Crime on the hill - Charles Allen has got to go

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You people claiming there is a “crime problem” or blaming Allen are just making it up, or possibly you are part of the right wing media.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10460307/Psaki-mocks-concern-consequences-soft-crime.html

That’s great. I’m actually a liberal who lives in Hill East near where the Harris Teeter is closing down. Just because you don’t like people expressing things doesn’t mean it’s some kind of campaign.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You people claiming there is a “crime problem” or blaming Allen are just making it up, or possibly you are part of the right wing media.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10460307/Psaki-mocks-concern-consequences-soft-crime.html

I'm a lefty and definitely not part of the right wing media, and I think there is a "crime problem" because I live on the Hill and have noticed an alarming uptick in crime. The crime in my immediate neighborhood is similar right now to what it's often like in July and August most years -- more daytime crime, more violent crime. Stick-ups, assaults, drug deals, shootings with stray bullets, etc. We often see crime spikes like this in the summer, when kids are not in school. I also think the heat just kind of makes people crazy sometimes.

If it's like this in January/February, I am really worried about what happens in a few months when kids get out of school and people are outside more, drinking and smoking up in alleys late into the night. This feels like a tinder keg.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You people claiming there is a “crime problem” or blaming Allen are just making it up, or possibly you are part of the right wing media.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10460307/Psaki-mocks-concern-consequences-soft-crime.html

That’s great. I’m actually a liberal who lives in Hill East near where the Harris Teeter is closing down. Just because you don’t like people expressing things doesn’t mean it’s some kind of campaign.

Wait, that's my store. Why is it closing down?!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You people claiming there is a “crime problem” or blaming Allen are just making it up, or possibly you are part of the right wing media.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10460307/Psaki-mocks-concern-consequences-soft-crime.html

That’s great. I’m actually a liberal who lives in Hill East near where the Harris Teeter is closing down. Just because you don’t like people expressing things doesn’t mean it’s some kind of campaign.

Wait, that's my store. Why is it closing down?!

Closed last month.

https://www.bizjournals.com/washington/news/2021/12/06/grocery-store-closing-in-southeast-d-c.html

It was the shiny new thing in that neighborhood for a long time, with nothing but that dingy old Safeway as competition. But then the new Safeway opened, and I'm going to guess that -- and various pandemic-related reasons -- affected sales at that HT to the point where it didn't make financial sense for parent company Kroger to keep it open.

[Anonymous]

Another OD

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Another OD

Probably the same batch of fentanyl-overloaded crap that screwed a bunch of people up in that same block a few days ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Neither of the prior posters seem to understand the "no snitching" culture that prevails in high poverty urban areas. If you want to understand how urban AA have historically been underserved with respect to justice (while being "over served" with respect to policing), read "Ghettoside". It's about LA but could just as easily be about DC. It does a good, and fairly apolitical, job of identifying the historical patterns that have led to low level criminals and community witnesses being unwilling to testify against the top predators in their communities. When you do not believe that the police will protect you from being murdered, then your appetite for cooperation plummets.

But that is a separate issue from overly generous plea deals and insufficient consequences for juvenile violent crime.

The truth is that only bad things happens if you get on the police’s radar. If you go to cooperate as a witness, they may try to bust you for something else. Since a lot of people end up with ticky tack stuff on their record, like unpaid tickets or failure to appear for jury duty or some minor technicality they may not even know about, putting yourself forward to police can also put yourself in jeopardy. They may use your name when interrogating suspects for unrelated crimes, intentionally or by accident. They may threaten to tell people you are a snitch in order to get you to make statements that were not true so they can secure a conviction. They may regularly show up at your house unannounced. Etc.

This attitude -- that fulfilling your responsibilities as a law abiding citizen by paying your parking tickets, showing up for jury duty, and the like is just "ticky tack" stuff is a big part of the culture problem actually. It's your civic responsibility to do these things, and when enough people in a city adopt the entitled attitude of "I shouldn't be held accountable for small things" it's no wonder the social fabric starts to tear. What's happening across DC is that those of us who are law abiding citizens who pay their taxes, are trying to raise families in a diverse city, see this city's leaders making constant excuses for the criminal, violent, anti-social elements of the city, while doing nothing to address the needs of the law abiding majority. It's not a sustainable civic posture. Add to that the abuse (and hypocrisy) of Bowser's emergency pandemic policies and you have a culture of suspicion, entitlement, and law breaking. Not a great recipe for a thriving city.

Signed, someone who has served on a DC jury every two years for the past 25 years I've lived here, pays my taxes, and constantly picks up the litter left behind by entitled thugs who sit around smoking pot, making homophobic and racist remarks, and sexually harassing bystanders rather than attending school or getting a job.

[Anonymous]

Robert White just have a speech ripping into Bowser for her failure at doing anything re: crime.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Robert White just have a speech ripping into Bowser for her failure at doing anything re: crime.

Interesting. It’s time to get some popcorn.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Neither of the prior posters seem to understand the "no snitching" culture that prevails in high poverty urban areas. If you want to understand how urban AA have historically been underserved with respect to justice (while being "over served" with respect to policing), read "Ghettoside". It's about LA but could just as easily be about DC. It does a good, and fairly apolitical, job of identifying the historical patterns that have led to low level criminals and community witnesses being unwilling to testify against the top predators in their communities. When you do not believe that the police will protect you from being murdered, then your appetite for cooperation plummets.

But that is a separate issue from overly generous plea deals and insufficient consequences for juvenile violent crime.

The truth is that only bad things happens if you get on the police’s radar. If you go to cooperate as a witness, they may try to bust you for something else. Since a lot of people end up with ticky tack stuff on their record, like unpaid tickets or failure to appear for jury duty or some minor technicality they may not even know about, putting yourself forward to police can also put yourself in jeopardy. They may use your name when interrogating suspects for unrelated crimes, intentionally or by accident. They may threaten to tell people you are a snitch in order to get you to make statements that were not true so they can secure a conviction. They may regularly show up at your house unannounced. Etc.

This attitude -- that fulfilling your responsibilities as a law abiding citizen by paying your parking tickets, showing up for jury duty, and the like is just "ticky tack" stuff is a big part of the culture problem actually. It's your civic responsibility to do these things, and when enough people in a city adopt the entitled attitude of "I shouldn't be held accountable for small things" it's no wonder the social fabric starts to tear. What's happening across DC is that those of us who are law abiding citizens who pay their taxes, are trying to raise families in a diverse city, see this city's leaders making constant excuses for the criminal, violent, anti-social elements of the city, while doing nothing to address the needs of the law abiding majority. It's not a sustainable civic posture. Add to that the abuse (and hypocrisy) of Bowser's emergency pandemic policies and you have a culture of suspicion, entitlement, and law breaking. Not a great recipe for a thriving city.

Signed, someone who has served on a DC jury every two years for the past 25 years I've lived here, pays my taxes, and constantly picks up the litter left behind by entitled thugs who sit around smoking pot, making homophobic and racist remarks, and sexually harassing bystanders rather than attending school or getting a job.

The social fabric was sewn incorrectly, and deserves to be torn. It needs to be re-sewn.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Neither of the prior posters seem to understand the "no snitching" culture that prevails in high poverty urban areas. If you want to understand how urban AA have historically been underserved with respect to justice (while being "over served" with respect to policing), read "Ghettoside". It's about LA but could just as easily be about DC. It does a good, and fairly apolitical, job of identifying the historical patterns that have led to low level criminals and community witnesses being unwilling to testify against the top predators in their communities. When you do not believe that the police will protect you from being murdered, then your appetite for cooperation plummets.

But that is a separate issue from overly generous plea deals and insufficient consequences for juvenile violent crime.

The truth is that only bad things happens if you get on the police’s radar. If you go to cooperate as a witness, they may try to bust you for something else. Since a lot of people end up with ticky tack stuff on their record, like unpaid tickets or failure to appear for jury duty or some minor technicality they may not even know about, putting yourself forward to police can also put yourself in jeopardy. They may use your name when interrogating suspects for unrelated crimes, intentionally or by accident. They may threaten to tell people you are a snitch in order to get you to make statements that were not true so they can secure a conviction. They may regularly show up at your house unannounced. Etc.

This attitude -- that fulfilling your responsibilities as a law abiding citizen by paying your parking tickets, showing up for jury duty, and the like is just "ticky tack" stuff is a big part of the culture problem actually. It's your civic responsibility to do these things, and when enough people in a city adopt the entitled attitude of "I shouldn't be held accountable for small things" it's no wonder the social fabric starts to tear. What's happening across DC is that those of us who are law abiding citizens who pay their taxes, are trying to raise families in a diverse city, see this city's leaders making constant excuses for the criminal, violent, anti-social elements of the city, while doing nothing to address the needs of the law abiding majority. It's not a sustainable civic posture. Add to that the abuse (and hypocrisy) of Bowser's emergency pandemic policies and you have a culture of suspicion, entitlement, and law breaking. Not a great recipe for a thriving city.

Signed, someone who has served on a DC jury every two years for the past 25 years I've lived here, pays my taxes, and constantly picks up the litter left behind by entitled thugs who sit around smoking pot, making homophobic and racist remarks, and sexually harassing bystanders rather than attending school or getting a job.

There are two separate pieces to that.

1.) the police - MPD needs to build trust. If they are doing the kinds of things like the PP says, that's a mistake. If someone's cooperating with them in good faith, MPD needs to honor and respect that, and protect their confidentiality and not take advantage.

2.) on the anti-social behavior, I kind of have to agree with the PP - it's baffling where some of these people DO get such a sense of entitlement and disrespect. It's as if they don't understand that most of the rest of America ARE doing our part, we ARE working hard, we DID stay in school, we DO pay our traffic tickets, we DO throw our trash into a bin instead of just throwing it on the ground, we DO respond to jury duty summons, we DO try to be decent people to others we come across. What makes them think they are or should be exempted and excused from any of that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Robert White just have a speech ripping into Bowser for her failure at doing anything re: crime.

Interesting. It’s time to get some popcorn.

Ehhh... He has a 25 pager on public safety. Has a few reasonable things in there but also a lot of vague handwavey things like "address systemic injustice as a root cause" - uh, like what specifically, and how exactly, Robert?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Robert White just have a speech ripping into Bowser for her failure at doing anything re: crime.

Interesting. It’s time to get some popcorn.

Ehhh... He has a 25 pager on public safety. Has a few reasonable things in there but also a lot of vague handwavey things like "address systemic injustice as a root cause" - uh, like what specifically, and how exactly, Robert?

The specifics don’t matter. The point is that someone is directly challenging Bowser on crime. She’s had a free run so far. I’m curious if she’s able to credibly defend her record or if she will only keep blaming everyone but herself. Time to show some leadership.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Neither of the prior posters seem to understand the "no snitching" culture that prevails in high poverty urban areas. If you want to understand how urban AA have historically been underserved with respect to justice (while being "over served" with respect to policing), read "Ghettoside". It's about LA but could just as easily be about DC. It does a good, and fairly apolitical, job of identifying the historical patterns that have led to low level criminals and community witnesses being unwilling to testify against the top predators in their communities. When you do not believe that the police will protect you from being murdered, then your appetite for cooperation plummets.

But that is a separate issue from overly generous plea deals and insufficient consequences for juvenile violent crime.

The truth is that only bad things happens if you get on the police’s radar. If you go to cooperate as a witness, they may try to bust you for something else. Since a lot of people end up with ticky tack stuff on their record, like unpaid tickets or failure to appear for jury duty or some minor technicality they may not even know about, putting yourself forward to police can also put yourself in jeopardy. They may use your name when interrogating suspects for unrelated crimes, intentionally or by accident. They may threaten to tell people you are a snitch in order to get you to make statements that were not true so they can secure a conviction. They may regularly show up at your house unannounced. Etc.

This attitude -- that fulfilling your responsibilities as a law abiding citizen by paying your parking tickets, showing up for jury duty, and the like is just "ticky tack" stuff is a big part of the culture problem actually. It's your civic responsibility to do these things, and when enough people in a city adopt the entitled attitude of "I shouldn't be held accountable for small things" it's no wonder the social fabric starts to tear. What's happening across DC is that those of us who are law abiding citizens who pay their taxes, are trying to raise families in a diverse city, see this city's leaders making constant excuses for the criminal, violent, anti-social elements of the city, while doing nothing to address the needs of the law abiding majority. It's not a sustainable civic posture. Add to that the abuse (and hypocrisy) of Bowser's emergency pandemic policies and you have a culture of suspicion, entitlement, and law breaking. Not a great recipe for a thriving city.

Signed, someone who has served on a DC jury every two years for the past 25 years I've lived here, pays my taxes, and constantly picks up the litter left behind by entitled thugs who sit around smoking pot, making homophobic and racist remarks, and sexually harassing bystanders rather than attending school or getting a job.

The social fabric was sewn incorrectly, and deserves to be torn. It needs to be re-sewn.

LOL and anti-social criminals are definitely going to "re-sew" the social fabric? How, exactly, was the social fabric sewn incorrectly? Seriously, what practical changes would you make to solve the problems of a violent underclass? Who terrorize the majority of law abiding citizens? We've thrown money and violence interruptors at this problems for decades. Hasn't worked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oh my god, everyone (at least in recent pages of this thread) needs to read up on how criminal justice actually works in DC. Karl Racine doesn't have any prosecutors (except in the loosest sense related to juvenile crimes). The federal government, specifically the United States Attorney's Office for the District of Columbia, is responsible for prosecuting all felonies (i.e., crimes punishable by more than one year in jail) in D.C. Our prosecutor-in-chief is the U.S. Attorney, a man named Matthew Graves. The disconnect between the police and the prosecutors, unique in our country, is a problem, but it's hardly one you can blame Bowser or Contee for when it was imposed on us by Congress.

The vast majority of the violent crimes being discussed in this thread (armed carjackings and robberies, gun cases) have been committed by teens, and those cases are “prosecuted” by Karl Racine’s office. This is why the mayor and Contee specifically targeted Racine. Additionally, even those cases where the perps are a little older, chances are they were juvenile delinquents previously “prosecuted” by Racine’s office but yet still roaming the streets committing crimes. Some of us know how the criminal justice system here in DC works, but thanks for the helpful tips.

And Racine’s response to Bowser is quite interesting in pointing out her penchant for finger pointing and buck passing instead of leadership. I’ve honestly never heard of a situation anywhere else where the mayor has been out there like this. Not saying that criticism of Allen, the council and Racine is unfair. However, first glass houses and all that. Second, the mayor should have a higher sense leadership no? Not even trying to use convening power to bring all actors together to coordinate.

Karl Racine: "My office prosecutes all violent crimes committed by juveniles where we have strong evidence, as the standard of proof is beyond a reasonable doubt, and where the arrest is constitutional."

Also Karl Racine: "No, I will not release statistics showing how many juveniles actually are prosecuted, even with names redacted. And no, I will not release statistics showing how many of these juveniles had previous arrests."

Also Karl Racine: we prosecute violent crimes, but will not define prosecute.
Sure, they are charging kids, but part of what the Mayor and Contee were getting at was what happens after you charge them? What are the pleas being taken (ie is a kid that carjacks someone pleading to misdemeanors), are violent offenders being released back into the community as part of their plea, are you treating repeat offenders differently than a kid with no priors. Racine will not answer these questions because he doesn’t want the public to know, in this midst of this spike in juvenile crime, that his office is offering misdemeanor pleas and other slaps on the wrist to kids who are violent.

What are we getting in exchange for the plea deals?
I feel we need to get something in exchange.

Like:

- No recidivism. If we give a plea deal this time, any plea deal is automatically off the table the next time they get arrested.

- They must give someone else up, of high value, and it must lead to an arrest, conviction and sentencing or the deal is revoked and they go back to prison. Like if it was a carjacking, they need to finger the chop shop. If it was a burglary, they need to finger their fence. And that deal is also only good once. If they get out and commit another carjacking or burglary, they need to give more high value people up.

Otherwise, why give any plea deal at all?

Just another "racial justice" initiative in disguise.