Middle and high school on Capitol Hill

[Anonymous]

^^ The PPP is scared of poor students, no matter their race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^ The PPP is scared of poor students, no matter their race.

Agree. I have no problem with a test in, rigorous school as I went to one myself and it changed my whole family's life (I posted before). That said, racist arguments don't support that argument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I worked in the admissions office of my highly-selective college for four years. They want students who can handle the academics, but, honestly, those kids are a dime a dozen. Having interesting life experiences and learning from them (including writing about them in a compelling manner) counted for a tremendous amount and was what made admission officers remember your application. They did not just tally the number of AP classes you took. Maybe things have changed and maybe this college is atypical, but the obsession with APs and IB may be unproductive.

I also worked in the admissions office of my alma mater, an Ivy, just a few years ago. What I observed is that admissions officers work off an unofficial baseline for academics, and the rest, as you point out, was what made them remember you application. The baseline for high SES whites and Asians seemed to be half a dozen (or more) AP tests with scores of 4s and 5s, an IBD points total of at least 40, SATs in the 700s (regular SAT and two subject tests), and a high GPA (but not necessarily sky high for one's high school - valedictorians didn't necessarily fare better than other applicants in the top 15% of their class). If applicants didn't meet the baseline, their application essays and alumni interview reports were not read. Their applications were promptly tossed into a digital "first round rejection" pile. Only applicants who'd met the baseline advanced to the "second read" stage, where essays were in fact read.

Interesting. From my reading, most highly selective schools compare an applicant's curriculum to the highest level curriculum offered at his/her school. Did your Ivy not do this? Many schools do not offer an extensive array of APs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Eastern's IBD pass rate average points totals have been a little lower than Banneker's to date, but they're only about to graduate their third class of IBD students, with a dozen students in a cohort.

Enough of this PC silliness. Controlling for race and class alone doesn't get you a high-performing school. In an urban center, bona fide selective admissions combined with decent facilities, strong teaching and leadership,and a diverse student body (with many high SES families of all races involved) gets you a high-performing school.

Yes, DCI will be offering International Baccalaureate Diploma studies, but only IBD lite. IBD studies won't be required at DCI, so they won't have a critical mass of students to offer many Higher Level (1-2 years past AP) classes. Reading the tea leaves, I predict that their pass total will be in the high 20s for the first five years or so they graduate students. If you're shooting for the stars in college admissions (Ivies, Little Ivies, Georgetown, Stanford, military academies, Duke etc.) and you're white or Asian, you're going to need a points total of 40+.

I'm the PP who's years away. Thank you for posting and explaining the stats. I'm familiar with the AP system from my own education but am learning about IB and watching closely what happens with the various local programs.

The other thing to consider is that Eastern and Banneker offer both AP and IB courses.

DCI, on the other hand, will only offer IB.

The problem definitely isn't that DCI will only offer IB courses, it's that their IB courses are unlikely to be terribly rigorous (because so many of their students aren't really "full" IBD material). If a Hill kid can score 6s and 7s on IBD exams at either the Standard or Higher Levels, 4s and 5s on corresponding APs come easily. Go visit one of the MoCo of Fairfax IBD programs and chat with their in-house IB Coordinator if you want to learn more. These programs run IBD open houses.

Just curious- are they not really "full IBD Material" because they're Hispanic? Or are you disgusted by the fact that DCI has black kids?

I am absolutely for a Hill middle school and a rigorous test-in high school, but your statement is flat out racist. The DCI feeders are very strong (stronger than many Hill schools in fact), and since you dismissed most of them as "not IDB material" based on nothing... You're really just a revolting racist.

- Hispanic IB diploma holder who probably would have been dismissed by racist trash like PP, but actually scored only 6s and 7s.

Hello Hispanic IBD holder, I'm not white. Look at DCI's PARCC scores, in the aggregate and by sub-bgroup. Then visit any of the MoCo elementary immersion "feeder" schools sending kids on to Richard Montgomery (which boasts one of the highest IBD average points totals in the world, and is loaded with high-scoring Hispanics). Compare the DCI feeder and DCI itself to the MoCo programs. Take my point without the vitriol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I worked in the admissions office of my highly-selective college for four years. They want students who can handle the academics, but, honestly, those kids are a dime a dozen. Having interesting life experiences and learning from them (including writing about them in a compelling manner) counted for a tremendous amount and was what made admission officers remember your application. They did not just tally the number of AP classes you took. Maybe things have changed and maybe this college is atypical, but the obsession with APs and IB may be unproductive.

I also worked in the admissions office of my alma mater, an Ivy, just a few years ago. What I observed is that admissions officers work off an unofficial baseline for academics, and the rest, as you point out, was what made them remember you application. The baseline for high SES whites and Asians seemed to be half a dozen (or more) AP tests with scores of 4s and 5s, an IBD points total of at least 40, SATs in the 700s (regular SAT and two subject tests), and a high GPA (but not necessarily sky high for one's high school - valedictorians didn't necessarily fare better than other applicants in the top 15% of their class). If applicants didn't meet the baseline, their application essays and alumni interview reports were not read. Their applications were promptly tossed into a digital "first round rejection" pile. Only applicants who'd met the baseline advanced to the "second read" stage, where essays were in fact read.

Interesting. From my reading, most highly selective schools compare an applicant's curriculum to the highest level curriculum offered at his/her school. Did your Ivy not do this? Many schools do not offer an extensive array of APs.

That ship has sailed, partly because the homeschooling movement has changed it. It's not longer difficult or expensive to prep for AP tests on your own. I've interviewed Wilson HS students for my Ivy who prepped for Calc BC (mostly on Khan Academy, on-line) before Wilson began teaching the course. They scored 5s. If your school doesn't offer many APs and you want to crack a college admitting in the single digits, you'd better find a way to supplement so you've taken at least 5 or 6 AP tests. Public libraries usually stock the prep books and Educational Testing services will waive the test fees for low-income test takers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^ The PPP is scared of poor students, no matter their race.

PP, who is not white, grew up poor and attended famous test-in magnet in another East Coast city (after having been prepped extensively for free at city run prep center), then an Ivy. PP decries DC's rotten treatment of ambitious and brilliant poor minority students, widely defended by well-meaning ultra liberal, uber educated whites on the Hill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Eastern's IBD pass rate average points totals have been a little lower than Banneker's to date, but they're only about to graduate their third class of IBD students, with a dozen students in a cohort.

Enough of this PC silliness. Controlling for race and class alone doesn't get you a high-performing school. In an urban center, bona fide selective admissions combined with decent facilities, strong teaching and leadership,and a diverse student body (with many high SES families of all races involved) gets you a high-performing school.

Yes, DCI will be offering International Baccalaureate Diploma studies, but only IBD lite. IBD studies won't be required at DCI, so they won't have a critical mass of students to offer many Higher Level (1-2 years past AP) classes. Reading the tea leaves, I predict that their pass total will be in the high 20s for the first five years or so they graduate students. If you're shooting for the stars in college admissions (Ivies, Little Ivies, Georgetown, Stanford, military academies, Duke etc.) and you're white or Asian, you're going to need a points total of 40+.

I'm the PP who's years away. Thank you for posting and explaining the stats. I'm familiar with the AP system from my own education but am learning about IB and watching closely what happens with the various local programs.

The other thing to consider is that Eastern and Banneker offer both AP and IB courses.

DCI, on the other hand, will only offer IB.

The problem definitely isn't that DCI will only offer IB courses, it's that their IB courses are unlikely to be terribly rigorous (because so many of their students aren't really "full" IBD material). If a Hill kid can score 6s and 7s on IBD exams at either the Standard or Higher Levels, 4s and 5s on corresponding APs come easily. Go visit one of the MoCo of Fairfax IBD programs and chat with their in-house IB Coordinator if you want to learn more. These programs run IBD open houses.

Just curious- are they not really "full IBD Material" because they're Hispanic? Or are you disgusted by the fact that DCI has black kids?

I am absolutely for a Hill middle school and a rigorous test-in high school, but your statement is flat out racist. The DCI feeders are very strong (stronger than many Hill schools in fact), and since you dismissed most of them as "not IDB material" based on nothing... You're really just a revolting racist.

- Hispanic IB diploma holder who probably would have been dismissed by racist trash like PP, but actually scored only 6s and 7s.

Hello Hispanic IBD holder, I'm not white. Look at DCI's PARCC scores, in the aggregate and by sub-bgroup. Then visit any of the MoCo elementary immersion "feeder" schools sending kids on to Richard Montgomery (which boasts one of the highest IBD average points totals in the world, and is loaded with high-scoring Hispanics). Compare the DCI feeder and DCI itself to the MoCo programs. Take my point without the vitriol.

No, your point is still racist. Just because you're Asian (yes I know who you are now), doesn't allow you to dismiss students based on their race.

Furthermore I would not say Montgomery county isn't doing its part when it comes to Hispanics. They themselves came to this conclusion last year. I understand that you're irritated that Yu Ying doesn't take mandarin speakers (I get it!), but that's not something that's Yu Ying or DCIs fault.

[Anonymous]

Different poster. This thread has woken me up to the reality that this city could really use the International Baccalaureate equivalent of SWW. This application school could work as a school within a school program AT Walls. None of the established DCPS or DC Public Charter IB programs sound like they serve the best IBD students well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different poster. This thread has woken me up to the reality that this city could really use the International Baccalaureate equivalent of SWW. This application school could work as a school within a school program AT Walls. None of the established DCPS or DC Public Charter IB programs sound like they serve the best IBD students well.

Good luck with that. DCPS put IB at Eastern to attract Cap Hill families who said that's what would make them enroll. They didn't enroll. DCPS will -- and frankly should -- say that the Eqstern program would improve if the students came.

I don't think they will throw more money at IB, especially IB for 'the best' students. That's not the priority in a city with thousands of students at risk and performing well below grade level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Eastern's IBD pass rate average points totals have been a little lower than Banneker's to date, but they're only about to graduate their third class of IBD students, with a dozen students in a cohort.

Enough of this PC silliness. Controlling for race and class alone doesn't get you a high-performing school. In an urban center, bona fide selective admissions combined with decent facilities, strong teaching and leadership,and a diverse student body (with many high SES families of all races involved) gets you a high-performing school.

Yes, DCI will be offering International Baccalaureate Diploma studies, but only IBD lite. IBD studies won't be required at DCI, so they won't have a critical mass of students to offer many Higher Level (1-2 years past AP) classes. Reading the tea leaves, I predict that their pass total will be in the high 20s for the first five years or so they graduate students. If you're shooting for the stars in college admissions (Ivies, Little Ivies, Georgetown, Stanford, military academies, Duke etc.) and you're white or Asian, you're going to need a points total of 40+.

I'm the PP who's years away. Thank you for posting and explaining the stats. I'm familiar with the AP system from my own education but am learning about IB and watching closely what happens with the various local programs.

The other thing to consider is that Eastern and Banneker offer both AP and IB courses.

DCI, on the other hand, will only offer IB.

The problem definitely isn't that DCI will only offer IB courses, it's that their IB courses are unlikely to be terribly rigorous (because so many of their students aren't really "full" IBD material). If a Hill kid can score 6s and 7s on IBD exams at either the Standard or Higher Levels, 4s and 5s on corresponding APs come easily. Go visit one of the MoCo of Fairfax IBD programs and chat with their in-house IB Coordinator if you want to learn more. These programs run IBD open houses.

Just curious- are they not really "full IBD Material" because they're Hispanic? Or are you disgusted by the fact that DCI has black kids?

I am absolutely for a Hill middle school and a rigorous test-in high school, but your statement is flat out racist. The DCI feeders are very strong (stronger than many Hill schools in fact), and since you dismissed most of them as "not IDB material" based on nothing... You're really just a revolting racist.

- Hispanic IB diploma holder who probably would have been dismissed by racist trash like PP, but actually scored only 6s and 7s.

Hello Hispanic IBD holder, I'm not white. Look at DCI's PARCC scores, in the aggregate and by sub-bgroup. Then visit any of the MoCo elementary immersion "feeder" schools sending kids on to Richard Montgomery (which boasts one of the highest IBD average points totals in the world, and is loaded with high-scoring Hispanics). Compare the DCI feeder and DCI itself to the MoCo programs. Take my point without the vitriol.

No, your point is still racist. Just because you're Asian (yes I know who you are now), doesn't allow you to dismiss students based on their race.

Furthermore I would not say Montgomery county isn't doing its part when it comes to Hispanics. They themselves came to this conclusion last year. I understand that you're irritated that Yu Ying doesn't take mandarin speakers (I get it!), but that's not something that's Yu Ying or DCIs fault.

Granted, but you're painting with too broad a brush. The low-income Hispanic students I attended Boston Latin, and my Ivy, with were impressive and I know a little bit about racism (having been called "chink" hundreds of times as a kid). If cities bother to identify academically advanced minority kids young to get them into GT programs, then ensure they have access to free, unlimited test prep, they can be well represented in MS and HS test-in magnet programs. As has been pointed out, Chicago's application system for test-in magnets is superior to MoCo's. Disagree that YY and the other DCI feeders aren't to blame for the lack of native speakers (which negatively impacts their IBD program results later). I've done research on the issue - the DCPC Board seems open to considering letting native speakers test in to replace upper grades drop-outs, tweaking their LEA arrangements, but the feeder schools have not teamed up to ask for this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different poster. This thread has woken me up to the reality that this city could really use the International Baccalaureate equivalent of SWW. This application school could work as a school within a school program AT Walls. None of the established DCPS or DC Public Charter IB programs sound like they serve the best IBD students well.

Good luck with that. DCPS put IB at Eastern to attract Cap Hill families who said that's what would make them enroll. They didn't enroll. DCPS will -- and frankly should -- say that the Eqstern program would improve if the students came.

I don't think they will throw more money at IB, especially IB for 'the best' students. That's not the priority in a city with thousands of students at risk and performing well below grade level.

Yes, yes, nothing is a priority for DCPS but raising PARCC scores for low SES minority kids who need remediation. I don't expect DCPS to see the light--the leadership isn't modern, flexible, pragmatic, strong or visionary--but the demand is real and the possibilities to expand IBD to give the burbs a run for their money are boundless (without breaking the bank).

[Anonymous]

Most depressing DCUM thread ever. So much potential wasted even as demographics change at breakneck speed. Couldn't believe what I saw at the mobbed new H St. Whole Foods over the weekend. Place was packed with young families.

[Anonymous]

Takoma Park thanks CH for it's poor middle school and high school options. It isn't a coincidence that the first major wave of of gentrification in the late 90s who are having kids reach their teenage years who have spent 15 years pretending to stick their noses up at the NW, Arlington and Bethesda families who have looked down on them have targeted an alternative spot causing a relative localized boom. As a developer in the TP area, I can't tell you how many of my customers are CH migrants flush with home proceeds looking to update their Victorian or bungalow to fancy while their older kids loaf around. I can't imagine they did it for the bus boys and poets.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Most depressing DCUM thread ever. So much potential wasted even as demographics change at breakneck speed. Couldn't believe what I saw at the mobbed new H St. Whole Foods over the weekend. Place was packed with young families.

Families who use schools and other public services are not as valuable to the city as single people who don't. You consume more services than a single person.

You think they want all of you to stay. They really don't care.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Most depressing DCUM thread ever. So much potential wasted even as demographics change at breakneck speed. Couldn't believe what I saw at the mobbed new H St. Whole Foods over the weekend. Place was packed with young families.

That is the point. The WF was filled with families despite the Hill MS situation. The area is changing rapidly despite the Hill MS situation. There is little appetite for even faster change, so no particular need for DCPS to invest resources and/or political capital in a big change (esp when they are in the midst of changing Hardy and dealing with non-Hill EOTP) Y'all are just going to have to wait for the demographic change at the "lesser" elementary schools to transform the whole situation. And if that is too late for Larla, and you have to move to Va or Md, well just man up and accept it.