The Marketing from some of these schools is nuts- and totally wasteful

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree it's gross and wasteful. My kids is at a magnet school where the kids are bombarded with UChicago marketing materials. In the Bethesda Magazine article, it was reported 55 students at this school applied last year and 0 were admitted. It's often about inflating application numbers, nothing else.

Are you suggesting that the folks in marketing who are responsible for encouraging as many students as possible to apply are sending out marketing materials with the intention of getting the maximum number of students to apply?

Is that really some kind of conspiracy? I mean, how is the college supposed to know you won’t get admitted unless you apply? Do you expect them just a guess because of the school you go to?

Do you get this mad when stores you don’t shop at send you advertising?

It’s well known that U Chicago sends loads of marketing materials to unqualified students and that this increases their number of applications and reduces their acceptance rate.

It’s not an accident.

Uchicago hired a guy to run its admissions dept about 20 years ago and his direct aim was to lower its acceptance rate, which was about 50-60%—way above its peers particularly
Columbia. I went to Columbia so I remember reading this and he remarked that Chicago should have as many apps as New York. He revamped the dept and undertook an aggressive campaign to increase the apps. The school utilizes 2 ED cycles, which explains an artificially high yield. Applying and getting accepted RD is impossible.

[Anonymous]

To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

You don't need to buy a book to read about it.
https://professionals.collegeboard.org/k-12/prepare/sss

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Uchicago hired a guy to run its admissions dept about 20 years ago and his direct aim was to lower its acceptance rate, which was about 50-60%—way above its peers particularly
Columbia. I went to Columbia so I remember reading this and he remarked that Chicago should have as many apps as New York. He revamped the dept and undertook an aggressive campaign to increase the apps. The school utilizes 2 ED cycles, which explains an artificially high yield. Applying and getting accepted RD is impossible.

Nordorf got there in 2009. Small detail.
https://president.uchicago.edu/en/leadership/officers/james-g-nondorf

"Impossible" gets thrown around a lot on here, so let's be careful about that. Admissions during any round is highly unlikely if you look at the little data they put out and even more so during RD there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree it's gross and wasteful. My kids is at a magnet school where the kids are bombarded with UChicago marketing materials. In the Bethesda Magazine article, it was reported 55 students at this school applied last year and 0 were admitted. It's often about inflating application numbers, nothing else.

Are you suggesting that the folks in marketing who are responsible for encouraging as many students as possible to apply are sending out marketing materials with the intention of getting the maximum number of students to apply?

Is that really some kind of conspiracy? I mean, how is the college supposed to know you won’t get admitted unless you apply? Do you expect them just a guess because of the school you go to?

Do you get this mad when stores you don’t shop at send you advertising?

It’s well known that U Chicago sends loads of marketing materials to unqualified students and that this increases their number of applications and reduces their acceptance rate.

It’s not an accident.

Uchicago hired a guy to run its admissions dept about 20 years ago and his direct aim was to lower its acceptance rate, which was about 50-60%—way above its peers particularly
Columbia. I went to Columbia so I remember reading this and he remarked that Chicago should have as many apps as New York. He revamped the dept and undertook an aggressive campaign to increase the apps. The school utilizes 2 ED cycles, which explains an artificially high yield. Applying and getting accepted RD is impossible.

Yes, U Chicago is absolutely the worst in the ranking games that includes its marketing. Someone in this thread asked, what is so sinister about what U Chicago does. It's not sinister but for a #6 ranked school, it's a bit pathetic. Obviously this is how it reached #6 but it's about time U Chicago tone down on it now that it has reached the top. I get why Case Western does it (the crazy number of post cards sent every 2 weeks) because it has a hard time getting students but why does Chicago need to do this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

Read back what you wrote - it directly contradicts your first sentence. You admit they get batches, and they don't know specifically who in each batch got what score... They have no idea who the 1550 is and who the 1200 is... so how would you suggest they market the school?

...they also don't know who will retake, or submit a different test, or what your GPA is and what else you have to offer...

...they have no idea if they will accept you until you send in the application. Yes the point of the marketing is to get you to apply.

But guess what? Guess who knows all the above data? YOU. So don't apply. It's not complicated and there is nothing sinister about it.

Yes I know this is a difficult process for families which often involves disappointment to our children, which we all don't like. How would you recommend U Chicago market their school, then?

What would work better?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree it's gross and wasteful. My kids is at a magnet school where the kids are bombarded with UChicago marketing materials. In the Bethesda Magazine article, it was reported 55 students at this school applied last year and 0 were admitted. It's often about inflating application numbers, nothing else.

Are you suggesting that the folks in marketing who are responsible for encouraging as many students as possible to apply are sending out marketing materials with the intention of getting the maximum number of students to apply?

Is that really some kind of conspiracy? I mean, how is the college supposed to know you won’t get admitted unless you apply? Do you expect them just a guess because of the school you go to?

Do you get this mad when stores you don’t shop at send you advertising?

It’s well known that U Chicago sends loads of marketing materials to unqualified students and that this increases their number of applications and reduces their acceptance rate.

It’s not an accident.

Uchicago hired a guy to run its admissions dept about 20 years ago and his direct aim was to lower its acceptance rate, which was about 50-60%—way above its peers particularly
Columbia. I went to Columbia so I remember reading this and he remarked that Chicago should have as many apps as New York. He revamped the dept and undertook an aggressive campaign to increase the apps. The school utilizes 2 ED cycles, which explains an artificially high yield. Applying and getting accepted RD is impossible.

Yes, U Chicago is absolutely the worst in the ranking games that includes its marketing. Someone in this thread asked, what is so sinister about what U Chicago does. It's not sinister but for a #6 ranked school, it's a bit pathetic. Obviously this is how it reached #6 but it's about time U Chicago tone down on it now that it has reached the top. I get why Case Western does it (the crazy number of post cards sent every 2 weeks) because it has a hard time getting students but why does Chicago need to do this?

How does marketing affect rankings?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

That's why it's ridiculous that they market to kids with 1100/1200 SAT/psats. Those kids have no chance really, but all the marketing gets some to attempt it, thus lowering acceptance rates

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

Read back what you wrote - it directly contradicts your first sentence. You admit they get batches, and they don't know specifically who in each batch got what score... They have no idea who the 1550 is and who the 1200 is... so how would you suggest they market the school?

...they also don't know who will retake, or submit a different test, or what your GPA is and what else you have to offer...

...they have no idea if they will accept you until you send in the application. Yes the point of the marketing is to get you to apply.

But guess what? Guess who knows all the above data? YOU. So don't apply. It's not complicated and there is nothing sinister about it.

Yes I know this is a difficult process for families which often involves disappointment to our children, which we all don't like. How would you recommend U Chicago market their school, then?

What would work better?

I think you are missing the point. They aren't looking for a specific kid. They are looking for more of a specific type of kid to apply so they have a better chance at meeting the school's goals. Kids don't necessarily see the marketing as just a numbers game and feel special when they receive the mail. More apply and the selectivity goes up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

Read back what you wrote - it directly contradicts your first sentence. You admit they get batches, and they don't know specifically who in each batch got what score... They have no idea who the 1550 is and who the 1200 is... so how would you suggest they market the school?

...they also don't know who will retake, or submit a different test, or what your GPA is and what else you have to offer...

...they have no idea if they will accept you until you send in the application. Yes the point of the marketing is to get you to apply.

But guess what? Guess who knows all the above data? YOU. So don't apply. It's not complicated and there is nothing sinister about it.

Yes I know this is a difficult process for families which often involves disappointment to our children, which we all don't like. How would you recommend U Chicago market their school, then?

What would work better?

I think you are missing the point. They aren't looking for a specific kid. They are looking for more of a specific type of kid to apply so they have a better chance at meeting the school's goals. Kids don't necessarily see the marketing as just a numbers game and feel special when they receive the mail. More apply and the selectivity goes up.

I'm missing the point?

How could it work better, please explain.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

That's why it's ridiculous that they market to kids with 1100/1200 SAT/psats. Those kids have no chance really, but all the marketing gets some to attempt it, thus lowering acceptance rates

Again, they don't know who scored in precisely that range from the lists they buy.

Would you want colleges to be able to buy lists with 100 point rages and know nearly exactly what your kid scored without your consent to submit those scores?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

That's why it's ridiculous that they market to kids with 1100/1200 SAT/psats. Those kids have no chance really, but all the marketing gets some to attempt it, thus lowering acceptance rates

Again, they don't know who scored in precisely that range from the lists they buy.

Would you want colleges to be able to buy lists with 100 point rages and know nearly exactly what your kid scored without your consent to submit those scores?

DP here - Colleges could buy a section of names from the 1400+ tests, but they get more apps if they send out more spam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the person who keeps saying that schools don’t know scores, you are wrong. They order batches and set parameters. For example, they may say send me all of the scores above 1200 from males in these three ZIP Codes……. If the batch is larger than what they are willing to pay for, they get a randomized sample from within that patch. This is all very clearly explained in the selling go book. Line.

Also, schools that are looking to increase their appearance of selectivity want as many kids to apply as possible. The goal is more applications.

That's why it's ridiculous that they market to kids with 1100/1200 SAT/psats. Those kids have no chance really, but all the marketing gets some to attempt it, thus lowering acceptance rates

Again, they don't know who scored in precisely that range from the lists they buy.

Would you want colleges to be able to buy lists with 100 point rages and know nearly exactly what your kid scored without your consent to submit those scores?

According to College Board, they do. They said:

"What Information Is Shared

General information you provided when creating your account, along with your score range on any College Board exams you’ve taken.
Colleges that you’ve added to your college list. This data helps those colleges see your demonstrated interest.
Information you’ve provided about your high school performance and activities, along with your college preferences."

https://bigfuture.collegeboard.org/student-search-service

[Anonymous]

I have the best U of C story. We didn't know that students could simply say "no" to this bombardment of stuff when they went thru the PSAT process. So the stuff from U of C starts with both kids, one was three years ahead.. The first child was nowhere near a U of C applicant (stats and GPA) but I knew at least the game they were playing (increase the number of applications no matter what to appear more selective) so I told both kids to ignore. Second child could have been a player (and a legacy) but had no interest because he wanted aerospace engineering, So no one from our family applied. Last year (ten years after DS enrolled at GMU) and seven years after DD enrolled at UVA, BOTH get an onslaught of email stuff and stuff in the mail from U of Chicago. DS is working at Microsoft, DD is doing grad work at Oxford. WTF? Someone must have hit the wrong button at U of C. And, yes, I remember the cute red kitten on the U of C's mailings reminding my kids to send in their applications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I agree it's gross and wasteful. My kids is at a magnet school where the kids are bombarded with UChicago marketing materials. In the Bethesda Magazine article, it was reported 55 students at this school applied last year and 0 were admitted. It's often about inflating application numbers, nothing else.

It’s not because your kids are at a magnet. U of Chicago inundated my average daughter. It’s not really targeted.