Brown reinstating SATs/ACT requirements

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My Senior kicked butt on standardized tests...of course, it's the year after him they come back.

Same here, but his grades were mediocre. Based on his outcomes, I think colleges have already started implementing Test-preferred policies.

I am so annoyed by these uninformed posts. You have no understanding of why they are reinstating. It's not so kids who "kick butt" on standardized tests can get in over others who people like you perceive of unworthy because they have a lower score. It's so people who do really well (1350+) submit their scores and show schools that they are capable of doing the work, despite a crappy education. This is not to let more 1600 students over potential 1400 students. Those of you with the high scores are actually at an even great disadvantage with test required. I can't believe how obtuse you all are to not understand this.

That's also simplistic. I think the test requirement will likely help two groups - (1) students from underprivileged schools/backgrounds who score relatively high (but not in the 35+/1500+ range), especially compared to the average score at their school and (2) students with a privileged background (private school, socioeconomic status) who score extremely high but were competing with TO privileged applicants from their own school.

This. It's not going to be a huge shift. Those with high test scores did great in the TO cycles, but the overall admission chances are slim for everyone. This won't help meaningfully to very many. It's not like they went from test blind to test required.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Welfare check on the TESTING IS NEVER COMING BACK! brigade, please.

I mean…Columbia went permanently TO. Cornell announced that it’s extending TO. Michigan is permanently TO. The UC schools are permanently test-blind. Amherst, Pomona, and a number of other top-ranked SLACs are permanently TO. The vast majority of schools outside the ~50 people on here talk about are still TO and don’t seem to be signaling any change.

I think testing is going to come back for a small subset of schools that have huge numbers of applications and want to use tests to cull applicants easily, and at public schools in some red states.

I think the “TO is over” folks are reading the evidence very selectively.

No such thing as permanent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:colleges will start making announcements for class of 2026 soon to give current sophomores plenty of time to prep.

Current juniors will be the last class to have real test optional options.

Brown and Dartmouth are implementing them for class of 2029 (currently juniors)...no options there. At least Yale offers flexibility on the types of tests accepted.

HS class of 2025 should be exempted from these requirements giving the timing of the announcements.

Yes, I like Yale's solution. Some kids just don't do well with the sat/act formats but are excellent students. AP and IB as options were a good idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My Senior kicked butt on standardized tests...of course, it's the year after him they come back.

Same here, but his grades were mediocre. Based on his outcomes, I think colleges have already started implementing Test-preferred policies.

I am so annoyed by these uninformed posts. You have no understanding of why they are reinstating. It's not so kids who "kick butt" on standardized tests can get in over others who people like you perceive of unworthy because they have a lower score. It's so people who do really well (1350+) submit their scores and show schools that they are capable of doing the work, despite a crappy education. This is not to let more 1600 students over potential 1400 students. Those of you with the high scores are actually at an even great disadvantage with test required. I can't believe how obtuse you all are to not understand this.

I think you're wrong on this. Universities compete with each other; they're considering the same 100 kids from rich suburban county A with about the same grades, ECs, recommendations. Unless you assume standardized scores tell you literally nothing, it's easy for the university to add those to it's overall evaluation (not like they need to evaluate another essay). The only downside is missing kids who logistically can't take the test, and who is that in Ffx/Montgomery etc? If it lets one university get kids who are more likely to succeed vs their peer universities, they will, and should. Even in a world where a lower score is an advantage (maybe it means the kid worked harder?) you would expect the universities to consider something as easy to factor in as test scores.

If we are talking T20, only 1 of those 100 are getting in tho.

The rest are too one dimensional (all stem) without “personal character qualities” that distinguish…The new spots are actually going to that kid with the 1350 score and the cooler/better story/character narrative that weaves through Letters of Rec/Essays etc.

+1
This benefits lower scorers with a hardship or character story

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Welfare check on the TESTING IS NEVER COMING BACK! brigade, please.

I mean…Columbia went permanently TO. Cornell announced that it’s extending TO. Michigan is permanently TO. The UC schools are permanently test-blind. Amherst, Pomona, and a number of other top-ranked SLACs are permanently TO. The vast majority of schools outside the ~50 people on here talk about are still TO and don’t seem to be signaling any change.

I think testing is going to come back for a small subset of schools that have huge numbers of applications and want to use tests to cull applicants easily, and at public schools in some red states.

I think the “TO is over” folks are reading the evidence very selectively.

No such thing as permanent.

So it is permanently impermanent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:colleges will start making announcements for class of 2026 soon to give current sophomores plenty of time to prep.

Current juniors will be the last class to have real test optional options.

Brown and Dartmouth are implementing them for class of 2029 (currently juniors)...no options there. At least Yale offers flexibility on the types of tests accepted.

HS class of 2025 should be exempted from these requirements giving the timing of the announcements.

That's silly. Surely kids (and parents, and counselors) knew that schools were reviewing the policies and considering going back to test-required. Anyway, March-August before senior year is a fine and traditional time to take the exam. (Really, are there kids who never even take the exams because of TO policies? I assumed almost all took the exams and decided not to submit based on lower-than-hoped-for scores.)

Your kid has over 7 months to take the test even if class of 2025. Some even take October of senior year.

Come on--they obviously took it once and did bad. Or took a mock at their school and figured they would have to do too much 'work' and studying to raise some points.

We already know that. Virtually every kid in the DMV takes it at least once. Every HS in the DMV suggests this. My kid is a sophomore and their school already provided free mock ACT and mock SATs.

IF they kid didn't ---well---they already weeded themselves out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AP exams should be scored 0-100 and kids should be able to submit their scores if they’d like. This would separate the wheat from the chaff much better than the SAT, which has a very low ceiling.

Kids can do this already and have been doing so for many years now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:colleges will start making announcements for class of 2026 soon to give current sophomores plenty of time to prep.

Current juniors will be the last class to have real test optional options.

Brown and Dartmouth are implementing them for class of 2029 (currently juniors)...no options there. At least Yale offers flexibility on the types of tests accepted.

HS class of 2025 should be exempted from these requirements giving the timing of the announcements.

That's silly. Surely kids (and parents, and counselors) knew that schools were reviewing the policies and considering going back to test-required. Anyway, March-August before senior year is a fine and traditional time to take the exam. (Really, are there kids who never even take the exams because of TO policies? I assumed almost all took the exams and decided not to submit based on lower-than-hoped-for scores.)

Your kid has over 7 months to take the test even if class of 2025. Some even take October of senior year.

Come on--they obviously took it once and did bad. Or took a mock at their school and figured they would have to do too much 'work' and studying to raise some points.

We already know that. Virtually every kid in the DMV takes it at least once. Every HS in the DMV suggests this. My kid is a sophomore and their school already provided free mock ACT and mock SATs.

IF they kid didn't ---well---they already weeded themselves out.

This! Every parent here fighting for TO with pretend reasons really does have a kid who didn't do well in the tests. A good number of them are spending multiple hundreds an hour to get that score to go up to that magic 1350 number. Of course, they'd all like for the SATs to disappear

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:colleges will start making announcements for class of 2026 soon to give current sophomores plenty of time to prep.

Current juniors will be the last class to have real test optional options.

Brown and Dartmouth are implementing them for class of 2029 (currently juniors)...no options there. At least Yale offers flexibility on the types of tests accepted.

HS class of 2025 should be exempted from these requirements giving the timing of the announcements.

That's silly. Surely kids (and parents, and counselors) knew that schools were reviewing the policies and considering going back to test-required. Anyway, March-August before senior year is a fine and traditional time to take the exam. (Really, are there kids who never even take the exams because of TO policies? I assumed almost all took the exams and decided not to submit based on lower-than-hoped-for scores.)

Your kid has over 7 months to take the test even if class of 2025. Some even take October of senior year.

Come on--they obviously took it once and did bad. Or took a mock at their school and figured they would have to do too much 'work' and studying to raise some points.

We already know that. Virtually every kid in the DMV takes it at least once. Every HS in the DMV suggests this. My kid is a sophomore and their school already provided free mock ACT and mock SATs.

IF they kid didn't ---well---they already weeded themselves out.

This! Every parent here fighting for TO with pretend reasons really does have a kid who didn't do well in the tests. A good number of them are spending multiple hundreds an hour to get that score to go up to that magic 1350 number. Of course, they'd all like for the SATs to disappear

Wow you know what EVERY parent is thinking? What a skill!

No, that's not what every parent is thinking. We only ever planned to take the SAT if the schools targeting it required it. Luckily, as of right now, none do. We also never took a "mock" test b/c the test would have been paper when we did so and the actual test digital (different tests).

We simply chose not to spend the time or money on these tests unless we had to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:colleges will start making announcements for class of 2026 soon to give current sophomores plenty of time to prep.

Current juniors will be the last class to have real test optional options.

Brown and Dartmouth are implementing them for class of 2029 (currently juniors)...no options there. At least Yale offers flexibility on the types of tests accepted.

HS class of 2025 should be exempted from these requirements giving the timing of the announcements.

That's silly. Surely kids (and parents, and counselors) knew that schools were reviewing the policies and considering going back to test-required. Anyway, March-August before senior year is a fine and traditional time to take the exam. (Really, are there kids who never even take the exams because of TO policies? I assumed almost all took the exams and decided not to submit based on lower-than-hoped-for scores.)

Your kid has over 7 months to take the test even if class of 2025. Some even take October of senior year.

Come on--they obviously took it once and did bad. Or took a mock at their school and figured they would have to do too much 'work' and studying to raise some points.

We already know that. Virtually every kid in the DMV takes it at least once. Every HS in the DMV suggests this. My kid is a sophomore and their school already provided free mock ACT and mock SATs.

IF they kid didn't ---well---they already weeded themselves out.

+2 If you are reading the DCUM college forum, you definitely knew this was coming. Frankly, applying test optional to Brown wasn’t going to be an acceptance anyway, unless the kid is an URM or first gen. PP just wanted to believe that inflated 4.5 GPA could get their “bad test taker” into an Ivy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My Senior kicked butt on standardized tests...of course, it's the year after him they come back.

my now freshman DC had amazing SAT scores, but a lot of colleges were TO. Bad luck of the draw.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But scores and grades and transcripts is all mad racist

education is mad racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:colleges will start making announcements for class of 2026 soon to give current sophomores plenty of time to prep.

Current juniors will be the last class to have real test optional options.

Brown and Dartmouth are implementing them for class of 2029 (currently juniors)...no options there. At least Yale offers flexibility on the types of tests accepted.

HS class of 2025 should be exempted from these requirements giving the timing of the announcements.

That's silly. Surely kids (and parents, and counselors) knew that schools were reviewing the policies and considering going back to test-required. Anyway, March-August before senior year is a fine and traditional time to take the exam. (Really, are there kids who never even take the exams because of TO policies? I assumed almost all took the exams and decided not to submit based on lower-than-hoped-for scores.)

Your kid has over 7 months to take the test even if class of 2025. Some even take October of senior year.

Come on--they obviously took it once and did bad. Or took a mock at their school and figured they would have to do too much 'work' and studying to raise some points.

We already know that. Virtually every kid in the DMV takes it at least once. Every HS in the DMV suggests this. My kid is a sophomore and their school already provided free mock ACT and mock SATs.

IF they kid didn't ---well---they already weeded themselves out.

Weeded out of what? Brown? Oh, ok. Since the odds are SO great of getting in there anyway. LOL.

There are many, many excellent schools that are TO and have been for a long time (locally, American for one). Others have committed to continue through 25 and are considering keeping it beyond that.

You are a smug a$$hole, too, to think the only ones not taking these tests are dumb kids not capable of doing well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:colleges will start making announcements for class of 2026 soon to give current sophomores plenty of time to prep.

Current juniors will be the last class to have real test optional options.

Brown and Dartmouth are implementing them for class of 2029 (currently juniors)...no options there. At least Yale offers flexibility on the types of tests accepted.

HS class of 2025 should be exempted from these requirements giving the timing of the announcements.

That's silly. Surely kids (and parents, and counselors) knew that schools were reviewing the policies and considering going back to test-required. Anyway, March-August before senior year is a fine and traditional time to take the exam. (Really, are there kids who never even take the exams because of TO policies? I assumed almost all took the exams and decided not to submit based on lower-than-hoped-for scores.)

Your kid has over 7 months to take the test even if class of 2025. Some even take October of senior year.

Come on--they obviously took it once and did bad. Or took a mock at their school and figured they would have to do too much 'work' and studying to raise some points.

We already know that. Virtually every kid in the DMV takes it at least once. Every HS in the DMV suggests this. My kid is a sophomore and their school already provided free mock ACT and mock SATs.

IF they kid didn't ---well---they already weeded themselves out.

This! Every parent here fighting for TO with pretend reasons really does have a kid who didn't do well in the tests. A good number of them are spending multiple hundreds an hour to get that score to go up to that magic 1350 number. Of course, they'd all like for the SATs to disappear

Agree with this. Very obvious. wealthy parents who don't have high scoring kids are the most pissed off about this.

Signed --

Former NMSF with immigrant parents who never did one thing to help me with "test prep" and whose score certainly helped get into a good college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My Senior kicked butt on standardized tests...of course, it's the year after him they come back.

Same here, but his grades were mediocre. Based on his outcomes, I think colleges have already started implementing Test-preferred policies.

I am so annoyed by these uninformed posts. You have no understanding of why they are reinstating. It's not so kids who "kick butt" on standardized tests can get in over others who people like you perceive of unworthy because they have a lower score. It's so people who do really well (1350+) submit their scores and show schools that they are capable of doing the work, despite a crappy education. This is not to let more 1600 students over potential 1400 students. Those of you with the high scores are actually at an even great disadvantage with test required. I can't believe how obtuse you all are to not understand this.

That's also simplistic. I think the test requirement will likely help two groups - (1) students from underprivileged schools/backgrounds who score relatively high (but not in the 35+/1500+ range), especially compared to the average score at their school and (2) students with a privileged background (private school, socioeconomic status) who score extremely high but were competing with TO privileged applicants from their own school.

+1 agree

Two students with a similar profile, but one has a much higher SAT score. If the school is test optional, the one who did not score high and doesn't send in the score has the same chance as the student who had the high score.

With test required, that lower test score applicant would have a lower chance of getting in compared to the higher scorer.

It matters.