Confederate Battle Flag

[Anonymous]

I read this article by the Washington Times the other day and was summarily impressed (by that conservative rag).

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/why-conservatives-should-hate-the-confederate-flag/article/2566609

"The invocation of "states rights" among those waving the Confederate flag while fighting for the evils of slavery and segregation has been devastating to the cause of limited government.

Not only were the institutions themselves an affront to liberty, but in fighting to defeat the institutions, the federal government claimed more power. And to this day, when any conservative tries to make a principled argument in favor of returning more power to the states, they have to grapple with the fact that for many Americans, such arguments are tainted by their historical association with slavery and segregation.

The Confederacy was formed to preserve and expand the brutal institution of slavery, and then its proponents subsequently tried to disguise their motivations in lofty language about states' rights."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Time magazine is reporting that Amazon has pulled Confederate flag merchandise as well.

Well done Amazon!!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mississippi to propose removal of Confederate emblem from state flag

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/23/mississippi-confederate-flag-consider-dropping-emblem

Lawmakers in Mississippi plan to propose legislation to remove the Confederate emblem from the state flag, as momentum grows across the south for symbols that evoke the era of slavery to be removed from public view.

This reminds me of how quickly things suddenly changed regarding same-sex marriage. Only faster.

I had the same thought too, recently. It would be interesting to examine if this moves the needle on guns at all.

Don't get crazy now. If 20 bullet riddled 6 year old kids couldn't achieve change, 9 black people won't. Sadly. Because we are a fucked up country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Time magazine is reporting that Amazon has pulled Confederate flag merchandise as well.

Well done Amazon!!!!

Heard on the radio that eBay has as well.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mississippi to propose removal of Confederate emblem from state flag

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/23/mississippi-confederate-flag-consider-dropping-emblem

Lawmakers in Mississippi plan to propose legislation to remove the Confederate emblem from the state flag, as momentum grows across the south for symbols that evoke the era of slavery to be removed from public view.

This reminds me of how quickly things suddenly changed regarding same-sex marriage. Only faster.

I had the same thought too, recently. It would be interesting to examine if this moves the needle on guns at all.

Don't get crazy now. If 20 bullet riddled 6 year old kids couldn't achieve change, 9 black people won't. Sadly. Because we are a fucked up country.

Maybe jumping on the "Take Down the Flag" bandwagon is way of keeping the focus off guns?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mississippi to propose removal of Confederate emblem from state flag

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/23/mississippi-confederate-flag-consider-dropping-emblem

Lawmakers in Mississippi plan to propose legislation to remove the Confederate emblem from the state flag, as momentum grows across the south for symbols that evoke the era of slavery to be removed from public view.

This reminds me of how quickly things suddenly changed regarding same-sex marriage. Only faster.

I had the same thought too, recently. It would be interesting to examine if this moves the needle on guns at all.

Don't get crazy now. If 20 bullet riddled 6 year old kids couldn't achieve change, 9 black people won't. Sadly. Because we are a fucked up country.

Eh, it might. For one thing, this guy wasn't nearly as easily dismissed as a lone wolf - he's not nearly as crazy as the Sandy Hook killer. For another thing, up until now mass killings like this have affected mostly white areas. There could be more momentum from the AA community (which, let it be known, suffers the most from gun violence than any other group).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The flag is a symbol, and as such, has different meanings to different people.

I get the same feeling when I see the Confederate flag as I have when I see someone burning the flag of the US - I think it is sad. But, I believe that people have the right to fly the Confederate flag just as people have the right to burn the US flag. I would never do either.

As an AA woman, I agree that people should be able to fly whatever flag they wish. However, I feel differently about the State of South Carolina.

Well, that State doesn't represent you or me, but the citizens actually living and voting there.

Whatever. A state in the USA should not be flying the flag of a non-government entity that was bested in a bloody and brutal civil war 150 years ago. It's inappropriate for ANY government entity in the USA, and to argue otherwise is illogical and treasonous.

I don't think it should fly there either. I also think adding ''bested'' is hilariously unnecessary. And come on now...treasonous?

BTW...check out the Mississippi flag. Stars and Bars are still there.

Yes. It is expressing loyalty to a non-US entity. That's the definition of treason.

And Mississippi is the land of overweight, uneducated troglodytes, so what do you expect? It's wrong there too.

The Confederacy is a part of history...it is no longer an entity.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mississippi to propose removal of Confederate emblem from state flag

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/23/mississippi-confederate-flag-consider-dropping-emblem

Lawmakers in Mississippi plan to propose legislation to remove the Confederate emblem from the state flag, as momentum grows across the south for symbols that evoke the era of slavery to be removed from public view.

This reminds me of how quickly things suddenly changed regarding same-sex marriage. Only faster.

I had the same thought too, recently. It would be interesting to examine if this moves the needle on guns at all.

Don't get crazy now. If 20 bullet riddled 6 year old kids couldn't achieve change, 9 black people won't. Sadly. Because we are a fucked up country.

Maybe jumping on the "Take Down the Flag" bandwagon is way of keeping the focus off guns?

Ding! I think we have a winner. Of course politicians are going to pick the easiest battle and deflect scrutiny from their own unconscionable and indefensible positions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The flag is a symbol, and as such, has different meanings to different people.

I get the same feeling when I see the Confederate flag as I have when I see someone burning the flag of the US - I think it is sad. But, I believe that people have the right to fly the Confederate flag just as people have the right to burn the US flag. I would never do either.

As an AA woman, I agree that people should be able to fly whatever flag they wish. However, I feel differently about the State of South Carolina.

Well, that State doesn't represent you or me, but the citizens actually living and voting there.

Whatever. A state in the USA should not be flying the flag of a non-government entity that was bested in a bloody and brutal civil war 150 years ago. It's inappropriate for ANY government entity in the USA, and to argue otherwise is illogical and treasonous.

I don't think it should fly there either. I also think adding ''bested'' is hilariously unnecessary. And come on now...treasonous?

BTW...check out the Mississippi flag. Stars and Bars are still there.

Yes. It is expressing loyalty to a non-US entity. That's the definition of treason.

And Mississippi is the land of overweight, uneducated troglodytes, so what do you expect? It's wrong there too.

The Confederacy is a part of history...it is no longer an entity.

Fine, whatever. It's a DISCREDITED part of history, that has no place flying over a state capital.

If the uneducated, poor and willfully ignorant south would like to secede again and proudly fly their racist flag, I invite them to go for it. We won't fight you this time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The flag is a symbol, and as such, has different meanings to different people.

I get the same feeling when I see the Confederate flag as I have when I see someone burning the flag of the US - I think it is sad. But, I believe that people have the right to fly the Confederate flag just as people have the right to burn the US flag. I would never do either.

As an AA woman, I agree that people should be able to fly whatever flag they wish. However, I feel differently about the State of South Carolina.

Well, that State doesn't represent you or me, but the citizens actually living and voting there.

Whatever. A state in the USA should not be flying the flag of a non-government entity that was bested in a bloody and brutal civil war 150 years ago. It's inappropriate for ANY government entity in the USA, and to argue otherwise is illogical and treasonous.

I don't think it should fly there either. I also think adding ''bested'' is hilariously unnecessary. And come on now...treasonous?

BTW...check out the Mississippi flag. Stars and Bars are still there.

Yes. It is expressing loyalty to a non-US entity. That's the definition of treason.

And Mississippi is the land of overweight, uneducated troglodytes, so what do you expect? It's wrong there too.

The Confederacy is a part of history...it is no longer an entity.

Fine, whatever. It's a DISCREDITED part of history, that has no place flying over a state capital.

I agree.

[Anonymous]

Racism is on our DNA donchaknow. Not a part of our history. In our DNA.

Please....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about Dylan Roof just because he is a racist. There are millions of racists. We care about Dylan Roof because he is a mass killer. You can name-call all you want but attempting to blame a psycho-killer's actions on a bunch of racists just because you don't like what the racists stand for is patently illogical.

You might as well blame Martin Scorcese for the movie "Taxi Driver" since that movie was one of the things that "motivated" Hinckley. Oh wait you don't mind that incident since it was an attempted assassination of a politician you don't like (Reagan) therefore it's all good, right?

I find this argument very strange and entirely illogical. First of all, we have no clue if Roof would have been inspired to commit a mass murder if he was not experiencing the paranoia that was sparked and nurtured by racist propaganda and white supremacist online "friends". He might have spent the rest of his lonely days playing violent video games or whatever he was doing before he committed this murder.

Also, we have a history of murders very much like this one in this country which were inspired by white supremacist hatred. The embers of our violent racist history smolder just beneath the surface as you can clearly see on the white supremacist blog Roof was frequenting. Were all of the racist murderers of our past criminally insane? Or were they inspired to change the world and become heroes? Zealots do commit mass murders for a cause. We are able to believe this fact when Islamic extremists commit mass murders but not when young, white Americans do it. Why is that? I don't see what is so different about this one besides the fact that people don't want to admit that racism is real and dangerous.

Things have improved a little bit for black people for a short while in this country. Many of us never thought we would see a black president and yet we did. Historically, whenever things begin to improve there is backlash. Frankly, I expected to see something like this happen much sooner after Obama was elected and we began to see racist statements about him popping up all over the place. If you don't think that intense, political beliefs can inspire murderers to commit mass murder, you are seriously delusional. Why would history not repeat itself?

Hmmm very interesting. So you believe murderers do it because of "inspiration" they receive from other people?

I guess that means you think someone must have inspired all the blacks who have murdered other blacks in Baltimore since the Freddy Gray indictments, it's probably close to a hundred of those murders by now.

Do you think that Prosecutor Mosby "inspired" some of these murders? How about Mayor Rawlings-Blake? Didn't they both make very public pronouncements basically encouraging chaos in their city?

Oh but no....no, all those thugs in Baltimore who've been basically going on a crime/killing spree since those indictments, they don't take any "inspiration" from those politicians. No sir. Because that would be....that would be.....racist, to blame black people for their actions.

Another PP here. What is interesting is that you want to portray this guy as a crazy lone-wolf who did not have any outside influences to kill - despite the fact that he was immersed in racist dogma. At the same time, folks on here and in the Con media were quick to say the NYC police killer was spurred to action by Sharpton and POTUS despite clear evidence that he was also crazy.

We also said only one person pulled the trigger....

If this kid had been a Muslim, you would have pointed to every single influence and declared that they "radicalized" him. His churches, the websites he visited, anyone of influence who had contact with him. Why is it different here?

Actually, it's the dems saying that WE, America, radicalized them. Look it up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many of you are no different than Dylan Roof in your beliefs about blacks and other minorities. The only difference between you and him is that he acted out on his hate by killing people and you spend the day on message boards continuing to spew the same stuff he believes somehow excusing your ignorance with non sequiturs, illogical nonsense, and other garbage.

If you read the comments that are made here by some throughout the board they are no different that Roof. You make sweeping comments about blacks that paint them as monsters, you continue to think they are killing everyone (and themselves), they are are on welfare, and a host of things that are backwards as hell.

Are you racist? Thats for you to determine. Youll sit here going back and forth with me about everyone else being racist but yourself and that your general statements about minorities are "facts". Thats fine. Again, to think this is the first time one has heard the idea that we(blacks) are taking over the country, raping your (white) women, and the thing Roof said before he killed those nine people is absurd.

One skim of this board, the comment section of any news article on blacks, or any online discussion board shows that these beliefs are not foreign. The action of killing and following through on those beliefs is thankfully foreign. Not the held beliefs.

Only the ones that act like monsters. I feel it's fine to call them out. Regardless of color.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about Dylan Roof just because he is a racist. There are millions of racists. We care about Dylan Roof because he is a mass killer. You can name-call all you want but attempting to blame a psycho-killer's actions on a bunch of racists just because you don't like what the racists stand for is patently illogical.

You might as well blame Martin Scorcese for the movie "Taxi Driver" since that movie was one of the things that "motivated" Hinckley. Oh wait you don't mind that incident since it was an attempted assassination of a politician you don't like (Reagan) therefore it's all good, right?

I find this argument very strange and entirely illogical. First of all, we have no clue if Roof would have been inspired to commit a mass murder if he was not experiencing the paranoia that was sparked and nurtured by racist propaganda and white supremacist online "friends". He might have spent the rest of his lonely days playing violent video games or whatever he was doing before he committed this murder.

Also, we have a history of murders very much like this one in this country which were inspired by white supremacist hatred. The embers of our violent racist history smolder just beneath the surface as you can clearly see on the white supremacist blog Roof was frequenting. Were all of the racist murderers of our past criminally insane? Or were they inspired to change the world and become heroes? Zealots do commit mass murders for a cause. We are able to believe this fact when Islamic extremists commit mass murders but not when young, white Americans do it. Why is that? I don't see what is so different about this one besides the fact that people don't want to admit that racism is real and dangerous.

Things have improved a little bit for black people for a short while in this country. Many of us never thought we would see a black president and yet we did. Historically, whenever things begin to improve there is backlash. Frankly, I expected to see something like this happen much sooner after Obama was elected and we began to see racist statements about him popping up all over the place. If you don't think that intense, political beliefs can inspire murderers to commit mass murder, you are seriously delusional. Why would history not repeat itself?

Hmmm very interesting. So you believe murderers do it because of "inspiration" they receive from other people?

I guess that means you think someone must have inspired all the blacks who have murdered other blacks in Baltimore since the Freddy Gray indictments, it's probably close to a hundred of those murders by now.

Do you think that Prosecutor Mosby "inspired" some of these murders? How about Mayor Rawlings-Blake? Didn't they both make very public pronouncements basically encouraging chaos in their city?

Oh but no....no, all those thugs in Baltimore who've been basically going on a crime/killing spree since those indictments, they don't take any "inspiration" from those politicians. No sir. Because that would be....that would be.....racist, to blame black people for their actions.

Another PP here. What is interesting is that you want to portray this guy as a crazy lone-wolf who did not have any outside influences to kill - despite the fact that he was immersed in racist dogma. At the same time, folks on here and in the Con media were quick to say the NYC police killer was spurred to action by Sharpton and POTUS despite clear evidence that he was also crazy.

We also said only one person pulled the trigger....

If this kid had been a Muslim, you would have pointed to every single influence and declared that they "radicalized" him. His churches, the websites he visited, anyone of influence who had contact with him. Why is it different here?

And had he been Muslim, the media would be bending over backwards to explain that this crime had nothing to do with Islam and was not representative of anything larger than a radical fringe, rather than waving the bloody shirt in the manner they are doing now. Few if any of the people discussing this incident are doing so in a principled way, its all about whose ox you want to gore. Too many houses, not enough pox, I say.

If that's true, it would be because conservatives like to say that it's not Islam, just "radical Islam".

I freely agree that many conservatives are unwilling to state the truth as they see it, because of a combination of reasonable fear of consequences, good manners, and abject cowardice, varying in proportion among individuals and circumstances. That's why they are losers. Say what you will about the left, suppressing the symbols of a defeated enemy and engaging in guilt-by-association smears to advance long held political goals are both rational and the acts of a side that wants to win. Which is, of course, why they will.

Suppressing symbols of a defeated enemy. What the hell are you blabbering about? You are free to fly the stars and bars. You are free to be a white supremacist, if you want.

But don't expect the government to be a part of it.

The guy you just insulted? Liberal. Read his post again. He is saying that liberals engaging in smear campaigns as a way to win, regardless of whether those campaigns have any grounds in truth. This is the best description of progressivism I've seen - and a fine admission of their nastiness.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mississippi to propose removal of Confederate emblem from state flag

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/23/mississippi-confederate-flag-consider-dropping-emblem

Lawmakers in Mississippi plan to propose legislation to remove the Confederate emblem from the state flag, as momentum grows across the south for symbols that evoke the era of slavery to be removed from public view.

This reminds me of how quickly things suddenly changed regarding same-sex marriage. Only faster.

Maybe you can keep it going now that you have momentum. You can destroy christianity, make our borders completely open, and finally, FINALLY confiscate those 401Ks and put them into government coffers where they belong.