Can we have an honest, good faith conversation about fat acceptance and body positivity?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Why are you inventing this? No, *you* check the labels. It's so easy to verify and disprove that I kinda feel secondhand embarrassment.

Please show us a nutritional label with more than 3 or 4 grams of sugar per slice of bread. Spoiler alert: there is none. Not a single one. (And if you manage to find a bread that does have more than that - that's on you, obviously it's a rarity.)

https://www.google.com/search?q=white+bread+nutrition+label&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=ALeKk006Stx3bFYDRXuKNj7V2g4FGlGMog:1620929235028&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsvYn6n8fwAhWJCRAIHRUlAiEQ_AUoAXoECAMQAQ&biw=360&bih=544

(and most of this sugar is a naturally occurring sugar in flour meaning you can't even make manufacturers decrease it).

You don't get fat by eating a slice of bread a day or 2 oz of deli meat. Don't eat too much of it - but that's a personal choice.

Subway. 5 grams of sugar per 6 inch roll, so much that in Ireland, Subway bread has legally been declared cake. Subway, billed as such a healthy choice because it’s low-fat. I don’t personally eat Subway, but let’s not pretend that it’s so uncommon. DP.

So? A 6 inch sub has 300-500 calories. No one is getting obese from eating a 6 inch sub for lunch once in a while and whether the bread has 5 gm sugar or 2 gm isnt going to make a difference in your health. A qboda burrito has over 1300 calories.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Why are you inventing this? No, *you* check the labels. It's so easy to verify and disprove that I kinda feel secondhand embarrassment.

Please show us a nutritional label with more than 3 or 4 grams of sugar per slice of bread. Spoiler alert: there is none. Not a single one. (And if you manage to find a bread that does have more than that - that's on you, obviously it's a rarity.)

https://www.google.com/search?q=white+bread+nutrition+label&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=ALeKk006Stx3bFYDRXuKNj7V2g4FGlGMog:1620929235028&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsvYn6n8fwAhWJCRAIHRUlAiEQ_AUoAXoECAMQAQ&biw=360&bih=544

(and most of this sugar is a naturally occurring sugar in flour meaning you can't even make manufacturers decrease it).

You don't get fat by eating a slice of bread a day or 2 oz of deli meat. Don't eat too much of it - but that's a personal choice.

Subway. 5 grams of sugar per 6 inch roll, so much that in Ireland, Subway bread has legally been declared cake. Subway, billed as such a healthy choice because it’s low-fat. I don’t personally eat Subway, but let’s not pretend that it’s so uncommon. DP.

So? A 6 inch sub has 300-500 calories. No one is getting obese from eating a 6 inch sub for lunch once in a while and whether the bread has 5 gm sugar or 2 gm isnt going to make a difference in your health. A qboda burrito has over 1300 calories.

Again. It’s not calories in, calories out. It’s the sugar. It’s probably also additives that have a synergistic effect, but mostly the sugar. And people pushing the low cal, low fat lifestyle have done untold damage to people whose genetics are inclined to gain weight with excess sugar. But please go on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Why are you inventing this? No, *you* check the labels. It's so easy to verify and disprove that I kinda feel secondhand embarrassment.

Please show us a nutritional label with more than 3 or 4 grams of sugar per slice of bread. Spoiler alert: there is none. Not a single one. (And if you manage to find a bread that does have more than that - that's on you, obviously it's a rarity.)

https://www.google.com/search?q=white+bread+nutrition+label&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=ALeKk006Stx3bFYDRXuKNj7V2g4FGlGMog:1620929235028&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsvYn6n8fwAhWJCRAIHRUlAiEQ_AUoAXoECAMQAQ&biw=360&bih=544

(and most of this sugar is a naturally occurring sugar in flour meaning you can't even make manufacturers decrease it).

You don't get fat by eating a slice of bread a day or 2 oz of deli meat. Don't eat too much of it - but that's a personal choice.

Subway. 5 grams of sugar per 6 inch roll, so much that in Ireland, Subway bread has legally been declared cake. Subway, billed as such a healthy choice because it’s low-fat. I don’t personally eat Subway, but let’s not pretend that it’s so uncommon. DP.

Probably that's why so many people are overweight - because they can't tell apples from oranges, they can't understand labels...

Okay, so how much did a 6 inch Subway roll weigh? It's 70 to 80 grams. A slice of bread is typically 25 to 45 grams.

See? 5 grams of sugar in a 70 g roll is roughly the same as 3 grams of sugar in a 40 g slice of bread. It's really simple.

https://www.google.com/search?q=subway+roll+nutritional+information&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjR1YqbqcfwAhU-7bsIHXx4DysQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=subway+roll+nutritional+information&gs_lcp=ChJtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1pbWcQAzoECCMQJ1D4YFj4YGCcY2gAcAB4AIABkQGIAf4BkgEDMC4ymAEAoAEBwAEB&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-img&ei=iHSdYNHxCb7a7_UP_PC92AI&bih=544&biw=360&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=ismvn#imgrc=iPngztPzg7c5cM

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Why are you inventing this? No, *you* check the labels. It's so easy to verify and disprove that I kinda feel secondhand embarrassment.

Please show us a nutritional label with more than 3 or 4 grams of sugar per slice of bread. Spoiler alert: there is none. Not a single one. (And if you manage to find a bread that does have more than that - that's on you, obviously it's a rarity.)

https://www.google.com/search?q=white+bread+nutrition+label&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=ALeKk006Stx3bFYDRXuKNj7V2g4FGlGMog:1620929235028&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsvYn6n8fwAhWJCRAIHRUlAiEQ_AUoAXoECAMQAQ&biw=360&bih=544

(and most of this sugar is a naturally occurring sugar in flour meaning you can't even make manufacturers decrease it).

You don't get fat by eating a slice of bread a day or 2 oz of deli meat. Don't eat too much of it - but that's a personal choice.

Subway. 5 grams of sugar per 6 inch roll, so much that in Ireland, Subway bread has legally been declared cake. Subway, billed as such a healthy choice because it’s low-fat. I don’t personally eat Subway, but let’s not pretend that it’s so uncommon. DP.

So? A 6 inch sub has 300-500 calories. No one is getting obese from eating a 6 inch sub for lunch once in a while and whether the bread has 5 gm sugar or 2 gm isn't going to make a difference in your health. A qboda burrito has over 1300 calories.

It's not about sub itself or the calories, it's the domino effect 5 grams of sugar can cause in your body,
Added sugar causes glucose level spikes, due to metabolic syndrome pancreas pumps out more insulin than needed, so after spike there is a steep dip down that drives hunger and cravings. And what do you really want during those dips? Right, sugar as fastest available source to bring glucose level up. And there you go again - up and down, up and down. And you're ended up overeating, because those cravings are really hard to control, they stronger than you.
Oh, and on top of that - dips in the blood glucose levels can cause release of the stress hormone cortisol, that also plays huge role in that whole circle.
Easiest way to manage - monitor sugar, in every bite, every time, everywhere. One wrong step - and you're on that glucose/insulin/cortisol roller-coaster again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. The denial is crazy. It is not a chicken before the egg scenario. It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues. Not all, but most people that get them have been overweight (with normal blood panels) for some time before being diagnosed.

It’s not denial. You are completely ignorant. There is ample evidence that the metabolic condition develops first and drives the weight gain. For example in Cushing’s. Or - maybe you just want people with Cushing’s to diet past those pesky pituitary tumors?

Ok..cushing's syndrome is very small percentage of people and not what we are talking about. The most common being type II diabetes and insulin resistance largely driven by being overweight and inactive. The end, Drs all know it. Educate yourself.

No, I know that, but it is indeed what we’re talking about. Just because it proves that your claim was wrong you want to pretend it’s irrelevant, but it’s not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Why are you inventing this? No, *you* check the labels. It's so easy to verify and disprove that I kinda feel secondhand embarrassment.

Please show us a nutritional label with more than 3 or 4 grams of sugar per slice of bread. Spoiler alert: there is none. Not a single one. (And if you manage to find a bread that does have more than that - that's on you, obviously it's a rarity.)

https://www.google.com/search?q=white+bread+nutrition+label&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=ALeKk006Stx3bFYDRXuKNj7V2g4FGlGMog:1620929235028&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsvYn6n8fwAhWJCRAIHRUlAiEQ_AUoAXoECAMQAQ&biw=360&bih=544

(and most of this sugar is a naturally occurring sugar in flour meaning you can't even make manufacturers decrease it).

You don't get fat by eating a slice of bread a day or 2 oz of deli meat. Don't eat too much of it - but that's a personal choice.

Subway. 5 grams of sugar per 6 inch roll, so much that in Ireland, Subway bread has legally been declared cake. Subway, billed as such a healthy choice because it’s low-fat. I don’t personally eat Subway, but let’s not pretend that it’s so uncommon. DP.

Probably that's why so many people are overweight - because they can't tell apples from oranges, they can't understand labels...

Okay, so how much did a 6 inch Subway roll weigh? It's 70 to 80 grams. A slice of bread is typically 25 to 45 grams.

See? 5 grams of sugar in a 70 g roll is roughly the same as 3 grams of sugar in a 40 g slice of bread. It's really simple.

https://www.google.com/search?q=subway+roll+nutritional+information&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjR1YqbqcfwAhU-7bsIHXx4DysQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=subway+roll+nutritional+information&gs_lcp=ChJtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1pbWcQAzoECCMQJ1D4YFj4YGCcY2gAcAB4AIABkQGIAf4BkgEDMC4ymAEAoAEBwAEB&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-img&ei=iHSdYNHxCb7a7_UP_PC92AI&bih=544&biw=360&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=ismvn#imgrc=iPngztPzg7c5cM

If you’re the one claiming that 3 g of sugar isn’t a big deal, you just proved the other PP’s point. Again, in Ireland (and I believe some other countries), that is legally cake. And you’re telling people with metabolic issues that it’s nothing? Please listen when those of us who know: sugar is to weight gain what oxygen is to fire.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Why are you inventing this? No, *you* check the labels. It's so easy to verify and disprove that I kinda feel secondhand embarrassment.

Please show us a nutritional label with more than 3 or 4 grams of sugar per slice of bread. Spoiler alert: there is none. Not a single one. (And if you manage to find a bread that does have more than that - that's on you, obviously it's a rarity.)

https://www.google.com/search?q=white+bread+nutrition+label&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=ALeKk006Stx3bFYDRXuKNj7V2g4FGlGMog:1620929235028&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsvYn6n8fwAhWJCRAIHRUlAiEQ_AUoAXoECAMQAQ&biw=360&bih=544

(and most of this sugar is a naturally occurring sugar in flour meaning you can't even make manufacturers decrease it).

You don't get fat by eating a slice of bread a day or 2 oz of deli meat. Don't eat too much of it - but that's a personal choice.

Subway. 5 grams of sugar per 6 inch roll, so much that in Ireland, Subway bread has legally been declared cake. Subway, billed as such a healthy choice because it’s low-fat. I don’t personally eat Subway, but let’s not pretend that it’s so uncommon. DP.

Probably that's why so many people are overweight - because they can't tell apples from oranges, they can't understand labels...

Okay, so how much did a 6 inch Subway roll weigh? It's 70 to 80 grams. A slice of bread is typically 25 to 45 grams.

See? 5 grams of sugar in a 70 g roll is roughly the same as 3 grams of sugar in a 40 g slice of bread. It's really simple.

https://www.google.com/search?q=subway+roll+nutritional+information&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjR1YqbqcfwAhU-7bsIHXx4DysQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=subway+roll+nutritional+information&gs_lcp=ChJtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1pbWcQAzoECCMQJ1D4YFj4YGCcY2gAcAB4AIABkQGIAf4BkgEDMC4ymAEAoAEBwAEB&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-img&ei=iHSdYNHxCb7a7_UP_PC92AI&bih=544&biw=360&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=ismvn#imgrc=iPngztPzg7c5cM

If you’re the one claiming that 3 g of sugar isn’t a big deal, you just proved the other PP’s point. Again, in Ireland (and I believe some other countries), that is legally cake. And you’re telling people with metabolic issues that it’s nothing? Please listen when those of us who know: sugar is to weight gain what oxygen is to fire.

If you have metabolic issues, you shouldn't be eating fast food.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Why are you inventing this? No, *you* check the labels. It's so easy to verify and disprove that I kinda feel secondhand embarrassment.

Please show us a nutritional label with more than 3 or 4 grams of sugar per slice of bread. Spoiler alert: there is none. Not a single one. (And if you manage to find a bread that does have more than that - that's on you, obviously it's a rarity.)

https://www.google.com/search?q=white+bread+nutrition+label&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=ALeKk006Stx3bFYDRXuKNj7V2g4FGlGMog:1620929235028&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsvYn6n8fwAhWJCRAIHRUlAiEQ_AUoAXoECAMQAQ&biw=360&bih=544

(and most of this sugar is a naturally occurring sugar in flour meaning you can't even make manufacturers decrease it).

You don't get fat by eating a slice of bread a day or 2 oz of deli meat. Don't eat too much of it - but that's a personal choice.

Subway. 5 grams of sugar per 6 inch roll, so much that in Ireland, Subway bread has legally been declared cake. Subway, billed as such a healthy choice because it’s low-fat. I don’t personally eat Subway, but let’s not pretend that it’s so uncommon. DP.

Probably that's why so many people are overweight - because they can't tell apples from oranges, they can't understand labels...

Okay, so how much did a 6 inch Subway roll weigh? It's 70 to 80 grams. A slice of bread is typically 25 to 45 grams.

See? 5 grams of sugar in a 70 g roll is roughly the same as 3 grams of sugar in a 40 g slice of bread. It's really simple.

https://www.google.com/search?q=subway+roll+nutritional+information&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjR1YqbqcfwAhU-7bsIHXx4DysQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=subway+roll+nutritional+information&gs_lcp=ChJtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1pbWcQAzoECCMQJ1D4YFj4YGCcY2gAcAB4AIABkQGIAf4BkgEDMC4ymAEAoAEBwAEB&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-img&ei=iHSdYNHxCb7a7_UP_PC92AI&bih=544&biw=360&client=ms-android-xiaomi&prmd=ismvn#imgrc=iPngztPzg7c5cM

If you’re the one claiming that 3 g of sugar isn’t a big deal, you just proved the other PP’s point. Again, in Ireland (and I believe some other countries), that is legally cake. And you’re telling people with metabolic issues that it’s nothing? Please listen when those of us who know: sugar is to weight gain what oxygen is to fire.

If you have metabolic issues, you shouldn't be eating fast food.

Yeah, and also 95% of the products in the supermarket. So, back to square 1 - if 50% of the population should avoid fast food and 95% of the food sold in the grocery stores - who's problem is that? Individuals or society as a whole?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. The denial is crazy. It is not a chicken before the egg scenario. It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues. Not all, but most people that get them have been overweight (with normal blood panels) for some time before being diagnosed.

It’s not denial. You are completely ignorant. There is ample evidence that the metabolic condition develops first and drives the weight gain. For example in Cushing’s. Or - maybe you just want people with Cushing’s to diet past those pesky pituitary tumors?

Ok..cushing's syndrome is very small percentage of people and not what we are talking about. The most common being type II diabetes and insulin resistance largely driven by being overweight and inactive. The end, Drs all know it. Educate yourself.

No, I know that, but it is indeed what we’re talking about. Just because it proves that your claim was wrong you want to pretend it’s irrelevant, but it’s not.

Cushing's syndrome and type II diabetes are separate diseases with completely different pathologies. Don't try to weasel out of admitting being overweight contributes to the most prevelent metabolic issues; type II diabetes and pre-diabetes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. The denial is crazy. It is not a chicken before the egg scenario. It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues. Not all, but most people that get them have been overweight (with normal blood panels) for some time before being diagnosed.

It’s not denial. You are completely ignorant. There is ample evidence that the metabolic condition develops first and drives the weight gain. For example in Cushing’s. Or - maybe you just want people with Cushing’s to diet past those pesky pituitary tumors?

Ok..cushing's syndrome is very small percentage of people and not what we are talking about. The most common being type II diabetes and insulin resistance largely driven by being overweight and inactive. The end, Drs all know it. Educate yourself.

No, I know that, but it is indeed what we’re talking about. Just because it proves that your claim was wrong you want to pretend it’s irrelevant, but it’s not.

Cushing's syndrome and type II diabetes are separate diseases with completely different pathologies. Don't try to weasel out of admitting being overweight contributes to the most prevelent metabolic issues; type II diabetes and pre-diabetes.

You, or someone whose viewpoint you’re defending said, “It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues.” And I gave an example of a metabolic disorder that most definitely causes weight gain. I’m not weaseling out of anything; I’m proving you wrong.

Just once I wish one of you know it alls would read a book or two.
This will blow your mind. https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Get-Fat-About/dp/0307272702/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=
Learn all about the atypical cases of fat and what it means for regular fat. Fat’s an organ; did you know? https://www.amazon.com/Secret-Life-Fat-Science-Understood/dp/0393354970/ref=pd_sbs_55?pd_rd_w=Cz729&pf_rd_p=2419a049-62bf-452e-b0d0-ca5b7e35a7b4&pf_rd_r=SFPE32W3AXBKB2W3JMM0&pd_rd_r=05275855-5dac-469f-91c1-311e24be865c&pd_rd_wg=TwURH&pd_rd_i=0393354970&psc=1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow do people not know tons of big law lawyers who are really good at their jobs and also fat? It’s almost like being a dedicated conscientious person doesn’t have much to do with your body weight!

Anyway we need to just leave fat people alone. Telling them and others that they are unhealthy and are just making excuses to be unhealthy doesn’t do anything. How about we instead make healthy food accessible, make gym memberships and health breaks a part of the work force, get grocery stores in food deserts, spend more money on school lunches to make them healthy AND taste good, etc. Those things would actually make a difference , not looking at a fat person eating ice cream and saying “ick!”

Healthy food is available. Anyone can talk a walk. It doesn't really matter. People choose to eat junk because it tastes better (to many), as pointed out. As long as high calorie junk food is being sold, enough people will continue to buy it/eat it over healthier foods time and time again.

To add: No one should feel hatred toward another person because of how they look. That is wrong. I don't think overweight people are "ick" I feel bad for them because I know it is a struggle in many different ways. But your thinking doesn't help the epidemic. It isn't the lack of gym memberships, the work day, or someone's income that causes obesity. It is part food addiction, part bad habits around food, part poor choices in food. The solution is entirely down to personal choices. That doesn't make it easy; but it is what it is. I don't think less than anyone because they aren't able to make the continuous choices needed to lose weight or stay at a healthy weight. It is hard. But my trying to place blame on the food industry, the workplace, schools...the solution isn't there.

Do you disagree that putting the blame on tobacco companies solved the smoking crisis? That putting the onus on car companies for car safety was wrong? This is how it has been throughout history. When someone can make a buck, and in this case a lottttta bucks on a human weakness they will. You can blame the human weakness and nothing will happen, or you can blame the industry and less people die.

When I hear people talk like this I continue to be convinced that you care a lot more about fat people understanding their moral failings then actually doing anything to solve the crisis.

Everyone has to eat. You can't edit away obesity by way of the food industry. One cigarette is harmful to you, one time in the car without seatbelt could be fetal. Eating one McDs hamburger is not harmful. Drinking one coke a week is fine and you won't be able to prove any scientific harm from that. As long as people have easy access to good tasting foods that they don't have to go to through trouble and time to prepare and cook..you will have over eating and obesity in large numbers. There is no solution that does not include a large amount of self control and good choices.

Can we just start small? Not ban McD and ice-cream, but regulate sugar content in the products that shouldn't have it to begging with? Bread, deli meat, etc. Remove sugary drinks from school-provided breakfast and lunches.
I enjoy occasional burger and fries, but on the regular basis I go to the grocery store with magnifying glass to make sure the normal food I buy is not infused with sugar. And let me tell you - it's not easy.

DP here (not Big Law but I agree with her).

Most breads need sugar for yeast to rise. I bake my bread so I know that. However, the amount of sugar in regular bread is usually pretty small - like 1 tbsp per 3 cups of flour (that's 2 or 3 max per one slice of even commercially produced bread). The flour itself, however, is very high in carbs so even if it would have been possible not to add any sugar at all, it wouldn't make any difference.

If someone wants to lose weight he or she needs either to ditch bread altogether for some period of time or eat much less of it. So in the end, everything still boils down to personal choice.

Same with deli meat, the amount of sugar is pretty small (3-4 grams per 2 oz serving). But it does add up if you eat too much... personal choice again )

I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

No I am not blind, in fact I lost 33 lbs by going low carb and creating calorie deficit. So trust me I know a LOT about hidden carbs. Even so, I am absolutely positive that 3 grams of sugar in 60 grams of deli meat is not much.

Let me rephrase it - i doesn't matter what percentage of that meat is sugar because if you eat 2 oz deli meat you will still consume only 3 g of sugar.

Three. grams.

This amount should be 0. period. Sugar has no place in deli meat. Add extra sugar in the bread, dressing etc- and you have a dessert instead of apparently healthy lunch. And it is a huge problem, especially for those of us who prone to metabolic issues such as insulin resistance. And I'm not alone - Just check stats for metabolic diseases. You'll see that's way beyond personal choices, it's systematic issue.

Most metabolic issues are from eating too much, storing extra fat. If you weren't overweight and didn't have metabolic issues, a small amount of sugar in a deli meat isn't going to be an issue. Sure they and should take it out- but that isn't really what the problem is

What was the first - chicken or the egg?
Being overweigh causing metabolic issues or having metabolic issues causes extra-weight buildup? Catch 22 or Möbius ring without beginning or end.
Point is, sugar everywhere triggers metabolic issues, and therefore weight gain for half of the population
Have you looked at the statistic? According to CDC - 34.2 million Americans—just over 1 in 10—have diabetes, 88 million American adults—approximately 1 in 3—have prediabetes. And those numbers don't include insulin resistance aka metabolic syndrome with is a step before pre-diabetic.

Wow. The denial is crazy. It is not a chicken before the egg scenario. It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues. Not all, but most people that get them have been overweight (with normal blood panels) for some time before being diagnosed.

Your ignorance is astonishing. Educate yourself on the subject. Just a little. For example, read about anti-diabetic drug metformin and it's effect on the weight loss.

Seriously. I am the PP who lost 40 pounds this year controlling insulin with intermittent fasting. Always been overweight, the only one in my family.

Exactly, you were overweight for YEARS before you started having insulin resistance. I'm guessing you had blood work done at some point in your life and it was likely normal-until it wasn't. Yes, getting it under control will help you lose, but being overweight in the first place contributed to your body processing insulin abnormally.

No, I misspoke. I was a high but normal weight, started gaining rapidly in my late teens, saw a doctor and was diagnosed with insulin resistance via PCOS, triggered into overdrive by puberty. I did say that in my previous post and I think its because I always felt fat, because I was always feeling like the biggest person. Since childhood I was on the high end of normal. And everyone in my family is skinny. So I was always made to feel fat. But it seems clear to me now that I've always had insulin resistance. Which is why despite growing up in the same house eating the same foods my siblings and I look really different today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow do people not know tons of big law lawyers who are really good at their jobs and also fat? It’s almost like being a dedicated conscientious person doesn’t have much to do with your body weight!

Anyway we need to just leave fat people alone. Telling them and others that they are unhealthy and are just making excuses to be unhealthy doesn’t do anything. How about we instead make healthy food accessible, make gym memberships and health breaks a part of the work force, get grocery stores in food deserts, spend more money on school lunches to make them healthy AND taste good, etc. Those things would actually make a difference , not looking at a fat person eating ice cream and saying “ick!”

Healthy food is available. Anyone can talk a walk. It doesn't really matter. People choose to eat junk because it tastes better (to many), as pointed out. As long as high calorie junk food is being sold, enough people will continue to buy it/eat it over healthier foods time and time again.

To add: No one should feel hatred toward another person because of how they look. That is wrong. I don't think overweight people are "ick" I feel bad for them because I know it is a struggle in many different ways. But your thinking doesn't help the epidemic. It isn't the lack of gym memberships, the work day, or someone's income that causes obesity. It is part food addiction, part bad habits around food, part poor choices in food. The solution is entirely down to personal choices. That doesn't make it easy; but it is what it is. I don't think less than anyone because they aren't able to make the continuous choices needed to lose weight or stay at a healthy weight. It is hard. But my trying to place blame on the food industry, the workplace, schools...the solution isn't there.

Do you disagree that putting the blame on tobacco companies solved the smoking crisis? That putting the onus on car companies for car safety was wrong? This is how it has been throughout history. When someone can make a buck, and in this case a lottttta bucks on a human weakness they will. You can blame the human weakness and nothing will happen, or you can blame the industry and less people die.

When I hear people talk like this I continue to be convinced that you care a lot more about fat people understanding their moral failings then actually doing anything to solve the crisis.

Everyone has to eat. You can't edit away obesity by way of the food industry. One cigarette is harmful to you, one time in the car without seatbelt could be fetal. Eating one McDs hamburger is not harmful. Drinking one coke a week is fine and you won't be able to prove any scientific harm from that. As long as people have easy access to good tasting foods that they don't have to go to through trouble and time to prepare and cook..you will have over eating and obesity in large numbers. There is no solution that does not include a large amount of self control and good choices.

Can we just start small? Not ban McD and ice-cream, but regulate sugar content in the products that shouldn't have it to begging with? Bread, deli meat, etc. Remove sugary drinks from school-provided breakfast and lunches.
I enjoy occasional burger and fries, but on the regular basis I go to the grocery store with magnifying glass to make sure the normal food I buy is not infused with sugar. And let me tell you - it's not easy.

DP here (not Big Law but I agree with her).

Most breads need sugar for yeast to rise. I bake my bread so I know that. However, the amount of sugar in regular bread is usually pretty small - like 1 tbsp per 3 cups of flour (that's 2 or 3 max per one slice of even commercially produced bread). The flour itself, however, is very high in carbs so even if it would have been possible not to add any sugar at all, it wouldn't make any difference.

If someone wants to lose weight he or she needs either to ditch bread altogether for some period of time or eat much less of it. So in the end, everything still boils down to personal choice.

Same with deli meat, the amount of sugar is pretty small (3-4 grams per 2 oz serving). But it does add up if you eat too much... personal choice again )

I bake bread too and aware of amount of sugar needed. 90%+ of the bread on supermarket shelfs has much more then that. Check the labels
3-4 g on 2 oz is not a minimal amount, it means that 7-10% of that serving is sugar!
Whether to eat or not eat bread/lunch meat/ketchup is besides the point. Food industry infuse majority of products with sugar as flavor enhancers, therefore normal food became an addictive drug. My personal choice is to bake my own bread and roast some meat for sandwiches, but I have time and means to do it.
Majority of the society (you included - see your comment about minimal non-harmful amount of sugar) is blind to the effect of added sugar and what it does to the population in general. Those small amounts kills your pancreas overtime, wreck metabolism, but nobody cares. It's personal choices, right?

Yes, regular bread definitely had a load of unnecessary sugar. When I first arrived in the US, I actually spat out my first bite of bread from Giant and subsequently spent an inordinate amount of time reading labels on bread to find something with less sugar. We foreigners swap tops on where to get ‘regular’ bread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. The denial is crazy. It is not a chicken before the egg scenario. It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues. Not all, but most people that get them have been overweight (with normal blood panels) for some time before being diagnosed.

It’s not denial. You are completely ignorant. There is ample evidence that the metabolic condition develops first and drives the weight gain. For example in Cushing’s. Or - maybe you just want people with Cushing’s to diet past those pesky pituitary tumors?

Ok..cushing's syndrome is very small percentage of people and not what we are talking about. The most common being type II diabetes and insulin resistance largely driven by being overweight and inactive. The end, Drs all know it. Educate yourself.

No, I know that, but it is indeed what we’re talking about. Just because it proves that your claim was wrong you want to pretend it’s irrelevant, but it’s not.

Cushing's syndrome and type II diabetes are separate diseases with completely different pathologies. Don't try to weasel out of admitting being overweight contributes to the most prevelent metabolic issues; type II diabetes and pre-diabetes.

You, or someone whose viewpoint you’re defending said, “It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues.” And I gave an example of a metabolic disorder that most definitely causes weight gain. I’m not weaseling out of anything; I’m proving you wrong.

Just once I wish one of you know it alls would read a book or two.
This will blow your mind. https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Get-Fat-About/dp/0307272702/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=
Learn all about the atypical cases of fat and what it means for regular fat. Fat’s an organ; did you know? https://www.amazon.com/Secret-Life-Fat-Science-Understood/dp/0393354970/ref=pd_sbs_55?pd_rd_w=Cz729&pf_rd_p=2419a049-62bf-452e-b0d0-ca5b7e35a7b4&pf_rd_r=SFPE32W3AXBKB2W3JMM0&pd_rd_r=05275855-5dac-469f-91c1-311e24be865c&pd_rd_wg=TwURH&pd_rd_i=0393354970&psc=1

New poster here. So, you are both right. Being overweight put you are risk for developing metabolic issues, but only 90% to 95% of the time. Nearly all reputable sources conclude that obesity and an inactive lifestyle are two of the most common causes of type 2 diabetes. These things are responsible for about 90% to 95% of diabetes cases in the United States.

Cushing's falls in the 5% to 10% range that is outside of the 90%-95% of cases that apply to the vast majority of people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. The denial is crazy. It is not a chicken before the egg scenario. It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues. Not all, but most people that get them have been overweight (with normal blood panels) for some time before being diagnosed.

It’s not denial. You are completely ignorant. There is ample evidence that the metabolic condition develops first and drives the weight gain. For example in Cushing’s. Or - maybe you just want people with Cushing’s to diet past those pesky pituitary tumors?

Ok..cushing's syndrome is very small percentage of people and not what we are talking about. The most common being type II diabetes and insulin resistance largely driven by being overweight and inactive. The end, Drs all know it. Educate yourself.

No, I know that, but it is indeed what we’re talking about. Just because it proves that your claim was wrong you want to pretend it’s irrelevant, but it’s not.

Cushing's syndrome and type II diabetes are separate diseases with completely different pathologies. Don't try to weasel out of admitting being overweight contributes to the most prevelent metabolic issues; type II diabetes and pre-diabetes.

You, or someone whose viewpoint you’re defending said, “It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues.” And I gave an example of a metabolic disorder that most definitely causes weight gain. I’m not weaseling out of anything; I’m proving you wrong.

Just once I wish one of you know it alls would read a book or two.
This will blow your mind. https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Get-Fat-About/dp/0307272702/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=
Learn all about the atypical cases of fat and what it means for regular fat. Fat’s an organ; did you know? https://www.amazon.com/Secret-Life-Fat-Science-Understood/dp/0393354970/ref=pd_sbs_55?pd_rd_w=Cz729&pf_rd_p=2419a049-62bf-452e-b0d0-ca5b7e35a7b4&pf_rd_r=SFPE32W3AXBKB2W3JMM0&pd_rd_r=05275855-5dac-469f-91c1-311e24be865c&pd_rd_wg=TwURH&pd_rd_i=0393354970&psc=1

New poster here. So, you are both right. Being overweight put you are risk for developing metabolic issues, but only 90% to 95% of the time. Nearly all reputable sources conclude that [b]obesity and an inactive lifestyle are two of the most common causes of type 2 diabetes. These things are responsible for about 90% to 95% of diabetes cases in the United States.

Cushing's falls in the 5% to 10% range that is outside of the 90%-95% of cases that apply to the vast majority of people.

Can you city your sources, please?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. The denial is crazy. It is not a chicken before the egg scenario. It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues. Not all, but most people that get them have been overweight (with normal blood panels) for some time before being diagnosed.

It’s not denial. You are completely ignorant. There is ample evidence that the metabolic condition develops first and drives the weight gain. For example in Cushing’s. Or - maybe you just want people with Cushing’s to diet past those pesky pituitary tumors?

Ok..cushing's syndrome is very small percentage of people and not what we are talking about. The most common being type II diabetes and insulin resistance largely driven by being overweight and inactive. The end, Drs all know it. Educate yourself.

No, I know that, but it is indeed what we’re talking about. Just because it proves that your claim was wrong you want to pretend it’s irrelevant, but it’s not.

Cushing's syndrome and type II diabetes are separate diseases with completely different pathologies. Don't try to weasel out of admitting being overweight contributes to the most prevelent metabolic issues; type II diabetes and pre-diabetes.

You, or someone whose viewpoint you’re defending said, “It is fact being overweight puts you at risk for developing metabolic issues.” And I gave an example of a metabolic disorder that most definitely causes weight gain. I’m not weaseling out of anything; I’m proving you wrong.

Just once I wish one of you know it alls would read a book or two.
This will blow your mind. https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Get-Fat-About/dp/0307272702/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=
Learn all about the atypical cases of fat and what it means for regular fat. Fat’s an organ; did you know? https://www.amazon.com/Secret-Life-Fat-Science-Understood/dp/0393354970/ref=pd_sbs_55?pd_rd_w=Cz729&pf_rd_p=2419a049-62bf-452e-b0d0-ca5b7e35a7b4&pf_rd_r=SFPE32W3AXBKB2W3JMM0&pd_rd_r=05275855-5dac-469f-91c1-311e24be865c&pd_rd_wg=TwURH&pd_rd_i=0393354970&psc=1

New poster here. So, you are both right. Being overweight put you are risk for developing metabolic issues, but only 90% to 95% of the time. Nearly all reputable sources conclude that obesity and an inactive lifestyle are two of the most common causes of type 2 diabetes. These things are responsible for about 90% to 95% of diabetes cases in the United States.

Cushing's falls in the 5% to 10% range that is outside of the 90%-95% of cases that apply to the vast majority of people.

It’s 2021. 5% is the new 100%. Right? Also, the cheeseburgers made people eat them.

In short, we can’t even have this discussion if the conversation diverts to rare disorders to the exclusion of actually talking about the overwhelming majority.