Gonzaga Kairos Vandalism

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gonzaga Alumni here...

KAIROS generally consists of anywhere from 40-50 kids, so it's safe to say the Post wrote the article in such a way that lead readers to believe the entire group participated. From what I know, it was somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 kids - give or take a few.

Exactly. Think maybe the writer could have avoided misleading in that manner? Pretty lazy, flawed, poorly sourced reporting all around.

From the article:

“Approximately a dozen or so students are reported to have been involved in the destruction of the cabin. A much larger group of 40 to 50 students were at the house when it was being vandalized, though it is unclear how many were actively taking part.”

Please revise to make it more accurate. It sounds fairly spot on to even what you describe. As a reminder they identified their sources as multiple Gonzaga employees.

Wish I could. I was not been there. Nor was the reporter or his sources.

Then how do you know the article is misleading? Or have any basis for accusing the reporter of being lazy? Remember you agreed with someone saying the article was misleading because it led readers to believe that 40-50 boys took part in the vandalism. If you think that paragraph was misleading you should be able to fix it. More likely youbrealize it wasn’t and your original post was misleading because you are lazy and your post was flawed. [/quote
Probably the prosecutor in me recognizing that true facts and details are glaringly absent. I have no skin in the game at all. Just tired of a rash of misleading journalism.

More like you don’t like what was is being reported so you are trying to undermine it by throwing around words like true facts and details when those are actually present. Why not just scream FAKE NEWS and be done with it. People would then know how seriously to take you and your true motivation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gonzaga Alumni here...

KAIROS generally consists of anywhere from 40-50 kids, so it's safe to say the Post wrote the article in such a way that lead readers to believe the entire group participated. From what I know, it was somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 kids - give or take a few.

Exactly. Think maybe the writer could have avoided misleading in that manner? Pretty lazy, flawed, poorly sourced reporting all around.

From the article:

“Approximately a dozen or so students are reported to have been involved in the destruction of the cabin. A much larger group of 40 to 50 students were at the house when it was being vandalized, though it is unclear how many were actively taking part.”

Please revise to make it more accurate. It sounds fairly spot on to even what you describe. As a reminder they identified their sources as multiple Gonzaga employees.

Wish I could. I was not been there. Nor was the reporter or his sources.

Then how do you know the article is misleading? Or have any basis for accusing the reporter of being lazy? Remember you agreed with someone saying the article was misleading because it led readers to believe that 40-50 boys took part in the vandalism. If you think that paragraph was misleading you should be able to fix it. More likely you realize it wasn’t and your original post was misleading because you are lazy and your post was flawed. [/quote
Probably the prosecutor in me recognizing that true facts and details are glaringly absent. I have no skin in the game at all. Just tired of a rash of misleading journalism.

More like you don’t like what was is being reported so you are trying to undermine it by throwing around words like true facts and details when those are actually present. Why not just scream FAKE NEWS and be done with it. People would then know how seriously to take you and your true motivation

Pointing to the story's missing, ambiguous, muddled parts of the description of the "unoccupied home" and the events, and I am interested in the psychology of readers willing to draw firm conclusions, even fill in their own details in order to do so. I do believe that any intentional destruction of another's property is inexcusable, and that whoever did it should be punished, but I really would need way more first-hand, non-hearsay, information to ascertain the degree of of involvement of each student in order to the punishment(s).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:limited to a handful of students who are not representative of the school as others are claiming.

Even if we were to assume that this was true, is the administration's handling of the incident not "representative of the school"?

Assuming that what one reads on here and in the Post is true, and that certainly is an assumption, the administration's handling of this is not "representative of the school" and that is likely why staff leaked the story to the Post and current parents, parents of alums and alums are upset. My son graduated a year ago. During his four years at GZ, the Kairos retreat was held in high regard as one of the best, most meaningful experiences a student would have in his 4 years and there were students who were expelled for much less than what some students apparently did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:limited to a handful of students who are not representative of the school as others are claiming.

Even if we were to assume that this was true, is the administration's handling of the incident not "representative of the school"?

Assuming that what one reads on here and in the Post is true, and that certainly is an assumption, the administration's handling of this is not "representative of the school" and that is likely why staff leaked the story to the Post and current parents, parents of alums and alums are upset. My son graduated a year ago. During his four years at GZ, the Kairos retreat was held in high regard as one of the best, most meaningful experiences a student would have in his 4 years and there were students who were expelled for much less than what some students apparently did.

The kids may or may not be representative of the school but the handling by the admiration is exactly the sort of brush it under the rug approach that it’s always taken.

[Anonymous]

My guess is that so many participated it would be a huge blow to the school reputation wise and financially to expel the crew team/or whatever core group did the actual damage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that so many participated it would be a huge blow to the school reputation wise and financially to expel the crew team/or whatever core group did the actual damage.

Your right!
Not only that, apparently large donations are coming from the parents of those involved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that so many participated it would be a huge blow to the school reputation wise and financially to expel the crew team/or whatever core group did the actual damage.

This post makes a point that should not be ignored. If this was just a small handful of individuals, the school almost certainly would have handled it appropriately (i.e., expelled them). Just a few bad apples wouldn't speak to the character of the entire school. The fact that they did not leads me to believe it was more than a few, and disciplining the involved students appropriately would have been difficult for the school (e.g., practically, in terms of expelling a large number of boys from one class or one athletic team, or from a PR standpoint). The fact that Gonzaga employees were sufficiently horrified by what happened and the administration's handling of it to leak the story to the Post supports this line of thinking. We will never know all of the facts, but what we do know is that some number of Gonzaga boys, while on a spiritual retreat, had so little respect for others' property that they completely trashed it (one day then, after a good night's sleep, the next day as well) and, when caught, the Gonzaga administration chose to sweep it under the rug rather than deal with those boys appropriately. Draw whatever conclusions about Gonzaga that you would like. I have drawn mine. My son will never go to Gonzaga.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gonzaga Alumni here...

KAIROS generally consists of anywhere from 40-50 kids, so it's safe to say the Post wrote the article in such a way that lead readers to believe the entire group participated. From what I know, it was somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 kids - give or take a few.

Exactly. Think maybe the writer could have avoided misleading in that manner? Pretty lazy, flawed, poorly sourced reporting all around.

From the article:

“Approximately a dozen or so students are reported to have been involved in the destruction of the cabin. A much larger group of 40 to 50 students were at the house when it was being vandalized, though it is unclear how many were actively taking part.”

Please revise to make it more accurate. It sounds fairly spot on to even what you describe. As a reminder they identified their sources as multiple Gonzaga employees.

Wish I could. I was not been there. Nor was the reporter or his sources.

Then how do you know the article is misleading? Or have any basis for accusing the reporter of being lazy? Remember you agreed with someone saying the article was misleading because it led readers to believe that 40-50 boys took part in the vandalism. If you think that paragraph was misleading you should be able to fix it. More likely you realize it wasn’t and your original post was misleading because you are lazy and your post was flawed. [/quote
Probably the prosecutor in me recognizing that true facts and details are glaringly absent. I have no skin in the game at all. Just tired of a rash of misleading journalism.

More like you don’t like what was is being reported so you are trying to undermine it by throwing around words like true facts and details when those are actually present. Why not just scream FAKE NEWS and be done with it. People would then know how seriously to take you and your true motivation

Pointing to the story's missing, ambiguous, muddled parts of the description of the "unoccupied home" and the events, and I am interested in the psychology of readers willing to draw firm conclusions, even fill in their own details in order to do so. I do believe that any intentional destruction of another's property is inexcusable, and that whoever did it should be punished, but I really would need way more first-hand, non-hearsay, information to ascertain the degree of of involvement of each student in order to the punishment(s).

What are the muddled parts? The article is clear on what it knows and how it came to know that. The fact that people on this forum derive whatever conclusions they derive ha late nothing to do with the article nor is anyone on this board filing out punishments. So your comments have no purpose other than to try to undermine the idea that anything happened at all that should concern anyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:the administration's handling of this is not "representative of the school" and that is likely why staff leaked the story to the Post and current parents, parents of alums and alums are upset

WTF? The administration of any school is literally its representative.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that so many participated it would be a huge blow to the school reputation wise and financially to expel the crew team/or whatever core group did the actual damage.

This post makes a point that should not be ignored. If this was just a small handful of individuals, the school almost certainly would have handled it appropriately (i.e., expelled them). Just a few bad apples wouldn't speak to the character of the entire school. The fact that they did not leads me to believe it was more than a few, and disciplining the involved students appropriately would have been difficult for the school (e.g., practically, in terms of expelling a large number of boys from one class or one athletic team, or from a PR standpoint). The fact that Gonzaga employees were sufficiently horrified by what happened and the administration's handling of it to leak the story to the Post supports this line of thinking. We will never know all of the facts, but what we do know is that some number of Gonzaga boys, while on a spiritual retreat, had so little respect for others' property that they completely trashed it (one day then, after a good night's sleep, the next day as well) and, when caught, the Gonzaga administration chose to sweep it under the rug rather than deal with those boys appropriately. Draw whatever conclusions about Gonzaga that you would like. I have drawn mine. My son will never go to Gonzaga.

This is simply not true. My DS is a freshman at Gonzaga. Parents have received several emails about the incident and actions being taken as a result. There have been and will be additional consequences. Nothing has been swept under the rug.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:the administration's handling of this is not "representative of the school" and that is likely why staff leaked the story to the Post and current parents, parents of alums and alums are upset

WTF? The administration of any school is literally its representative.

Exactly. The way the administration handled this situation is very representative of how they handle things. I am aware of other disciplinary actions that have been taken at Gonzaga, with respect to both students and faculty. The administration always has two overriding concerns: the school's reputation; and the bottom line. Handling matters responsibly, fairly, and respectfully are secondary concerns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that so many participated it would be a huge blow to the school reputation wise and financially to expel the crew team/or whatever core group did the actual damage.

This post makes a point that should not be ignored. If this was just a small handful of individuals, the school almost certainly would have handled it appropriately (i.e., expelled them). Just a few bad apples wouldn't speak to the character of the entire school. The fact that they did not leads me to believe it was more than a few, and disciplining the involved students appropriately would have been difficult for the school (e.g., practically, in terms of expelling a large number of boys from one class or one athletic team, or from a PR standpoint). The fact that Gonzaga employees were sufficiently horrified by what happened and the administration's handling of it to leak the story to the Post supports this line of thinking. We will never know all of the facts, but what we do know is that some number of Gonzaga boys, while on a spiritual retreat, had so little respect for others' property that they completely trashed it (one day then, after a good night's sleep, the next day as well) and, when caught, the Gonzaga administration chose to sweep it under the rug rather than deal with those boys appropriately. Draw whatever conclusions about Gonzaga that you would like. I have drawn mine. My son will never go to Gonzaga.

This is simply not true. My DS is a freshman at Gonzaga. Parents have received several emails about the incident and actions being taken as a result. There have been and will be additional consequences. Nothing has been swept under the rug.

Keep telling yourself that there was no sweeping going on. I am also within the GZ community. Until the story was leaked, the administration did EVERYTHING it could to sweep this under the rug. Everything you're seeing now is nothing more than damage control.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that so many participated it would be a huge blow to the school reputation wise and financially to expel the crew team/or whatever core group did the actual damage.

This post makes a point that should not be ignored. If this was just a small handful of individuals, the school almost certainly would have handled it appropriately (i.e., expelled them). Just a few bad apples wouldn't speak to the character of the entire school. The fact that they did not leads me to believe it was more than a few, and disciplining the involved students appropriately would have been difficult for the school (e.g., practically, in terms of expelling a large number of boys from one class or one athletic team, or from a PR standpoint). The fact that Gonzaga employees were sufficiently horrified by what happened and the administration's handling of it to leak the story to the Post supports this line of thinking. We will never know all of the facts, but what we do know is that some number of Gonzaga boys, while on a spiritual retreat, had so little respect for others' property that they completely trashed it (one day then, after a good night's sleep, the next day as well) and, when caught, the Gonzaga administration chose to sweep it under the rug rather than deal with those boys appropriately. Draw whatever conclusions about Gonzaga that you would like. I have drawn mine. My son will never go to Gonzaga.

This is simply not true. My DS is a freshman at Gonzaga. Parents have received several emails about the incident and actions being taken as a result. There have been and will be additional consequences. Nothing has been swept under the rug.

Keep telling yourself that there was no sweeping going on. I am also within the GZ community. Until the story was leaked, the administration did EVERYTHING it could to sweep this under the rug. Everything you're seeing now is nothing more than damage control.

The administration is not at liberty to share private information about its student. Has anyone ever been fired in your workplace? Did supervisors share all the details of what the person did, why they were fired, and any other consequences or actions taken? No - because legally they cannot, unless they're looking to be sued. Unfortunately, this is what causes rumors to run rampant.
When the information became public, the administration at Gonzaga responded appropriately and shared what information it could.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that so many participated it would be a huge blow to the school reputation wise and financially to expel the crew team/or whatever core group did the actual damage.

This post makes a point that should not be ignored. If this was just a small handful of individuals, the school almost certainly would have handled it appropriately (i.e., expelled them). Just a few bad apples wouldn't speak to the character of the entire school. The fact that they did not leads me to believe it was more than a few, and disciplining the involved students appropriately would have been difficult for the school (e.g., practically, in terms of expelling a large number of boys from one class or one athletic team, or from a PR standpoint). The fact that Gonzaga employees were sufficiently horrified by what happened and the administration's handling of it to leak the story to the Post supports this line of thinking. We will never know all of the facts, but what we do know is that some number of Gonzaga boys, while on a spiritual retreat, had so little respect for others' property that they completely trashed it (one day then, after a good night's sleep, the next day as well) and, when caught, the Gonzaga administration chose to sweep it under the rug rather than deal with those boys appropriately. Draw whatever conclusions about Gonzaga that you would like. I have drawn mine. My son will never go to Gonzaga.

This is simply not true. My DS is a freshman at Gonzaga. Parents have received several emails about the incident and actions being taken as a result. There have been and will be additional consequences. Nothing has been swept under the rug.

Keep telling yourself that there was no sweeping going on. I am also within the GZ community. Until the story was leaked, the administration did EVERYTHING it could to sweep this under the rug. Everything you're seeing now is nothing more than damage control.

The administration is not at liberty to share private information about its student. Has anyone ever been fired in your workplace? Did supervisors share all the details of what the person did, why they were fired, and any other consequences or actions taken? No - because legally they cannot, unless they're looking to be sued. Unfortunately, this is what causes rumors to run rampant.
When the information became public, the administration at Gonzaga responded appropriately and shared what information it could.

But in this case, the administration barely took any PRIVATE action until the story broke. Once it did, and the administration realized their cover up looked as bad as (or worse than) the initial vandalism, then they focused on disciplining those involved. No one said they should have released names of offenders and their punishments. Keep telling yourself the administration responded appropriately. Especially when they describe back to back days of intentional vandalism of another's property as "mistakes."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:the administration's handling of this is not "representative of the school" and that is likely why staff leaked the story to the Post and current parents, parents of alums and alums are upset

WTF? The administration of any school is literally its representative.

Exactly. The way the administration handled this situation is very representative of how they handle things. I am aware of other disciplinary actions that have been taken at Gonzaga, with respect to both students and faculty. The administration always has two overriding concerns: the school's reputation; and the bottom line. Handling matters responsibly, fairly, and respectfully are secondary concerns.

I have had multiple sons attend Gonzaga and one there now and this is not at all our experience. Privacy of those involved is always a concern and things you hear often include rumor and speculation unless you are directly involved.