Athletes have such an edge

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't most recruited athletes end up teaching sports in high school? I have never met a doctor or surgeon who was previously an athlete. Perhaps we move in different circles.

This is perhaps the dumbest question I’ve seen on DCUM. We definitely move in different circles.

+1

That was remarkably dumb.

Hmmmm....touched a nerve there didn't I?

Interesting take. I attended a Midwestern HS with about a 60/40 white/black enrollment, mostly working class with some middle class (journalists, professors, research scientists). There were a number of former pro athletes on the school staff. Nearly all had gotten injured in their pro careers, sadly during an era where they were shot up with pain killers and pushed back out on the field. They now had a teaching load and all of them were head/assistant coaches. They were great role models and kept some of the student athletes busy and out of trouble. A few of the athletes went on to pro careers - two of them very, very successful and one a household name. But there were many who had no prospect in playing in college, but ended up enrolling in and graduating from college because of these coach mentors.

I don't expect every athlete - or every college student - to be able to operate on a spine or a knee. But I really appreciate when former athletes inspire a range of students with a range of academic/athletic abilities to be the best they can be.

A lot of former college athletes and professional athletes work as coaches at the high school level. Particularly in mens high school sports these
coaches provide positive male role models to vulnerable at risk kids at the high school many of whom have no Dads or other male models in their lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

you know what - this is kinda an asshole response. some kids have up to 20+ hours work study and a subset of them have a side gig to supplement as the work study is not sufficient. a lot of these kids are not athletes b/c they could not afford the club/travel/pay to play circuit as kids.

i really hope i don't know you or that my kids were every friendly with yours if they share the same closeminded attitudes you have about life.

I’m not one bit close-minded. I worked all through college to pay for it myself and am very familiar with the difficulties presented by working and going to school. But you should not read my post in a vacuum - I was responding to PP who claimed that athletes got special tutoring and could skip class and get special videos/notes, which is completely inaccurate at the three Ivy schools I know well. The athletes I know were often forced to miss classes on Fridays for away games, so would get notes from other students. There is nothing at Ivy schools set up to make it academically easier for an athlete.

In case you forgot what you wrote: So sorry -if you were too busy to study because you had 10-15 hours a week of class and a work-study job, you need better time management skills (which you would have learned growing up if you had played a club sport outside of your high school, like all the recruited athletes).

I can't imagine anyone who worked all the way through school would be so callous in their response.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I don't disagree with you, but I find it hard to believe that many Ivy League athletes have academic profiles "better" than the average Ivy League admit. How do you quantify that?

I don’t think I said “many,” but I do know some with high school stats at the upper end of the admissions data. Obviously, most kids admitted to an Ivy are high stats, but by “better than average” I really was just referring to the 25-75% data that schools release - and I know this is only one piece of being a qualified applicant. On one of my DC’s teams, four of the seven in DC’s recruiting class were at the 75% or above for testing, two were NMSF and two were valedictorians. All were very good athletes. My point really was that Ivy athletes are not necessarily getting a pass academically in the admissions process.

+1, I know several recruited athletes at Ivies: they all had excellent academic stats in addition to their outstanding sports ability: granted they are more in sports like cross country, squash, lacrosse, etc. not football, basketball, etc. Pretty amazing kids in terms of excellent time management/executive functioning.

[Anonymous]

This is what I don’t get:

People are saying these athletes deserve it bc they have shown grit and determination, etc. well…LOTS of average athletes have shown the same determination. Someone mentioned that their swimmer is up early every morning to swim. I’m sure not every swimmer who does that is amazing. Many probably have A and BB times - nothing spectacular. They have no less grit or determination than other better athletes, but they just have a natural ability added to it. So, no, I don’t think an athlete should get special consideration for being an athlete because it shows determination - because then all athletes, even mediocre ones, should get a leg up. Doesn’t work like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is what I don’t get:

People are saying these athletes deserve it bc they have shown grit and determination, etc. well…LOTS of average athletes have shown the same determination. Someone mentioned that their swimmer is up early every morning to swim. I’m sure not every swimmer who does that is amazing. Many probably have A and BB times - nothing spectacular. They have no less grit or determination than other better athletes, but they just have a natural ability added to it. So, no, I don’t think an athlete should get special consideration for being an athlete because it shows determination - because then all athletes, even mediocre ones, should get a leg up. Doesn’t work like that.

News: Being outstanding in something not necessarily sports helps in admissions at the very top schools. Effort doesn’t mean much if you are mediocre at it.

[Anonymous]

So hating on athletes is the new hating on affirmative action? Many, many of the arguments here just sound so familiar....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think I’ve ever met an orthopedic surgeon who wasn’t either a college athlete or in the military

And ask doctors what the jokes are about orthopedic surgeons (as a medical specialty).

Hint: They are known to need brute more than brains.

Oh please. To recap: Some ignorant-sounding PPs above kept talking about how athletes can't possibly be surgeons. So people pointed out how wildly false that is, given that surgeons actually have a higher percentage of college athletes in their ranks than the general population or even other professions. Orthopedic surgery was provided as a specific example of a specialty with a high number.

So now, because you've been proven extremely wrong about surgeons in general, your response now is that orthopedic surgeons don't actually need to be smart? Do you have any idea how dumb you sound?

[Anonymous]

I find it aggravating too (and I was a college athlete).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is what I don’t get:

People are saying these athletes deserve it bc they have shown grit and determination, etc. well…LOTS of average athletes have shown the same determination. Someone mentioned that their swimmer is up early every morning to swim. I’m sure not every swimmer who does that is amazing. Many probably have A and BB times - nothing spectacular. They have no less grit or determination than other better athletes, but they just have a natural ability added to it. So, no, I don’t think an athlete should get special consideration for being an athlete because it shows determination - because then all athletes, even mediocre ones, should get a leg up. Doesn’t work like that.

Mediocre athletes do get a leg up at lesser colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't most recruited athletes end up teaching sports in high school? I have never met a doctor or surgeon who was previously an athlete. Perhaps we move in different circles.

This is perhaps the dumbest question I’ve seen on DCUM. We definitely move in different circles.

+1

That was remarkably dumb.

Hmmmm....touched a nerve there didn't I?

I suppose you did in that I can't abide stupidity, and your post was remarkably stupid. Perhaps I should just pity you, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

What annoys me is the special treatment and perks the athletes get once in the school.

Athletes at my Ivy League school got free one-on-one tutoring and were allowed to skip classes and were given special notes and videos of the classes they missed. I had to work many hours at my exhausting work study job to make money. I would have liked a tutor to help make up for the time I also was too “busy” to study.

This is so far off base you must be a troll. I have three kids who were athletes at different Ivy schools. They practiced/played 20 hours per week and traveled on weekends on top of being science/math majors, with zero tutoring available to them (other than what was available to non-athletes). They also had to practice all summer in addition to their internships. They, and many of their teammates, definitely had high school academic profiles that were similar (often better) than the average student admitted to their schools. Some of their teammates also had work-study jobs on top of their already-packed schedules. So sorry -if you were too busy to study because you had 10-15 hours a week of class and a work-study job, you need better time management skills (which you would have learned growing up if you had played a club sport outside of your high school, like all the recruited athletes).

you know what - this is kinda an asshole response. some kids have up to 20+ hours work study and a subset of them have a side gig to supplement as the work study is not sufficient. a lot of these kids are not athletes b/c they could not afford the club/travel/pay to play circuit as kids.

i really hope i don't know you or that my kids were every friendly with yours if they share the same closeminded attitudes you have about life.

DP. I thought your response was the more asshole of the two responses, for what it's worth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is what I don’t get:

People are saying these athletes deserve it bc they have shown grit and determination, etc. well…LOTS of average athletes have shown the same determination. Someone mentioned that their swimmer is up early every morning to swim. I’m sure not every swimmer who does that is amazing. Many probably have A and BB times - nothing spectacular. They have no less grit or determination than other better athletes, but they just have a natural ability added to it. So, no, I don’t think an athlete should get special consideration for being an athlete because it shows determination - because then all athletes, even mediocre ones, should get a leg up. Doesn’t work like that.

You don't know anything about athletic development. At this level it is almost entirely exceptional grit, competitive drive, and enormous work. Natural ability doesn't get you into college athletics.

[Anonymous]

I had a two Ds recruited and apply to college as athletes. D1 athlete was not on scholarship, so had some pressure to get recruited and get admitted. Team GPA was higher than the school’s average.

Second D played at the D3 level and team GPA was also higher than the school’s average. When she met with admissions, the admissions counselor said “she had everything they were looking for: academics, personal presentation, and her interest in sports and the school.”

Both applied ED. Both were full pay.

What we learned is that being an athlete and applying ED put the applications in a smaller pile.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what I don’t get:

People are saying these athletes deserve it bc they have shown grit and determination, etc. well…LOTS of average athletes have shown the same determination. Someone mentioned that their swimmer is up early every morning to swim. I’m sure not every swimmer who does that is amazing. Many probably have A and BB times - nothing spectacular. They have no less grit or determination than other better athletes, but they just have a natural ability added to it. So, no, I don’t think an athlete should get special consideration for being an athlete because it shows determination - because then all athletes, even mediocre ones, should get a leg up. Doesn’t work like that.

You don't know anything about athletic development. At this level it is almost entirely exceptional grit, competitive drive, and enormous work. Natural ability doesn't get you into college athletics.

This is not really true of all sports. Some kids absolutely have natural ability. We see it with swim.

[Anonymous]

And by see it with swim - some kids who start very late or practice a few times a week have AAA or higher times.