Are the non "W" schools really that bad?

[Anonymous]

PP - my response was to the person thinking a poster had a personality disorder. That person is a good reason many don’t care about attending W schools and are very happy where they are.

[Anonymous]

I went to Whitman. My daughter goes to Blair.

[Anonymous]

Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good morning OP. The answer to your question is NO. There are plenty of wonderful schools and communities outside of the W’s. There are plenty of engaged families whose kid are thriving and going on to be successful who go to schools outside of the W’s. There are plenty of highly capable teachers outside of the W’s.

The zones outside the W’s are more diverse both racially and socioeconomically. That’s it.

+1

Children of affluent educated people perform well and that's why the perception is that the W schools are the "best." OP, the fact is that your children will do as well at Richard Montgomery or Quince Orchard (or Blair or Einstein) as they would at Whitman or Wooton.

This is only partially true. When the majority of the student body performs at a lower level the teachers and administrators supports and expectations follow. The same is true when the majority of the student body is higher achieving. The PTA matters, too. I can not enumerate the extras provided by a strong PTA. Our W provides college prep seminars for both parents and students on a regular basis. Paid college advisors are clamoring to hold free sessions at our school because they understand that enough of our parents will follow up with paid services. You will not get that in the poorly perfor.ing schools. Furthermore, our strong parental presence keeps pressure on administrators to retain teachers who go above and beyond in the classroom.

Those who would have you believe it is as simple as what happens at home must be unaware of what they are missing.

Huh??
My non-W school has that and I'm pretty sure most, if not all MCPS school, provides that.

DP - exactly, because NO high school in MCPS would be considered "poorly performing" in any reasonable definition of the term. It's comical, to the point of being pathetic, that people don't understand that. That speaks volumes about their lack of perspective.

Test scores look pretty bad to me

Lol - you don't understand how mean scores work, do you? Or that "test scores" on their own, especially when averaged, are a poor metric of school quality.

But please, keep telling me how my kids and I are the dumb ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good morning OP. The answer to your question is NO. There are plenty of wonderful schools and communities outside of the W’s. There are plenty of engaged families whose kid are thriving and going on to be successful who go to schools outside of the W’s. There are plenty of highly capable teachers outside of the W’s.

The zones outside the W’s are more diverse both racially and socioeconomically. That’s it.

The bolded.

Moreover, there's substantial research showing that attending what are called "high-achieving schools" is a specific risk factor for adverse outcomes in adolescent mental health, so much so that it's one of the top four factors (the others are poverty, trauma, and discrimination). Now, pretty much all the high schools within MCPS would meet the research definition of a "high-achieving school," but there are differences between the culture of various schools that make some (the Ws) more "high-achieving" than others. One study here, in case you're interested: https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2019-65949-001

I'm a W graduate and we're in-bounds for the DCC. You literally could not pay me to send my kids to a W school at this point. I know what the non-W schools are like and I prefer those for my kids.

I completely agree that there are many, many outstanding schools in all of MCPS. I do want to jump in to say that WJ has been wonderful for my kid. You can avoid the pressure stuff by instilling and reinforcing your own family values. Just like there are smart kids everywhere in MCPS, there is a range of experiences at WJ.

PP you're quoting - the bolded is incorrect. You can *mitigate* some of the "pressure stuff," but you absolutely cannot eliminate it entirely. It's the water you swim in. I'm glad WJ has been great for your kid; it was for me, too, back in the day. That there's a range of experience at those schools does not preclude the fact that overall, very highly achieving schools increase risk for kids generally.

I agree that it is mitigation not pressure elimination. But the mitigation plus the advantages we see at WJ outweigh the downsides of the pressure.

Everything is about balancing pros and cons. If you end up at WJ, you have to be mindful of the pressure. It can be dealt with since so much is parent driven.

Our friends at RM and QO complain about it there too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

But it is a lottery. What if your name isn’t picked? Or are you saying it is better to avoid the pressure of Ws by living in DCC and pushing your child to guaranteed magnet admission all the way through.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good morning OP. The answer to your question is NO. There are plenty of wonderful schools and communities outside of the W’s. There are plenty of engaged families whose kid are thriving and going on to be successful who go to schools outside of the W’s. There are plenty of highly capable teachers outside of the W’s.

The zones outside the W’s are more diverse both racially and socioeconomically. That’s it.

+1

Children of affluent educated people perform well and that's why the perception is that the W schools are the "best." OP, the fact is that your children will do as well at Richard Montgomery or Quince Orchard (or Blair or Einstein) as they would at Whitman or Wooton.

This is only partially true. When the majority of the student body performs at a lower level the teachers and administrators supports and expectations follow. The same is true when the majority of the student body is higher achieving. The PTA matters, too. I can not enumerate the extras provided by a strong PTA. Our W provides college prep seminars for both parents and students on a regular basis. Paid college advisors are clamoring to hold free sessions at our school because they understand that enough of our parents will follow up with paid services. You will not get that in the poorly perfor.ing schools. Furthermore, our strong parental presence keeps pressure on administrators to retain teachers who go above and beyond in the classroom.

Those who would have you believe it is as simple as what happens at home must be unaware of what they are missing.

We have that at RM, too.

These happen at other HS’s in the county as well. Not sure why W folks thinks these are happening solely for them. Heck there are ones going on during the summer.

Makes them feel special. Don't burst their bubble.

We don’t. And some of us at those schools skip them bc it dials the pressure up. There are multiple ways to research

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good morning OP. The answer to your question is NO. There are plenty of wonderful schools and communities outside of the W’s. There are plenty of engaged families whose kid are thriving and going on to be successful who go to schools outside of the W’s. There are plenty of highly capable teachers outside of the W’s.

The zones outside the W’s are more diverse both racially and socioeconomically. That’s it.

+1

Children of affluent educated people perform well and that's why the perception is that the W schools are the "best." OP, the fact is that your children will do as well at Richard Montgomery or Quince Orchard (or Blair or Einstein) as they would at Whitman or Wooton.

This is only partially true. When the majority of the student body performs at a lower level the teachers and administrators supports and expectations follow. The same is true when the majority of the student body is higher achieving. The PTA matters, too. I can not enumerate the extras provided by a strong PTA. Our W provides college prep seminars for both parents and students on a regular basis. Paid college advisors are clamoring to hold free sessions at our school because they understand that enough of our parents will follow up with paid services. You will not get that in the poorly perfor.ing schools. Furthermore, our strong parental presence keeps pressure on administrators to retain teachers who go above and beyond in the classroom.

Those who would have you believe it is as simple as what happens at home must be unaware of what they are missing.

Huh??
My non-W school has that and I'm pretty sure most, if not all MCPS school, provides that.

DP - exactly, because NO high school in MCPS would be considered "poorly performing" in any reasonable definition of the term. It's comical, to the point of being pathetic, that people don't understand that. That speaks volumes about their lack of perspective.

Test scores look pretty bad to me

Lol - you don't understand how mean scores work, do you? Or that "test scores" on their own, especially when averaged, are a poor metric of school quality.

But please, keep telling me how my kids and I are the dumb ones.

You are not very persuasive. When less than 50% of kids are considered proficient in many schools that doesn't strike me as high performing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First of all, I understand that this is probably a hot button topic, but I need a bit of insight here.

My wife, my self, and our three year old daughter are planning on moving to Montgomery County sometime in 2025. We currently live on the west coast. She grew up going to MCPS and her parents still live in the area (which is why we're moving back). I lived in DC for a few years in the early 2010's, so I'm familiar with the area as a whole, but not as intimately familiar with the suburbs as my wife and her family are.

From my understanding, the "W" schools in MCPS are very high performing, and we'd love to move to an area zoned for a W school, but, they're pretty expensive and at the top of our price range. There are other houses outside the W schools that are more affordable, but when I brought up the idea of moving to one of these neighborhoods, my wife and IL's acted like it would be like sending our daughter to go to a school in a third world country. Is the gap between the W and non-W schools really that big? FWIW, the non-W schools we'd be looking at are Quince Orchard and Richard Montgomery.

My children went to Quince Orchard. As a parent who was educated at a top public high school, I found it to be very disappointing. The school is very competitive with sports. It is known for them and for its theater program. Academically we found most counselors and administrators to be disappointing. Teachers were a mixed bag with a handful of great teachers, most mediocre and a few poor ones. If you are looking for strong academics you will want to look to Poolesville or the Ws.

I have to agree. I’ve had three kids go through there. QO is a good school if your child is athletically inclined or into theatre. Everything at QO revolves around sports, especially football. If your child is not interested in those activities then it’s a boring school where academics take a back seat. Keep that in mind OP when making decisions.

[Anonymous]

We chose to live in Kensington/Silver Spring so our kids (K and 1st) could go to the bilingual immersion ES we are zoned for. We are zoned for the Down County consortia so middle and high school are choices. We will see how it goes year by year and make our choices. At any rate, we love our little elementary school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First of all, I understand that this is probably a hot button topic, but I need a bit of insight here.

My wife, my self, and our three year old daughter are planning on moving to Montgomery County sometime in 2025. We currently live on the west coast. She grew up going to MCPS and her parents still live in the area (which is why we're moving back). I lived in DC for a few years in the early 2010's, so I'm familiar with the area as a whole, but not as intimately familiar with the suburbs as my wife and her family are.

From my understanding, the "W" schools in MCPS are very high performing, and we'd love to move to an area zoned for a W school, but, they're pretty expensive and at the top of our price range. There are other houses outside the W schools that are more affordable, but when I brought up the idea of moving to one of these neighborhoods, my wife and IL's acted like it would be like sending our daughter to go to a school in a third world country. Is the gap between the W and non-W schools really that big? FWIW, the non-W schools we'd be looking at are Quince Orchard and Richard Montgomery.

My children went to Quince Orchard. As a parent who was educated at a top public high school, I found it to be very disappointing. The school is very competitive with sports. It is known for them and for its theater program. Academically we found most counselors and administrators to be disappointing. Teachers were a mixed bag with a handful of great teachers, most mediocre and a few poor ones. If you are looking for strong academics you will want to look to Poolesville or the Ws.

I have to agree. I’ve had three kids go through there. QO is a good school if your child is athletically inclined or into theatre. Everything at QO revolves around sports, especially football. If your child is not interested in those activities then it’s a boring school where academics take a back seat. Keep that in mind OP when making decisions.

IMO, RM has a good balance: academics with IB and AP, sports (I think their swim team did really well this year, but the football team has been going down hill), and the arts -- their theater dept is top notch. Always impressed by the production they put together.

That's not to say it doesn't have issues. It most definitely does.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We chose to live in Kensington/Silver Spring so our kids (K and 1st) could go to the bilingual immersion ES we are zoned for. We are zoned for the Down County consortia so middle and high school are choices. We will see how it goes year by year and make our choices. At any rate, we love our little elementary school.

For the most part, ES across MCPS is fine. The weak link is the MS, and HS can be hit or miss.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

But it is a lottery. What if your name isn’t picked? Or are you saying it is better to avoid the pressure of Ws by living in DCC and pushing your child to guaranteed magnet admission all the way through.

Obviously the 1000 high achieving kids in W schools and around the county should all sit together in the 100 seats in the magenet. It's so simple!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

But it is a lottery. What if your name isn’t picked? Or are you saying it is better to avoid the pressure of Ws by living in DCC and pushing your child to guaranteed magnet admission all the way through.

HS is not a lottery and neither were CES or MS when my kids went through this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

But it is a lottery. What if your name isn’t picked? Or are you saying it is better to avoid the pressure of Ws by living in DCC and pushing your child to guaranteed magnet admission all the way through.

Obviously the 1000 high achieving kids in W schools and around the county should all sit together in the 100 seats in the magenet. It's so simple!

maybe high-achieving by W standards but most wouldn't make the cut for the magnets.