Help me figure out which schools are realistic

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public school grades have become so inflated it’s really hard to say. A target would be UVa, VaTech, William &Mary or Maryland CP, depending what state you are in. I think T20 will be unrealistic, but there is no harm applying if your dd understands it is an extreme long shot. It’s very hard for girls in particular right now.

A 3.95 UW gpa is near perfect. They have great SATs and ECs with leadership. If T20 is out of reach for this kid, then it's out of reach for any kid.

It's not "out of reach". They have the resume, if ECs and leadership are there. But all T20s are highly rejective schools thus not very likely for anyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Build a balanced list of schools: reach, targets and safeties/likelies. That means recognizing that any school with less than 20% acceptance rate is a Reach for ANYONE. So NU/Duke/HYPSM etc are a major reach for everyone---think of them as highly rejective. So pick a few and apply and give it your all, but do not let your kid fall in love with them and make sure they know it's not likely to happen.

Pick targets where your kids scores are 50%+ and acceptance rates are 20-25%+.
Safeties are 50%+ acceptance rates and your kid's scores at/above 75%+
Likelies are 75%+ acceptance rates and kid's scores at/above 75+.

remember your kid must like all the schools and you must be able to afford them in order for them to be real and on your list. A safety your kid doesn't want to attend is NOT a safety.

Pick at least 3-4 in each category and your kid will be fine come March/April senior year. They will likely be in at 50% of their Targets and 50%+ of their safeties. Reaches who knows, they might win the lottery.

Based on the other post, no public university is a true safety for anyone because they do yield protection.

You have really oversimplified this. I will say that MOST public universities are "safeties" for OP's kid.

Having just gone the application cycle, a big nope to that. Targets at best.

Depends upon the major. Most public Universities are Safeties with that resume if applying to Arts and Sciences/general admission. If you want a highly desired major (cs/eng/business) then yes they are reaches or targets. Outside of 10 or so Public U and the UCs, most state Universities would be a safety with that resume for general admission (general admission is the key phrase)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After reading through the northwestern thread where multiple people said no one gets in…I’m just not sure where to encourage my kid to look. What would you all suggest for a white female, good public school, 3.95 UW with high rigor, 1550 SAT, several extracurriculars including leadership roles, volunteerism and awards — but nothing knock your socks off like those famous awards or started a non-profit or wrote a published book or whatever.

I’m assuming Harvard, Yale, Princeton and places like Amherst are unrealistic. What would be realistic? Kid does not want to go to the Sputh and isn’t super interested in California so we are primarily looking Northeast, mid Atlantic, or upper Midwest.

Thanks for any ideas.

I didn't read the other thread. But this describes my DD's friend who got in from a Tysons Corner (Vienna/Falls Church) HS in 2020. OF course this is just 1 person I know of personally. She applied ED to their music program.

That's a highly selective program and she got in for her music performance skills, that is what matters most for that major. DOn't kid yourself, that is a hard thing to do as there are ONLY ~100-120 freshman music majors and those are split accordingly over the spaces in the various instrumental studios (Ie flute has 2 spots, violins have 10, etc). So if you are #3 flute in auditions, you wont get accepted as a music major as there is no space.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Build a balanced list of schools: reach, targets and safeties/likelies. That means recognizing that any school with less than 20% acceptance rate is a Reach for ANYONE. So NU/Duke/HYPSM etc are a major reach for everyone---think of them as highly rejective. So pick a few and apply and give it your all, but do not let your kid fall in love with them and make sure they know it's not likely to happen.

Pick targets where your kids scores are 50%+ and acceptance rates are 20-25%+.
Safeties are 50%+ acceptance rates and your kid's scores at/above 75%+
Likelies are 75%+ acceptance rates and kid's scores at/above 75+.

remember your kid must like all the schools and you must be able to afford them in order for them to be real and on your list. A safety your kid doesn't want to attend is NOT a safety.

Pick at least 3-4 in each category and your kid will be fine come March/April senior year. They will likely be in at 50% of their Targets and 50%+ of their safeties. Reaches who knows, they might win the lottery.

Based on the other post, no public university is a true safety for anyone because they do yield protection.

You have really oversimplified this. I will say that MOST public universities are "safeties" for OP's kid.

Having just gone the application cycle, a big nope to that. Targets at best.

Depends upon the major. Most public Universities are Safeties with that resume if applying to Arts and Sciences/general admission. If you want a highly desired major (cs/eng/business) then yes they are reaches or targets. Outside of 10 or so Public U and the UCs, most state Universities would be a safety with that resume for general admission (general admission is the key phrase)

Maybe in 1999, certainly not today.

My student went through the cycle this year. I really don’t want to waste more of my energy arguing this point. Deluded parents who want to believe the admissions environment isn’t as competitive as it is only hurt the applicants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Build a balanced list of schools: reach, targets and safeties/likelies. That means recognizing that any school with less than 20% acceptance rate is a Reach for ANYONE. So NU/Duke/HYPSM etc are a major reach for everyone---think of them as highly rejective. So pick a few and apply and give it your all, but do not let your kid fall in love with them and make sure they know it's not likely to happen.

Pick targets where your kids scores are 50%+ and acceptance rates are 20-25%+.
Safeties are 50%+ acceptance rates and your kid's scores at/above 75%+
Likelies are 75%+ acceptance rates and kid's scores at/above 75+.

remember your kid must like all the schools and you must be able to afford them in order for them to be real and on your list. A safety your kid doesn't want to attend is NOT a safety.

Pick at least 3-4 in each category and your kid will be fine come March/April senior year. They will likely be in at 50% of their Targets and 50%+ of their safeties. Reaches who knows, they might win the lottery.

Based on the other post, no public university is a true safety for anyone because they do yield protection.

No, they are not a safety for specific majors and because their acceptance rates are too low for that. Sure Public U might have a 50% admit rate, but if you want CS/Eng/business the admit rates are 10-20%, so they are a Reach. It's not yield protection, it's understanding the numbers and what they mean. It also means knowing that you MUST do EA at UMD, it's not a choice---that is how they admit most students. UMD acceptance rate makes it a Target for many, but that is only for General entry. Want the elite/hard to get into majors and it is a REACH.

A lot of Public U don't even admit by major - unless it's Engineering. Just apply as an Art major and then declare CS in the College or apply to McIntire when the time comes. As a non-URM female, DD's friend applied to UVA as a Chemistry major (for the "female in STEM" narrative to go along with her AP classes and volunteer work as a math tutor). She did have awesome grades and stellar SAT scores. But ended up not majoring in STEM

Easy to go from the STEM major admissions to a Humanities/Social science. Not so easy to go to eng/cs/stem major if they are direct admit. The elite Public U do admit by major (GaTech/VaTech/UMD/UMich, many UCs, Purdue Eng/CS, UIndiana Business, etc) or at least those with elite programs (I wouldn't call UIndiana elite for anything except the business program)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public school grades have become so inflated it’s really hard to say. A target would be UVa, VaTech, William &Mary or Maryland CP, depending what state you are in. I think T20 will be unrealistic, but there is no harm applying if your dd understands it is an extreme long shot. It’s very hard for girls in particular right now.

A 3.95 UW gpa is near perfect. They have great SATs and ECs with leadership. If T20 is out of reach for this kid, then it's out of reach for any kid.

You have no clue how common these grades are these days. More than 20 percent of the class will have similar grades.

Do you have any data to back up that claim?

There have been multiple threads on this forum about the topic, do a search.

Usually it’s bitter parents of mediocre students in private school complaining about public school kids taking spots in colleges they view as belonging to their kids.

See the post above from the Howard county parent.

once anecdote with zero actual data

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public school grades have become so inflated it’s really hard to say. A target would be UVa, VaTech, William &Mary or Maryland CP, depending what state you are in. I think T20 will be unrealistic, but there is no harm applying if your dd understands it is an extreme long shot. It’s very hard for girls in particular right now.

A 3.95 UW gpa is near perfect. They have great SATs and ECs with leadership. If T20 is out of reach for this kid, then it's out of reach for any kid.

It largely depends on the major. I know many 4.0 kids with 1580+ SAT scores with great e.c.'s who were rejected at T20.

Of course, because the T20 have acceptance rates under 10%. That means 90%+ are rejected. Majority applying would be ideal candidates, but there isn't enough space for all the kids with 1550+/3.9UW+/10+ APs/Top ECs. That is why you apply to T20s your kid likes, but you assume they wont get in and have a great list of targets and safeties where they have a better chance. Then enjoy the lottery win if you get in

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public school grades have become so inflated it’s really hard to say. A target would be UVa, VaTech, William &Mary or Maryland CP, depending what state you are in. I think T20 will be unrealistic, but there is no harm applying if your dd understands it is an extreme long shot. It’s very hard for girls in particular right now.

A 3.95 UW gpa is near perfect. They have great SATs and ECs with leadership. If T20 is out of reach for this kid, then it's out of reach for any kid.

Yes if you are not a recruited athlete, ist gen, URM or ED, there are many kids who want T20 with similar stats.

A few will get in, the vast majority won't. With that GPA and SAT, it will come down to hoping the essay or something about the ECs catches someone's eye. The difference between now and 20 years ago is that used to be Harvard and Princeton, now it's all T20s. That doesn't mean that it isn't worth applying if you are realistic about your chances

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think ED to Amherst is a reach but doable I

I’m an Amherst alum and after seeing their promotional materials for admit rates for first generation and people of color, I would not encourage any white kid from the northeastern suburbs that is not a recruited athlete or first Gen college to apply. I just don’t see how they can hit the numbers they are aiming for, and fill their sports teams, otherwise. Maybe if you were an Olympian or child actor or coca-cola scholar or something like that.

Amherst is different from swarthmore, Williams, etc. in its level of commitment to diversifying its classes.

This advice is spot-on and could apply to Bowdoin, Williams, Wesleyan, and others. Unless you're a recruited athlete, first gen or something extraordinary, do not get your caucasian child's hopes up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Build a balanced list of schools: reach, targets and safeties/likelies. That means recognizing that any school with less than 20% acceptance rate is a Reach for ANYONE. So NU/Duke/HYPSM etc are a major reach for everyone---think of them as highly rejective. So pick a few and apply and give it your all, but do not let your kid fall in love with them and make sure they know it's not likely to happen.

Pick targets where your kids scores are 50%+ and acceptance rates are 20-25%+.
Safeties are 50%+ acceptance rates and your kid's scores at/above 75%+
Likelies are 75%+ acceptance rates and kid's scores at/above 75+.

remember your kid must like all the schools and you must be able to afford them in order for them to be real and on your list. A safety your kid doesn't want to attend is NOT a safety.

Pick at least 3-4 in each category and your kid will be fine come March/April senior year. They will likely be in at 50% of their Targets and 50%+ of their safeties. Reaches who knows, they might win the lottery.

Based on the other post, no public university is a true safety for anyone because they do yield protection.

No, they are not a safety for specific majors and because their acceptance rates are too low for that. Sure Public U might have a 50% admit rate, but if you want CS/Eng/business the admit rates are 10-20%, so they are a Reach. It's not yield protection, it's understanding the numbers and what they mean. It also means knowing that you MUST do EA at UMD, it's not a choice---that is how they admit most students. UMD acceptance rate makes it a Target for many, but that is only for General entry. Want the elite/hard to get into majors and it is a REACH.

A lot of Public U don't even admit by major - unless it's Engineering. Just apply as an Art major and then declare CS in the College or apply to McIntire when the time comes. As a non-URM female, DD's friend applied to UVA as a Chemistry major (for the "female in STEM" narrative to go along with her AP classes and volunteer work as a math tutor). She did have awesome grades and stellar SAT scores. But ended up not majoring in STEM

Easy to go from the STEM major admissions to a Humanities/Social science. Not so easy to go to eng/cs/stem major if they are direct admit. The elite Public U do admit by major (GaTech/VaTech/UMD/UMich, many UCs, Purdue Eng/CS, UIndiana Business, etc) or at least those with elite programs (I wouldn't call UIndiana elite for anything except the business program)

University of MD does not admit by major. You can be admitted to the university without getting your major of choice. If you maintain your GPA you can then switch into most majors (including CS and engineering). Business is actually hard to transfer into. I would not go to UMD for business unless I actually got into the program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think ED to Amherst is a reach but doable I

I’m an Amherst alum and after seeing their promotional materials for admit rates for first generation and people of color, I would not encourage any white kid from the northeastern suburbs that is not a recruited athlete or first Gen college to apply. I just don’t see how they can hit the numbers they are aiming for, and fill their sports teams, otherwise. Maybe if you were an Olympian or child actor or coca-cola scholar or something like that.

Amherst is different from swarthmore, Williams, etc. in its level of commitment to diversifying its classes.

This advice is spot-on and could apply to Bowdoin, Williams, Wesleyan, and others. Unless you're a recruited athlete, first gen or something extraordinary, do not get your caucasian child's hopes up.

Would you put Colgate and Hamilton in that group as well?

FYI per our guidance counselor, it has been more than 10 years since Bowdoin accepted someone from our school who was not a recruited athlete.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unhooked male from public school NOVA. CS major 3.96, 1560, Varsity athlete, club leadership, CS related internship, state award this admissions cycle:
Rejected Harvard and Penn
Waitlisted UVA and NEU
Accepted to 8 schools in 30-75 range. 6 offered merit

Would be helpful to see the list of 8 schools to which you were accepted for CS. Thank you in advance.

Not PP, first take a look at all the schools in the 30-75 range that are NOT direct admit to majors (hint there are plenty) or would be an easy target for those stats, because they have dropped "a tier".

My 1500/3.99UW kid got into 4 for eng/CS as planned majors.

Off top of my head: Boston College, URochester, Case Western, RPI, WPI, Lehigh, Santa Clara, Syracuse, Pitt are all schools that would be an easy target if you demonstrate interest and most give merit and most are not Direct admit for majors.

Proof that "stepping down a tier" can achieve excellent results. Those who are disappointed are ones without true targets or safeties or who apply only to Direct admit CS/Eng programs and no schools that let you self select your major once there (at least 6 of those listed I know allow you to pick whatever major you want)

[Anonymous]

^ Hamilton is such a hot school right now but if your bright, non-recruited, white DC ED'd to Hamilton, I'd say they have a shot. At my dc's school, Colgate seems to be for recruited athletes, Bates as well. And Bowdoin is for the unicorns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public school grades have become so inflated it’s really hard to say. A target would be UVa, VaTech, William &Mary or Maryland CP, depending what state you are in. I think T20 will be unrealistic, but there is no harm applying if your dd understands it is an extreme long shot. It’s very hard for girls in particular right now.

A 3.95 UW gpa is near perfect. They have great SATs and ECs with leadership. If T20 is out of reach for this kid, then it's out of reach for any kid.

You have no clue how common these grades are these days. More than 20 percent of the class will have similar grades.

Do you have any data to back up that claim?

There have been multiple threads on this forum about the topic, do a search.

Usually it’s bitter parents of mediocre students in private school complaining about public school kids taking spots in colleges they view as belonging to their kids.

See the post above from the Howard county parent.

once anecdote with zero actual data

Ask your school’s college counselor. Sounds like you may be in for a shock, 20 percent of the class was conservative, at some schools it will be 40 percent or more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think ED to Amherst is a reach but doable I

I’m an Amherst alum and after seeing their promotional materials for admit rates for first generation and people of color, I would not encourage any white kid from the northeastern suburbs that is not a recruited athlete or first Gen college to apply. I just don’t see how they can hit the numbers they are aiming for, and fill their sports teams, otherwise. Maybe if you were an Olympian or child actor or coca-cola scholar or something like that.

Amherst is different from swarthmore, Williams, etc. in its level of commitment to diversifying its classes.

This advice is spot-on and could apply to Bowdoin, Williams, Wesleyan, and others. Unless you're a recruited athlete, first gen or something extraordinary, do not get your caucasian child's hopes up.

All of the schools you listed are between 35%-70% Caucasian. How is that discouraging?