Waiver for HB Woodlawn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:For real though — why should low income and ELs get preferential treatment when it comes to attending choice schools?

I don’t understand this either. If all APS schools are good why do certain groups get a preference? It should be a lottery for all.

Right now HB is whiter and richer than APS schools overall That's a bad look. Reeks of privilege hoarding.

I suspect that APS should take another look at hub bus stops in disadvantaged communities and make sure we're not hindering students from accessing option programs. There was a big stink from the Hispanic community during the pandemic about how inconvenient the hub bus stops were in their neighborhoods and it's not clear that problem was ever resolved.

HB has failed to solve its rich and white problem for 40 years. I can’t believe we are still discussing this. Nothing has worked because the voices that support the program don’t actually want it to reflect APS as a whole.

Okay, now I’m confused. No one who supports HB has said that they don’t want it to be more diverse, that they want to make it harder for diverse populations to apply to the lottery, etc. I get it that you don’t like the distribution there, but what specific evidence do you have for your comment that HB supporters don’t want the school to reflect APS as a whole? If you want to have a discussion where you don’t look like a reflexive knee-jerk HB hater, you need to have some basis for your arguments.

Questions: How to try to make HB more reflective of APS as a whole?

Their Answer: Nothing can be done, they just don’t want to come. Too bad so sad.

I was a pp who posted my experience at a title 1 ES where the school organized an info session on all the MS options. Unfortunately, there were not many parents who attended, but of those I talked to, many "diverse" families were not interested in HB. There seemed to be a perception that larger was better when it comes to schools - more course offerings, sports, clubs, etc. They didn't have any interest in sending their kids a small "alternative" school away from their friends. Just didn't see any reason for it.

Thank you for perfectly illustrating my point. You are a gem.

Of course APS isn’t going to reveal the truth behind the curtain that HB secret sauce is its small size. Most kids can’t be on a small schools, many will end up at XL high schools, they don’t want a revolt or content with figuring out that 4th high school.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Keep the HB lottery based on elementary school assignments. Give disadvantaged kids extra weight (one entry is double or triple counted for example for FRM, EL or SWD).

Why? That would give non US citizens an extra shot at a coveted school. That’s messed up.

Did this thread go Maga?

APE in the house.

HB is a haven for queer kids. Gross to see people who don't want it to exist. Just like they don't want gay/trans kids to exist.

If it's a haven for queer kids, wouldn't you want other LGBT+ children to have the same benefit? Also SPED kids?

Not all can get into HB.

The question is why you want to take it away from those who are there and really need it?

But why is it a haven for queer kids?

The lottery is just really, really good at picking queer kids.

And SPED kids too!

Yeah, the subset of kids who a) aren't into sports and b) aren't hyper-focused on college and willing to go to a school that has fewer APs/no IB option/isn't TJHSST and c) has limited integration with the Career Center/is not Arlington Tech. It's ANOTHER OPTION.

Actually fewer AB and IB is a BOOST for college admissions. You are scored on if you took all the “most advanced” classes offered; and since those classes are APS honors at best, they are far easier to ace than scoring a 5 on a dozen AP exams.

Not quite. College transcripts show rankings of HB Woodlawn students in relation to the kids at their home comprehensive schools, not just as compared to other HB Woodlawn students. So not being able to take all the same APs as their home schools will push their ranks down compared to the comprehensive high school kids. As others in this thread have said, it's a tradeoff.

HB does not cost more per student than the comprehensive schools, and now with the hub zones the transportation costs are in line as well. I'm not sure how to pull up the APS reports to prove this but some Yorktown kid wrote an school newspaper article discussing this in 2023. They still wanted to nix all options programs just because, but even they admitted HB didn't cost more than other schools and argued other option programs should reign in spending like HB did, fwiw.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Keep the HB lottery based on elementary school assignments. Give disadvantaged kids extra weight (one entry is double or triple counted for example for FRM, EL or SWD).

Why? That would give non US citizens an extra shot at a coveted school. That’s messed up.

Did this thread go Maga?

APE in the house.

HB is a haven for queer kids. Gross to see people who don't want it to exist. Just like they don't want gay/trans kids to exist.

If it's a haven for queer kids, wouldn't you want other LGBT+ children to have the same benefit? Also SPED kids?

Not all can get into HB.

The question is why you want to take it away from those who are there and really need it?

But why is it a haven for queer kids?

The lottery is just really, really good at picking queer kids.

And SPED kids too!

Yeah, the subset of kids who a) aren't into sports and b) aren't hyper-focused on college and willing to go to a school that has fewer APs/no IB option/isn't TJHSST and c) has limited integration with the Career Center/is not Arlington Tech. It's ANOTHER OPTION.

Except exercising that option isn't an option to MOST ARLINGTON KIDS. Disproportionately ELL kids, SPED kids, LGBT kids go to their neighborhood schools. Even if they do apply.

[Anonymous]

Most people manage to pick up the pieces of their shattered lives and move on. It is not some huge windfall that gives you a giant advantage with colleges. You can reapply every year. If your kid is really having a hard time and being bullied, you can also apply for a waiver which is what this initial post was all about. Not sure why you are intent on destroying a school that doesn't cost more, relieves capacity at other schools, fits into a niche, and is loved by its student population, but I guess haters gotta hate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Most people manage to pick up the pieces of their shattered lives and move on. It is not some huge windfall that gives you a giant advantage with colleges. You can reapply every year. If your kid is really having a hard time and being bullied, you can also apply for a waiver which is what this initial post was all about. Not sure why you are intent on destroying a school that doesn't cost more, relieves capacity at other schools, fits into a niche, and is loved by its student population, but I guess haters gotta hate.

You're so dramatic. I just point out inequity wherever it lies. Good for your special snowflake that they got in and can enjoy all of that freedom, small class sizes and private school feel on my dime.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For real though — why should low income and ELs get preferential treatment when it comes to attending choice schools?

I don’t understand this either. If all APS schools are good why do certain groups get a preference? It should be a lottery for all.

Right now HB is whiter and richer than APS schools overall That's a bad look. Reeks of privilege hoarding.

I suspect that APS should take another look at hub bus stops in disadvantaged communities and make sure we're not hindering students from accessing option programs. There was a big stink from the Hispanic community during the pandemic about how inconvenient the hub bus stops were in their neighborhoods and it's not clear that problem was ever resolved.

HB has failed to solve its rich and white problem for 40 years. I can’t believe we are still discussing this. Nothing has worked because the voices that support the program don’t actually want it to reflect APS as a whole.

Okay, now I’m confused. No one who supports HB has said that they don’t want it to be more diverse, that they want to make it harder for diverse populations to apply to the lottery, etc. I get it that you don’t like the distribution there, but what specific evidence do you have for your comment that HB supporters don’t want the school to reflect APS as a whole? If you want to have a discussion where you don’t look like a reflexive knee-jerk HB hater, you need to have some basis for your arguments.

Questions: How to try to make HB more reflective of APS as a whole?

Their Answer: Nothing can be done, they just don’t want to come. Too bad so sad.

And which part of that answer is inaccurate? Do you want them to draft kids who don't want to come?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For real though — why should low income and ELs get preferential treatment when it comes to attending choice schools?

I don’t understand this either. If all APS schools are good why do certain groups get a preference? It should be a lottery for all.

Right now HB is whiter and richer than APS schools overall That's a bad look. Reeks of privilege hoarding.

I suspect that APS should take another look at hub bus stops in disadvantaged communities and make sure we're not hindering students from accessing option programs. There was a big stink from the Hispanic community during the pandemic about how inconvenient the hub bus stops were in their neighborhoods and it's not clear that problem was ever resolved.

HB has failed to solve its rich and white problem for 40 years. I can’t believe we are still discussing this. Nothing has worked because the voices that support the program don’t actually want it to reflect APS as a whole.

Okay, now I’m confused. No one who supports HB has said that they don’t want it to be more diverse, that they want to make it harder for diverse populations to apply to the lottery, etc. I get it that you don’t like the distribution there, but what specific evidence do you have for your comment that HB supporters don’t want the school to reflect APS as a whole? If you want to have a discussion where you don’t look like a reflexive knee-jerk HB hater, you need to have some basis for your arguments.

Questions: How to try to make HB more reflective of APS as a whole?

Their Answer: Nothing can be done, they just don’t want to come. Too bad so sad.

And which part of that answer is inaccurate? Do you want them to draft kids who don't want to come?

The problem is that a lot of kids want to come. The waitlist doesn't lie. That and whoever does come is primarily white and wealthy. They get the spoils.

[Anonymous]

A lottery that anyone can choose or decline to enter doesn't seem by definition inequitable. Enter or don't. Some will win and others won't. Not winning doesn't make the lottery unfair. This is going to sound snide but it's not meant that way: Have you considered whether maybe you're just exhibiting poor sportsmanship?

As others in the thread have noted, there are tradeoffs that make HB unappealing to many (No fields, sports are a pain, fewer course offerings and APs, fewer teachers, no counselors and other staff, class rank tallied from home school, etc). Are lotteries to attend immersion schools similarly unfair, even though not everyone wants to go to one, so immersion schools should also be closed?

Chance can be a bummer but it's not really inequity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Keep the HB lottery based on elementary school assignments. Give disadvantaged kids extra weight (one entry is double or triple counted for example for FRM, EL or SWD).

Why? That would give non US citizens an extra shot at a coveted school. That’s messed up.

Did this thread go Maga?

APE in the house.

HB is a haven for queer kids. Gross to see people who don't want it to exist. Just like they don't want gay/trans kids to exist.

If it's a haven for queer kids, wouldn't you want other LGBT+ children to have the same benefit? Also SPED kids?

Not all can get into HB.

The question is why you want to take it away from those who are there and really need it?

But why is it a haven for queer kids?

The lottery is just really, really good at picking queer kids.

And SPED kids too!

Yeah, the subset of kids who a) aren't into sports and b) aren't hyper-focused on college and willing to go to a school that has fewer APs/no IB option/isn't TJHSST and c) has limited integration with the Career Center/is not Arlington Tech. It's ANOTHER OPTION.

Actually fewer AB and IB is a BOOST for college admissions. You are scored on if you took all the “most advanced” classes offered; and since those classes are APS honors at best, they are far easier to ace than scoring a 5 on a dozen AP exams.

Not quite. College transcripts show rankings of HB Woodlawn students in relation to the kids at their home comprehensive schools, not just as compared to other HB Woodlawn students. So not being able to take all the same APs as their home schools will push their ranks down compared to the comprehensive high school kids. As others in this thread have said, it's a tradeoff.

HB does not cost more per student than the comprehensive schools, and now with the hub zones the transportation costs are in line as well. I'm not sure how to pull up the APS reports to prove this but some Yorktown kid wrote a school newspaper article discussing this in 2023. They still wanted to nix all options programs just because, but even they admitted HB didn't cost more than other schools and argued other option programs should reign in spending like HB did, fwiw.

You are talking about ranking. There will be a checkbox that they took the highest level course available.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lottery that anyone can choose or decline to enter doesn't seem by definition inequitable. Enter or don't. Some will win and others won't. Not winning doesn't make the lottery unfair. This is going to sound snide but it's not meant that way: Have you considered whether maybe you're just exhibiting poor sportsmanship?

As others in the thread have noted, there are tradeoffs that make HB unappealing to many (No fields, sports are a pain, fewer course offerings and APs, fewer teachers, no counselors and other staff, class rank tallied from home school, etc). Are lotteries to attend immersion schools similarly unfair, even though not everyone wants to go to one, so immersion schools should also be closed?

Chance can be a bummer but it's not really inequity.

Even more people want to end immersion, that won’t help your cause.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lottery that anyone can choose or decline to enter doesn't seem by definition inequitable. Enter or don't. Some will win and others won't. Not winning doesn't make the lottery unfair. This is going to sound snide but it's not meant that way: Have you considered whether maybe you're just exhibiting poor sportsmanship?

As others in the thread have noted, there are tradeoffs that make HB unappealing to many (No fields, sports are a pain, fewer course offerings and APs, fewer teachers, no counselors and other staff, class rank tallied from home school, etc). Are lotteries to attend immersion schools similarly unfair, even though not everyone wants to go to one, so immersion schools should also be closed?

Chance can be a bummer but it's not really inequity.

No counselors. It’s not like the 3000 student schools ever see their counselor unless they have a run in with the law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lottery that anyone can choose or decline to enter doesn't seem by definition inequitable. Enter or don't. Some will win and others won't. Not winning doesn't make the lottery unfair. This is going to sound snide but it's not meant that way: Have you considered whether maybe you're just exhibiting poor sportsmanship?

As others in the thread have noted, there are tradeoffs that make HB unappealing to many (No fields, sports are a pain, fewer course offerings and APs, fewer teachers, no counselors and other staff, class rank tallied from home school, etc). Are lotteries to attend immersion schools similarly unfair, even though not everyone wants to go to one, so immersion schools should also be closed?

Chance can be a bummer but it's not really inequity.

Sounds like you're a person whose kids go to SB, so you can say these things with a straight face.

I'm cool with all options programs closing and reverting back to neighborhood schools. And then we can close the most broken/old ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lottery that anyone can choose or decline to enter doesn't seem by definition inequitable. Enter or don't. Some will win and others won't. Not winning doesn't make the lottery unfair. This is going to sound snide but it's not meant that way: Have you considered whether maybe you're just exhibiting poor sportsmanship?

As others in the thread have noted, there are tradeoffs that make HB unappealing to many (No fields, sports are a pain, fewer course offerings and APs, fewer teachers, no counselors and other staff, class rank tallied from home school, etc). Are lotteries to attend immersion schools similarly unfair, even though not everyone wants to go to one, so immersion schools should also be closed?

Chance can be a bummer but it's not really inequity.

Sounds like you're a person whose kids go to SB, so you can say these things with a straight face.

I'm cool with all options programs closing and reverting back to neighborhood schools. And then we can close the most broken/old ones.

HB not SB. Sorry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lottery that anyone can choose or decline to enter doesn't seem by definition inequitable. Enter or don't. Some will win and others won't. Not winning doesn't make the lottery unfair. This is going to sound snide but it's not meant that way: Have you considered whether maybe you're just exhibiting poor sportsmanship?

As others in the thread have noted, there are tradeoffs that make HB unappealing to many (No fields, sports are a pain, fewer course offerings and APs, fewer teachers, no counselors and other staff, class rank tallied from home school, etc). Are lotteries to attend immersion schools similarly unfair, even though not everyone wants to go to one, so immersion schools should also be closed?

Chance can be a bummer but it's not really inequity.

Sounds like you're a person whose kids go to SB, so you can say these things with a straight face.

I'm cool with all options programs closing and reverting back to neighborhood schools. And then we can close the most broken/old ones.

We can even have swing space to renovate the older schools! What a concept!

[Anonymous]

HB can’t be a comprehensive or neighborhood school because it doesn’t have the fields or space needed. It can only function as a choice school. Kids can’t be forced to go there but they can choose to go there. I guess it could aKai be used aa office space for staff? The symbiotic relationship between this space and the choice school has been explained several times now but clearly some people don’t get it.