POLL: Do you feel pressure to be religious?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

So why is helping those families demonstrating that they are “very committed to their faith”.

Because Jesus said to be kind to one another and love thy neighbor.

So they are following instructions? Not something they did on their own?

So these people helped because they were instructed to help?

Not just out of the “kindness” of their hearts?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

Some people are like that - saved or not. And who said religious people can't be kind -- no one. And no one should expect to be praised for helping people in need.

Those churches aren’t asking for praise.

You don't know that. They certainly are expecting that their good works will help land them a spot in heaven. Meanwhile, non-Christians are kind because it's human nature. Christians, too, but they are taught to give Jesus the credit and believe that their good deeds will reap eternal rewards.

Show evidence the churches are asking for praise? Where is your evidence for that claim?

For the record: not one dollar of help, not one food item for a needy family, not one gift was given to the over 400 students from anyone but the churches. Where is all this non-Christian, authentic charity and help you are crowing about? Because I didn’t see one jot of it.

In their faith tradition good works are NOT NEEDED to go to heaven. It’s through the blood of Christ only. They could give their entire bank accounts away to needy people and that’s not getting them into heaven.

I’ve explained that before and you keep saying they need good works and to do charity work and give money to be saved. No. That’s Islam.

There is a fundamental lack of knowledge among non-Christians and even most casual Christians in my experience about the differences in theology throughout Christianity. Salvation through acts, or faith alone, or faith + acts, or how salvation is intertwined with or distinct from living in God's image... These concepts and more all vary from sect to sect as each interprets the scriptures differently or places different emphasis on them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

Some people are like that - saved or not. And who said religious people can't be kind -- no one. And no one should expect to be praised for helping people in need.

Those churches aren’t asking for praise.

You don't know that. They certainly are expecting that their good works will help land them a spot in heaven. Meanwhile, non-Christians are kind because it's human nature. Christians, too, but they are taught to give Jesus the credit and believe that their good deeds will reap eternal rewards.

Show evidence the churches are asking for praise? Where is your evidence for that claim?

For the record: not one dollar of help, not one food item for a needy family, not one gift was given to the over 400 students from anyone but the churches. Where is all this non-Christian, authentic charity and help you are crowing about? Because I didn’t see one jot of it.

In their faith tradition good works are NOT NEEDED to go to heaven. It’s through the blood of Christ only. They could give their entire bank accounts away to needy people and that’s not getting them into heaven.

I’ve explained that before and you keep saying they need good works and to do charity work and give money to be saved. No. That’s Islam.

There is a fundamental lack of knowledge among non-Christians and even most casual Christians in my experience about the differences in theology throughout Christianity. Salvation through acts, or faith alone, or faith + acts, or how salvation is intertwined with or distinct from living in God's image... These concepts and more all vary from sect to sect as each interprets the scriptures differently or places different emphasis on them.

Really? Which Christian sect says you can get into heaven through good works?

[Anonymous]

Seems like most Christians think that good works will get them into heaven.

https://www.christianpost.com/amp/over-half-of-us-christians-believe-good-works-will-get-them-into-heaven-study.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Seems like most Christians think that good works will get them into heaven.

https://www.christianpost.com/amp/over-half-of-us-christians-believe-good-works-will-get-them-into-heaven-study.html

Wow. This does square with Americans' predilection to believe in the parts of the Bible they like (the good stuff), and ignore or disregard the parts they don't like, and to church-shop until they find one that' just right for their personal taste. I guess the majority isn't familiar with, or just ignores Paul's insistence that one gets eternal salvation only by believing in Jesus and NOT by just being a good person and doing good acts. See Romans 10: 8-17

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like most Christians think that good works will get them into heaven.

https://www.christianpost.com/amp/over-half-of-us-christians-believe-good-works-will-get-them-into-heaven-study.html

Wow. This does square with Americans' predilection to believe in the parts of the Bible they like (the good stuff), and ignore or disregard the parts they don't like, and to church-shop until they find one that' just right for their personal taste. I guess the majority isn't familiar with, or just ignores Paul's insistence that one gets eternal salvation only by believing in Jesus and NOT by just being a good person and doing good acts. See Romans 10: 8-17

Catholicism teaches that you need faith *and* good works.
https://bccatholic.ca/voices/graham-osborne/apostles-taught-salvation-by-faith-and-good-works

And many Protestants seem to also believe that.
https://www.pewforum.org/2017/08/31/after-500-years-reformation-era-divisions-have-lost-much-of-their-potency/
“the surveys show that many Protestants today say instead that eternal salvation is attained through a combination of faith and good works – which is the traditional Catholic position”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

Some people are like that - saved or not. And who said religious people can't be kind -- no one. And no one should expect to be praised for helping people in need.

Those churches aren’t asking for praise.

You don't know that. They certainly are expecting that their good works will help land them a spot in heaven. Meanwhile, non-Christians are kind because it's human nature. Christians, too, but they are taught to give Jesus the credit and believe that their good deeds will reap eternal rewards.

Show evidence the churches are asking for praise? Where is your evidence for that claim?

For the record: not one dollar of help, not one food item for a needy family, not one gift was given to the over 400 students from anyone but the churches. Where is all this non-Christian, authentic charity and help you are crowing about? Because I didn’t see one jot of it.

Where's your evidence that they are not? and since when do Christians require evidence for anything?

I witnessed the program in action? The churches received nothing but the satisfaction of helping the kids. I also attended a Mennonite interfaith service and the Mennonite pastor had a box we could put the name and contact information of any needy families in anonymously, so they could help those families. The families didn’t have to be Mennonite or even Christian to receive help.

So the evidence is an anonymous poster on a public message board, who happens to be pp. Not impressed and certainly not convinced.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

Some people are like that - saved or not. And who said religious people can't be kind -- no one. And no one should expect to be praised for helping people in need.

Those churches aren’t asking for praise.

You don't know that. They certainly are expecting that their good works will help land them a spot in heaven. Meanwhile, non-Christians are kind because it's human nature. Christians, too, but they are taught to give Jesus the credit and believe that their good deeds will reap eternal rewards.

Show evidence the churches are asking for praise? Where is your evidence for that claim?

For the record: not one dollar of help, not one food item for a needy family, not one gift was given to the over 400 students from anyone but the churches. Where is all this non-Christian, authentic charity and help you are crowing about? Because I didn’t see one jot of it.

Where's your evidence that they are not? and since when do Christians require evidence for anything?

I witnessed the program in action? The churches received nothing but the satisfaction of helping the kids. I also attended a Mennonite interfaith service and the Mennonite pastor had a box we could put the name and contact information of any needy families in anonymously, so they could help those families. The families didn’t have to be Mennonite or even Christian to receive help.

So the evidence is an anonymous poster on a public message board, who happens to be pp. Not impressed and certainly not convinced.

The most ridiculous people post here and I can guarantee you wouldn’t give anyone a thin dime to help them out. Nasty and awful and miserable. Ugh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

Some people are like that - saved or not. And who said religious people can't be kind -- no one. And no one should expect to be praised for helping people in need.

Those churches aren’t asking for praise.

You don't know that. They certainly are expecting that their good works will help land them a spot in heaven. Meanwhile, non-Christians are kind because it's human nature. Christians, too, but they are taught to give Jesus the credit and believe that their good deeds will reap eternal rewards.

Show evidence the churches are asking for praise? Where is your evidence for that claim?

For the record: not one dollar of help, not one food item for a needy family, not one gift was given to the over 400 students from anyone but the churches. Where is all this non-Christian, authentic charity and help you are crowing about? Because I didn’t see one jot of it.

Where's your evidence that they are not? and since when do Christians require evidence for anything?

I witnessed the program in action? The churches received nothing but the satisfaction of helping the kids. I also attended a Mennonite interfaith service and the Mennonite pastor had a box we could put the name and contact information of any needy families in anonymously, so they could help those families. The families didn’t have to be Mennonite or even Christian to receive help.

So the evidence is an anonymous poster on a public message board, who happens to be pp. Not impressed and certainly not convinced.

The most ridiculous people post here and I can guarantee you wouldn’t give anyone a thin dime to help them out. Nasty and awful and miserable. Ugh.

Like pp, for instance

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

Some people are like that - saved or not. And who said religious people can't be kind -- no one. And no one should expect to be praised for helping people in need.

Those churches aren’t asking for praise.

You don't know that. They certainly are expecting that their good works will help land them a spot in heaven. Meanwhile, non-Christians are kind because it's human nature. Christians, too, but they are taught to give Jesus the credit and believe that their good deeds will reap eternal rewards.

Show evidence the churches are asking for praise? Where is your evidence for that claim?

For the record: not one dollar of help, not one food item for a needy family, not one gift was given to the over 400 students from anyone but the churches. Where is all this non-Christian, authentic charity and help you are crowing about? Because I didn’t see one jot of it.

Where's your evidence that they are not? and since when do Christians require evidence for anything?

I witnessed the program in action? The churches received nothing but the satisfaction of helping the kids. I also attended a Mennonite interfaith service and the Mennonite pastor had a box we could put the name and contact information of any needy families in anonymously, so they could help those families. The families didn’t have to be Mennonite or even Christian to receive help.

So the evidence is an anonymous poster on a public message board, who happens to be pp. Not impressed and certainly not convinced.

The most ridiculous people post here and I can guarantee you wouldn’t give anyone a thin dime to help them out. Nasty and awful and miserable. Ugh.

How was that PP’s post nasty?

Your post was nasty, not hers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:On a few recent threads, we’ve touched on external pressures from friends and family around religion.

Would love to hear more experiences.

At any point in your life:
1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier?

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure?

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service?

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity?

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs?

If you feel comfortable, please share your general location/religious belief. Or any other related thoughts.

I'll play!
1) I'm Jewish and, as another Jewish PP stated, sometimes it's a safety issue. Also sometimes in large groups of acquaintances people will start talking about their Christmas trees or something and it can be awkward to interject, as it will derail what is otherwise a nice conversation for everyone else.
2) I assume you're not asking about door-to-door Jehovah's witnesses or the guys on street corners yelling about the end times. Aside from those, yes, people have asked if I'm worried about my eternal soul for not believing in Jesus as the Messiah.
3) No. There were weeks when I was younger that my family went to shul and I would have preferred to sleep in, but I wouldn't say I was made to go.
4) No. Like youth groups or confirmation or something?
5) Yes, especially at this time of year when my neighbors ask where we plan to get a tree, and at the High Holidays when I have to fight with my kids' school about missing/making up assignments for Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur. From family, I'm Conservative, but have family who are Orthodox and family who are Reform. One Orthodox cousin in particular is always lending me books about Jewish womanhood extolling the virtues of Orthodoxy for women (no thank you; I enjoy sitting with my family at services and hearing from our female rabbi). My Reform MIL always remarks on how uncomfortable she is in our kosher home, because she doesn't understand the rules and doesn't understand why we would keep kosher. So in both of those cases (though obviously in different directions), I feel pressure to be more or less religious to make my family more comfortable.

Generally-speaking, however, I've found a community where I am comfortable (theologically, socially, spiritually) and that goes a long way toward helping to block out external pressures. I'm happy with my level of observance, my relationship with God and Torah, and my community. I'm proud of the connection to Judaism DH and I are fostering in our children. Everything else is (to a certain extent) just noise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Nope. We’re a small office of 5 people and I only know the religions (or none) of two of them. I know for sure one is Christian (ashes on forehead) and I strongly suspect another is, but it just never comes up.

I do find some Jews to be insular and exclusionary.

In what way(s)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

Congratulations on being part of the problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

"And somehow you think religious people can't be kind?"

She NEVER said that. Cut the fake persecution nonsense. It's absurd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Have you ever omitted (or even lied) about your true religious beliefs to make a social situation easier? Yes. For a while in middle school I didn't really know which denomination my family was and mistakenly told people I was Catholic (we were Lutheran). In reality, I was agnostic.

2) Has anyone ever insisted that you believe in a certain god or religious figure? I had a friend in high school who was very into her evangelical church and always trying to get other people to go with her to their teen services. They definitely had the goal of getting other kids to be Christian, but tried to pass it off like their teen service was just a party or a concert that just happened to have Christian Rock performers and a pastor.

3) Has anyone ever made you go to a religious service? My mom made us go for a while when I was little. But then she got tired of me and my siblings and my dad complaining about having to go, and she gave up.

4) Has anyone ever made you participate in a religious activity? No.

5) Do you ever feel like an outsider because of your religious beliefs? When I lived in heavily Christian areas in the deep south, sometimes yes. Up north, not very often.

1) Why do you lie about being agnostic?
2) Did you go to her church? How did she insist you believe in God by extending an invitation to her church? Asking you to attend a church youth service is NOT insistence that you believe in God. Having a band at the service is forbidden? Why is that detail so ominous? If your friend said “come to my church friend, we will have a good time, etc,” she was not hiding the location of the event to lie to you.
3) Your mom had a right to take you to church.
4)
5)How did the people I’m the south make you feel like an outsider?

1) I wasn't (intentionally) lying about being agnostic; I just didn't have the words to define myself as such. My family belonged to a church, hence I had a religion. Just not one I believed.
2) I think you're getting a little defensive about this. Growing up mainstream protestant (and not particularly invested in the fact that there were different denominations), I had no concept of how my friend's evangelical church would be so drastically different from my own church. Her description of a party at her church was about how it's a concert for teens and the teen pastor was so cool. Was I naive? Yes, definitely. But I didn't expect a concert to turn into a sermon about converting your friends to evangelicalism and that part struck me as a bait and switch.
3) Of course she had the right to take me to church. But the question was about being forced to go and if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't have gone.
4) No snarky comment?
5) People in the south were incredibly nice and welcoming and interested in helping me find "a church home" which was lovely. But not being religious myself and thus not having or looking for a church home, made me feel like an outsider. It was about being a minority agnostic in a culture where the majority are religious, in contrast to the north, where people don't talk about religion as openly.

Thanks for the complete and non-snarky explanation.

People in the south who are religious are very committed to their faith. I work at a school in the south. 3 churches donated thousands of dollars of food and gifts to the students. They also donated amazing food baskets to the custodians, along with gift cards to a grocery store. They did this for every school in the area. Over 75% of the students at our school have families that live below the poverty line. It was very nice for the families to receive this at Christmas.

I'm glad to hear that Christians can be kind to others, although religion is not needed to be kind. Many non-religious people are kind without any mandate from above and without any expectation of eternal life.

Right. But to do what was done for these kids and families- churches did it. There was great need and it was kindly filled. Words talking about kindness and help are just words. These churches put their money where their mouth is. I really doubt the kids and families who received this help at Christmas are worried about the motivation behind the gifts and food. If these churches would not have stepped up to the plate, nothing, nothing would have been done. And somehow you think religious people can’t be kind? Religion doesn’t force anyone to be kind or giving. In this area good works don’t get you into heaven. It’s through the Blood of Christ only. So these people don’t even think they have to do such things to get to heaven. They are already saved and heaven bound. They just like helping people.

"And somehow you think religious people can't be kind?"

She NEVER said that. Cut the fake persecution nonsense. It's absurd.

Persecution is an important part of Christianity. Jesus was persecuted, remember. However, it doesn't justify lying about being persecuted. Lying is a sin for Christians - and wrong for everyone.