Breaking up with my toxic mom group (Ashley Tisdale essay)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I first read about this on Reddit and people were saying the mom group was lead by Hilary Duff and also included Mandy Moore, and possibly/likely Meghan Trainor and Lea Michele. And some women who were likely not famous but were rich and well-connected, either from their husbands or from their own work as celeb stylists, influencers, etc. So a real group of A-listers …

It sounded like Ashley came late to the group and was a fringe friend/member or the queen bees Hilary and Mandy didn’t really care for her too much and wouldn’t let her into the “inner circle.” Tale as old as time! She was right to extract herself from the group when she did.

I wonder if Emily from the old Cupcakes and Cashmere blog is part of mom group? And is this the same group that sort of kicked Minka Kelly out because they started having kids and she didn't?

Confirmation: i see Ems, Christina, Raina, and a Striker sister in the alleged toxic mom gang per page six

Who is the surgeon who did all these women's faces? I don't know whether to condemn him or nominate him for a comedy award, I can't tell anyone apart. This is like the limousine liberal's answer to the Mara Lago makeover. Horrid and hilarious. And red lipstick always makes face work look more cartoonish, just so you know.

I don't think they've had surgery but that hair! Are they not allowed to join unless they have straight, longish blondish center parted hair? All the rich women I know have this same boring hair. God forbid you cut bangs or have a hint of a curl.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I first read about this on Reddit and people were saying the mom group was lead by Hilary Duff and also included Mandy Moore, and possibly/likely Meghan Trainor and Lea Michele. And some women who were likely not famous but were rich and well-connected, either from their husbands or from their own work as celeb stylists, influencers, etc. So a real group of A-listers …

It sounded like Ashley came late to the group and was a fringe friend/member or the queen bees Hilary and Mandy didn’t really care for her too much and wouldn’t let her into the “inner circle.” Tale as old as time! She was right to extract herself from the group when she did.

I wonder if Emily from the old Cupcakes and Cashmere blog is part of mom group? And is this the same group that sort of kicked Minka Kelly out because they started having kids and she didn't?

Confirmation: i see Ems, Christina, Raina, and a Striker sister in the alleged toxic mom gang per page six

Who is the surgeon who did all these women's faces? I don't know whether to condemn him or nominate him for a comedy award, I can't tell anyone apart. This is like the limousine liberal's answer to the Mara Lago makeover. Horrid and hilarious. And red lipstick always makes face work look more cartoonish, just so you know.

I don't think they've had surgery but that hair! Are they not allowed to join unless they have straight, longish blondish center parted hair? All the rich women I know have this same boring hair. God forbid you cut bangs or have a hint of a curl.

My daughter asked for a steam straightener for Christmas and got one from her grandmother. I'd never seen or used anything like it before. DD and I both have hair that is both wavy/curly but also very fine. It tends towards frizz. I handle mine using a sort of curly girl method but it doesn't work for DD who is a swimmer and a dancer and really has to wash her hair daily or almost daily. We've been trying to figure out something that will help make her hair more manageable given that she frequently showers after swim or dance class and then sleeps on damp hair, resulting in a real mess in the AM.

The steam straightener makes her hair (and mine, we tried it) look like these ladies' hair. I even have bangs but the straightener makes them blend in with the rest of my hair. It's like this very specific result where the hair is straight but not not like stick straight, it retains some of the natural bend. And it makes your hair look very smooth and shiny. But it also flattens it out so we lose most of the natural height and body in our hair -- my hair normally has a natural "rise" of like 2-3 inches on the top of my head from the curl, and the steam completely flattens it.

So now I know how to get boring rich white lady hair. What a weird discovery to make at 45, I would have been so excited to figure this out at 30 when I was very insecure and wanted to fit in at work and at a total loss for how to handle my frizz-prone hair. Oh well!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tisdale’s article appeared on my newsfeed today right next to the headlines about Tatiana schlossberg’s funeral and untimely death from aggressive cancer. A stark contrast and a reminder of how completely asinine and unimportant this entire topic is. It’s pedantic that cliques exist amongst grown adults and attention and validation seeking that tisdale would write an article about it. People lack perspective on what’s important in life.

Of course it seems unimportant compared to someone dying at a young age from cancer. 99% of this website is unimportant compared to that.

But friendships, finding support as a mom, and just generally having community are actually very important.

Which you can do without the friend “group” angle. Your own mom, or other women who have raised kids and share their wisdom and advice, coworkers, one-on-one friends. There’s so many ways to have the support and community, without the “group” part of it.

Many, many women find themselves in Mom groups. They want to know other moms in the neighborhood with babies the same age. This isn't remotely weird or odd.

The “group” idea is odd. Most people find 1-2 people they like in a group.

In a class of people you find 1-2 friends.
On a sports team you find 1-2 friends.
At work you find 1-2 friends.

The idea you will find a group where every single person is close friends is not real life.

Ok? But in that group are people pointedly excluding you, being weird and sitting you far away from the rest of the group, making plans in front of you? We don't all have to be friends but some of these women went out of their way to be jerks. It's not that hard to be nice at a kid's birthday party and not you know, invite all the other girlies for something like a brunch the next day in front of the hostess and not include her.

In a class we break into groups and yes I’m not part of every group. In school at lunch the lunch tables are harder to join than sororities. I’m not invited to every study group. In sports I’m not always invited to get food after practice, I don’t sit with certain people at pre-game dinners.

I go to birthday parties and don’t talk to every parent.

Your taking this not talk about something too far. It reminds me of the movie Booksmart where nobody’s allowed to talk about what school they got into because it might hurt somebody’s feelings.

Here’s the reality people are doing things without you. Some people have more money than you. Some people go on vacation vacations with friends and you’re not invited. You’re not invited to every brunch.

Find your one or two friends and do something with them.

Oh please. This is about what Ashley wrote. If you want to talk about your own personal groups do that elsewhere. What she described sucks.

We are in the relationship forum not the entertainment forum. This is talking about women groups in general.

Ashley, just needs to relax. People are mean I could write 20 articles about mean women I’ve met in the DC area.

Really? It’s not new. It’s not interesting.

Exactly. She wrote this article like she was me too’d. The mom group sounds like a cult. Just make a few friends and stop referring to yourself as a group.

One of my kids had a small preschool pod that was together for a few years. Us mom in the group bonded. We love seeing each other and some of our kids do some activities together, we have a what’s app group and sometimes get dinner. But some individuals are closer to each other than others and we all have other friends. What tisdale is whining about seems so immature. She’s 40 years old and doesn’t need her friend group to be everything in life, and even weirder to use her kids as a vehicle for it.

Sounds a bit hypocritical coming from someone with a group based around preschoolers. Find your own friends and leave the kids out if it.

We don’t have a “group.” We like each other and stay in touch and get dinner sometimes. We all have our own lives and friends outside of it and there’s no “Queen bee” dynamic.

The irritating parts of this saga are:

- grown women acting like they’re in middle school and having a “clique” that does everything together
- grown women behaving like their life revolves around said clique
- rejected clique member feeling so infuriated by her self proclaimed “drama” that they feel the need to expose it on a public way.

Hilary duff and Mandy Moore may be catty (who knows? Not me) but tisdale stirring the pot by creating tabloid fodder - all while framing this like a vanity fair assault expose - also tells you a lot about her level of self absorption as a person.

Pp again. And to add to that, I’d say that everything about duff and Mandy Moore is heresay, based on tisdales account. The only thing we actually know for sure is that tisdale is enough of a drama queen to publish this self absorbed, tone deaf article about a saga of her own creation.

I don’t think you can say it’s all just Ashley Tisdale airing random grievances and “what’s the other side of the story” when Hilary Duff’s husband stepped in, guns a blazin. Now Hilary (and her husband) both look kind of crazy and guilty. They could have stayed out of it and the whole thing would have blown over in a day or two, now look what we’re all talking about.

This. The messiest move here has been Duff's husband attacking Ashley directly, basically confirming for everyone that Hillary is part of the "toxic mom group" even as Ashley was denying that there were other famous moms in the group she was talking about.

Also, just a general pet peeve -- there is no "hearsay" here. It's not court. IRL, people can talk about their experiences and you can decide whether or not you trust their account or not, but there's no rule that you can't share things that other people may have said or done to you. Which, by the way, Tisdale didn't even do because she doesn't even say who any of the moms in her mom group were and she's not actually accusing anyone of anything.

I'm sorry, did you read the article? She's definitely accusing people of being petty, mean, toxic, exclusive, etc. If what she said wasn't bad at all then no one would be talking about it...

You have to name names to accuse people. She was purposefully vague. If her former friends recognized themselves they should have just said they don’t know her or have any idea what she’s talking about if asked. Not do what Mr Duff did.

So they should have...lied?

And no, you don't have to name names to accuse people. It's like when a celebrity says something bad about a co-star. It's not like they're talking about someone else on the planet - they're clearly talking about a defined group of people.

You don’t think celebs lie all the time? It’s what they do. They deny dating rumors, break up rumors, rumors about being difficult on set or having beef with co-stars. Yes, they lie.

Everyone lies. But I find it odd that you're saying that the proper reaction to Ashley's article was to lie. That's...interesting.

In their eyes it would almost certainly just be a denial. To Ashley it might appear to be a lie. She felt iced out and ignored. They might say they just didn’t like her becasue of x, y, z. They likely have a different take. So it’s not a lie but a different interpretation so they “don’t know what she’s talking about” or “aren’t friends” . It’s really not that hard. Do you often see things in black and white?

You literally said that their response should have been to say they didn't know her. As in, they didn't know the person they've been photographed in matching pajamas with. Do you often act this obtuse?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I first read about this on Reddit and people were saying the mom group was lead by Hilary Duff and also included Mandy Moore, and possibly/likely Meghan Trainor and Lea Michele. And some women who were likely not famous but were rich and well-connected, either from their husbands or from their own work as celeb stylists, influencers, etc. So a real group of A-listers …

It sounded like Ashley came late to the group and was a fringe friend/member or the queen bees Hilary and Mandy didn’t really care for her too much and wouldn’t let her into the “inner circle.” Tale as old as time! She was right to extract herself from the group when she did.

I wonder if Emily from the old Cupcakes and Cashmere blog is part of mom group? And is this the same group that sort of kicked Minka Kelly out because they started having kids and she didn't?

Confirmation: i see Ems, Christina, Raina, and a Striker sister in the alleged toxic mom gang per page six

NGL, going on vibes only, this looks like a nightmare.

Is this basically a bunch of rich but not necessarily famous women sucking up to 2-3 actresses/singers?

Perhaps sucking up to D list former child stars with social media followings so they can better sell their products and services? If I were a rich LA mommy with a business and college education why would I want to hang with uneducated socially stunted former child stars and their kids?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just like when the pretty girl gets excluded by the other mean girls at the best lunch table in middle school, this group pulled the same on a former actress. Women can be the worst to other women.

I'm sorry, are you saying Ashley is the pretty girl here? I'm too old to care about any of these women, but she's the least famous of the famous ones in that group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tisdale’s article appeared on my newsfeed today right next to the headlines about Tatiana schlossberg’s funeral and untimely death from aggressive cancer. A stark contrast and a reminder of how completely asinine and unimportant this entire topic is. It’s pedantic that cliques exist amongst grown adults and attention and validation seeking that tisdale would write an article about it. People lack perspective on what’s important in life.

Of course it seems unimportant compared to someone dying at a young age from cancer. 99% of this website is unimportant compared to that.

But friendships, finding support as a mom, and just generally having community are actually very important.

Which you can do without the friend “group” angle. Your own mom, or other women who have raised kids and share their wisdom and advice, coworkers, one-on-one friends. There’s so many ways to have the support and community, without the “group” part of it.

Many, many women find themselves in Mom groups. They want to know other moms in the neighborhood with babies the same age. This isn't remotely weird or odd.

The “group” idea is odd. Most people find 1-2 people they like in a group.

In a class of people you find 1-2 friends.
On a sports team you find 1-2 friends.
At work you find 1-2 friends.

The idea you will find a group where every single person is close friends is not real life.

Ok? But in that group are people pointedly excluding you, being weird and sitting you far away from the rest of the group, making plans in front of you? We don't all have to be friends but some of these women went out of their way to be jerks. It's not that hard to be nice at a kid's birthday party and not you know, invite all the other girlies for something like a brunch the next day in front of the hostess and not include her.

In a class we break into groups and yes I’m not part of every group. In school at lunch the lunch tables are harder to join than sororities. I’m not invited to every study group. In sports I’m not always invited to get food after practice, I don’t sit with certain people at pre-game dinners.

I go to birthday parties and don’t talk to every parent.

Your taking this not talk about something too far. It reminds me of the movie Booksmart where nobody’s allowed to talk about what school they got into because it might hurt somebody’s feelings.

Here’s the reality people are doing things without you. Some people have more money than you. Some people go on vacation vacations with friends and you’re not invited. You’re not invited to every brunch.

Find your one or two friends and do something with them.

Oh please. This is about what Ashley wrote. If you want to talk about your own personal groups do that elsewhere. What she described sucks.

We are in the relationship forum not the entertainment forum. This is talking about women groups in general.

Ashley, just needs to relax. People are mean I could write 20 articles about mean women I’ve met in the DC area.

Really? It’s not new. It’s not interesting.

Exactly. She wrote this article like she was me too’d. The mom group sounds like a cult. Just make a few friends and stop referring to yourself as a group.

One of my kids had a small preschool pod that was together for a few years. Us mom in the group bonded. We love seeing each other and some of our kids do some activities together, we have a what’s app group and sometimes get dinner. But some individuals are closer to each other than others and we all have other friends. What tisdale is whining about seems so immature. She’s 40 years old and doesn’t need her friend group to be everything in life, and even weirder to use her kids as a vehicle for it.

Sounds a bit hypocritical coming from someone with a group based around preschoolers. Find your own friends and leave the kids out if it.

We don’t have a “group.” We like each other and stay in touch and get dinner sometimes. We all have our own lives and friends outside of it and there’s no “Queen bee” dynamic.

The irritating parts of this saga are:

- grown women acting like they’re in middle school and having a “clique” that does everything together
- grown women behaving like their life revolves around said clique
- rejected clique member feeling so infuriated by her self proclaimed “drama” that they feel the need to expose it on a public way.

Hilary duff and Mandy Moore may be catty (who knows? Not me) but tisdale stirring the pot by creating tabloid fodder - all while framing this like a vanity fair assault expose - also tells you a lot about her level of self absorption as a person.

Pp again. And to add to that, I’d say that everything about duff and Mandy Moore is heresay, based on tisdales account. The only thing we actually know for sure is that tisdale is enough of a drama queen to publish this self absorbed, tone deaf article about a saga of her own creation.

I don’t think you can say it’s all just Ashley Tisdale airing random grievances and “what’s the other side of the story” when Hilary Duff’s husband stepped in, guns a blazin. Now Hilary (and her husband) both look kind of crazy and guilty. They could have stayed out of it and the whole thing would have blown over in a day or two, now look what we’re all talking about.

This. The messiest move here has been Duff's husband attacking Ashley directly, basically confirming for everyone that Hillary is part of the "toxic mom group" even as Ashley was denying that there were other famous moms in the group she was talking about.

Also, just a general pet peeve -- there is no "hearsay" here. It's not court. IRL, people can talk about their experiences and you can decide whether or not you trust their account or not, but there's no rule that you can't share things that other people may have said or done to you. Which, by the way, Tisdale didn't even do because she doesn't even say who any of the moms in her mom group were and she's not actually accusing anyone of anything.

I'm sorry, did you read the article? She's definitely accusing people of being petty, mean, toxic, exclusive, etc. If what she said wasn't bad at all then no one would be talking about it...

She didn't name names. She also doesn't just name call. She's not saying "ugh all the women in this group were petty, mean, toxic, and exclusive." Rather, she describes her personal experience of feeling excluded or left out, and many people concluded upon reading it "oh that is mean". She calls the group and its dynamics toxic (which, based on what we continue to find out, appears to be spot on) but says she thinks the women *in* the group are mostly good people caught in a negative dynamic. The meanest thing she says is that she thinks one of the women in the group might not be a good person, but she doesn't say who that woman is nor does she describe anything specifically this woman did that might provide hints as to who it is.

I read the piece when it came out and I didn't think "wow she's really calling these women out." My first thought was "yeah it is too bad when women get caught up in those dynamics -- I've been stuck in dynamics like that before and it sucks." I viewed it as a criticism of how women in general sometimes relate to each other, and not an attack on specific women at all.

Weird take, but ok. If she was fine with all the women, like you seem to claim, then why couldn't they have either ironed out their differences or left on a good note? Better yet, why couldn't they all have written a joint article about the ways in which groups of really nice women can somehow become toxic when all of them are so nice?

It doesn't sound like the other women had any interest in ironing out differences or ending on a good note. Her description of the dynamic is that she felt excluded from activities and sidelined in general, but that when she reached out to say she was feeling hurt, people said things like "oh we just assumed you were invited" or that they forgot.

I've been through this and that's part of the power play. They ignore you and exclude you, and if you say "hey it seems like people are upset with me but I don't know why, can we talk about it?" and everyone says "we have no idea what you're talking about, don't be so sensitive" and then it just continues. There is no closure, just a general feeling of rejection, and that is by design. They think no one can criticize them for their actions because they've gone out of their way to do the whole thing passively and under the cover of "oops I just just forgot to invite you."

So what you're describing is mean girl behavior, yes? When she asked why she wasn't invited they lied to her. When she told them she was upset they told her she was crazy. When she tried to discuss things they ignored her. Is that correct? So how on earth is saying that people did those things NOT a criticism of the awful behavior of those women?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just like when the pretty girl gets excluded by the other mean girls at the best lunch table in middle school, this group pulled the same on a former actress. Women can be the worst to other women.

I think they probably just didn’t like her.

This is what I'm thinking. Especially if they were an already established closer group of women. It's hard to break into groups like that and you pretty much have to be universally liked/have multiple strong relationships with women in the larger group for it to happen. I've been in the same friend group of 10 women for about a decade now. We all have sub groups for different reasons (I'd say I'm in 4 subgroups) and we all have friendships/groups outside of the main group, but for many of us, this is the core local group. I have a shorthand with these women, they know me, my husband, my kids and we have a significant history with one another. It's not that I'm not interested in other friends, I'm fine creating new relationships, but I wouldn't initiate trying to fold another friend into this particular group. I can't say people are clamouring to join us, I think we're pretty chill and not overly obvious about our clique in most cases. I don't use social media and for the women in the group who do, they're very selective about posting. For me, as a general rule I don't talk about what I do and who I do it with with outside friends unless it's in some way pertinent, but I find it rarely is. Many of my non-group friends probably think I sit at home a lot and that's fine by me.

If they didn't like her and didn't want to be friends with her, then they should not have done things like shown up to her daughter's birthday party or invited her to all the things in the first place. Sure, maybe they invite her to a few things but people don't click and it fizzles out. That happens and I'm sure wouldn't feel good to her, but at least it's honest and a natural process and then she goes and finds other friends.

What she describes is a group who were very friendly to her until suddenly they were not, and rather than discuss the issue with her like adults or at least own up to their change in feeling, decided to gaslight her by excluding her from things but then claiming later they just forgot to invite her.

Passive aggression is a terrible personality trait. Don't do this.

+1. You seem the same sort of behavior in here with people saying she had no business airing this in public and not talking it out as if the former friends were going to admit to what they were doing or be honest with her. If they wanted to handle it that way they would have, but they didn’t.

She can do whatever she wants. But her behavior in airing it was childish, similar to to the high school behavior she accused those women of engaging in. People are allowed to have that opinion.

Also, her passive-aggressive text at the end shows she was just as petty as they were. Good riddance to all of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I first read about this on Reddit and people were saying the mom group was lead by Hilary Duff and also included Mandy Moore, and possibly/likely Meghan Trainor and Lea Michele. And some women who were likely not famous but were rich and well-connected, either from their husbands or from their own work as celeb stylists, influencers, etc. So a real group of A-listers …

It sounded like Ashley came late to the group and was a fringe friend/member or the queen bees Hilary and Mandy didn’t really care for her too much and wouldn’t let her into the “inner circle.” Tale as old as time! She was right to extract herself from the group when she did.

I wonder if Emily from the old Cupcakes and Cashmere blog is part of mom group? And is this the same group that sort of kicked Minka Kelly out because they started having kids and she didn't?

Confirmation: i see Ems, Christina, Raina, and a Striker sister in the alleged toxic mom gang per page six

How do any of you know who these people are? Ems? You're friends with someone who bakes cupcakes and wears cashmere? Have you met in real life? This is all so odd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tisdale’s article appeared on my newsfeed today right next to the headlines about Tatiana schlossberg’s funeral and untimely death from aggressive cancer. A stark contrast and a reminder of how completely asinine and unimportant this entire topic is. It’s pedantic that cliques exist amongst grown adults and attention and validation seeking that tisdale would write an article about it. People lack perspective on what’s important in life.

Of course it seems unimportant compared to someone dying at a young age from cancer. 99% of this website is unimportant compared to that.

But friendships, finding support as a mom, and just generally having community are actually very important.

Which you can do without the friend “group” angle. Your own mom, or other women who have raised kids and share their wisdom and advice, coworkers, one-on-one friends. There’s so many ways to have the support and community, without the “group” part of it.

Many, many women find themselves in Mom groups. They want to know other moms in the neighborhood with babies the same age. This isn't remotely weird or odd.

The “group” idea is odd. Most people find 1-2 people they like in a group.

In a class of people you find 1-2 friends.
On a sports team you find 1-2 friends.
At work you find 1-2 friends.

The idea you will find a group where every single person is close friends is not real life.

Ok? But in that group are people pointedly excluding you, being weird and sitting you far away from the rest of the group, making plans in front of you? We don't all have to be friends but some of these women went out of their way to be jerks. It's not that hard to be nice at a kid's birthday party and not you know, invite all the other girlies for something like a brunch the next day in front of the hostess and not include her.

In a class we break into groups and yes I’m not part of every group. In school at lunch the lunch tables are harder to join than sororities. I’m not invited to every study group. In sports I’m not always invited to get food after practice, I don’t sit with certain people at pre-game dinners.

I go to birthday parties and don’t talk to every parent.

Your taking this not talk about something too far. It reminds me of the movie Booksmart where nobody’s allowed to talk about what school they got into because it might hurt somebody’s feelings.

Here’s the reality people are doing things without you. Some people have more money than you. Some people go on vacation vacations with friends and you’re not invited. You’re not invited to every brunch.

Find your one or two friends and do something with them.

Oh please. This is about what Ashley wrote. If you want to talk about your own personal groups do that elsewhere. What she described sucks.

We are in the relationship forum not the entertainment forum. This is talking about women groups in general.

Ashley, just needs to relax. People are mean I could write 20 articles about mean women I’ve met in the DC area.

Really? It’s not new. It’s not interesting.

Exactly. She wrote this article like she was me too’d. The mom group sounds like a cult. Just make a few friends and stop referring to yourself as a group.

One of my kids had a small preschool pod that was together for a few years. Us mom in the group bonded. We love seeing each other and some of our kids do some activities together, we have a what’s app group and sometimes get dinner. But some individuals are closer to each other than others and we all have other friends. What tisdale is whining about seems so immature. She’s 40 years old and doesn’t need her friend group to be everything in life, and even weirder to use her kids as a vehicle for it.

Sounds a bit hypocritical coming from someone with a group based around preschoolers. Find your own friends and leave the kids out if it.

We don’t have a “group.” We like each other and stay in touch and get dinner sometimes. We all have our own lives and friends outside of it and there’s no “Queen bee” dynamic.

The irritating parts of this saga are:

- grown women acting like they’re in middle school and having a “clique” that does everything together
- grown women behaving like their life revolves around said clique
- rejected clique member feeling so infuriated by her self proclaimed “drama” that they feel the need to expose it on a public way.

Hilary duff and Mandy Moore may be catty (who knows? Not me) but tisdale stirring the pot by creating tabloid fodder - all while framing this like a vanity fair assault expose - also tells you a lot about her level of self absorption as a person.

Pp again. And to add to that, I’d say that everything about duff and Mandy Moore is heresay, based on tisdales account. The only thing we actually know for sure is that tisdale is enough of a drama queen to publish this self absorbed, tone deaf article about a saga of her own creation.

Tisdale said nothing about mandy or Hilary but you clearly have an axe to grind. Why are you so mad?

I have no axe to grind. Just find the whole thing so sophomoric and was trying to put my finger on why I feel that way.

You’re not really making any deep insights here. Ashley said it was stupid and highschoolish and when she finally realized what was going on and how it made her feel, got out of it. Sometimes people just get caught up in things and with babies and a new phase of life maybe wasn’t being as clearheaded as she should have been. It resonates with some people and not with others. But it’s weird that people keep coming back in here to tell everyone how they just don’t get it and can’t figure it out. I’m not divorced but I don’t need to go into divorce threads telling people I just get why everyone can’t get along because I’m happily married.

Well that’s fine - only she didn’t just “get out of it once she realized how immature it was.” She wrote a public article on it and slandered her ex friends. And she didn’t “get out of it” she was iced out. So she’s not low drama. She’s the definition of high drama.

Nobody was slandered. She’s allowed to write about her own personal experiences after the fact. Your overreaction is a bit dramatic here.

My overreaction? I’m not the one who wrote an article claiming to be over my semi famous friends excommunicating me. If she was so blase about it, she wouldn’t feel the need to make it seem like something dramatic had happened when it didn’t. To blow this out of proportion like she has indicates a) a lot of self absorption and b) too much time on her hands

+1

Some of us have better things to do than write an article for clickbait to try to be relevant and to follow these insipid women on social media when we don't actually know them.

[Anonymous]

More mess. Mandy Moore posted one of Hillary Duff's husband's instagram reels to her IG stories with a note about what an amazing person he is and how he let MM stay with them after the fires. And Ashley Tisdale's husband posted an IG story of a quote that just says "Underrated life skill: pausing to decide if it's worth your energy."

They all seem messy and insecure and ridiculous but I lean towards Tisdale at this point. It seems like the others ganged up on her and are using their combined fame to crap on someone whose crime appears to have being insufficiently supportive towards a millionaire whose house was temporarily unlivable. Like... come on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Stupid question: Does this mom’s group get together without their kids?

Yes it sounds like they mostly got together without kids -- dinners out, spa trips, weekends away, etc. These are all wealthy women with nannies so it's not like they were SAHMs forming the group so they had people to talk to at the playground with their kids 5 days a week. It was just a friend group, but everyone in it was a mom with young kids so they had that in common.

Is this common? Do the people here saying they had a similar dynamic also have “mom groups” that the kids aren’t involved in? It seems so unusual to me.

Do you have any friends at all? What is so unusual about “moms” hanging out? They are people with children who happen to get together.

Because it’s weird. It’s normal to have a group of women who all hang out together, but there is no need for them to all be moms. And it’s totally normal for a group of women to all be moms. Like if they have a toddler playgroup or a bunch of moms with older kids who go to school together or do an activity together get to know each other and hang out.

It’s weird for a bunch of ladies to all get together in a “mom-group” and then not bring their kids. What is this?

I mean, I’ve been in plenty of book clubs where no one reads the book and eventually we give up the premise that there is actually a book we are going to read. But I have never been in a “mom group” that didn’t somehow involve the kids.

Ok? I think this whole group, Ashley included, sounds like a nightmare, but I don't believe they never involved their kids in what they did. The pictures posted seem to be of just the moms, but I hang out with friends who are moms without our kids all the time. Because, you know, we're also humans. It sounds like they met BECAUSE they had become moms. I have friends who don't have kids, and I hang out with them with moms, but I also have groups who have gotten together because we are all moms of kids who (pick you choice) go to school together, play a sport together, etc. I suppose I could call them school friends, but we met because our kids do something together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Stupid question: Does this mom’s group get together without their kids?

Yes it sounds like they mostly got together without kids -- dinners out, spa trips, weekends away, etc. These are all wealthy women with nannies so it's not like they were SAHMs forming the group so they had people to talk to at the playground with their kids 5 days a week. It was just a friend group, but everyone in it was a mom with young kids so they had that in common.

Is this common? Do the people here saying they had a similar dynamic also have “mom groups” that the kids aren’t involved in? It seems so unusual to me.

Do you have any friends at all? What is so unusual about “moms” hanging out? They are people with children who happen to get together.

Because it’s weird. It’s normal to have a group of women who all hang out together, but there is no need for them to all be moms. And it’s totally normal for a group of women to all be moms. Like if they have a toddler playgroup or a bunch of moms with older kids who go to school together or do an activity together get to know each other and hang out.

It’s weird for a bunch of ladies to all get together in a “mom-group” and then not bring their kids. What is this?

I mean, I’ve been in plenty of book clubs where no one reads the book and eventually we give up the premise that there is actually a book we are going to read. But I have never been in a “mom group” that didn’t somehow involve the kids.

Are you sure you’re a woman with woman friends?

Yes…
Are you in a group like this? Where everyone in the group has to have kids, but you don’t involve the kids?

I can't believe I'm quoting Page Six but here's the caption under Hilary Duff's picture: "Duff (pictured above in October 2025) created the mom group in 2021 by hosting music classes." So yeah, the group was about getting together as moms when it first started, or so it seems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I first read about this on Reddit and people were saying the mom group was lead by Hilary Duff and also included Mandy Moore, and possibly/likely Meghan Trainor and Lea Michele. And some women who were likely not famous but were rich and well-connected, either from their husbands or from their own work as celeb stylists, influencers, etc. So a real group of A-listers …

It sounded like Ashley came late to the group and was a fringe friend/member or the queen bees Hilary and Mandy didn’t really care for her too much and wouldn’t let her into the “inner circle.” Tale as old as time! She was right to extract herself from the group when she did.

I wonder if Emily from the old Cupcakes and Cashmere blog is part of mom group? And is this the same group that sort of kicked Minka Kelly out because they started having kids and she didn't?

Confirmation: i see Ems, Christina, Raina, and a Striker sister in the alleged toxic mom gang per page six

Mandy Moore is dressed like an elderly person’s couch.

Ashley Tisdale is dressed like a genie. And the one next to her? I guess I'm too old (45) to know what's cool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is Ashley in any of these photos? She’s barely in the group.

Yeah, it kind of seems like the broke up with her...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tisdale’s article appeared on my newsfeed today right next to the headlines about Tatiana schlossberg’s funeral and untimely death from aggressive cancer. A stark contrast and a reminder of how completely asinine and unimportant this entire topic is. It’s pedantic that cliques exist amongst grown adults and attention and validation seeking that tisdale would write an article about it. People lack perspective on what’s important in life.

Of course it seems unimportant compared to someone dying at a young age from cancer. 99% of this website is unimportant compared to that.

But friendships, finding support as a mom, and just generally having community are actually very important.

Which you can do without the friend “group” angle. Your own mom, or other women who have raised kids and share their wisdom and advice, coworkers, one-on-one friends. There’s so many ways to have the support and community, without the “group” part of it.

Many, many women find themselves in Mom groups. They want to know other moms in the neighborhood with babies the same age. This isn't remotely weird or odd.

The “group” idea is odd. Most people find 1-2 people they like in a group.

In a class of people you find 1-2 friends.
On a sports team you find 1-2 friends.
At work you find 1-2 friends.

The idea you will find a group where every single person is close friends is not real life.

Ok? But in that group are people pointedly excluding you, being weird and sitting you far away from the rest of the group, making plans in front of you? We don't all have to be friends but some of these women went out of their way to be jerks. It's not that hard to be nice at a kid's birthday party and not you know, invite all the other girlies for something like a brunch the next day in front of the hostess and not include her.

In a class we break into groups and yes I’m not part of every group. In school at lunch the lunch tables are harder to join than sororities. I’m not invited to every study group. In sports I’m not always invited to get food after practice, I don’t sit with certain people at pre-game dinners.

I go to birthday parties and don’t talk to every parent.

Your taking this not talk about something too far. It reminds me of the movie Booksmart where nobody’s allowed to talk about what school they got into because it might hurt somebody’s feelings.

Here’s the reality people are doing things without you. Some people have more money than you. Some people go on vacation vacations with friends and you’re not invited. You’re not invited to every brunch.

Find your one or two friends and do something with them.

Oh please. This is about what Ashley wrote. If you want to talk about your own personal groups do that elsewhere. What she described sucks.

We are in the relationship forum not the entertainment forum. This is talking about women groups in general.

Ashley, just needs to relax. People are mean I could write 20 articles about mean women I’ve met in the DC area.

Really? It’s not new. It’s not interesting.

Exactly. She wrote this article like she was me too’d. The mom group sounds like a cult. Just make a few friends and stop referring to yourself as a group.

One of my kids had a small preschool pod that was together for a few years. Us mom in the group bonded. We love seeing each other and some of our kids do some activities together, we have a what’s app group and sometimes get dinner. But some individuals are closer to each other than others and we all have other friends. What tisdale is whining about seems so immature. She’s 40 years old and doesn’t need her friend group to be everything in life, and even weirder to use her kids as a vehicle for it.

Sounds a bit hypocritical coming from someone with a group based around preschoolers. Find your own friends and leave the kids out if it.

We don’t have a “group.” We like each other and stay in touch and get dinner sometimes. We all have our own lives and friends outside of it and there’s no “Queen bee” dynamic.

The irritating parts of this saga are:

- grown women acting like they’re in middle school and having a “clique” that does everything together
- grown women behaving like their life revolves around said clique
- rejected clique member feeling so infuriated by her self proclaimed “drama” that they feel the need to expose it on a public way.

Hilary duff and Mandy Moore may be catty (who knows? Not me) but tisdale stirring the pot by creating tabloid fodder - all while framing this like a vanity fair assault expose - also tells you a lot about her level of self absorption as a person.

Pp again. And to add to that, I’d say that everything about duff and Mandy Moore is heresay, based on tisdales account. The only thing we actually know for sure is that tisdale is enough of a drama queen to publish this self absorbed, tone deaf article about a saga of her own creation.

I don’t think you can say it’s all just Ashley Tisdale airing random grievances and “what’s the other side of the story” when Hilary Duff’s husband stepped in, guns a blazin. Now Hilary (and her husband) both look kind of crazy and guilty. They could have stayed out of it and the whole thing would have blown over in a day or two, now look what we’re all talking about.

This. The messiest move here has been Duff's husband attacking Ashley directly, basically confirming for everyone that Hillary is part of the "toxic mom group" even as Ashley was denying that there were other famous moms in the group she was talking about.

Also, just a general pet peeve -- there is no "hearsay" here. It's not court. IRL, people can talk about their experiences and you can decide whether or not you trust their account or not, but there's no rule that you can't share things that other people may have said or done to you. Which, by the way, Tisdale didn't even do because she doesn't even say who any of the moms in her mom group were and she's not actually accusing anyone of anything.

I'm sorry, did you read the article? She's definitely accusing people of being petty, mean, toxic, exclusive, etc. If what she said wasn't bad at all then no one would be talking about it...

She didn't name names. She also doesn't just name call. She's not saying "ugh all the women in this group were petty, mean, toxic, and exclusive." Rather, she describes her personal experience of feeling excluded or left out, and many people concluded upon reading it "oh that is mean". She calls the group and its dynamics toxic (which, based on what we continue to find out, appears to be spot on) but says she thinks the women *in* the group are mostly good people caught in a negative dynamic. The meanest thing she says is that she thinks one of the women in the group might not be a good person, but she doesn't say who that woman is nor does she describe anything specifically this woman did that might provide hints as to who it is.

I read the piece when it came out and I didn't think "wow she's really calling these women out." My first thought was "yeah it is too bad when women get caught up in those dynamics -- I've been stuck in dynamics like that before and it sucks." I viewed it as a criticism of how women in general sometimes relate to each other, and not an attack on specific women at all.

Weird take, but ok. If she was fine with all the women, like you seem to claim, then why couldn't they have either ironed out their differences or left on a good note? Better yet, why couldn't they all have written a joint article about the ways in which groups of really nice women can somehow become toxic when all of them are so nice?

It doesn't sound like the other women had any interest in ironing out differences or ending on a good note. Her description of the dynamic is that she felt excluded from activities and sidelined in general, but that when she reached out to say she was feeling hurt, people said things like "oh we just assumed you were invited" or that they forgot.

I've been through this and that's part of the power play. They ignore you and exclude you, and if you say "hey it seems like people are upset with me but I don't know why, can we talk about it?" and everyone says "we have no idea what you're talking about, don't be so sensitive" and then it just continues. There is no closure, just a general feeling of rejection, and that is by design. They think no one can criticize them for their actions because they've gone out of their way to do the whole thing passively and under the cover of "oops I just just forgot to invite you."

So what you're describing is mean girl behavior, yes? When she asked why she wasn't invited they lied to her. When she told them she was upset they told her she was crazy. When she tried to discuss things they ignored her. Is that correct? So how on earth is saying that people did those things NOT a criticism of the awful behavior of those women?

Of course it's a criticism of that behavior. No one said it wasn't. The point is she didn't name names. She was talking about her own experience and didn't drag anyone else into it. Whereas Duff's husband launched a direct attack at Tisdale by directly calling her names.

The normie version of this would be like if someone posted on Facebook about how they had a hard year and realized some of their friendships weren't serving them but they are happy to moving into 2026 with good family and friends or something. I've seen people post stuff like this. Is it a little cryptic? Yeah, and if I don't already know, I might wonder about those friendships that "weren't serving them". But mostly I'll just take it at face value and be like "glad you're doing better" or something. Sure, that person might be trying to send a message to some of those former friends like "see, I'm doing great and I never cared about you anyway." That could be a little petty. But the pettiness is private and only the people who know what she's talking about are going to feel a way about it. This is a little messy but not super drama-seeking, IMO.

Now, if one of those former friends were to screen grab that post and re-post it with a nasty comment about the original poster, I would consider THAT super drama seeking and tacky and obnoxious. Especially if the tone of the original post was mostly positive and meant to be like "I was struggling but I'm doing good now." Like, why drag it into the mud.

That's how I read the situation.