2019 AAP Results

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

My daughter’s NNAT was 120 (89 percentile) and his COGAT is:
V: 111
Q: 129
NV: 126
Componsite (VQN): 127

My daughter didn't get in but we included work and we wrote letter. We are wondering if there is any point appealing this. We don't know the GBRS score, DRC or pool and have no idea where to get that info.

Any input? Is it worth appealing? Is it worth getting WISC? If so where do you suggest? Gmu or private?

Sorry, but how can you not know if she was in the pool?? It would have been included in your child’s envelope with the CoGAT scores.

You don’t get told you are not in pool. Pp probably wasn’t in pool.

My point still stands. How can anyone not figure it out? The letter that says in pool comes with your child’s scores. If you didn’t get a letter, your child obviously wasn’t in the pool. SMH. At this point in the process to not know that? I’m sorry, pure ignorance.

Sorry, we are new here and not familiar with the system. We were told to complete referral form an submit work. No idea about the pool, GBRC or DRa. This is the first time I am hearing about them.
If I did not get a letter saying she is in the pool with the Cogat score, does that mean she is not in?

Correct. She was not in the pool automatically, which is why you had to parent refer her. She still got looked at but rejected. Your next step is an appeal. Ask the AART for a copy of her AAP file so you can see how the teacher rated her.

Thanks a lot for the information. I really appreciate it.
Do you think it’s worth appealing? Is it worth getting WISC? If so where do you suggest? GMU or private? By the way I am not expecting a very strong letter from her teacher. She is really good but gets distracted by other kids easily. She has an extremely great memory and talents and interests in many areas, like chess, piano, geography, rubikscubes, etc. I don’t think she can show her best. I am afraid that she won’t be challenged enough in other classes. On the other hand, I don’t want her to struggle if she is not eligible for AAP. However all of our friends notice her intelligence. Also when I see her friends at similar age groups I also notice that she grasps faster than other kids around. I would appreciate any comments, thanks

Oh, there won’t be a letter from the teacher. It’s actually just a form (called the GBRS form) and it’s just two pages with a rating and comments. You need to see that and see what work samples the school sent in.

I just got the AAP package. As I expected she doesn’t have good GBRC. All, occasional although the teacher says that she frequently shows those talents. I really don’t understand why her teacher gives o if she shows frequently. Her DRA is 24. Do you suggest appealing? Would you go to private for WISC? If so, which one do you suggest? Also, as I see from the website GMU conducts WISC for level 5 only, no level 4. Any feedback will be appreciated. Thanks

Hi OP, the current version of the WISC test is Version V, so its called the WISC-V. It has nothing to do with AAP levels.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I hate the quote boxes so responding to 22:12 post.

From what I have read, mainly on these boards, the WISC is not likely to be that much higher then the NNAT and CogAT. The NNAT was 120 and the highest subscore on the CogAT was a 129 with a composite of 127. If her GBRSs were all Occasionally, I don't know how likely she is to be accepted on appeal. The WISC might be 139 but the GBRS are just not that great.

Are you willing to pay around $400 for a test that might help her get in on appeal but probably won't? The NNAT and CogAT are pretty close in score so I don't know that the WISC is going to be that much higher.

You can ask for a retest on the CogAT next year and submit a package then. Hopefully she will end up with better GBRSs.

Overall, it looks like you have a smart child but not one that is jumping off the page as an AAP student.

I don't know what school you are at or what the Gen Ed program is like. Reading what some people have posted gives me a better appreciation for why AAP is so important for some families.

No matter what happens, know that you have a bright child and nurture her interests and her education. She has all the raw materials to do very well in school, even outside of AAP. Honors classes and AP and IB options are available once she gets to middle school and high school.

+1. I had no idea some schools offered so little enrichment/differentiation. When they say kids needs can be met in the general ed classroom, that is pretty unfair considering the huge range of what's offered in general ed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

+1. I had no idea some schools offered so little enrichment/differentiation. When they say kids needs can be met in the general ed classroom, that is pretty unfair considering the huge range of what's offered in general ed.

Yes, so much THIS. Often see bickering in this board about who can or cannot be served in gen ed that fails to appreciate gen ed is not some standard. If you have a good gen ed be glad.as not all do. Gotta admit it makes me wonder if LIV varies as much as gen ed offerings do.

[Anonymous]

I agree. It's frustrating when people say that an in-pool kid with high Q and NV but lower V belongs in gen ed + advanced math, because a lot of schools don't offer advanced math in 3rd. The only way for a kid who is gifted in math to be guaranteed advanced math is by being LIV eligible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate the quote boxes so responding to 22:12 post.

From what I have read, mainly on these boards, the WISC is not likely to be that much higher then the NNAT and CogAT. The NNAT was 120 and the highest subscore on the CogAT was a 129 with a composite of 127. If her GBRSs were all Occasionally, I don't know how likely she is to be accepted on appeal. The WISC might be 139 but the GBRS are just not that great.

Are you willing to pay around $400 for a test that might help her get in on appeal but probably won't? The NNAT and CogAT are pretty close in score so I don't know that the WISC is going to be that much higher.

You can ask for a retest on the CogAT next year and submit a package then. Hopefully she will end up with better GBRSs.

Overall, it looks like you have a smart child but not one that is jumping off the page as an AAP student.

I don't know what school you are at or what the Gen Ed program is like. Reading what some people have posted gives me a better appreciation for why AAP is so important for some families.

No matter what happens, know that you have a bright child and nurture her interests and her education. She has all the raw materials to do very well in school, even outside of AAP. Honors classes and AP and IB options are available once she gets to middle school and high school.

+1. I had no idea some schools offered so little enrichment/differentiation. When they say kids needs can be met in the general ed classroom, that is pretty unfair considering the huge range of what's offered in general ed.

Agree with this 100%, and I have a kid at a great school so no real dog in this fight. I was surprised to see other schools don't offer what my child has and it did open my eyes to why some parents are really desperate to get their kids into the center. A great school might serve a 125 CogAt kid wonderfully in gen ed, but these almost-title-1 schools seem like they are offering nothing for that category of kids right below center-eligibility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate the quote boxes so responding to 22:12 post.

From what I have read, mainly on these boards, the WISC is not likely to be that much higher then the NNAT and CogAT. The NNAT was 120 and the highest subscore on the CogAT was a 129 with a composite of 127. If her GBRSs were all Occasionally, I don't know how likely she is to be accepted on appeal. The WISC might be 139 but the GBRS are just not that great.

Are you willing to pay around $400 for a test that might help her get in on appeal but probably won't? The NNAT and CogAT are pretty close in score so I don't know that the WISC is going to be that much higher.

You can ask for a retest on the CogAT next year and submit a package then. Hopefully she will end up with better GBRSs.

Overall, it looks like you have a smart child but not one that is jumping off the page as an AAP student.

I don't know what school you are at or what the Gen Ed program is like. Reading what some people have posted gives me a better appreciation for why AAP is so important for some families.

No matter what happens, know that you have a bright child and nurture her interests and her education. She has all the raw materials to do very well in school, even outside of AAP. Honors classes and AP and IB options are available once she gets to middle school and high school.

+1. I had no idea some schools offered so little enrichment/differentiation. When they say kids needs can be met in the general ed classroom, that is pretty unfair considering the huge range of what's offered in general ed.

Agree with this 100%, and I have a kid at a great school so no real dog in this fight. I was surprised to see other schools don't offer what my child has and it did open my eyes to why some parents are really desperate to get their kids into the center. A great school might serve a 125 CogAt kid wonderfully in gen ed, but these almost-title-1 schools seem like they are offering nothing for that category of kids right below center-eligibility.

This is the crux of the issue for many FCPS families. If FCPS wants to de-bloat AAP, they need to have a minimum academic standard offering at all the schools, even the ones with lots of poor kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Agree with this 100%, and I have a kid at a great school so no real dog in this fight. I was surprised to see other schools don't offer what my child has and it did open my eyes to why some parents are really desperate to get their kids into the center. A great school might serve a 125 CogAt kid wonderfully in gen ed, but these almost-title-1 schools seem like they are offering nothing for that category of kids right below center-eligibility.

PP from the strong gen ed program with the leveled math classes and all of the pull outs here: We're just barely on the other side of the Title 1 fence, meaning the school is Title 1 but with only a 45%-50% FARMS rate. That extra Title 1 money makes a huge difference in the gen ed programs.

[Anonymous]

What's the title 1 cut off?

[Anonymous]

So thankful to be IN!! We don’t have to move to private!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What's the title 1 cut off?

The federal cut off is 40%, but school systems have a lot of latitude. By law, all school systems are required to serve any school that's 75+% FRM. Right now, FCPS has it at 45%, but the school board is thinking about moving it to 55% by 2021. I suspect anyone who thinks this is a good idea does not have children who attend a school between 40-55% FRM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I agree. It's frustrating when people say that an in-pool kid with high Q and NV but lower V belongs in gen ed + advanced math, because a lot of schools don't offer advanced math in 3rd. The only way for a kid who is gifted in math to be guaranteed advanced math is by being LIV eligible.

If I had a child who was gifted in math, I wouldn't rely on a public school to meet this need. My DS is a normal bright kid, not especially gifted in anything that I can see but bright. He has been taking advanced math (a year or two ahead) outside of school since forever. He still does plus attends RSM. Whatever they do in school is simply a baseline.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree. It's frustrating when people say that an in-pool kid with high Q and NV but lower V belongs in gen ed + advanced math, because a lot of schools don't offer advanced math in 3rd. The only way for a kid who is gifted in math to be guaranteed advanced math is by being LIV eligible.

If I had a child who was gifted in math, I wouldn't rely on a public school to meet this need. My DS is a normal bright kid, not especially gifted in anything that I can see but bright. He has been taking advanced math (a year or two ahead) outside of school since forever. He still does plus attends RSM. Whatever they do in school is simply a baseline.

Well that’s wonderful but many parents don’t have that option for financial reasons and depend on the public schools to properly educate their kids. Kids shouldn’t have to outsource their education, although many around here do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree. It's frustrating when people say that an in-pool kid with high Q and NV but lower V belongs in gen ed + advanced math, because a lot of schools don't offer advanced math in 3rd. The only way for a kid who is gifted in math to be guaranteed advanced math is by being LIV eligible.

If I had a child who was gifted in math, I wouldn't rely on a public school to meet this need. My DS is a normal bright kid, not especially gifted in anything that I can see but bright. He has been taking advanced math (a year or two ahead) outside of school since forever. He still does plus attends RSM. Whatever they do in school is simply a baseline.

So he does Kumon or equivalent plus the Russia school of math? How much does that cost? How many hours per week?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree. It's frustrating when people say that an in-pool kid with high Q and NV but lower V belongs in gen ed + advanced math, because a lot of schools don't offer advanced math in 3rd. The only way for a kid who is gifted in math to be guaranteed advanced math is by being LIV eligible.

If I had a child who was gifted in math, I wouldn't rely on a public school to meet this need. My DS is a normal bright kid, not especially gifted in anything that I can see but bright. He has been taking advanced math (a year or two ahead) outside of school since forever. He still does plus attends RSM. Whatever they do in school is simply a baseline.

So he does Kumon or equivalent plus the Russia school of math? How much does that cost? How many hours per week?

I'm not sure of the total. RSM is two hours a week plus maybe half hr of homework. Tutoring is an hour a week plus another hour of homework. So maybe 4 hrs? conservatively. Total cost of both is maybe 2,600 - 2,800.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree. It's frustrating when people say that an in-pool kid with high Q and NV but lower V belongs in gen ed + advanced math, because a lot of schools don't offer advanced math in 3rd. The only way for a kid who is gifted in math to be guaranteed advanced math is by being LIV eligible.

If I had a child who was gifted in math, I wouldn't rely on a public school to meet this need. My DS is a normal bright kid, not especially gifted in anything that I can see but bright. He has been taking advanced math (a year or two ahead) outside of school since forever. He still does plus attends RSM. Whatever they do in school is simply a baseline.

So he does Kumon or equivalent plus the Russia school of math? How much does that cost? How many hours per week?

I'm not sure of the total. RSM is two hours a week plus maybe half hr of homework. Tutoring is an hour a week plus another hour of homework. So maybe 4 hrs? conservatively. Total cost of both is maybe 2,600 - 2,800.

Wow. That is a lot of time (class + driving back and forth) and money for one child to learn a subject he should be learning at school. Very few people can afford $2800/year for one child to learn one subject.