WWYD? DD doesn't want to apply for AAP

[Anonymous]

The title says it all. DD went so far as to say that she would purposely do badly on the re-take of the Cogat. She says it will be more work, she doesn't want to do more work, and she already does get frustrated sometimes even with having little work that is easy for her. The gen. ed class this year (4th grade) and last year (3rd) have been easy, and AAP would be a challenge, I think DD is somewhere in between gen. ed and AAP. I'm concerned that by not taking AAP, that some doors will be closed in the future, like math in high school. Also, DD's older sister is in AAP, and she is doing great. On the other hand, if DD is not mature enough yet for harder work, even if she could do it, maybe she shouldn't. Thoughts?

[Anonymous]

I have kind of a similar situation but my child is in 5th. I can see both sides of the coin b/c my kids will turn down all kinds of things just b/c they like what they know -- so I don't give 100% decision making authority to them. On the other hand, as a child gets older, I think it is right to listen to what they are telling us about their interests and motivation.

Teasing out how far to push and how far to let them blaze their own path is the trick of parenting. As I said, my child is a year older and I think that is significant -- not b/c she has so much more insight, but b/c my child would only have one year at the AAP center and then on to JH. I feel like 6th grade is the "victory lap" year and a kid should feel like he/she is a big deal for that year. So, I hate to take that away from my child since she would be going to a new school. But, that is not the only reason... and it would not be enough of a reason to stay at the base school. My point, however, is that if you are going to switch her, do it for 5th grade -- do not tell yourself that you can always switch next year (when she would be in 6th).

Like your DD, OP, mine does not want extra challenges at school. She is capable, but her personality is such that she is more prone to quit or give up rather than try when she meets a roadblock. My younger child who is at a center would say that he doesn't want extra challenges either (i.e. more work!???) but his personality is different. He has a lot of confidence in his abilities (sometimes more than is warranted), but he generally likes challenges.

I don't think you should be worried about doors closing just b/c she isn't in AAP. Is she taking adv. math now? If not, is it offered? I don't think it is going derail anyone's future if they take Algebra in 8th grade vs. 7th grade. In fact, it might very well be preferable to take it in 8th grade.

No one on this board is going to be able to tell you for sure one way or the other. It may be worth having her tested just to see how she does and then you have it ready if you decide to refer her. Kids can be fickle and not like something this week, but six months later have a completely different opinion.

But, I can totally understand your quandry. She probably could go either way with it. Know that you won't be making a "wrong" choice either way.

[Anonymous]

Sounds lazy and probably not fit for the program.

[Anonymous]

It isn't a one time only admission. She can apply later. Does your school offer compacted math or whatever it is that they are calling it now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds lazy and probably not fit for the program.

you are such a jerk... clearly you know nothing about child psychology or even education in general.

I'm the PP. My child (who is not in AAP), was placed in Adv. Math. She struggled with it and resisted it. After one quarter of dealing with her breakdowns and "it's too hard" and "I can't..." and "I'm not good at math!" etc., I called a conf. with the math teacher and regular teacher. After hearing me say "I don't think this is right for my child." They calmly told me "she wasn't even a close case" for putting her in Adv. Math. From then on, I decided to take myself out of the homework process and told DD to just put "I don't know how to do this" on her homework when she didn't know how to do it so that the teacher would know. Well, fast forward two years and she has risen to the challenge (despite herself). Not only has she held her own in Adv. Math, but SHE sees herself as "good at math even though I don't really like it."

THAT is HUGE! By not giving into her complaints and self-doubt, she has gained the self-image of one who is quite good in math -- as well as the skills to back it up. There is something to be said for pushing kids (and helping them as well) -- b/c in reality, I think there are MANY more kids who could do the AAP/Advanced Math programs than are given the opportunity. Fixed thinking like yours 13:17 -- is the opposite of "gifted thinking."

OP -- I'm definitely NOT saying that you should send her. It's a fine balance b/t push and pull.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The title says it all. DD went so far as to say that she would purposely do badly on the re-take of the Cogat. She says it will be more work, she doesn't want to do more work, and she already does get frustrated sometimes even with having little work that is easy for her. The gen. ed class this year (4th grade) and last year (3rd) have been easy, and AAP would be a challenge, I think DD is somewhere in between gen. ed and AAP. I'm concerned that by not taking AAP, that some doors will be closed in the future, like math in high school. Also, DD's older sister is in AAP, and she is doing great. On the other hand, if DD is not mature enough yet for harder work, even if she could do it, maybe she shouldn't. Thoughts?

I wouldn't push. If she fall between AAP and GE, she'll have plenty of peers in GEN ED. Don't buy into the hysteria. NO MATH DOORS will be closed to her if she isn't in AAP. My non-AAP kid did algebra in 7th and geometry in 8th and is doing the same math in high school as his AAP brother, who ran out of high level math classes by his senior year.

The people who talk about push, push, pushing on this thread are usually folks with younger kids who know NOTHING or from cultures that over-stress academics because historically the options for all but the highest achieving were so limited. Better a child be happy and comfortable at her/his elementary school like many of my kids' AAP qualified friends who chose to stay at local schools (and are now indistinguishable from most AAP kids in HS, btw). There's plenty of stress down the road in HS and beyond without laying the hammer down on kids and preteens.

Your daughter is young and will find the things that interest her and her challenges when she is ready. Smart kids don't lose intelligence because they're not pushed -- in fact many of them learn quite a bit on their own, which is really what you want to teach anyway. I've had two in general ed, who I'm sure lots of people would have angled to get into AAP, but they were happy just where they were. One is getting straight As in honor classes in middle school, the other doing great in his IB program.

IMO, parents need to resist passing on their anxiety that their kids are missing out on some secret formula for learning if they're not in AAP. Sometimes, I feel like it's the parents who weren't standout students themselves who stress the most. I get that, but like the frustrated athlete trying to live through his/her kid (as I've been guilty of becoming on occasion ), it's worth learning to just support your kid in who they are and let go.

[Anonymous]

As the others have said, math doors will not be closed whether a child is in AAP or not. Remember, everything starts over in 9th grade. Anyone can take honors or AP and plenty of kids who were never in AAP are every bit as successful in high school as kids who came up through AAP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The title says it all. DD went so far as to say that she would purposely do badly on the re-take of the Cogat. She says it will be more work, she doesn't want to do more work, and she already does get frustrated sometimes even with having little work that is easy for her. The gen. ed class this year (4th grade) and last year (3rd) have been easy, and AAP would be a challenge, I think DD is somewhere in between gen. ed and AAP. I'm concerned that by not taking AAP, that some doors will be closed in the future, like math in high school. Also, DD's older sister is in AAP, and she is doing great. On the other hand, if DD is not mature enough yet for harder work, even if she could do it, maybe she shouldn't. Thoughts?

If it were my family, I would not push her whatsoever. You have a child who is saying she will sabotage the CogAT AND a mother who is saying she is somewhere b/w ged. ed. and AAP. You can't force her to do well on the CogAT - it is like forcing a 2.5 year old to use the potty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As the others have said, math doors will not be closed whether a child is in AAP or not. Remember, everything starts over in 9th grade. Anyone can take honors or AP and plenty of kids who were never in AAP are every bit as successful in high school as kids who came up through AAP.

Math doors may not be closed but they are more likely to be opened for a child who is in AAP.

It is not a good thing to encourage mediocrity in children who have the capability to do better.

[Anonymous]

Our DS said the same thing to us early in the fall. Luckily we didn't talk much about it or tell him when the test was. Thus he had no idea that he'd taken that particular test. I don't believe the teachers made any announcements about what test it was. He knew about AAP from his older sister and didn't think he wanted to switch schools. He did end up wanting to switch by the end of the year and after he was accepted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As the others have said, math doors will not be closed whether a child is in AAP or not. Remember, everything starts over in 9th grade. Anyone can take honors or AP and plenty of kids who were never in AAP are every bit as successful in high school as kids who came up through AAP.

Math doors may not be closed but they are more likely to be opened for a child who is in AAP.

It is not a good thing to encourage mediocrity in children who have the capability to do better.

Glad you're not my parent. 1. you're wrong about math --a smart math kid will get into all the higher math he/she wants. it's not a race, it's about readiness. and I've seen plenty of AAP kids have to retake algebra or geometry in middle school -- so much for their big advantage.

2. Gen. Ed isn't mediocrity in one of the top school systems in the country. Sounds like your kids can't excel without constant pressure and being put in an advanced group to push them along. Intelligence doesn't wilt and die as long as kids are challenged or learn to challenge themselves. I am so sick of posters fanning the" AAP or life fail" flames because of their own insecurity/ignorance.

Please walk, don't run to find a video of Race to Nowhere

Oh, and I had a kid in GT, btw. DC would have done fine either way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As the others have said, math doors will not be closed whether a child is in AAP or not. Remember, everything starts over in 9th grade. Anyone can take honors or AP and plenty of kids who were never in AAP are every bit as successful in high school as kids who came up through AAP.

Math doors may not be closed but they are more likely to be opened for a child who is in AAP.

It is not a good thing to encourage mediocrity in children who have the capability to do better.

Glad you're not my parent. 1. you're wrong about math --a smart math kid will get into all the higher math he/she wants. it's not a race, it's about readiness. and I've seen plenty of AAP kids have to retake algebra or geometry in middle school -- so much for their big advantage.

2. Gen. Ed isn't mediocrity in one of the top school systems in the country. Sounds like your kids can't excel without constant pressure and being put in an advanced group to push them along. Intelligence doesn't wilt and die as long as kids are challenged or learn to challenge themselves. I am so sick of posters fanning the" AAP or life fail" flames because of their own insecurity/ignorance.

Please walk, don't run to find a video of Race to Nowhere

Oh, and I had a kid in GT, btw. DC would have done fine either way.

I am sorry to say you are clueless; this is nothing to do with "fanning the flames" ......... and one does not need to constantly pressure kids. But encouraging mediocrity is an outright disservice to a bright kid. But believe whatever you will.

And as far having a kid in GT, big fricking deal!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
As the others have said, math doors will not be closed whether a child is in AAP or not. Remember, everything starts over in 9th grade. Anyone can take honors or AP and plenty of kids who were never in AAP are every bit as successful in high school as kids who came up through [i]AAP.


Math doors may not be closed but they are more likely to be opened for a child who is in AAP.

It is not a good thing to encourage mediocrity in children who have the capability to do better.



Not sure why anyone thinks that post encourages mediocrity. If anything, it should offer peace of mind that just because an elementary aged child may not be ready or desire AAP, once they reach high school they will have the same opportunities to pursue and achieve success in advanced curriculums. Also not sure why there is a perception that not being in AAP limits math opportunities. Our DD went through AAP but her elementary school offered compacted math for non AAP kids so they had the same opportunity for the advanced math track. Ours is a high school senior now and her AP classes are filled with successful students some who went through AAP and plenty who didn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The title says it all. DD went so far as to say that she would purposely do badly on the re-take of the Cogat. She says it will be more work, she doesn't want to do more work, and she already does get frustrated sometimes even with having little work that is easy for her. The gen. ed class this year (4th grade) and last year (3rd) have been easy, and AAP would be a challenge, I think DD is somewhere in between gen. ed and AAP. I'm concerned that by not taking AAP, that some doors will be closed in the future, like math in high school. Also, DD's older sister is in AAP, and she is doing great. On the other hand, if DD is not mature enough yet for harder work, even if she could do it, maybe she shouldn't. Thoughts?

I wouldn't push. If she fall between AAP and GE, she'll have plenty of peers in GEN ED. Don't buy into the hysteria. NO MATH DOORS will be closed to her if she isn't in AAP. My non-AAP kid did algebra in 7th and geometry in 8th and is doing the same math in high school as his AAP brother, who ran out of high level math classes by his senior year.

The people who talk about push, push, pushing on this thread are usually folks with younger kids who know NOTHING or from cultures that over-stress academics because historically the options for all but the highest achieving were so limited. Better a child be happy and comfortable at her/his elementary school like many of my kids' AAP qualified friends who chose to stay at local schools (and are now indistinguishable from most AAP kids in HS, btw). There's plenty of stress down the road in HS and beyond without laying the hammer down on kids and preteens.

Your daughter is young and will find the things that interest her and her challenges when she is ready. Smart kids don't lose intelligence because they're not pushed -- in fact many of them learn quite a bit on their own, which is really what you want to teach anyway. I've had two in general ed, who I'm sure lots of people would have angled to get into AAP, but they were happy just where they were. One is getting straight As in honor classes in middle school, the other doing great in his IB program.

IMO, parents need to resist passing on their anxiety that their kids are missing out on some secret formula for learning if they're not in AAP. Sometimes, I feel like it's the parents who weren't standout students themselves who stress the most. I get that, but like the frustrated athlete trying to live through his/her kid (as I've been guilty of becoming on occasion ), it's worth learning to just support your kid in who they are and let go.

Absolutely true, especially the part about AAP and GenEd kids being indistinguishable once in high school. It's too bad so many parents of younger kids believe all this absurd AAP hype.

[Anonymous]

Do not push her. She is telling you that the AAP would be stressful and a strain for her. Don't push her to satisfy some goals YOU have for her.