Holding back a very bright, but socially immature child?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for all of the feedback. My DH strongly agrees with holding her back as well. Some of my hesitation is that I was a late July birthday myself, but there was never a question of holding me back in public school in the 1980s and so it was my experience to be the youngest in the class. Funny enough, my childhood best friends all had summer birthdays as well and in retrospect we were all the same maturity-wise (and in terms of physical development, too!). DD is our oldest child, and it's so interesting to see how class room age cut-offs have shifted, particularly in private schools. Thanks again for the timely and helpful responses.

In general, most highly rated public and private schools are more rigorous in the earlier years than the typical elementary school of the 80's. As an example, it's now typical for children to take Algebra I in 8th and there's a reasonable bunch who take it in 7th and even 6th. Growing up Algebra I in 8th was the highest math track.

Interesting. I went to GDS in the 80s-90s where about a quarter of the class to algebra in 7th, then the rest split evenly between algebra in 8th and pre-algebra in 8th. I don't get the impression that has changed too much. Maybe it was always rigorous and the rest of the elementary schools are catching up?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for all of the feedback. My DH strongly agrees with holding her back as well. Some of my hesitation is that I was a late July birthday myself, but there was never a question of holding me back in public school in the 1980s and so it was my experience to be the youngest in the class. Funny enough, my childhood best friends all had summer birthdays as well and in retrospect we were all the same maturity-wise (and in terms of physical development, too!). DD is our oldest child, and it's so interesting to see how class room age cut-offs have shifted, particularly in private schools. Thanks again for the timely and helpful responses.

In general, most highly rated public and private schools are more rigorous in the earlier years than the typical elementary school of the 80's. As an example, it's now typical for children to take Algebra I in 8th and there's a reasonable bunch who take it in 7th and even 6th. Growing up Algebra I in 8th was the highest math track.

I agree that schools are more rigorous now, but I took Algebra in 7th grade more than 30 years ago in a well regarded public.

[Anonymous]

I know this is an old post but I am going to throw this out there anyway. My first grader was born early and very tiny but never struggled with meeting his milestones as he grew. He is small for his age and one of the youngest in the class. We have been reading to him since in utero and he is quite well spoken for a boy so young (some people say he is like talking to a 40 year old). I think he has social issues because of his vocabulary (and vocabulary comprehension) is so much much more advanced than his peers. Instead of recognizing his intelligence, his teacher thinks he is socially immature and should be held back. Academically, he is right where he should be. The teacher has indicated that she does not care for him with a few comments that she has made about him. For example, she doesn't like how he looks at her, she feels like he looks right through her like "he is going to tear her apart". She has also mentioned that she is "really trying" to show him compassion. I don't feel that it would be a benefit for him to stay back since there is clearly a personality clash. We decided to have him tested because she was concerned that his social and emotional state is affecting his academics. The tests confirmed that not only is he capable, he is quite intelligent. My husband and I are not social creatures and she is forcing him to be part of the "team". I think he has decided that she is pretentious and that he doesn't want to perform for her. So how do you deal with a situation where both parties are being stubborn?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know this is an old post but I am going to throw this out there anyway. My first grader was born early and very tiny but never struggled with meeting his milestones as he grew. He is small for his age and one of the youngest in the class. We have been reading to him since in utero and he is quite well spoken for a boy so young (some people say he is like talking to a 40 year old). I think he has social issues because of his vocabulary (and vocabulary comprehension) is so much much more advanced than his peers. Instead of recognizing his intelligence, his teacher thinks he is socially immature and should be held back. Academically, he is right where he should be. The teacher has indicated that she does not care for him with a few comments that she has made about him. For example, she doesn't like how he looks at her, she feels like he looks right through her like "he is going to tear her apart". She has also mentioned that she is "really trying" to show him compassion. I don't feel that it would be a benefit for him to stay back since there is clearly a personality clash. We decided to have him tested because she was concerned that his social and emotional state is affecting his academics. The tests confirmed that not only is he capable, he is quite intelligent. My husband and I are not social creatures and she is forcing him to be part of the "team". I think he has decided that she is pretentious and that he doesn't want to perform for her. So how do you deal with a situation where both parties are being stubborn?

PP, If the teacher indeed said she didn’t like the way he looks at her, I suggest you take a deeper look at why she’s saying that. To me, it suggests that he is looking at her with hostility.

He way you phrased your e-mail is also hostile, i.e. that you and your husband are not social creatures and your son is being forced to be part of a team; that he doesn’t want to perform for her.

Perhaps there were some negative interactions early on that set a certain tone in the interactions among all of you. However, being intelligent does not mean that you cannot learn to interact well with other people. My son is highly gifted and also has an advanced vocabulary - testing at the 11th grade. He gets on well with most teachers. Our family is pretty social, and our son gets a lot of exposure to and practice interacting with a wide range of people.

I think it’s quite possible your son is having difficulties socially, most likely because of the negative lens you place on being social. It is a vitally important skill, and if you value your son’s happiness, you may want to put greater effort into helping him develop social skills.

[Anonymous]

I know schools work ahead from where they used to be, but I’m questioning a place that touts being a grade level ahead while holding many back. It doesn’t sound developmentally appropriate for kids who in theory meet the age cut off. The ACTUAL age cutoff, not the one where they suggest holding back April and May birthdays. That is absurd.

I guess if you are going to keep her there, hold her back. No reason for her to suffer socially with kids who are much older.

[Anonymous]

20:13, I think your advice to OP is probably OBE’d.

Two posts prior, a new poster has resurrected the three year old thread to ask about a different child.

[Anonymous]

My DD had a 99% WPPSI and late July birthday and I sent her ahead. She is in upper elementary now and I wish that I had held her back. She's *ok* socially but isn't gelling with her school peers as well as I would like.

[Anonymous]

I have a late summer birthday, and went to school “on time.” I test gifted, but I always felt out of sync with my classmates until about late high school. I was emotionally younger. Being gifted actually made that worse sometimes, but here was a core emotional immaturity that was perfectly age appropriate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD had a 99% WPPSI and late July birthday and I sent her ahead. She is in upper elementary now and I wish that I had held her back. She's *ok* socially but isn't gelling with her school peers as well as I would like.

It isn't about you. It is entirely probable that your child is an introvert like my kids, and just doesn't gel the way extroverted kids do. I am an extrovert, so I get it, but holding a kid back doesn't change their personality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD had a 99% WPPSI and late July birthday and I sent her ahead. She is in upper elementary now and I wish that I had held her back. She's *ok* socially but isn't gelling with her school peers as well as I would like.

It isn't about you. It is entirely probable that your child is an introvert like my kids, and just doesn't gel the way extroverted kids do. I am an extrovert, so I get it, but holding a kid back doesn't change their personality.

same here. my child excelled in gifted programs, turns quiet in 30+ kid classes, and doesn't always pick up social cues. But she has her set of best friends, but they are not from her current school.

the downside of a small school (30-40 boys, 30-40 girls) is exactly that issue, gelling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for all of the feedback. My DH strongly agrees with holding her back as well. Some of my hesitation is that I was a late July birthday myself, but there was never a question of holding me back in public school in the 1980s and so it was my experience to be the youngest in the class. Funny enough, my childhood best friends all had summer birthdays as well and in retrospect we were all the same maturity-wise (and in terms of physical development, too!). DD is our oldest child, and it's so interesting to see how class room age cut-offs have shifted, particularly in private schools. Thanks again for the timely and helpful responses.

School is very different now than when we were growing up in many ways. Kindergarten is closer to first grade academically. Schools are more partner/group project heavy and in my experience it’s way easier for older / more socially mature kids to work with others than their younger counterparts. This can get even more challenging the older the kids get. If you are at a private, they should be able to make sure your daughter is challenged. I think you can only put so much stock in Admissions tests—my son did very well but he’s plenty challenged at his school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I posted a month or so ago about the private school suggesting we start DD in Kindergarten instead of 1st grade and I got some very good and thought-provoking responses. DH and I have almost decided to do it, but I'm hesitating just a bit.

DD is a late July birthday and her school has an informal cut-off birth date of April or May. So, while she could technically fit into the 1st grade class, it is clear that almost every single child with a summer birthday is held back and that if she were pushed ahead she would be in class with 30-40% of students who are a full calendar year older than her or more. The school is also academically rigorous and claims that they teach almost a grade above level, compared to public schools. DD is also socially immature for her age. She struggles with some social interactions, gets frustrated quickly, resorts to baby talk when feeling shy or awkward, etc. For all of those reasons, it seems to make sense to enroll her in K again.

On the other hand, DD is very, very bright. She scored 97-99% on each category of the WPPSI. She is spatially and mathematically inclined. She learned chess and understood some strategy when she was just 5. She's great at puzzles and patterns. I don't think she's the next Einstein or anything, but I worry that holding her back academically may not be the best choice in a few years once she has grown in maturity if she is still very bright.

So, for parents who have been down this road before: is social development a better yardstick than academic development in terms of where to place a child in school? Or will she wind up bored later on?


Hold them back. Life is boring. No matter how bright you are/how well you score, you need to know how to be bored and tolerate it.

[Anonymous]

What do her teachers say? I would go by their recommendation. They have the experience of having seen hundreds of 5 year olds and can compare your daughter's development and personality to her peers in a way that you simply cannot. (Yes, you do know your daughter well, but you don't know her as well in the classroom setting.)

-A teacher

[Anonymous]

Her social skills will get worse if she’s bored out of her mind.

[Anonymous]

Pros and con: We sent our November boy to K when he was 4, but he was big, athletic very verbal and a little bossy. His pre-school teacher encouraged us to do this. It worked out well both academically and socially. But now that he is a college junior at 19, ( he got AP credit) he seems a lot younger than his friends. He is being recruited now for jobs after he graduates
and unless he matures quickly I think he will seem very young in the workplace. If we were wealthy it would be good for him to take a couple years off after college, but we cannot afford it.