Inheritance debacle. WWYD?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What questions, exactly, have I ignored?

If you mean the constant, "But WHY did she leave YOU the house instead of her kids?!?!?!"

The answer is that I DO NOT KNOW. I can guess it is because she has floated my cousin/godsister all this time and gave her some money and called it even

If this were a TV movie we were watching, I would say the answer to the question of why Thelma left the house to Larla goes back to the day Thelma and Larla's grandmother went to the lawyer together to have Thelma's will written. How interesting that when they left that office, Thelma's home was being left to her sister's granddaughter instead of her own two children. If this were a movie, I think a flashback to what happened in that lawyer's office would answer that question.

Sorry, I know you'd prefer not to have to think of it this way, but the way Thelma's assets were divided in her will is not at all common. It is much more common for an estate to be divided evenly among the children of the deceased. Skipping over the deceased's own children to leave a large asset like a family home to a great niece is highly unusual. It is just not how these things are typically done. I have read a lot of wills and I've never seen one that handled the family home in this manner.

And here's some questions that were never answered: Who served as the witnesses to the will? Who produced the copy of the will after Thelma died? was the lawyer who wrote the will the same one who handled the disposition of the will?

The house was originally left to the two sisters (Thelma and Larla's grandmother) by their parents. Who knows what agreement they made when they inherited it. Obviously, only one lived there after they each got married. The house may have remained in both of their names. Fairness would dictate that the one who lived there (Thelma) owed something to the other one who moved out (Larla's grandmother), but we don't know how that was resolved. I doubt this all just happened when the will was drawn up in the lawyer's office.

Thelma left money to others as well in her will, and this important because it appears that she wanted to leave some of her wealth to all who mattered to her. Thelma may have told Mary that her stipend was coming out of her inheritance, and she may have been telling her that all along, but maybe Mary just tuned her out, thinking that the good times would last forever. We really don't know what went on or was said between Thelma and Mary. But it appears to me that Thelma's will was made when she was of sound mind and body, and she seemed to have given much thought to it. I think the family needs to respect and accept Thelma's final wishes -- especially Mary.

Somewhere back in this thread, Larla stated that Thelma had bought out the sister's half of the house and there was no agreement to give it back to the sister's side of the family.

Also, we really don't know that this will reflects Thelma's wishes. It's entirely possible that her sister had an influence on how the will was written since she was in the lawyer's office with Thelma when the will was done. I haven't seen evidence here that Thelma gave a lot of thought to her will, just that her sister took her to a lawyer's office to have it done about five years ago.

The issue here is not that Mary needs to be taken care of, but that the usual thing is for parents to pass on their family's assets to their children or possibly their grandchildren. It is rare to see a will that leaves a larger asset to a more distant relative like a great niece rather that the decedent's own children.
It is too bad that Mary and Roy did not get good legal advice about their mother's will.

Again, you are making it seem like Thelma's sister dragged her to a lawyer's office and held her at gunpoint until she wrote out the will the way it is. Most likely, Thelma knew what she wanted to put in the will and simply had her sister go with her so that they were on the same page, seeing as her sister is the executor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What questions, exactly, have I ignored?

If you mean the constant, "But WHY did she leave YOU the house instead of her kids?!?!?!"

The answer is that I DO NOT KNOW. I can guess it is because she has floated my cousin/godsister all this time and gave her some money and called it even

If this were a TV movie we were watching, I would say the answer to the question of why Thelma left the house to Larla goes back to the day Thelma and Larla's grandmother went to the lawyer together to have Thelma's will written. How interesting that when they left that office, Thelma's home was being left to her sister's granddaughter instead of her own two children. If this were a movie, I think a flashback to what happened in that lawyer's office would answer that question.

Sorry, I know you'd prefer not to have to think of it this way, but the way Thelma's assets were divided in her will is not at all common. It is much more common for an estate to be divided evenly among the children of the deceased. Skipping over the deceased's own children to leave a large asset like a family home to a great niece is highly unusual. It is just not how these things are typically done. I have read a lot of wills and I've never seen one that handled the family home in this manner.

And here's some questions that were never answered: Who served as the witnesses to the will? Who produced the copy of the will after Thelma died? was the lawyer who wrote the will the same one who handled the disposition of the will?

The house was originally left to the two sisters (Thelma and Larla's grandmother) by their parents. Who knows what agreement they made when they inherited it. Obviously, only one lived there after they each got married. The house may have remained in both of their names. Fairness would dictate that the one who lived there (Thelma) owed something to the other one who moved out (Larla's grandmother), but we don't know how that was resolved. I doubt this all just happened when the will was drawn up in the lawyer's office.

Thelma left money to others as well in her will, and this important because it appears that she wanted to leave some of her wealth to all who mattered to her. Thelma may have told Mary that her stipend was coming out of her inheritance, and she may have been telling her that all along, but maybe Mary just tuned her out, thinking that the good times would last forever. We really don't know what went on or was said between Thelma and Mary. But it appears to me that Thelma's will was made when she was of sound mind and body, and she seemed to have given much thought to it. I think the family needs to respect and accept Thelma's final wishes -- especially Mary.

Somewhere back in this thread, Larla stated that Thelma had bought out the sister's half of the house and there was no agreement to give it back to the sister's side of the family.

Also, we really don't know that this will reflects Thelma's wishes. It's entirely possible that her sister had an influence on how the will was written since she was in the lawyer's office with Thelma when the will was done. I haven't seen evidence here that Thelma gave a lot of thought to her will, just that her sister took her to a lawyer's office to have it done about five years ago.

The issue here is not that Mary needs to be taken care of, but that the usual thing is for parents to pass on their family's assets to their children or possibly their grandchildren. It is rare to see a will that leaves a larger asset to a more distant relative like a great niece rather that the decedent's own children.
It is too bad that Mary and Roy did not get good legal advice about their mother's will.

I am aware that you think she is biased, but realistically, the OP is in a much better position to know Thelma's wishes than you are. Your insistence that her sister MUST have influenced her to write the will in a particular way is bizarre. I also think that your fixation on "great niece" is ignoring the actual relationship as described between these two people. For one thing, in addition to being a great niece, she is also Thelma's goddaughter. That relationship is, for many people, much closer than whatever the on-paper blood relationship is. I posted I-don't-even-know-how-many-pages-ago asking about the family's cultural background, and the OP's answer indicated to me that they come from a culture where extended family relationships are closer than in my WASP family. I saw my grandparents and aunts and cousins a couple times a year. We didn't communicate that regularly. We definitely didn't see each other regularly outside of holidays and special occasions. That's not the case with the OP's family. This is a family that remained close together geographically and close knit personally for decades. Saying "a more distant relative like a great niece" misunderstands this family's way of relating. Mary's adulting incompetence aside, I don't think it's out of the ordinary that Thelma left a substantial inheritance to her goddaughter at all, and I don't think you'd think it was that strange either, except that you are weirdly fixated on how Mary and Roy got screwed by Evil Gold Digger Grandma.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What questions, exactly, have I ignored?

If you mean the constant, "But WHY did she leave YOU the house instead of her kids?!?!?!"

The answer is that I DO NOT KNOW. I can guess it is because she has floated my cousin/godsister all this time and gave her some money and called it even

If this were a TV movie we were watching, I would say the answer to the question of why Thelma left the house to Larla goes back to the day Thelma and Larla's grandmother went to the lawyer together to have Thelma's will written. How interesting that when they left that office, Thelma's home was being left to her sister's granddaughter instead of her own two children. If this were a movie, I think a flashback to what happened in that lawyer's office would answer that question.

Sorry, I know you'd prefer not to have to think of it this way, but the way Thelma's assets were divided in her will is not at all common. It is much more common for an estate to be divided evenly among the children of the deceased. Skipping over the deceased's own children to leave a large asset like a family home to a great niece is highly unusual. It is just not how these things are typically done. I have read a lot of wills and I've never seen one that handled the family home in this manner.

And here's some questions that were never answered: Who served as the witnesses to the will? Who produced the copy of the will after Thelma died? was the lawyer who wrote the will the same one who handled the disposition of the will?

The house was originally left to the two sisters (Thelma and Larla's grandmother) by their parents. Who knows what agreement they made when they inherited it. Obviously, only one lived there after they each got married. The house may have remained in both of their names. Fairness would dictate that the one who lived there (Thelma) owed something to the other one who moved out (Larla's grandmother), but we don't know how that was resolved. I doubt this all just happened when the will was drawn up in the lawyer's office.

Thelma left money to others as well in her will, and this important because it appears that she wanted to leave some of her wealth to all who mattered to her. Thelma may have told Mary that her stipend was coming out of her inheritance, and she may have been telling her that all along, but maybe Mary just tuned her out, thinking that the good times would last forever. We really don't know what went on or was said between Thelma and Mary. But it appears to me that Thelma's will was made when she was of sound mind and body, and she seemed to have given much thought to it. I think the family needs to respect and accept Thelma's final wishes -- especially Mary.

Somewhere back in this thread, Larla stated that Thelma had bought out the sister's half of the house and there was no agreement to give it back to the sister's side of the family.

Also, we really don't know that this will reflects Thelma's wishes. It's entirely possible that her sister had an influence on how the will was written since she was in the lawyer's office with Thelma when the will was done. I haven't seen evidence here that Thelma gave a lot of thought to her will, just that her sister took her to a lawyer's office to have it done about five years ago.

The issue here is not that Mary needs to be taken care of, but that the usual thing is for parents to pass on their family's assets to their children or possibly their grandchildren. It is rare to see a will that leaves a larger asset to a more distant relative like a great niece rather that the decedent's own children.
It is too bad that Mary and Roy did not get good legal advice about their mother's will.

I am aware that you think she is biased, but realistically, the OP is in a much better position to know Thelma's wishes than you are. Your insistence that her sister MUST have influenced her to write the will in a particular way is bizarre. I also think that your fixation on "great niece" is ignoring the actual relationship as described between these two people. For one thing, in addition to being a great niece, she is also Thelma's goddaughter. That relationship is, for many people, much closer than whatever the on-paper blood relationship is. I posted I-don't-even-know-how-many-pages-ago asking about the family's cultural background, and the OP's answer indicated to me that they come from a culture where extended family relationships are closer than in my WASP family. I saw my grandparents and aunts and cousins a couple times a year. We didn't communicate that regularly. We definitely didn't see each other regularly outside of holidays and special occasions. That's not the case with the OP's family. This is a family that remained close together geographically and close knit personally for decades. Saying "a more distant relative like a great niece" misunderstands this family's way of relating. Mary's adulting incompetence aside, I don't think it's out of the ordinary that Thelma left a substantial inheritance to her goddaughter at all, and I don't think you'd think it was that strange either, except that you are weirdly fixated on how Mary and Roy got screwed by Evil Gold Digger Grandma.

People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What questions, exactly, have I ignored?

If you mean the constant, "But WHY did she leave YOU the house instead of her kids?!?!?!"

The answer is that I DO NOT KNOW. I can guess it is because she has floated my cousin/godsister all this time and gave her some money and called it even

If this were a TV movie we were watching, I would say the answer to the question of why Thelma left the house to Larla goes back to the day Thelma and Larla's grandmother went to the lawyer together to have Thelma's will written. How interesting that when they left that office, Thelma's home was being left to her sister's granddaughter instead of her own two children. If this were a movie, I think a flashback to what happened in that lawyer's office would answer that question.

Sorry, I know you'd prefer not to have to think of it this way, but the way Thelma's assets were divided in her will is not at all common. It is much more common for an estate to be divided evenly among the children of the deceased. Skipping over the deceased's own children to leave a large asset like a family home to a great niece is highly unusual. It is just not how these things are typically done. I have read a lot of wills and I've never seen one that handled the family home in this manner.

And here's some questions that were never answered: Who served as the witnesses to the will? Who produced the copy of the will after Thelma died? was the lawyer who wrote the will the same one who handled the disposition of the will?

The house was originally left to the two sisters (Thelma and Larla's grandmother) by their parents. Who knows what agreement they made when they inherited it. Obviously, only one lived there after they each got married. The house may have remained in both of their names. Fairness would dictate that the one who lived there (Thelma) owed something to the other one who moved out (Larla's grandmother), but we don't know how that was resolved. I doubt this all just happened when the will was drawn up in the lawyer's office.

Thelma left money to others as well in her will, and this important because it appears that she wanted to leave some of her wealth to all who mattered to her. Thelma may have told Mary that her stipend was coming out of her inheritance, and she may have been telling her that all along, but maybe Mary just tuned her out, thinking that the good times would last forever. We really don't know what went on or was said between Thelma and Mary. But it appears to me that Thelma's will was made when she was of sound mind and body, and she seemed to have given much thought to it. I think the family needs to respect and accept Thelma's final wishes -- especially Mary.

Somewhere back in this thread, Larla stated that Thelma had bought out the sister's half of the house and there was no agreement to give it back to the sister's side of the family.

Also, we really don't know that this will reflects Thelma's wishes. It's entirely possible that her sister had an influence on how the will was written since she was in the lawyer's office with Thelma when the will was done. I haven't seen evidence here that Thelma gave a lot of thought to her will, just that her sister took her to a lawyer's office to have it done about five years ago.

The issue here is not that Mary needs to be taken care of, but that the usual thing is for parents to pass on their family's assets to their children or possibly their grandchildren. It is rare to see a will that leaves a larger asset to a more distant relative like a great niece rather that the decedent's own children.
It is too bad that Mary and Roy did not get good legal advice about their mother's will.

I am aware that you think she is biased, but realistically, the OP is in a much better position to know Thelma's wishes than you are. Your insistence that her sister MUST have influenced her to write the will in a particular way is bizarre. I also think that your fixation on "great niece" is ignoring the actual relationship as described between these two people. For one thing, in addition to being a great niece, she is also Thelma's goddaughter. That relationship is, for many people, much closer than whatever the on-paper blood relationship is. I posted I-don't-even-know-how-many-pages-ago asking about the family's cultural background, and the OP's answer indicated to me that they come from a culture where extended family relationships are closer than in my WASP family. I saw my grandparents and aunts and cousins a couple times a year. We didn't communicate that regularly. We definitely didn't see each other regularly outside of holidays and special occasions. That's not the case with the OP's family. This is a family that remained close together geographically and close knit personally for decades. Saying "a more distant relative like a great niece" misunderstands this family's way of relating. Mary's adulting incompetence aside, I don't think it's out of the ordinary that Thelma left a substantial inheritance to her goddaughter at all, and I don't think you'd think it was that strange either, except that you are weirdly fixated on how Mary and Roy got screwed by Evil Gold Digger Grandma.

People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.

And yet there are people who decide to make other decisions regarding their estate. Since you do not actually know any of the people in this situation, your insistence that something truly untoward must have happened in order for this situation to occur is strange. Almost like you do not want to believe it could possibly occur.

You have read a lot of wills, so the situation whereby Thelma is somehow coerced into bequeathing her daughter a house - one of many assets that Thelma was in possession of - seems unusual to you. I have worked with a lot of older people who are being used financially by adult children and other family members who do not wish to pay their own way in the world, so the situation where Mary is a moocher who is upset that her free ride is ending does not seem unusual to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What questions, exactly, have I ignored?

If you mean the constant, "But WHY did she leave YOU the house instead of her kids?!?!?!"

The answer is that I DO NOT KNOW. I can guess it is because she has floated my cousin/godsister all this time and gave her some money and called it even

If this were a TV movie we were watching, I would say the answer to the question of why Thelma left the house to Larla goes back to the day Thelma and Larla's grandmother went to the lawyer together to have Thelma's will written. How interesting that when they left that office, Thelma's home was being left to her sister's granddaughter instead of her own two children. If this were a movie, I think a flashback to what happened in that lawyer's office would answer that question.

Sorry, I know you'd prefer not to have to think of it this way, but the way Thelma's assets were divided in her will is not at all common. It is much more common for an estate to be divided evenly among the children of the deceased. Skipping over the deceased's own children to leave a large asset like a family home to a great niece is highly unusual. It is just not how these things are typically done. I have read a lot of wills and I've never seen one that handled the family home in this manner.

And here's some questions that were never answered: Who served as the witnesses to the will? Who produced the copy of the will after Thelma died? was the lawyer who wrote the will the same one who handled the disposition of the will?

The house was originally left to the two sisters (Thelma and Larla's grandmother) by their parents. Who knows what agreement they made when they inherited it. Obviously, only one lived there after they each got married. The house may have remained in both of their names. Fairness would dictate that the one who lived there (Thelma) owed something to the other one who moved out (Larla's grandmother), but we don't know how that was resolved. I doubt this all just happened when the will was drawn up in the lawyer's office.

Thelma left money to others as well in her will, and this important because it appears that she wanted to leave some of her wealth to all who mattered to her. Thelma may have told Mary that her stipend was coming out of her inheritance, and she may have been telling her that all along, but maybe Mary just tuned her out, thinking that the good times would last forever. We really don't know what went on or was said between Thelma and Mary. But it appears to me that Thelma's will was made when she was of sound mind and body, and she seemed to have given much thought to it. I think the family needs to respect and accept Thelma's final wishes -- especially Mary.

Somewhere back in this thread, Larla stated that Thelma had bought out the sister's half of the house and there was no agreement to give it back to the sister's side of the family.

Also, we really don't know that this will reflects Thelma's wishes. It's entirely possible that her sister had an influence on how the will was written since she was in the lawyer's office with Thelma when the will was done. I haven't seen evidence here that Thelma gave a lot of thought to her will, just that her sister took her to a lawyer's office to have it done about five years ago.

The issue here is not that Mary needs to be taken care of, but that the usual thing is for parents to pass on their family's assets to their children or possibly their grandchildren. It is rare to see a will that leaves a larger asset to a more distant relative like a great niece rather that the decedent's own children.
It is too bad that Mary and Roy did not get good legal advice about their mother's will.

PP here. I went back and re-read alll of OP's posts and saw no statement that Thelma paid her sister for half the house they inherited.

Maybe OP can shed some light on this.

[Anonymous]

People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.


If Thelma was a religious person, she probably took the fact that Larla was her GOD-DAUGHTER very seriously and treated her as if she was an actual daughter. Churches mandate that a godparent has a responsibility toward a godchild. Larla was not just some random distant relative. That was mentioned repeatedly in the thread, both by Larla and othr posters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

anonymous wrote:People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.

If Thelma was a religious person, she probably took the fact that Larla was her GOD-DAUGHTER very seriously and treated her as if she was an actual daughter. Churches mandate that a godparent has a responsibility toward a godchild. Larla was not just some random distant relative. That was mentioned repeatedly in the thread, both by Larla and othr posters.

Anyone who is so religious that they would consider a god-daughter the same as a daughter would not treat their own children worse than the god-daighter.

BTW, which religions mandate that a godchild be treated the same as one's own children? I am only familiar with religions that place responsibility for religious instruction on the godparents, so I am curious which religions put the heavier responsibility of the possibility of Godchildren becoming the same as your own children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

anonymous wrote:People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.

If Thelma was a religious person, she probably took the fact that Larla was her GOD-DAUGHTER very seriously and treated her as if she was an actual daughter. Churches mandate that a godparent has a responsibility toward a godchild. Larla was not just some random distant relative. That was mentioned repeatedly in the thread, both by Larla and othr posters.

Anyone who is so religious that they would consider a god-daughter the same as a daughter would not treat their own children worse than the god-daighter.

BTW, which religions mandate that a godchild be treated the same as one's own children? I am only familiar with religions that place responsibility for religious instruction on the godparents, so I am curious which religions put the heavier responsibility of the possibility of Godchildren becoming the same as your own children.

But has Mary really been treated "worse"? or even badly at all?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

anonymous wrote:People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.

If Thelma was a religious person, she probably took the fact that Larla was her GOD-DAUGHTER very seriously and treated her as if she was an actual daughter. Churches mandate that a godparent has a responsibility toward a godchild. Larla was not just some random distant relative. That was mentioned repeatedly in the thread, both by Larla and othr posters.

Anyone who is so religious that they would consider a god-daughter the same as a daughter would not treat their own children worse than the god-daighter.

BTW, which religions mandate that a godchild be treated the same as one's own children? I am only familiar with religions that place responsibility for religious instruction on the godparents, so I am curious which religions put the heavier responsibility of the possibility of Godchildren becoming the same as your own children.

But has Mary really been treated "worse"? or even badly at all?

Well, Mary received $100,000 and a car. Larla, Mary's first cousin once removed, received the family home that Mary grew up in. According to Larla, that home is worth about $400,000.

So, yes, from the information we've been given here, the great-niece/goddaughter has acquired far more monetary value from Thelma's will than Thelma's own daughter. Especially in this area, where housing is very expensive.

[Anonymous]

Well right now, we don't know if Thelma owed her sister anything for the house. That would certainly affect how she needed to distribute the assets.

Even if she didn't have to repay a debt on the house to Larla's grandmother, over the course of a lifetime, Mary received far, far more than Larla, and that's as it should be. Thelma delivered there. But as Thelma was facing her mortality, maybe she felt she needed to do more for her goddaughter. While religious doctrine stipulates the minimum responsibilities for godparents, no one stands in the way if a godparent wants to do more. Some people just want to go above and beyond. Cultural expectations also play a role in this family.

Faced with an argumentive and entitled daughter who seemed to give her endless grief (see OP's post on p.4) while given every advantage and a generous allowance well into adulthood, and a struggling and hard-working goddaughter at about the same age as as Thelma was when her parents died, leaving her alone to make her way in the world, I can see why Thelma may have wanted to give her a hand up in this world.

Some of us do not think Thelma's behavior is strange or unusual at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What questions, exactly, have I ignored?

If you mean the constant, "But WHY did she leave YOU the house instead of her kids?!?!?!"

The answer is that I DO NOT KNOW. I can guess it is because she has floated my cousin/godsister all this time and gave her some money and called it even

If this were a TV movie we were watching, I would say the answer to the question of why Thelma left the house to Larla goes back to the day Thelma and Larla's grandmother went to the lawyer together to have Thelma's will written. How interesting that when they left that office, Thelma's home was being left to her sister's granddaughter instead of her own two children. If this were a movie, I think a flashback to what happened in that lawyer's office would answer that question.

Sorry, I know you'd prefer not to have to think of it this way, but the way Thelma's assets were divided in her will is not at all common. It is much more common for an estate to be divided evenly among the children of the deceased. Skipping over the deceased's own children to leave a large asset like a family home to a great niece is highly unusual. It is just not how these things are typically done. I have read a lot of wills and I've never seen one that handled the family home in this manner.

And here's some questions that were never answered: Who served as the witnesses to the will? Who produced the copy of the will after Thelma died? was the lawyer who wrote the will the same one who handled the disposition of the will?

The house was originally left to the two sisters (Thelma and Larla's grandmother) by their parents. Who knows what agreement they made when they inherited it. Obviously, only one lived there after they each got married. The house may have remained in both of their names. Fairness would dictate that the one who lived there (Thelma) owed something to the other one who moved out (Larla's grandmother), but we don't know how that was resolved. I doubt this all just happened when the will was drawn up in the lawyer's office.

Thelma left money to others as well in her will, and this important because it appears that she wanted to leave some of her wealth to all who mattered to her. Thelma may have told Mary that her stipend was coming out of her inheritance, and she may have been telling her that all along, but maybe Mary just tuned her out, thinking that the good times would last forever. We really don't know what went on or was said between Thelma and Mary. But it appears to me that Thelma's will was made when she was of sound mind and body, and she seemed to have given much thought to it. I think the family needs to respect and accept Thelma's final wishes -- especially Mary.

Somewhere back in this thread, Larla stated that Thelma had bought out the sister's half of the house and there was no agreement to give it back to the sister's side of the family.

Also, we really don't know that this will reflects Thelma's wishes. It's entirely possible that her sister had an influence on how the will was written since she was in the lawyer's office with Thelma when the will was done. I haven't seen evidence here that Thelma gave a lot of thought to her will, just that her sister took her to a lawyer's office to have it done about five years ago.

The issue here is not that Mary needs to be taken care of, but that the usual thing is for parents to pass on their family's assets to their children or possibly their grandchildren. It is rare to see a will that leaves a larger asset to a more distant relative like a great niece rather that the decedent's own children.
It is too bad that Mary and Roy did not get good legal advice about their mother's will.

I am aware that you think she is biased, but realistically, the OP is in a much better position to know Thelma's wishes than you are. Your insistence that her sister MUST have influenced her to write the will in a particular way is bizarre. I also think that your fixation on "great niece" is ignoring the actual relationship as described between these two people. For one thing, in addition to being a great niece, she is also Thelma's goddaughter. That relationship is, for many people, much closer than whatever the on-paper blood relationship is. I posted I-don't-even-know-how-many-pages-ago asking about the family's cultural background, and the OP's answer indicated to me that they come from a culture where extended family relationships are closer than in my WASP family. I saw my grandparents and aunts and cousins a couple times a year. We didn't communicate that regularly. We definitely didn't see each other regularly outside of holidays and special occasions. That's not the case with the OP's family. This is a family that remained close together geographically and close knit personally for decades. Saying "a more distant relative like a great niece" misunderstands this family's way of relating. Mary's adulting incompetence aside, I don't think it's out of the ordinary that Thelma left a substantial inheritance to her goddaughter at all, and I don't think you'd think it was that strange either, except that you are weirdly fixated on how Mary and Roy got screwed by Evil Gold Digger Grandma.

People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.

Just stop writing the same shit over and over again.

Good God - if you don't have something new to say - be a broken record somewhere else.

The fact is very simple - you DON'T know - and you make wild accusations and assumptions.

Like the PP before you said - the relationship between Larla and Thelma has been exhaustively described as much closer than Mary and Thelma. Thelma looked at Larla like she was the daughter she wished she had - going to college, working full time, having a bright future, appreciative, etc... while her own daughter was a lazy, entitled, mooch.

OF COURSE SHE LEFT EVERYTHING TO LARLA - I would have. I would have been pissed that my daughter never accomplished a thing, was lazy, entitled, and I had to pay for her whole life and live with her for my whole life... The only difference, is that I would have told her. And quite frankly, Thelma could very well have told Mary - we DON'T KNOW. Maybe Mary just hears what she wants to hear, which wouldn't be a stretch either.

Regardless, the will was written, it was carried out, Larla has possession of the house, is kicking Mary out, and it's done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

anonymous wrote:People can be influenced in ways that don't involve being dragged and held at gun point. We have heard this story only from one side and, as with any story, it might look very different when told from another side.

I have read a lot of wills and most of them with the level of assets involved in the situation recounted here leave everything to the children of the couple, to be divided equally. Leaving large bequests to people outside the nuclear family is not common, particularly when those amounts are larger than those left to the decedent's own children.

If Thelma was a religious person, she probably took the fact that Larla was her GOD-DAUGHTER very seriously and treated her as if she was an actual daughter. Churches mandate that a godparent has a responsibility toward a godchild. Larla was not just some random distant relative. That was mentioned repeatedly in the thread, both by Larla and othr posters.

Anyone who is so religious that they would consider a god-daughter the same as a daughter would not treat their own children worse than the god-daighter.

BTW, which religions mandate that a godchild be treated the same as one's own children? I am only familiar with religions that place responsibility for religious instruction on the godparents, so I am curious which religions put the heavier responsibility of the possibility of Godchildren becoming the same as your own children.

But has Mary really been treated "worse"? or even badly at all?

Well, Mary received $100,000 and a car. Larla, Mary's first cousin once removed, received the family home that Mary grew up in. According to Larla, that home is worth about $400,000.

So, yes, from the information we've been given here, the great-niece/goddaughter has acquired far more monetary value from Thelma's will than Thelma's own daughter. Especially in this area, where housing is very expensive.

You are forgetting the fact that Mary has also been receiving a stipend from her mother her WHOLE LIFE, free housing, food, etc...

As a parent, I would have kicked my child out of my house a long time ago. What Thelma did for her child is way beyond what she should have done or been responsible for doing.

Children, are supposed to become adults and then lead their own lives.

Parents are supposed to be able to have their own lives as well, without being mooched off of by their 50 year old daughters.

Nothing confusing or weird about this to me.

Mary got what she deserved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well right now, we don't know if Thelma owed her sister anything for the house. That would certainly affect how she needed to distribute the assets.

Even if she didn't have to repay a debt on the house to Larla's grandmother, over the course of a lifetime, Mary received far, far more than Larla, and that's as it should be. Thelma delivered there. But as Thelma was facing her mortality, maybe she felt she needed to do more for her goddaughter. While religious doctrine stipulates the minimum responsibilities for godparents, no one stands in the way if a godparent wants to do more. Some people just want to go above and beyond. Cultural expectations also play a role in this family.

Faced with an argumentive and entitled daughter who seemed to give her endless grief (see OP's post on p.4) while given every advantage and a generous allowance well into adulthood, and a struggling and hard-working goddaughter at about the same age as as Thelma was when her parents died, leaving her alone to make her way in the world, I can see why Thelma may have wanted to give her a hand up in this world.

Some of us do not think Thelma's behavior is strange or unusual at all.

I think you'd be correct in stating that MOST of us feel the exact same way.

It seems the ONE poster who keeps clumping "Mary & Roy" together over & over & OVER again seems to have her own family dynamic issues & is perpetuating them onto Larla (especially since the OP has said REPEATEDLY that Roy wants absolutely NOTHING to do with this house & in fact, Roy is taking LARLA'S side & feels Mary should be kicked out!).

If Larla's grandmother was SO dubious that she influenced her sister, wouldn't Roy have had some MAJOR objection to the will in all of this?

The answer is HELL YES!

So the fact that Roy is on-board with everything, he does NOT want a share of the house AND agrees that his sister needs to be kicked to the curb, says everything I need to know right there.

Let's play devils advocate, ok?
Even if Roy hated Mary & was thrilled she was getting the boot, he'd still want his share of the house if he thought that it was bequeathed in a dubious manner, right??

The fact is he didn't & he DOESN'T... so SHUT UP about "Mary & Roy" already & stop projecting your messed up family dynamic on Larla.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well right now, we don't know if Thelma owed her sister anything for the house. That would certainly affect how she needed to distribute the assets.

Even if she didn't have to repay a debt on the house to Larla's grandmother, over the course of a lifetime, Mary received far, far more than Larla, and that's as it should be. Thelma delivered there. But as Thelma was facing her mortality, maybe she felt she needed to do more for her goddaughter. While religious doctrine stipulates the minimum responsibilities for godparents, no one stands in the way if a godparent wants to do more. Some people just want to go above and beyond. Cultural expectations also play a role in this family.

Faced with an argumentive and entitled daughter who seemed to give her endless grief (see OP's post on p.4) while given every advantage and a generous allowance well into adulthood, and a struggling and hard-working goddaughter at about the same age as as Thelma was when her parents died, leaving her alone to make her way in the world, I can see why Thelma may have wanted to give her a hand up in this world.

Some of us do not think Thelma's behavior is strange or unusual at all.

I think you'd be correct in stating that MOST of us feel the exact same way.

It seems the ONE poster who keeps clumping "Mary & Roy" together over & over & OVER again seems to have her own family dynamic issues & is perpetuating them onto Larla (especially since the OP has said REPEATEDLY that Roy wants absolutely NOTHING to do with this house & in fact, Roy is taking LARLA'S side & feels Mary should be kicked out!).

If Larla's grandmother was SO dubious that she influenced her sister, wouldn't Roy have had some MAJOR objection to the will in all of this?

The answer is HELL YES!

So the fact that Roy is on-board with everything, he does NOT want a share of the house AND agrees that his sister needs to be kicked to the curb, says everything I need to know right there.

Let's play devils advocate, ok?
Even if Roy hated Mary & was thrilled she was getting the boot, he'd still want his share of the house if he thought that it was bequeathed in a dubious manner, right??

The fact is he didn't & he DOESN'T... so SHUT UP about "Mary & Roy" already & stop projecting your messed up family dynamic on Larla.

Amen! Perfectly explained - thank you!
I want to see the lone "MaRoy" advocate explain why Roy isn't up in arms with his evil Aunts manipulative plot, Bwahaha!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well right now, we don't know if Thelma owed her sister anything for the house. That would certainly affect how she needed to distribute the assets.

Even if she didn't have to repay a debt on the house to Larla's grandmother, over the course of a lifetime, Mary received far, far more than Larla, and that's as it should be. Thelma delivered there. But as Thelma was facing her mortality, maybe she felt she needed to do more for her goddaughter. While religious doctrine stipulates the minimum responsibilities for godparents, no one stands in the way if a godparent wants to do more. Some people just want to go above and beyond. Cultural expectations also play a role in this family.

Faced with an argumentive and entitled daughter who seemed to give her endless grief (see OP's post on p.4) while given every advantage and a generous allowance well into adulthood, and a struggling and hard-working goddaughter at about the same age as as Thelma was when her parents died, leaving her alone to make her way in the world, I can see why Thelma may have wanted to give her a hand up in this world.

Some of us do not think Thelma's behavior is strange or unusual at all.

I think you'd be correct in stating that MOST of us feel the exact same way.

It seems the ONE poster who keeps clumping "Mary & Roy" together over & over & OVER again seems to have her own family dynamic issues & is perpetuating them onto Larla (especially since the OP has said REPEATEDLY that Roy wants absolutely NOTHING to do with this house & in fact, Roy is taking LARLA'S side & feels Mary should be kicked out!).

If Larla's grandmother was SO dubious that she influenced her sister, wouldn't Roy have had some MAJOR objection to the will in all of this?

The answer is HELL YES!

So the fact that Roy is on-board with everything, he does NOT want a share of the house AND agrees that his sister needs to be kicked to the curb, says everything I need to know right there.

Let's play devils advocate, ok?
Even if Roy hated Mary & was thrilled she was getting the boot, he'd still want his share of the house if he thought that it was bequeathed in a dubious manner, right??

The fact is he didn't & he DOESN'T... so SHUT UP about "Mary & Roy" already & stop projecting your messed up family dynamic on Larla.

Amen! Perfectly explained - thank you!
I want to see the lone "MaRoy" advocate explain why Roy isn't up in arms with his evil Aunts manipulative plot, Bwahaha!

+1

Roy has his own life and could care less because he probably understands his mother's thinking. I am sure Roy understands his own mother's thinking much better than some internet stranger who can't get over their own family issues.

In fact, the ONLY thing that I think Roy is worried about is Mary trying to crash with him!