving in bounds for Edison. Smaller school, AP classes, AAP feeders, and convenient location. That area is going to be a big winner if this happens.