Why is Blake Lively so overrated?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BL and JB are both so messy. I’m embarrassed for them that this is all being fought so publicly. Neither of them come off as very sympathetic to me. They need to go do private mediation and take a break from the spotlight.

Nah. She went to the NYT. He’s going to wind up humiliating Lively and Reynolds, is my guess — and the twist is this would never have crossed Baldoni’s mind but for their attacks. Oh well!

Totally agree. This is the point his lawyer made, too. If she hadn't attacked, no one ever would have known how badly she behaved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BL and JB are both so messy. I’m embarrassed for them that this is all being fought so publicly. Neither of them come off as very sympathetic to me. They need to go do private mediation and take a break from the spotlight.

Nah. She went to the NYT. He’s going to wind up humiliating Lively and Reynolds, is my guess — and the twist is this would never have crossed Baldoni’s mind but for their attacks. Oh well!

Totally agree. This is the point his lawyer made, too. If she hadn't attacked, no one ever would have known how badly she behaved.

I don't get this though. Didn't he "attack" first? I thought the only reason she filed the complaint is because they found out he hired a PR firm over the summer to attack her in the press. I thought that's what started the whole thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BL and JB are both so messy. I’m embarrassed for them that this is all being fought so publicly. Neither of them come off as very sympathetic to me. They need to go do private mediation and take a break from the spotlight.

Nah. She went to the NYT. He’s going to wind up humiliating Lively and Reynolds, is my guess — and the twist is this would never have crossed Baldoni’s mind but for their attacks. Oh well!

This. No one really knew him before, sure some did from the tv show and his podcast, but he is not well known. Blake and Ryan will be humiliated and the hit to their egos will be devastating for them.

I'm curious how people think they are going to be humiliated or destroyed or whatever.

Ryan, in particular, is going to be totally unscathed. At worst, he will be seen as sticking up for his wife. I've seen this before, actually, with an overzealous husband going after someone he thought wronged his wife -- people eat it up. It will play right into Ryan's existing public persona. I think he's in zero danger.

With Lively I'll be curious how this whole thing impacts the release of A Simple Favor 2. It doesn't have a release date yet and they claim that fact is unrelated to what's going on with Lively in the press but I doubt they are ignoring. But I think if we ultimately see Lively palling around with Anna Kendrick at the premiere of that movie, she'll probably escape pretty unimpacted. Who knows, maybe interest in this thing with Baldoni will boost interest in that movie -- It Ends With Us probably benefited from the controversy a bit. Even if Lively winds up being someone people "love to hate," it could work out for her.

I think Baldoni has way more to lose than anyone else involved here. Like you said, he was a no one before this. If I had to bet, he'll wind up defined by this controversy.

Regardless of the truth, I think he probably should have played along and gotten through it. Then he'd just be that guy who was in that one movie with Blake Lively and hey, didn't he direct it too? That would be a much better situation for him.

I think he had to defend the allegations or he’d never work again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BL and JB are both so messy. I’m embarrassed for them that this is all being fought so publicly. Neither of them come off as very sympathetic to me. They need to go do private mediation and take a break from the spotlight.

Nah. She went to the NYT. He’s going to wind up humiliating Lively and Reynolds, is my guess — and the twist is this would never have crossed Baldoni’s mind but for their attacks. Oh well!

This. No one really knew him before, sure some did from the tv show and his podcast, but he is not well known. Blake and Ryan will be humiliated and the hit to their egos will be devastating for them.

I'm curious how people think they are going to be humiliated or destroyed or whatever.

Ryan, in particular, is going to be totally unscathed. At worst, he will be seen as sticking up for his wife. I've seen this before, actually, with an overzealous husband going after someone he thought wronged his wife -- people eat it up. It will play right into Ryan's existing public persona. I think he's in zero danger.

With Lively I'll be curious how this whole thing impacts the release of A Simple Favor 2. It doesn't have a release date yet and they claim that fact is unrelated to what's going on with Lively in the press but I doubt they are ignoring. But I think if we ultimately see Lively palling around with Anna Kendrick at the premiere of that movie, she'll probably escape pretty unimpacted. Who knows, maybe interest in this thing with Baldoni will boost interest in that movie -- It Ends With Us probably benefited from the controversy a bit. Even if Lively winds up being someone people "love to hate," it could work out for her.

I think Baldoni has way more to lose than anyone else involved here. Like you said, he was a no one before this. If I had to bet, he'll wind up defined by this controversy.

Regardless of the truth, I think he probably should have played along and gotten through it. Then he'd just be that guy who was in that one movie with Blake Lively and hey, didn't he direct it too? That would be a much better situation for him.

I think he had to defend the allegations or he’d never work again.

I agree. He had to defend his reputation or risk his livelihood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From a legal perspective, does it even matter if he harassed her? Is her just saying
she felt uncomfortable (even in hindsight) enough to say he can’t then “retaliate”?

I’m asking because I don’t understand if any of this matters.

So I’m not fully up on the case law, but in general, no, the underlying harassment claim does not have to be proven in order to give rise to a retaliation claim. The point of retaliation protections is to ensure that people are not dissuaded or punished for complaints. That said, the timeline and other motivations do matter, as does a real absence of merit in her underlying complaint.

I started out with the opinion that the retaliation case is very strong - in general it is really hard for anyone not to retaliate somewhat after being the subject of a complaint, and there are myriad cases where the complaint was weak but the retaliation was strong. But now it looks a LOT more muddy to me. In particular it looks like the underlying complaint might be wholly unreasonable. And Baldoni’s actions were reacting against her undermining him, not the complaint.

All of this. I also initially thought her retaliation claim was very strong, but yes - it's starting to look like her underlying complaint is not reasonable or credible at all, and that gives credibility to the reddit theory that Blake was about to file bogus sexual harassment claims. That said, maybe her other claims are more meritorious, but this one is so blatant that it casts her credibility seriously into doubt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BL and JB are both so messy. I’m embarrassed for them that this is all being fought so publicly. Neither of them come off as very sympathetic to me. They need to go do private mediation and take a break from the spotlight.

Nah. She went to the NYT. He’s going to wind up humiliating Lively and Reynolds, is my guess — and the twist is this would never have crossed Baldoni’s mind but for their attacks. Oh well!

This. No one really knew him before, sure some did from the tv show and his podcast, but he is not well known. Blake and Ryan will be humiliated and the hit to their egos will be devastating for them.

I'm curious how people think they are going to be humiliated or destroyed or whatever.

Ryan, in particular, is going to be totally unscathed. At worst, he will be seen as sticking up for his wife. I've seen this before, actually, with an overzealous husband going after someone he thought wronged his wife -- people eat it up. It will play right into Ryan's existing public persona. I think he's in zero danger.

With Lively I'll be curious how this whole thing impacts the release of A Simple Favor 2. It doesn't have a release date yet and they claim that fact is unrelated to what's going on with Lively in the press but I doubt they are ignoring. But I think if we ultimately see Lively palling around with Anna Kendrick at the premiere of that movie, she'll probably escape pretty unimpacted. Who knows, maybe interest in this thing with Baldoni will boost interest in that movie -- It Ends With Us probably benefited from the controversy a bit. Even if Lively winds up being someone people "love to hate," it could work out for her.

I think Baldoni has way more to lose than anyone else involved here. Like you said, he was a no one before this. If I had to bet, he'll wind up defined by this controversy.

Regardless of the truth, I think he probably should have played along and gotten through it. Then he'd just be that guy who was in that one movie with Blake Lively and hey, didn't he direct it too? That would be a much better situation for him.

I think he had to defend the allegations or he’d never work again.

But he would never have had allegations to defend if he hadn't launched the PR attack. If he hadn't done that, they'd have no retaliation case, and it's unlikely she would have brought a lawsuit just on the basis of harassment, IMO.

[Anonymous]

I still want to know why his podcast host quit immediately and without comment when her complaint came out. Like it was instant. They've worked together for several years and the whole point of the podcast is that they talk about feminism and relationships and harassment issues.

What does Liz Plank know that the rest of us don't?

[Anonymous]

^ should say co-host

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From a legal perspective, does it even matter if he harassed her? Is her just saying
she felt uncomfortable (even in hindsight) enough to say he can’t then “retaliate”?

I’m asking because I don’t understand if any of this matters.

So I’m not fully up on the case law, but in general, no, the underlying harassment claim does not have to be proven in order to give rise to a retaliation claim. The point of retaliation protections is to ensure that people are not dissuaded or punished for complaints. That said, the timeline and other motivations do matter, as does a real absence of merit in her underlying complaint.

I started out with the opinion that the retaliation case is very strong - in general it is really hard for anyone not to retaliate somewhat after being the subject of a complaint, and there are myriad cases where the complaint was weak but the retaliation was strong. But now it looks a LOT more muddy to me. In particular it looks like the underlying complaint might be wholly unreasonable. And Baldoni’s actions were reacting against her undermining him, not the complaint.

All of this. I also initially thought her retaliation claim was very strong, but yes - it's starting to look like her underlying complaint is not reasonable or credible at all, and that gives credibility to the reddit theory that Blake was about to file bogus sexual harassment claims. That said, maybe her other claims are more meritorious, but this one is so blatant that it casts her credibility seriously into doubt.

I don't see that this footage undermines her claims. They might still be BS, but these clips don't disprove what she said. I think it's still an open question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I still want to know why his podcast host quit immediately and without comment when her complaint came out. Like it was instant. They've worked together for several years and the whole point of the podcast is that they talk about feminism and relationships and harassment issues.

What does Liz Plank know that the rest of us don't?

I don't support him, but I don't think that supports his guilt. People get cancelled over stuff like this. The podcaster may not want to deal with comments asking why they support an (alleged) abuser. It may be that Baldoni is kind of creepy and the podcaster doesn't know whether the allegations were true but couldn't rule them out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still want to know why his podcast host quit immediately and without comment when her complaint came out. Like it was instant. They've worked together for several years and the whole point of the podcast is that they talk about feminism and relationships and harassment issues.

What does Liz Plank know that the rest of us don't?

I don't support him, but I don't think that supports his guilt. People get cancelled over stuff like this. The podcaster may not want to deal with comments asking why they support an (alleged) abuser. It may be that Baldoni is kind of creepy and the podcaster doesn't know whether the allegations were true but couldn't rule them out.

Agree it could be any of the above. Given their working relationship and the content of the podcast, I'm surprised she's been completely silent on this and wonder if she knows something either way.

Also Jamey Heath was also a co-host on the podcast and Plank worked with both of them. When Baldoni was filming It Ends With Us, Plank and Heath did episodes just the two of them.

So she knows both these men fairly well. As a result, I find it odd she quit instantly (instead of taking a leave of absence or just saying they were hitting pause on the podcast) and hasn't said anything at all in defense of either of them. Not saying that means they are guilty, but it doesn't look *good*.

[Anonymous]

As a result, I find it odd she quit instantly (instead of taking a leave of absence or just saying they were hitting pause on the podcast) and hasn't said anything at all in defense of either of them. Not saying that means they are guilty, but it doesn't look *good*.

That's fair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still want to know why his podcast host quit immediately and without comment when her complaint came out. Like it was instant. They've worked together for several years and the whole point of the podcast is that they talk about feminism and relationships and harassment issues.

What does Liz Plank know that the rest of us don't?

I don't support him, but I don't think that supports his guilt. People get cancelled over stuff like this. The podcaster may not want to deal with comments asking why they support an (alleged) abuser. It may be that Baldoni is kind of creepy and the podcaster doesn't know whether the allegations were true but couldn't rule them out.

Agree it could be any of the above. Given their working relationship and the content of the podcast, I'm surprised she's been completely silent on this and wonder if she knows something either way.

Also Jamey Heath was also a co-host on the podcast and Plank worked with both of them. When Baldoni was filming It Ends With Us, Plank and Heath did episodes just the two of them.

So she knows both these men fairly well. As a result, I find it odd she quit instantly (instead of taking a leave of absence or just saying they were hitting pause on the podcast) and hasn't said anything at all in defense of either of them. Not saying that means they are guilty, but it doesn't look *good*.

I don’t find it weird at all, it looks really bad if you defend anyone who could be a sexual harasser regardless of your personal feelings about it. Have you seen what happens when someone does defend a questionable man? You say something like “this is not the person I know,” and everyone comes after you stating you don’t know every facet of a person and just because they were nice to you doesn’t mean they weren’t terrible behind the scenes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BL and JB are both so messy. I’m embarrassed for them that this is all being fought so publicly. Neither of them come off as very sympathetic to me. They need to go do private mediation and take a break from the spotlight.

Nah. She went to the NYT. He’s going to wind up humiliating Lively and Reynolds, is my guess — and the twist is this would never have crossed Baldoni’s mind but for their attacks. Oh well!

Totally agree. This is the point his lawyer made, too. If she hadn't attacked, no one ever would have known how badly she behaved.

I don't get this though. Didn't he "attack" first? I thought the only reason she filed the complaint is because they found out he hired a PR firm over the summer to attack her in the press. I thought that's what started the whole thing.

I think it gets really messy with the Stephanie jones/jennifer Abel fallout. As Abel was exiting, jones was trying to be involved but was making a mess with the truce Abel and Nathan were trying to preserve with Leslie sloane. Sounds like lively’s side overreacted and when Abel split from jonesworks, jones gave sloane and co. ammunition. Somewhere in all this mess was an ultimatum from lively and Reynolds that baldoni and heath should “apologize for missteps” or “the gloves would come off.” This is what I remember from his complaint anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I still want to know why his podcast host quit immediately and without comment when her complaint came out. Like it was instant. They've worked together for several years and the whole point of the podcast is that they talk about feminism and relationships and harassment issues.

What does Liz Plank know that the rest of us don't?

She didn’t. There were all these swirling allegations around him for months, and the podcast just kinda of stopped having new episodes. She left immediately after the NYT article came out (the same time that everyone was freaking out at JB in total horror). I really don’t think there’s a smoking gun there. As a highly vocal feminist, she simply couldn’t align herself with someone who was accused (by the highly respected NYT) of mounting a smear campaign after an allegation of SH. (And her other podcast folded at the same time as well, for different reasons.)

The NYT article really lent credibility to her claims. Everyone thought he was guilty over the holidays.