DC Charter sector is blacker and poorer and outscores DCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a previous poster said, it is not that black & white. Some charters are doing a great job but some are pretty crappy.
They do have an advantage over DCPS schools, besides more motivated families, in being able to limit enrolment and being able to get rid of troublesome students.
There is the unfortunate practice where they keep students until Novemver and then expel them.
This ensures that they get the money allocated for that student and then the kid is sent off to their local DCPS school that
has no choice but to accept them even though the money for that student has already been given to the charter school.

They need to change funding to make the money follow the child. At least all schools would be motivated to keep the child until the end of the school year. Alternatively, have two count days per year - one for each semester.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a previous poster said, it is not that black & white. Some charters are doing a great job but some are pretty crappy.
They do have an advantage over DCPS schools, besides more motivated families, in being able to limit enrolment and being able to get rid of troublesome students.
There is the unfortunate practice where they keep students until Novemver and then expel them.
This ensures that they get the money allocated for that student and then the kid is sent off to their local DCPS school that
has no choice but to accept them even though the money for that student has already been given to the charter school.

They need to change funding to make the money follow the child. At least all schools would be motivated to keep the child until the end of the school year. Alternatively, have two count days per year - one for each semester.

Plan being developed - it's part of cross sector task force agenda.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Guys, the ability to counsel out kids is a major factor here -- if all schools could get "rid" of their special ed and troublesome students, scores would climb demonstrably. You CANNOT discount this.

I don't understand, in this age of bountiful special Ed money, why schools are allowed to counsel out any kids at all. Get them paras, put them in a separate class with a lot more support (that's what our NYC Ps did and it worked). I know a lot of the counseling out is informal, and "unofficial" (the charters in NYC do this too); but if a certain percentage of families are leaving, it should trigger some kind of investigation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Guys, the ability to counsel out kids is a major factor here -- if all schools could get "rid" of their special ed and troublesome students, scores would climb demonstrably. You CANNOT discount this.

I don't understand, in this age of bountiful special Ed money, why schools are allowed to counsel out any kids at all. Get them paras, put them in a separate class with a lot more support (that's what our NYC Ps did and it worked). I know a lot of the counseling out is informal, and "unofficial" (the charters in NYC do this too); but if a certain percentage of families are leaving, it should trigger some kind of investigation.

IT DOES!!!

DCPCSB monitors it month by month.

However, special ed money is not 'bountiful' -- the amount provided for a special service provider doesn't cover the prevailing rates in this city, or many others.

[Anonymous]

can'h handle the truth huh the people left EOTP in publics are barely functioning due to multiple generations of poverty/neglect/drugs/ignorance

[Anonymous]

sorry menat to say EOTR aka wards 7 and 8 you know basically the dredges of society. Noone in their right minds wants to live there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need statistics

Look at KIPP, DC Prep, other chartesrs that are almost all minority. The test scores are light years ahead of other schools in DCPS that are all minority

Charters are giving SOME African Americans and Hispanics an actual path to success instead of being stuck in extremely terrible public schools

Fixed that for you. I say that because I work at a school in ward 7 where we get quite a few ex-KIPPers who have been counseled out for various reasons.

Thats still better than the status quo of crappy public schools though

Instead of people being stuck at your crappy ward 7 school there is an option to go to a charter and break the poverty cycle.

I hear you and even agree with you somewhat. Just don't pretend that my crappy ward 7 school doesn't end up taking the charters' throwaways, k?

I hope you are not an educator.

+1. I feel sad for these kids.

Sorry to pile on even more but what do you expect. Its a very tough environment. Any decent teacher would try to get out of that situation as quikcly as possible. You are left with the worst teachers in many cases aka the dead wood.

Actually that's not true. One of the downsides of charter schools are the high teacher turnover rate. Where exactly do you think these charter teachers go when they leave the charters? The majority end up in DCPS, MOCO, and PGC public schools. You didn't really think they want to earn a mere 30k for the rest of the lives, do you. So your once lauded charter school teachers are now the considered dead wood according to you.

They might start there and then any of them with commonsense leave as quickly as possible due to the poor student body and out of control behavior issues. Look if you teach in a poor performing schools you either 1. Have a great heart and care about making difference in a very challenging environment (great respect and admiration) or 2. You are deadwood and can't get a job in a better school area/district.

These schools suck for multiple reasons. Low SES parents/community who could care less about eduction, and "teachers" who are phoning it in

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:sorry menat to say EOTR aka wards 7 and 8 you know basically the dredges of society. Noone in their right minds wants to live there.

Crawl back under your rock, PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need statistics

Look at KIPP, DC Prep, other chartesrs that are almost all minority. The test scores are light years ahead of other schools in DCPS that are all minority

Charters are giving SOME African Americans and Hispanics an actual path to success instead of being stuck in extremely terrible public schools

Fixed that for you. I say that because I work at a school in ward 7 where we get quite a few ex-KIPPers who have been counseled out for various reasons.

Thats still better than the status quo of crappy public schools though

Instead of people being stuck at your crappy ward 7 school there is an option to go to a charter and break the poverty cycle.

I hear you and even agree with you somewhat. Just don't pretend that my crappy ward 7 school doesn't end up taking the charters' throwaways, k?

I hope you are not an educator.

+1. I feel sad for these kids.

Sorry to pile on even more but what do you expect. Its a very tough environment. Any decent teacher would try to get out of that situation as quikcly as possible. You are left with the worst teachers in many cases aka the dead wood.

Actually that's not true. One of the downsides of charter schools are the high teacher turnover rate. Where exactly do you think these charter teachers go when they leave the charters? The majority end up in DCPS, MOCO, and PGC public schools. You didn't really think they want to earn a mere 30k for the rest of the lives, do you. So your once lauded charter school teachers are now the considered dead wood according to you.

They might start there and then any of them with commonsense leave as quickly as possible due to the poor student body and out of control behavior issues. Look if you teach in a poor performing schools you either 1. Have a great heart and care about making difference in a very challenging environment (great respect and admiration) or 2. You are deadwood and can't get a job in a better school area/district.

These schools suck for multiple reasons. Low SES parents/community who could care less about eduction, and "teachers" who are phoning it in

Please assure us that you are not a teacher and for the love of all that is good, have never been a teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:sorry menat to say EOTR aka wards 7 and 8 you know basically the dredges of society. Noone in their right minds wants to live there.

Oh, Tucker. Are the interns letting you have the cough syrup with codeine in your coffee again?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Guys, the ability to counsel out kids is a major factor here -- if all schools could get "rid" of their special ed and troublesome students, scores would climb demonstrably. You CANNOT discount this.

I don't understand, in this age of bountiful special Ed money, why schools are allowed to counsel out any kids at all. Get them paras, put them in a separate class with a lot more support (that's what our NYC Ps did and it worked). I know a lot of the counseling out is informal, and "unofficial" (the charters in NYC do this too); but if a certain percentage of families are leaving, it should trigger some kind of investigation.

IT DOES!!!

DCPCSB monitors it month by month.

However, special ed money is not 'bountiful' -- the amount provided for a special service provider doesn't cover the prevailing rates in this city, or many others.

Is it more than their transit spending? Because I think that is a rather large pile of cash being spent very badly right there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need statistics

Look at KIPP, DC Prep, other chartesrs that are almost all minority. The test scores are light years ahead of other schools in DCPS that are all minority

Charters are giving SOME African Americans and Hispanics an actual path to success instead of being stuck in extremely terrible public schools

Fixed that for you. I say that because I work at a school in ward 7 where we get quite a few ex-KIPPers who have been counseled out for various reasons.

Thats still better than the status quo of crappy public schools though

Instead of people being stuck at your crappy ward 7 school there is an option to go to a charter and break the poverty cycle.

I hear you and even agree with you somewhat. Just don't pretend that my crappy ward 7 school doesn't end up taking the charters' throwaways, k?

I hope you are not an educator.

+1. I feel sad for these kids.

Sorry to pile on even more but what do you expect. Its a very tough environment. Any decent teacher would try to get out of that situation as quikcly as possible. You are left with the worst teachers in many cases aka the dead wood.

Actually that's not true. One of the downsides of charter schools are the high teacher turnover rate. Where exactly do you think these charter teachers go when they leave the charters? The majority end up in DCPS, MOCO, and PGC public schools. You didn't really think they want to earn a mere 30k for the rest of the lives, do you. So your once lauded charter school teachers are now the considered dead wood according to you.

They might start there and then any of them with commonsense leave as quickly as possible due to the poor student body and out of control behavior issues. Look if you teach in a poor performing schools you either 1. Have a great heart and care about making difference in a very challenging environment (great respect and admiration) or 2. You are deadwood and can't get a job in a better school area/district.

These schools suck for multiple reasons. Low SES parents/community who could care less about eduction, and "teachers" who are phoning it in

Please assure us that you are not a teacher and for the love of all that is good, have never been a teacher.

I am sorry reality is not your strong suit. DCPS has sucked for over 50 years. The charters and gentrification have finally made things better. Death to the unions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away is that large percentages African American and more poor families are self selecting into charters. So those around DCUM who argue that charters are elitist and a bastion for racist white families can now shut up.

That's not a point we're making about charters in general. There are simply some that have erected barriers (intentionally or unintentionally) that end up with higher-SES populations (rabid DCUM charter cheerleading parents). These charters got a lot of buzz here, but they're also the ones undermining some DCPS's in gentrifying neighborhoods from getting a toehold on neighborhood kids.

So you'd like to hobble and dismantle the charter sector in general ( which is serving many, many more low income families than rich ones ) so that you sweet gentrifying neighborhood school "might" have more students? What"s wrong with you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Guys, the ability to counsel out kids is a major factor here -- if all schools could get "rid" of their special ed and troublesome students, scores would climb demonstrably. You CANNOT discount this.

I don't understand, in this age of bountiful special Ed money, why schools are allowed to counsel out any kids at all. Get them paras, put them in a separate class with a lot more support (that's what our NYC Ps did and it worked). I know a lot of the counseling out is informal, and "unofficial" (the charters in NYC do this too); but if a certain percentage of families are leaving, it should trigger some kind of investigation.

The ability to control your student population is one of the biggest reasons private schools do so well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need statistics

Look at KIPP, DC Prep, other chartesrs that are almost all minority. The test scores are light years ahead of other schools in DCPS that are all minority

Charters are giving SOME African Americans and Hispanics an actual path to success instead of being stuck in extremely terrible public schools

Fixed that for you. I say that because I work at a school in ward 7 where we get quite a few ex-KIPPers who have been counseled out for various reasons.

Thats still better than the status quo of crappy public schools though

Instead of people being stuck at your crappy ward 7 school there is an option to go to a charter and break the poverty cycle.

I hear you and even agree with you somewhat. Just don't pretend that my crappy ward 7 school doesn't end up taking the charters' throwaways, k?

I hope you are not an educator.

+1. I feel sad for these kids.

Sorry to pile on even more but what do you expect. Its a very tough environment. Any decent teacher would try to get out of that situation as quikcly as possible. You are left with the worst teachers in many cases aka the dead wood.

Actually that's not true. One of the downsides of charter schools are the high teacher turnover rate. Where exactly do you think these charter teachers go when they leave the charters? The majority end up in DCPS, MOCO, and PGC public schools. You didn't really think they want to earn a mere 30k for the rest of the lives, do you. So your once lauded charter school teachers are now the considered dead wood according to you.

They might start there and then any of them with commonsense leave as quickly as possible due to the poor student body and out of control behavior issues. Look if you teach in a poor performing schools you either 1. Have a great heart and care about making difference in a very challenging environment (great respect and admiration) or 2. You are deadwood and can't get a job in a better school area/district.

These schools suck for multiple reasons. Low SES parents/community who could care less about eduction, and "teachers" who are phoning it in

Please assure us that you are not a teacher and for the love of all that is good, have never been a teacher.

I am sorry reality is not your strong suit. DCPS has sucked for over 50 years. The charters and gentrification have finally made things better. Death to the unions

it's likely the same pro-charter troll who won't STFU on all things rainbow and unicorns about charters and the evils of DCPS.