Why are so many women here so angry with / resentful toward women who stay home?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't read this whole thread, so likely someone has already pointed this out, but being a sahm does not mean that is the only thing you ever did. I'm a former scientist turned sahm. My kids love hearing about the research that I used to do, and I am instilling a love of science in both my son and my daughter. I doubt my daughter would list becoming an astronaut as one of her aspirations if she was hanging out with a nanny after school instead of watching NASA videos of the ISS with me. I actually worked part time until my second child was born, and frankly, because I made it a point to always work around my first child's schedule, he didn't even notice that I was working. So, if you think that the only example of women having choices is by taking time away from your kids, you're wrong. Kudos to those who have flexible jobs that allow them to be there for their kids when needed, without a whole lot of stress on the entire family. For many of us, that is not realistic. My staying home benefits my entire family by allowing us to always make whatever choice is best for the kids (such as keeping them at home when they are even slightly sick and not worrying about summer plans) without the stress of dealing with an employer's expectations. With my particular career, that flexibility would not have been possible if I continued to woh. My former professsional interests have a greater influence on my kids' interests than my husband's current career because I get to spend more time with our kids than he does. So, if anything, by staying home, I am actually guiding my daughter toward interests in stem to a greater extent than if I was still woh.

+1. Those of us who had children late in life have had amazing careers and I don't think my children will suffer in any way if I take time off to raise them. Granted, I will try to work 1 day a week after the baby is born, so I'm not a true stay at home mom. Although I technically have to rely on my husband to cover most of our expenses, I can get a job very quickly and when I work full time, I make much more than my husband. Feminism is about giving women a choice. It doesn't mean we all have to slave away outside of the home. It means we get to choose whether we want to stay home or work elsewhere.

But before there was feminism, you were AH. No change for you then.

[Anonymous]

I haven't come across hate for SAHMs in my circle (I'm a lawyer). It's a choice and feminism is all about choices. I also don't get the anger over SAHMs who went to prestigious schools. I believe education is important for the country and for voters. I don't think it's throwing it away to go to fancy schools than decide to stay home.

That said, I am glad I am not a SAHM. My husband had an affair and I would not want to have to be reliant on him financially. He was one of the most loving, doting husbands and dads and everyone was shocked. He was my best friend and we had a very active sex life. Thus, I really feel like I need my own financial abilities. I also wonder what happens when the kids leave the nest - off for college or whatever. Are the dads resentful? Are the moms bored? I am fine with people doing the whole SAH thing, but I would be worried. Of course, I generally am a worrier.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I do think that in some way SAHM's contribute to the "Mom Industrial Complex." I am someone who was extremely ill-suited to being a stay at home mom and who was deeply unhappy as a SAHM. Unfortunately, in a society there is still this idea of the toned woman who is happy and organized and completely fulfilled by staying at home, doing crafts and decorating. This ideal can be harmful to people who don't fit this ideal -- for whatever reason (just like the ideal of the Alpha Male can be harmful to guys who don't fit this mold).

I'm older now but as I look back, I do think that I was harmed by the incredible expectations that we encounter from so many sources that say: You should volunteer to stay home, you should love it and you shouldn't feel resentful or conflicted.

I would look around and think "If Sheryl is fine introducing herself to people as someone who used to be a lawyer, and if Annie has no problem with having a law degree from Duke and never practicing law ever again, then there's something wrong with me because I"m so unhappy doing the same."

I hope that my girls won't end up feeling the same way in fifteen or twenty years -- feeling like they're kind of forced by society to give the whole SAHM thing a try, and feeling like a failure if it didn't work out for them.

That's the thing. You all can argue that SAHM'ing is a perfectly reasonable choice that you chose freely , but your "choosing" it makes it harder for those who don't choose it, because it establishes the ideal that choosing to SAHM is the norm and those who choose otherwise are aberrrant, selfish, entitled, whatever.

Agree, but luckily I was strong in my self knowledge and didn't care when women said, "oh, it must be so hard to work full time with two kids under 3." I took even less maternity leave with my second child than with my first. I have no criticism at all of SAHP, just don't expect me to cook, clean, decorate, party plan, etc. Not my thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm proud to have taught her both, by having a rewarding career before SAH.


And yes, if any of my children makes the choice to care for their own offspring I will support them 100%.

WOHPs do care for their own offspring, nitwit.

Maybe after their 8-10 hour workday/commute. Who's with them while you're not there?

My kids leave for school at 7:45, and get done with sports practice at 5:30. So the answer is their teachers and coaches. And only a totally ignorant SAHP thinks all full time working parents have sizable commutes. Mine is 15 minutes each way, and yes I am in the DMV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are all going to die anyway so stop yapping who is better or not. You all are gonna be sitting in a wet, poopy diaper eating mashed food somewhere your precious snowflakes will send you to. At the end of the day, no one is going to care of you were WOHM or SAHM or not. Good luck everyone.

Man, ain't this the truth. The older I get, the more true this is. Both of my parents worked and had great careers, they're retired in their 70s now, and we don't sit around discussing their careers or their career accomplishments. They like to tell the same old stories about some embarrassing shit I said as a kid, some embarrassing shit I did as a kid, how cute I was as a kid, etc, etc.

But they also don't sit around being regretful that they didn't SAH.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't read this whole thread, so likely someone has already pointed this out, but being a sahm does not mean that is the only thing you ever did. I'm a former scientist turned sahm. My kids love hearing about the research that I used to do, and I am instilling a love of science in both my son and my daughter. I doubt my daughter would list becoming an astronaut as one of her aspirations if she was hanging out with a nanny after school instead of watching NASA videos of the ISS with me. I actually worked part time until my second child was born, and frankly, because I made it a point to always work around my first child's schedule, he didn't even notice that I was working. So, if you think that the only example of women having choices is by taking time away from your kids, you're wrong. Kudos to those who have flexible jobs that allow them to be there for their kids when needed, without a whole lot of stress on the entire family. For many of us, that is not realistic. My staying home benefits my entire family by allowing us to always make whatever choice is best for the kids (such as keeping them at home when they are even slightly sick and not worrying about summer plans) without the stress of dealing with an employer's expectations. With my particular career, that flexibility would not have been possible if I continued to woh. My former professsional interests have a greater influence on my kids' interests than my husband's current career because I get to spend more time with our kids than he does. So, if anything, by staying home, I am actually guiding my daughter toward interests in stem to a greater extent than if I was still woh.

so your daughter is more likely to become a scientist because you used to be a scientist but now SAH, as opposed to if you were still a working scientist? Riiiiiight.

She's full of herself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, it's not D.C. It's a few select women who are desperate to feel they are better than other women.

No the mommy wars are going on all over the Internet not just here in DCUM-land. It's tiresome. I had the option to be a SAHW and decided against it but that's my business. People who choose differently are not wrong, they aren't wasting their degrees and so on. Why do we act like raising children is akin to shoveling shit? If women thought more of it, maybe men and society would think more of that role.

I've been a parent for 22 years and on the internet for 23. It has always, always, always been like this.

I'm so embarrassed that I ever participated in stupid Mommy wars, bf vs ff was particularly shameful. I refuse to do it here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm cracking up. If I didn't think SAH was easier than working full time and parenting, I'd go get a job!!! I don't want two jobs though.

I mean, I know a few of people said that even if they had money or were married to a high earner they would not SAH..........but a ton of people admitted that they would. If you like taking the hardest path, good for you, but I like the path that was best for our individual family.

It was hard when the kids were younger to WOH FT and parent, but now that all my kids are in high school or older, I would not want to have given up my job. I don't have any hobbies I like well enough to do 45 hours a week. I am high energy and high drive in terms of concrete, measurable accomplishments.

Of course you dont have any hobbies- you've been working ft while having kids. This is where being a SAHM has its advantages. I've managed to have many measurable accomplishments that are varied and engaging. I often wonder what retirement looks like for those who never developed hobbies or interests outside of children and work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are all going to die anyway so stop yapping who is better or not. You all are gonna be sitting in a wet, poopy diaper eating mashed food somewhere your precious snowflakes will send you to. At the end of the day, no one is going to care of you were WOHM or SAHM or not. Good luck everyone.

Man, ain't this the truth. The older I get, the more true this is. Both of my parents worked and had great careers, they're retired in their 70s now, and we don't sit around discussing their careers or their career accomplishments. They like to tell the same old stories about some embarrassing shit I said as a kid, some embarrassing shit I did as a kid, how cute I was as a kid, etc, etc.

But they also don't sit around being regretful that they didn't SAH.

It seems then that raising you was their fondest memory. What's wrong with me wanting to make memories when I don't need money?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm cracking up. If I didn't think SAH was easier than working full time and parenting, I'd go get a job!!! I don't want two jobs though.

I mean, I know a few of people said that even if they had money or were married to a high earner they would not SAH..........but a ton of people admitted that they would. If you like taking the hardest path, good for you, but I like the path that was best for our individual family.

It was hard when the kids were younger to WOH FT and parent, but now that all my kids are in high school or older, I would not want to have given up my job. I don't have any hobbies I like well enough to do 45 hours a week. I am high energy and high drive in terms of concrete, measurable accomplishments.

Of course you dont have any hobbies- you've been working ft while having kids. This is where being a SAHM has its advantages. I've managed to have many measurable accomplishments that are varied and engaging. I often wonder what retirement looks like for those who never developed hobbies or interests outside of children and work.

I do have hobbies (I run, do jigsaw puzzles and crochet) and volunteer (I am on the board of two charities). I plan to expand on volunteering in retirement. You didn't read my post carefully enough...I said, "I don't have any hobbies I like well enough to do 45 hours a week."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You're never going to convince me that the bitter working women on here spewing hatred aren't somehow jealous. You only get angry and worked up like this if it somehow personally involves your emotions.

If they were truly, genuinely happy with their choices they wouldn't give a rat's ass about what someone else is doing. They *claim* to have better things to think about and yet this is how they choose to spend their time? Doesn't add up. I am a working mom and I know that I am jealous of people how have more money and will be spending their day today driving around in their BMW carefree on the way to barre class. Alas, I have a mortgage to pay.

I don't feel jealous. I could easily afford to stay home. It does make me somewhat angry that women, especially women born into privilege, take up spaces in fancy colleges and grad schools to acquire education they never planned to use. I also feel like women who stay home make it harder for working women - employers tend to assume they'll leave after pregnancy, etc. My annoyance - can't even really call it anger - comes from bringing down women as a whole. The idea of being wholly dependent on a man's salary, not to mention having my sons see me cooking and cleaning while daddy makes the money - makes me shudder. YMMV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm proud to have taught her both, by having a rewarding career before SAH.


And yes, if any of my children makes the choice to care for their own offspring I will support them 100%.

WOHPs do care for their own offspring, nitwit.

Maybe after their 8-10 hour workday/commute. Who's with them while you're not there?

Most kids are in school. Do you homeschool your children?

At age 5, the teachers become the main caregivers. At least, that's the point SAHMs make - whoever spend the majority of the day with a kid is the biggest influence on them, correct?

I also love the SAHMs who sent their kids to preschool from 9-1, then they nap, then the SAHM is with them from 3pm on. I pick up my kids at 4:30 AND have a career I love and that makes a difference in the world. I know I'm lucky, but the idea that any woman who stays home spends all day influencing her kid with her amazing persona is laughable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:i will be honest. I have nothing at all against stay at home moms. The only thing that drives me crazy when they say they have "the hardest job in the world" or are "so busy" all the time - esp when they have school-aged kids. Seems a little clueless to say that to someone who is working 50 hours a week, plus has kids too. And for some reason at our school almost all the PTA moms are WOHM moms - not sure what the SAHMs are doing. so anyway - there's no resentment against SAHMs per se - it's just the ones who act like they are saints making a huge sacrifice for their kids that bring out my resentment. And I will add that 95% of SAHMs that I know IRL are NOT like that.

+100

My thoughts exactly. I love it when their husbands make excuses for why their wives cannot work "she's so busy she doesn't have time to work"...

My husband would never justify nor explain to a stranger or anyone else why I don't work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't read this whole thread, so likely someone has already pointed this out, but being a sahm does not mean that is the only thing you ever did. I'm a former scientist turned sahm. My kids love hearing about the research that I used to do, and I am instilling a love of science in both my son and my daughter. I doubt my daughter would list becoming an astronaut as one of her aspirations if she was hanging out with a nanny after school instead of watching NASA videos of the ISS with me. I actually worked part time until my second child was born, and frankly, because I made it a point to always work around my first child's schedule, he didn't even notice that I was working. So, if you think that the only example of women having choices is by taking time away from your kids, you're wrong. Kudos to those who have flexible jobs that allow them to be there for their kids when needed, without a whole lot of stress on the entire family. For many of us, that is not realistic. My staying home benefits my entire family by allowing us to always make whatever choice is best for the kids (such as keeping them at home when they are even slightly sick and not worrying about summer plans) without the stress of dealing with an employer's expectations. With my particular career, that flexibility would not have been possible if I continued to woh. My former professsional interests have a greater influence on my kids' interests than my husband's current career because I get to spend more time with our kids than he does. So, if anything, by staying home, I am actually guiding my daughter toward interests in stem to a greater extent than if I was still woh.

so your daughter is more likely to become a scientist because you used to be a scientist but now SAH, as opposed to if you were still a working scientist? Riiiiiight.

She's full of herself.

Yeah, the only problem I have with this is the bolded. The whole point is to not undermine ANY caretaker. A nanny or daycare is valuable too if we want people to think the work SAHP do is valuable. They are shaping little lives. Nanny could ALSO have been a scientist who changed careers (Nannies can be WOHPs you know) to a different career she lives. Nanny could have been a nurse, a plumber, former SAHM, anything.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are all going to die anyway so stop yapping who is better or not. You all are gonna be sitting in a wet, poopy diaper eating mashed food somewhere your precious snowflakes will send you to. At the end of the day, no one is going to care of you were WOHM or SAHM or not. Good luck everyone.

Man, ain't this the truth. The older I get, the more true this is. Both of my parents worked and had great careers, they're retired in their 70s now, and we don't sit around discussing their careers or their career accomplishments. They like to tell the same old stories about some embarrassing shit I said as a kid, some embarrassing shit I did as a kid, how cute I was as a kid, etc, etc.

But they also don't sit around being regretful that they didn't SAH.

It seems then that raising you was their fondest memory. What's wrong with me wanting to make memories when I don't need money?

Original PP here, I didn't write the second comment.

My mother was actually a SAHM for some time, but she went back to work when I was in first grade so I don't recall much from our time together.

My original point was that they lived in their present, and their careers (and for my mother, staying home for a few years) were important at the time, but it isn't now and it would have been silly for them to argue about their choices to strangers 40 years prior.

Seriously people, this debate is nonsensical. Do what you want.