Hijab/headscarf for Muslims

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to high school (an all-girls independent school) with a Muslim girl, who really struggled when her family made her start wearing a hijab. It was devastating to her at first and she tried fighting it, but then she finally gave up the battle. A spark in her died with that headscarf and whether it was self-imposed or the other kids discomfort, she went from being fairly popular to really isolated. I always felt so sorry for her. When I see a woman in a hijab, part of me pities her. The other part is angry that she doesn't fight harder for her rights and continues wearing that symbol of oppression.

Mission accomplished. Her family prevented her from becoming too enmeshed in non-Muslim society and from having too many non-Muslim friends. The isolation was the point.

This. I'm Muslim and make no mistake - the parents in America forcing or even encouraging their daughters to do this are doing it to isolate them and make sure there's minimal assimilation. Doesn't matter if they're poor or UMC or anything in between - there is a goal that is not spoken to anyone who is non Muslim.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I don't really care what grown women do with their clothes, but I get really pissed off when I see little girls (8 or 10 or 12) in a head covering, jeans and a long sleeve knit shirt in July at someplace like Six Flags. It's brutally hot out. Putting a kid in those kinds of clothes is cruel.

Do you feel the same way if you see conservative Jewish kids covered up at amusement parks? I've seen girls and boys at Hersheypark in August with long sleeves, long skirts or pants, and fully covered.

Doesn't bother me but I kind of want to buy them an extra large iced tea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I don't really care what grown women do with their clothes, but I get really pissed off when I see little girls (8 or 10 or 12) in a head covering, jeans and a long sleeve knit shirt in July at someplace like Six Flags. It's brutally hot out. Putting a kid in those kinds of clothes is cruel.

Do you feel the same way if you see conservative Jewish kids covered up at amusement parks? I've seen girls and boys at Hersheypark in August with long sleeves, long skirts or pants, and fully covered.

Doesn't bother me but I kind of want to buy them an extra large iced tea.

Those are Orthodox kids, not Conservative kids, and yes, I feel for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I don't really care what grown women do with their clothes, but I get really pissed off when I see little girls (8 or 10 or 12) in a head covering, jeans and a long sleeve knit shirt in July at someplace like Six Flags. It's brutally hot out. Putting a kid in those kinds of clothes is cruel.

Do you feel the same way if you see conservative Jewish kids covered up at amusement parks? I've seen girls and boys at Hersheypark in August with long sleeves, long skirts or pants, and fully covered.

Doesn't bother me but I kind of want to buy them an extra large iced tea.

I feel for them but not the same way I feel for those in hijabs/niquabs. Their own people are not killing them or lashing them in other countries for not covering.

[Anonymous]

In India before the past 2 decades, you pretty much NEVER saw educated Muslim women wearing either a hijab or a niqab. I still know many Indian Muslim women who would preeeetty much laugh scornfully at the idea of wearing either of those things.

It's just never been how Indian Islam was. It used to be that Indian Muslim girls were actually considered pretty racy and liberal by pearl-clutching Catholic and Hindu Indians. That's changing now, which is sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In India before the past 2 decades, you pretty much NEVER saw educated Muslim women wearing either a hijab or a niqab. I still know many Indian Muslim women who would preeeetty much laugh scornfully at the idea of wearing either of those things.

It's just never been how Indian Islam was. It used to be that Indian Muslim girls were actually considered pretty racy and liberal by pearl-clutching Catholic and Hindu Indians. That's changing now, which is sad.

Are you saying this has changed? I grew up with many Muslim girls. Not one of them wore a hijab or niqab.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In India before the past 2 decades, you pretty much NEVER saw educated Muslim women wearing either a hijab or a niqab. I still know many Indian Muslim women who would preeeetty much laugh scornfully at the idea of wearing either of those things.

It's just never been how Indian Islam was. It used to be that Indian Muslim girls were actually considered pretty racy and liberal by pearl-clutching Catholic and Hindu Indians. That's changing now, which is sad.

Are you saying this has changed? I grew up with many Muslim girls. Not one of them wore a hijab or niqab.

Unfortunately it is slowly changing. If you visit some Indian cities now, especially Delhi, you see more Muslim girls wearing a niqab or hajib. It's depressing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In India before the past 2 decades, you pretty much NEVER saw educated Muslim women wearing either a hijab or a niqab. I still know many Indian Muslim women who would preeeetty much laugh scornfully at the idea of wearing either of those things.

It's just never been how Indian Islam was. It used to be that Indian Muslim girls were actually considered pretty racy and liberal by pearl-clutching Catholic and Hindu Indians. That's changing now, which is sad.

Are you saying this has changed? I grew up with many Muslim girls. Not one of them wore a hijab or niqab.

Unfortunately it is slowly changing. If you visit some Indian cities now, especially Delhi, you see more Muslim girls wearing a niqab or hajib. It's depressing.

You see it a lot in Kerala now too. Full on niqabs everywhere.

Zakir Naik and his "Peace TV'' have been breeding and selling Wahhabist ideology. The Urdu newspapers also spread it relentlessly. It is very sad to see how it is changing. Even my aunt who had always been very liberal and never wore hijab. Now she won't watch TV and only listens to sermons on the internet and is so paranoid about her faith.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hijabs doesn't bother me.

Niqabs actually really bother me. I feel that its an aggressive political statement in some ways seeing as its quite extreme to hide your face in that way.

After all as a society, we place a lot of value in facial expressions and non-verbal cues. I would not feel especially encouraged to start a conversation with someone in a niqab. Its sort of a Do Not Disturb sign.

+1. The niqab is a patriarchal cultural relic turned into a political statement. Some dispute that the Quran requires a woman to cover her hair.

Don't be ridiculous. It's a cultural relic for sure, but that culture is stemmed in class, not patriarchy. Rich urban married women used to cover their faces to protect them from the sun and most importantly, show that they don't have to work. Women working the fields never cover their faces. You pretty much couldn't work with your face covered, and upperclass women wore them to show they didn't have to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Europe has banned them as a sign of oppression

No it didn't. "Europe", incidentally, can't really ban them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to respond to the PP who mentioned in passing that she wondered if women in a hijab were judging women dressed less conservatively. For some reason I always feel like a hoochie when I see someone in a hijab and i'm wearing shorts. Should I continue to be embarrassed or do they not mind my outfit?

You should feel proud to live in a country that allows women to be themselves and dress as they please.

And if you are 16-30 you should be proud of your young and fit body and not oet archaic religious practices shame you for wearing normal.clothes.

You will never look as beautiful as you do during those years so be proud of whay God has given you.

You are confusing pride with display. You can be proud of something without feeling compelled to show it to all and sundry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Forty pages of comments on the hijab:

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/520851.page

Personally I don't like it because I believe the vast majority of those who do believe it is required by Islam--my view is it is not.

So my prejudice on seeing a woman wearing a hijab is that she is doing so because: 1) she believes in a fundamentalist version of Islam that allows for no critical thinking, b) her family has forced her to do, c) she comes from a country where it is required or d) she wears it so her family will not be less suspicious that she is doing something she shouldn't. There are a couple of other fringe reasons, like wearing it as a sign of Muslim pride--that is, more as identifier as belonging to a group from which others are excluded.

I could see the hair accessory point of view, but only if sometimes she didn't cover her hair--otherwise we are back to one of the above.

It's a good thing you recognize that this is your prejudice, not an actual well reasoned point of view.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to respond to the PP who mentioned in passing that she wondered if women in a hijab were judging women dressed less conservatively. For some reason I always feel like a hoochie when I see someone in a hijab and i'm wearing shorts. Should I continue to be embarrassed or do they not mind my outfit?

You should feel proud to live in a country that allows women to be themselves and dress as they please.

And if you are 16-30 you should be proud of your young and fit body and not oet archaic religious practices shame you for wearing normal.clothes.

You will never look as beautiful as you do during those years so be proud of whay God has given you.

You are confusing pride with display. You can be proud of something without feeling compelled to show it to all and sundry.

And you are confusing oppression with modesty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Forty pages of comments on the hijab:

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/520851.page

Personally I don't like it because I believe the vast majority of those who do believe it is required by Islam--my view is it is not.

So my prejudice on seeing a woman wearing a hijab is that she is doing so because: 1) she believes in a fundamentalist version of Islam that allows for no critical thinking, b) her family has forced her to do, c) she comes from a country where it is required or d) she wears it so her family will not be less suspicious that she is doing something she shouldn't. There are a couple of other fringe reasons, like wearing it as a sign of Muslim pride--that is, more as identifier as belonging to a group from which others are excluded.

I could see the hair accessory point of view, but only if sometimes she didn't cover her hair--otherwise we are back to one of the above.

I can't fathom, why women in today's day and age and in a free country like the US, would wear a headscarf or a burka. When I see a woman wearing any of these, the first emotion is sadness. : More so if they are wearing it out of their own free will. Like someone's holding an invisible gun to your head. Do this or else.. Even in a free country. Whoever said hijab is a hair accessory.. You got to be kidding. No comparison to a hijab and Sophia Lirens scarf there. None. Just saying.
Not saying wear skimpy clothes, but celebrate and enjoy who you are, hair, face, arms, legs.. All of you. Why the need to cover or identify yourself differently always? I wear clothes from my culture many times but I would never let myself be tied down to that.. Know what I mean? I am much more than a religion or a symbol.

You don't own other women's bodies and you have no right to dictate how much of their bodies they should display to please you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I don't really care what grown women do with their clothes, but I get really pissed off when I see little girls (8 or 10 or 12) in a head covering, jeans and a long sleeve knit shirt in July at someplace like Six Flags. It's brutally hot out. Putting a kid in those kinds of clothes is cruel.

Do you feel the same way if you see conservative Jewish kids covered up at amusement parks? I've seen girls and boys at Hersheypark in August with long sleeves, long skirts or pants, and fully covered.

Doesn't bother me but I kind of want to buy them an extra large iced tea.

I feel for them but not the same way I feel for those in hijabs/niquabs. Their own people are not killing them or lashing them in other countries for not covering.

I dunno, tourists in t-shirts and shorts who wander into Jerusalem's Orthodox neighborhoods report high levels of harassment.