What SHOULD Dems do?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:January 6th is everything to me

I was traumatized by that and can't fathom how the Republicans rationalize it.

The most common class signaling we do is to pretend that we “can’t even fathom” what middle class voters are thinking. HOW can they possibly disagree with us richer, more educated, more moral people on climate, migrants, trans, whatever. If we’ve never even been able to UNDERSTAND, what middle class people even THINK, well, that show that we really are more fancy. They may look like is, but we’re definitely NOT like them! No Trump, no gold buildings, Nd no McDonalds for us!

That works in reverse too. Where are the MAGAs reaching out to understand what Democrats want?

…Oh, that’s right. They don’t care. Because, according to your calculus, simply being in power is proof that you are correct and morally superior.

You’re confused. Republicans know what hardcore Dems want. We broadcast it all over the media. And middle class voters din’t have status anxiety the way we do. They already know we’re more affluent. But we want to prove to each other, to our upper middle class peers, that we are NOTHNG like the mere middle class.

It’s just signaling. We know the middle class doesn’t care about climate like we do, doesn’t care about trans like we (say we) do, etc. We just play dumb sometimes among each other as a way to strike a pose.

Just because others don’t care doesn’t mean we shouldn’t

I have said before that I’m not throwing important issues under the bus just because the common voter doesn’t understand them (which leads to the not caring OR susceptibility to RW nuttery re:said issues)

[Anonymous]

Here it is Dems! The painful truth.

What Democrats should do is apologize.

The voters DO want servant leaders who care more about what THEY want than what WE believe.

The voters do NOT want know-it-alls, snobs, or leaders who resent voters for daring to choose the other party once in a while.

The customer is always right. We can either cling to our belief that WE are always right and the customers are wrong, or we can apologize for our past failures to give the customers what they want, apologize for disrespecting the customers, change our offerings, and try to earn back their business.

If we can’t even apologize, then they know we don’t intend to respect their wishes over our own beliefs going forward either.

Here is just a partial list of what swing voters and flyover state viters want us to apologize for:

1) Covid overreach. I know, I know, we f**king love science and the voters are stupid. It doesn’t matter. The voters reject our belief that we helped against Covid, and they are furious about forced masking of children, school closures, and forced injections on penalty of job loss. They were also very shaken by what they saw as our totalitarian streak. A lot of us were very cruel to neighbors and even family members. I know it will be very difficult psychologically for us to admit any fault here. We were on the right side of this, our intentions were good, etc. But so far basically none of us have said sorry to anyone for any of this. If we want swing voters back, we have to say sorry.

2) Illegal Immigration

3) Using affirmative action to harm white workers

4) LGBTQIA+ education in elementary schools. (I agree, it’s a good thing. It teaches kids tolerance. Rs make too big a deal of it. But remember, they are the customers. If we’re the “force unpopular things down your throat Party,” they won’t vote for us. We went too far (for THEIR liking), and for that, we should apologize

5) Inflation. Yes it was Covid, the Fed, and Trump’s fault too. But our team printed and borrowed and spent too much money.

6) Calling voters stupid racists

Think about it. We win’t like this prescription, but without it we can’t get the votes back

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I love elimination of all the fraud, waste and abuse. There should be more cuts to federal spending. More fat can be trimmed.

Trump should be cut.

[Anonymous]

Give the people what they want:

Storm the capitol.

Attack voting sites.

Hack the vote-counting computers.

Get a pardon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:January 6th is everything to me

I was traumatized by that and can't fathom how the Republicans rationalize it.

The most common class signaling we do is to pretend that we “can’t even fathom” what middle class voters are thinking. HOW can they possibly disagree with us richer, more educated, more moral people on climate, migrants, trans, whatever. If we’ve never even been able to UNDERSTAND, what middle class people even THINK, well, that show that we really are more fancy. They may look like is, but we’re definitely NOT like them! No Trump, no gold buildings, Nd no McDonalds for us!

That works in reverse too. Where are the MAGAs reaching out to understand what Democrats want?

…Oh, that’s right. They don’t care. Because, according to your calculus, simply being in power is proof that you are correct and morally superior.

You’re confused. Republicans know what hardcore Dems want. We broadcast it all over the media. And middle class voters din’t have status anxiety the way we do. They already know we’re more affluent. But we want to prove to each other, to our upper middle class peers, that we are NOTHNG like the mere middle class.

It’s just signaling. We know the middle class doesn’t care about climate like we do, doesn’t care about trans like we (say we) do, etc. We just play dumb sometimes among each other as a way to strike a pose.

Everything you’ve just said is completely wrong. Republicans and RW media outlets lie and distort all the time. They mischaracterize Democrats. They demonize Democrats. They have no idea what Democrats stand for, or they pretend not to, because the Dem positions on things like health care, the environment, and worker’s rights are in fact more popular with voters than useless grievance politics. Their tactic is to drown out Dem messaging with a lot of culture war noise and take control of the narrative. It feels good to blame everything on immigrants, but it doesn’t lower the price of groceries or make your drinking water safer.

You’re doing the same thing right now: caricaturing Democrats as effete out of touch upper class snobs constantly “signaling” to each other about trans people. You love that term, signaling, as if you don’t believe Democrats are real people with thoughtful opinions based on a lifetime of observing how the world works. It’s incredibly condescending and dishonest to pretend to speak for people when you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here it is Dems! The painful truth.

What Democrats should do is apologize.

The voters DO want servant leaders who care more about what THEY want than what WE believe.

The voters do NOT want know-it-alls, snobs, or leaders who resent voters for daring to choose the other party once in a while.

The customer is always right. We can either cling to our belief that WE are always right and the customers are wrong, or we can apologize for our past failures to give the customers what they want, apologize for disrespecting the customers, change our offerings, and try to earn back their business.

If we can’t even apologize, then they know we don’t intend to respect their wishes over our own beliefs going forward either.

Here is just a partial list of what swing voters and flyover state viters want us to apologize for:

1) Covid overreach. I know, I know, we f**king love science and the voters are stupid. It doesn’t matter. The voters reject our belief that we helped against Covid, and they are furious about forced masking of children, school closures, and forced injections on penalty of job loss. They were also very shaken by what they saw as our totalitarian streak. A lot of us were very cruel to neighbors and even family members. I know it will be very difficult psychologically for us to admit any fault here. We were on the right side of this, our intentions were good, etc. But so far basically none of us have said sorry to anyone for any of this. If we want swing voters back, we have to say sorry.

2) Illegal Immigration

3) Using affirmative action to harm white workers

4) LGBTQIA+ education in elementary schools. (I agree, it’s a good thing. It teaches kids tolerance. Rs make too big a deal of it. But remember, they are the customers. If we’re the “force unpopular things down your throat Party,” they won’t vote for us. We went too far (for THEIR liking), and for that, we should apologize

5) Inflation. Yes it was Covid, the Fed, and Trump’s fault too. But our team printed and borrowed and spent too much money.

6) Calling voters stupid racists

Think about it. We win’t like this prescription, but without it we can’t get the votes back

“Hey Dems! Here’s what you need to do! Abandon all your principles and move further right. Signed, MAGA”.

Better idea: MAGA should apologize to the country for getting in bed with theocratic fascists, throwing away the Constitution and democracy, abandoning our allies, and destroying the social contract.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jon Stewart is ridiculing Dem leadership.
People want to dump Schumer for caving.
What would be an attack plan that makes sense?
I almost wish we had a parliamentary system right now, a dozen parties and coalitions forming and reforming.

I think what the Democratic leadership is implying is that Trump’s approval has to fall below 40 percent and, ideally, 30 percent for them to do a lot.

The problem is that liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc. have been divided by Russian or Republican manipulation, too, and mostly refuse to acknowledge that.

We’re not taking the Trump threat seriously.

We’re blaming each other, saying we want to eject this or that flawed person, wanting to refuse aid from billionaires, wanting to refuse ties with PACs or big business, and making many other idiotic, self-destructive decisions.

If Trump is really a dictator, we have to focus on that issue, cast aside ordinary policy differences and unite to fight things like the administration ignoring routine court rulings.

If we have to unite with people who hate abortion or love tax breaks but who also support free elections, the rule of law and peaceful resolution of disputes, we have to hold our noses and get in a big tent with those folks.

And, in addition to welcoming AOC and Rashida Tlaib with enthusiastic love, we have to find arguments that appeal to independents and persuadable Republicans, not revel in arguments that we like.

We can cling to what we believe and not water that down, but we have to stop the nuclear bomb that’s going off now before we focus on other issues and wall ourselves off from people who disagree about those issues.

And most of the people in the center and in the left disagreeing with this are simply targets of disinformation aimed at us instead of the Republicans are. Until we understand that we’re manipulated, too, we have no hope of fighting back. If you’re raging about the suggestion that we should unite with jerks, then you’re as much a part of the problem as the people in MAGA caps. You’re just the blue version of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here it is Dems! The painful truth.

What Democrats should do is apologize.

The voters DO want servant leaders who care more about what THEY want than what WE believe.

The voters do NOT want know-it-alls, snobs, or leaders who resent voters for daring to choose the other party once in a while.

The customer is always right. We can either cling to our belief that WE are always right and the customers are wrong, or we can apologize for our past failures to give the customers what they want, apologize for disrespecting the customers, change our offerings, and try to earn back their business.

If we can’t even apologize, then they know we don’t intend to respect their wishes over our own beliefs going forward either.

Here is just a partial list of what swing voters and flyover state viters want us to apologize for:

1) Covid overreach. I know, I know, we f**king love science and the voters are stupid. It doesn’t matter. The voters reject our belief that we helped against Covid, and they are furious about forced masking of children, school closures, and forced injections on penalty of job loss. They were also very shaken by what they saw as our totalitarian streak. A lot of us were very cruel to neighbors and even family members. I know it will be very difficult psychologically for us to admit any fault here. We were on the right side of this, our intentions were good, etc. But so far basically none of us have said sorry to anyone for any of this. If we want swing voters back, we have to say sorry.
--Covid policies were state and local, except for fed employees and military, and there was plenty of cruelty from the MAGA side

2) Illegal Immigration
--need to tie it more closely to foreign relations and international politics, they are all getting lumped together

3) Using affirmative action to harm white workers
--seriously? embrace a lie?

4) LGBTQIA+ education in elementary schools. (I agree, it’s a good thing. It teaches kids tolerance. Rs make too big a deal of it. But remember, they are the customers. If we’re the “force unpopular things down your throat Party,” they won’t vote for us. We went too far (for THEIR liking), and for that, we should apologize
--I have no idea what is actually happening in most elem schools so can't respond to that. I'm positive it's way way less than MAGA says. When CRT is considered the same thing as a picture of Collin Powell. . . .

5) Inflation. Yes it was Covid, the Fed, and Trump’s fault too. But our team printed and borrowed and spent too much money.
It was global, the spending prevented recession.

6) Calling voters stupid racists
I was talking more about more from the Dem leadership POV

I do think Dems failed to lead in messaging, although it is very hard to lead when your message is preventing things that did NOT happen, like a major recession.

Think about it. We win’t like this prescription, but without it we can’t get the votes back

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here it is Dems! The painful truth.

What Democrats should do is apologize.

The voters DO want servant leaders who care more about what THEY want than what WE believe.

The voters do NOT want know-it-alls, snobs, or leaders who resent voters for daring to choose the other party once in a while.

The customer is always right. We can either cling to our belief that WE are always right and the customers are wrong, or we can apologize for our past failures to give the customers what they want, apologize for disrespecting the customers, change our offerings, and try to earn back their business.

If we can’t even apologize, then they know we don’t intend to respect their wishes over our own beliefs going forward either.

Here is just a partial list of what swing voters and flyover state viters want us to apologize for:

1) Covid overreach. I know, I know, we f**king love science and the voters are stupid. It doesn’t matter. The voters reject our belief that we helped against Covid, and they are furious about forced masking of children, school closures, and forced injections on penalty of job loss. They were also very shaken by what they saw as our totalitarian streak. A lot of us were very cruel to neighbors and even family members. I know it will be very difficult psychologically for us to admit any fault here. We were on the right side of this, our intentions were good, etc. But so far basically none of us have said sorry to anyone for any of this. If we want swing voters back, we have to say sorry.

2) Illegal Immigration

3) Using affirmative action to harm white workers

4) LGBTQIA+ education in elementary schools. (I agree, it’s a good thing. It teaches kids tolerance. Rs make too big a deal of it. But remember, they are the customers. If we’re the “force unpopular things down your throat Party,” they won’t vote for us. We went too far (for THEIR liking), and for that, we should apologize

5) Inflation. Yes it was Covid, the Fed, and Trump’s fault too. But our team printed and borrowed and spent too much money.

6) Calling voters stupid racists

Think about it. We win’t like this prescription, but without it we can’t get the votes back

“Hey Dems! Here’s what you need to do! Abandon all your principles and move further right. Signed, MAGA”.

Better idea: MAGA should apologize to the country for getting in bed with theocratic fascists, throwing away the Constitution and democracy, abandoning our allies, and destroying the social contract.

This list is things we should apologize to SWING VOTERS for, not MAGA. And this list is things swing voters really do object to. I personally do NOT think if this as a list of non-negotiable Democratic Party principles! If it is, then we really ARE screwed.

At the end of the day, it’s all trade offs. We aren’t running a religion here, we’re running a political party. If we want to fight against voter preferences on everything, we’ll get less votes. For some of us, that’s okay. There ARE some principles more important than political power. For others of us, having the chance to nominate Supremes is more important than being too stubborn to apologize for school closures. We’ll each have to make our own decision. But if we hate the voters and can’t admit we’ve ever made any mistakes, we’re not going to be that popular.

[Anonymous]

Dems need to pull together to defend DEIA on every level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here it is Dems! The painful truth.

What Democrats should do is apologize.

The voters DO want servant leaders who care more about what THEY want than what WE believe.

The voters do NOT want know-it-alls, snobs, or leaders who resent voters for daring to choose the other party once in a while.

The customer is always right. We can either cling to our belief that WE are always right and the customers are wrong, or we can apologize for our past failures to give the customers what they want, apologize for disrespecting the customers, change our offerings, and try to earn back their business.

If we can’t even apologize, then they know we don’t intend to respect their wishes over our own beliefs going forward either.

Here is just a partial list of what swing voters and flyover state viters want us to apologize for:

1) Covid overreach. I know, I know, we f**king love science and the voters are stupid. It doesn’t matter. The voters reject our belief that we helped against Covid, and they are furious about forced masking of children, school closures, and forced injections on penalty of job loss. They were also very shaken by what they saw as our totalitarian streak. A lot of us were very cruel to neighbors and even family members. I know it will be very difficult psychologically for us to admit any fault here. We were on the right side of this, our intentions were good, etc. But so far basically none of us have said sorry to anyone for any of this. If we want swing voters back, we have to say sorry.

2) Illegal Immigration

3) Using affirmative action to harm white workers

4) LGBTQIA+ education in elementary schools. (I agree, it’s a good thing. It teaches kids tolerance. Rs make too big a deal of it. But remember, they are the customers. If we’re the “force unpopular things down your throat Party,” they won’t vote for us. We went too far (for THEIR liking), and for that, we should apologize

5) Inflation. Yes it was Covid, the Fed, and Trump’s fault too. But our team printed and borrowed and spent too much money.

6) Calling voters stupid racists

Think about it. We win’t like this prescription, but without it we can’t get the votes back

“Hey Dems! Here’s what you need to do! Abandon all your principles and move further right. Signed, MAGA”.

Better idea: MAGA should apologize to the country for getting in bed with theocratic fascists, throwing away the Constitution and democracy, abandoning our allies, and destroying the social contract.

This list is things we should apologize to SWING VOTERS for, not MAGA. And this list is things swing voters really do object to. I personally do NOT think if this as a list of non-negotiable Democratic Party principles! If it is, then we really ARE screwed.

At the end of the day, it’s all trade offs. We aren’t running a religion here, we’re running a political party. If we want to fight against voter preferences on everything, we’ll get less votes. For some of us, that’s okay. There ARE some principles more important than political power. For others of us, having the chance to nominate Supremes is more important than being too stubborn to apologize for school closures. We’ll each have to make our own decision. But if we hate the voters and can’t admit we’ve ever made any mistakes, we’re not going to be that popular.

Please, please, please

Side with us do you don't have to have a dictator over you

Those who need such speech to be convinced against Trump wouldn't be much use in a democracy any way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm not sure what Democrats should do. Even after two months of Trump, they still poll below Republicans. Democrats are associated either with geriatric and compromised leaders like Schumer or with unpopular identity politics and performative virtue signaling. The only Democrats that I'm seeing who are breaking through and giving voice to the anger and outrage are Bernie Sanders and AOC. I'm impressed with both of them. They are rising to the moment. And most importantly they are authentic. You can disagree with them, but at least you know where they stand. I think Democrats should follow their lead. Keep the focus on economic issues, fighting oligarchs, and Republican treachery. Be angry. Be outraged. Do town halls everywhere. Go grassroots. And for God's sake, understand the media universe these days. Babbling platitudes on Face the Nation is so 1983.

+1

They need to be everywhere. Online on everything. Enraged and authentic. We need to reach the masses!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When will the Dems find people to play the propaganda game as well as the GOP. We have to embrace the new reality. We have to reach them on their phones and appeal to their emotions.

+1000

[Anonymous]

People, the right response is not to nitpick the list. The CUSTOMER is always right, NOT the store manager. Swing voters don’t care if WE think school closures were “worth the costs,” they were longer here than anywhere else on Earth, and they had real costs. Swing voters want an apology. If we refuse, then apparently “being right” is more important to us than winning back votes.

I’m giving you the prescription. It’s painful for people like us who get a lot of our sense of moral worth from our party affiliation. And a lot if our sense of intellectual worth from winning arguments. We think politics is a debating society, and we happen to be the smart kids. But it’s actually a value exchange. If we give the voters what they want (and what they are ready for), they’ll let us lead. If we don’t give them what they want (because we think we know better), they won’t let us lead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:January 6th is everything to me

I was traumatized by that and can't fathom how the Republicans rationalize it.

The most common class signaling we do is to pretend that we “can’t even fathom” what middle class voters are thinking. HOW can they possibly disagree with us richer, more educated, more moral people on climate, migrants, trans, whatever. If we’ve never even been able to UNDERSTAND, what middle class people even THINK, well, that show that we really are more fancy. They may look like is, but we’re definitely NOT like them! No Trump, no gold buildings, Nd no McDonalds for us!

That works in reverse too. Where are the MAGAs reaching out to understand what Democrats want?

…Oh, that’s right. They don’t care. Because, according to your calculus, simply being in power is proof that you are correct and morally superior.

You’re confused. Republicans know what hardcore Dems want. We broadcast it all over the media. And middle class voters din’t have status anxiety the way we do. They already know we’re more affluent. But we want to prove to each other, to our upper middle class peers, that we are NOTHNG like the mere middle class.

It’s just signaling. We know the middle class doesn’t care about climate like we do, doesn’t care about trans like we (say we) do, etc. We just play dumb sometimes among each other as a way to strike a pose.

Everything you’ve just said is completely wrong. Republicans and RW media outlets lie and distort all the time. They mischaracterize Democrats. They demonize Democrats. They have no idea what Democrats stand for, or they pretend not to, because the Dem positions on things like health care, the environment, and worker’s rights are in fact more popular with voters than useless grievance politics. Their tactic is to drown out Dem messaging with a lot of culture war noise and take control of the narrative. It feels good to blame everything on immigrants, but it doesn’t lower the price of groceries or make your drinking water safer.

You’re doing the same thing right now: caricaturing Democrats as effete out of touch upper class snobs constantly “signaling” to each other about trans people. You love that term, signaling, as if you don’t believe Democrats are real people with thoughtful opinions based on a lifetime of observing how the world works. It’s incredibly condescending and dishonest to pretend to speak for people when you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about.

+1. These MAGA pretending to be “lifelong Dems” cannot stop doing the thing they claim Democrats are doing. There are many salt of the earth working folks that support Democratic values. Or rather, turn their noses up at the GOP’s lack of values.