How does your family survive making under 200k hhi

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Sure it can work but without a lot of room for savings, 529s, incidentals. . . This is how ppl end up feeling strapped. 70% of their take home is going to the mortgage, childcare, and food.

Child care can be up to 65% of take home pay.

That's when it's time to quit work and SAH.

+ 100

The fact is that no one is assigning a dollar amount to the work SAHP do at home, the savings as well as cost of going to work - clothes, commuting, childcare etc.

But sometimes it is more economical if one partner stays at home and takes care of things at home and save money. If HHI goes up along with expenses - then it may not be worth it for one partner to WOH

That works fine if one parent makes $160K and the other makes $40K. Not so much if they each make $100K.

[Anonymous]

1) You got to keep your fixed essential cost low - mortgage, car, childcare, school, utilities, insurance etc.

2) Long term savings have to be consistent and u need to start early (from yr first paycheck)- retirement, college.

3) Pay off your debt by living on a shoe string budget.

4) Then everything is extra money after that!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Sure it can work but without a lot of room for savings, 529s, incidentals. . . This is how ppl end up feeling strapped. 70% of their take home is going to the mortgage, childcare, and food.

Child care can be up to 65% of take home pay.

That's when it's time to quit work and SAH.

+ 100

The fact is that no one is assigning a dollar amount to the work SAHP do at home, the savings as well as cost of going to work - clothes, commuting, childcare etc.

But sometimes it is more economical if one partner stays at home and takes care of things at home and save money. If HHI goes up along with expenses - then it may not be worth it for one partner to WOH

How could childcare come to 65% of take home? Is that for just one person or the whole HHI? I can't imagine going that route. We currently pay 13k for childcare for one. Our take home would have to be 20k for that to be 65%. If I made that little I'd qualify for various childcare vouchers so I actually wouldn't even be paying that. So I call BS or you're paying for luxury care you can't afford.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Haven't read all the replies here, but I'd say that your definition of "survival" is probably what's making you feel so strapped. $3k per month mortgage (I think you said) is not a bargain mortgage. $1100 per month for food and kids stuff (again, I think you said) does not sound like people who are trying to keep their spending down. I'm not saying it's easy to live in this area on incomes that are anywhere near normal - but to characterize your spending as barely surviving is really making it seem as if you live in a bubble.

You want to live a higher-income life than you comfortably have, is what it comes down to. And, look, I'm the same way - husb and I earn about $150k, have no kids, pay $600 per month toward student loans, $2k per month for rent. And it seems like we are just barely keeping our heads above water. But in reality that is bullshit. We order in food every time we want it. We keep an expensive cable package because we feel like keeping it. I buy clothes a fair amount. My husband likes to buy comic books. We may not have a whole lot of savings, and we may not have a huge amount of extra $ once we're done accounting for all the stuff we buy - but that's not barely surviving!

Comment again after having two kids on your salary.

PP here: and, look, this is sort of exactly the point. DC is expensive! You can't have everything you want here. That might mean not having 2 kids in daycare at the same time. Or if you want to do that, then you need a cheaper house. Or to spend less on food. Again, like I said before, just like OP, I would like to live a more luxurious, more comfortable life than I actually have. But to characterize this as not being able to SURVIVE is stupid.

NP here. On less than 200K HHI, we have funded our retirement, heavily insured, Prepaid college tuition for both kids, 2 cars, a SFH in the suburbs. Our kids will have very little or no student loans.

So what did we not do?
1) Did not do private schools
2) Did not have student loans
3) Did not upgrade to a bigger house (ours is 3200 sq ft)
4) Do not lease new cars. We have fuel efficient cars
5) Do not have pets.
6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates.
7) No childcare cost now.
8) No one is in therapy
9) No divorce, alimony, child support
10) No fertility treatments
11) No spa days
12) Only some organic stuff is consumed - milk, eggs, meat, berries. Rest is regular produce.
13) Do not have consumer loan (except for cars and house - we are not in debt)
14) I do not buy designer clothes, bags, shoes etc. Most of my clothes come from Kohl's and Macy's.
15) I will not buy most things from a shop, if I can buy from Costco.

Finally, I have confirmed that there is someone else on the boards like me! Our choices have left us in a comfortable position as we reach middle age, and it is a great feeling.

[Anonymous]

Um, 2000 sq ft is a mansion. Downsize.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Haven't read all the replies here, but I'd say that your definition of "survival" is probably what's making you feel so strapped. $3k per month mortgage (I think you said) is not a bargain mortgage. $1100 per month for food and kids stuff (again, I think you said) does not sound like people who are trying to keep their spending down. I'm not saying it's easy to live in this area on incomes that are anywhere near normal - but to characterize your spending as barely surviving is really making it seem as if you live in a bubble.

You want to live a higher-income life than you comfortably have, is what it comes down to. And, look, I'm the same way - husb and I earn about $150k, have no kids, pay $600 per month toward student loans, $2k per month for rent. And it seems like we are just barely keeping our heads above water. But in reality that is bullshit. We order in food every time we want it. We keep an expensive cable package because we feel like keeping it. I buy clothes a fair amount. My husband likes to buy comic books. We may not have a whole lot of savings, and we may not have a huge amount of extra $ once we're done accounting for all the stuff we buy - but that's not barely surviving!

Comment again after having two kids on your salary.

PP here: and, look, this is sort of exactly the point. DC is expensive! You can't have everything you want here. That might mean not having 2 kids in daycare at the same time. Or if you want to do that, then you need a cheaper house. Or to spend less on food. Again, like I said before, just like OP, I would like to live a more luxurious, more comfortable life than I actually have. But to characterize this as not being able to SURVIVE is stupid.

NP here. On less than 200K HHI, we have funded our retirement, heavily insured, Prepaid college tuition for both kids, 2 cars, a SFH in the suburbs. Our kids will have very little or no student loans.

So what did we not do?
1) Did not do private schools
2) Did not have student loans
3) Did not upgrade to a bigger house (ours is 3200 sq ft)
4) Do not lease new cars. We have fuel efficient cars
5) Do not have pets.
6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates.
7) No childcare cost now.
8) No one is in therapy
9) No divorce, alimony, child support
10) No fertility treatments
11) No spa days
12) Only some organic stuff is consumed - milk, eggs, meat, berries. Rest is regular produce.
13) Do not have consumer loan (except for cars and house - we are not in debt)
14) I do not buy designer clothes, bags, shoes etc. Most of my clothes come from Kohl's and Macy's.
15) I will not buy most things from a shop, if I can buy from Costco.

Finally, I have confirmed that there is someone else on the boards like me! Our choices have left us in a comfortable position as we reach middle age, and it is a great feeling.

High five! Actually before I came on this board, I used to feel that we are very rich - especially looking at what we achieved. Only now I realize that we are actually poor by DCUM HHI standards. Still, it is a bliss to have created wealth and to have hung on to it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Um, 2000 sq ft is a mansion. Downsize.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Um, 2000 sq ft is a mansion. Downsize.

Don't know if your comment was directed towards me (3200 sq ft homeowner)?

Maybe it is a mansion. We have friends who live in million dollar homes, and trust me that our house feels small compared to theirs. We bought our house for about 290 K. We are not investment savvy kind of people but this was an extremely lucky break for us. If we sell it, we would not get 1/2 this house for 290K. Nope. I don't think we will downsize. There is no reason to. Our needs are well taken care of.

However, if we needed to - because we were debt ridden, or because of some misfortune, or because we did not have a retirement fund...we would sell and live in an apartment. I am not ashamed to say this. I would ALWAYS prefer to be cash rich vs, house rich!

[Anonymous]

I relate to OP. Our HHI is about 170k, but after costs (metro, parking, and gas is a whopping $600 for the two of us, health insurance $500 for a family of 3, grocery $600, daycare for one $1400) we don't have much to save. Housing costs in this area are insane. We manage by living in a relatively shitty neighborhood, small townhouse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

NP here. On less than 200K HHI, we have funded our retirement, heavily insured, Prepaid college tuition for both kids, 2 cars, a SFH in the suburbs. Our kids will have very little or no student loans.

So what did we not do?
1) Did not do private schools
2) Did not have student loans
3) Did not upgrade to a bigger house (ours is 3200 sq ft)
4) Do not lease new cars. We have fuel efficient cars
5) Do not have pets.
6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates.
7) No childcare cost now.
8) No one is in therapy
9) No divorce, alimony, child support
10) No fertility treatments
11) No spa days
12) Only some organic stuff is consumed - milk, eggs, meat, berries. Rest is regular produce.
13) Do not have consumer loan (except for cars and house - we are not in debt)
14) I do not buy designer clothes, bags, shoes etc. Most of my clothes come from Kohl's and Macy's.
15) I will not buy most things from a shop, if I can buy from Costco.

Finally, I have confirmed that there is someone else on the boards like me! Our choices have left us in a comfortable position as we reach middle age, and it is a great feeling.
I know you are really eager to feel superior but the fact is that only some of the items on this list are choices. Others are pure luck.

6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates. - That's pure luck.

8) No one is in therapy. - That isn't a choice, that's the lucky circumstance. It isn't a character flaw to need therapy.

9) No divorce, alimony, child support. - Few people getting divorced do so by choice. Some had that choice sprung upon them.

10) No fertility treatments. - THAT is pure luck, had nothing to do with choice. Go into a fertility clinic waiting room and marvel at how young the women waiting there are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

NP here. On less than 200K HHI, we have funded our retirement, heavily insured, Prepaid college tuition for both kids, 2 cars, a SFH in the suburbs. Our kids will have very little or no student loans.

So what did we not do?
1) Did not do private schools
2) Did not have student loans
3) Did not upgrade to a bigger house (ours is 3200 sq ft)
4) Do not lease new cars. We have fuel efficient cars
5) Do not have pets.
6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates.
7) No childcare cost now.
8) No one is in therapy
9) No divorce, alimony, child support
10) No fertility treatments
11) No spa days
12) Only some organic stuff is consumed - milk, eggs, meat, berries. Rest is regular produce.
13) Do not have consumer loan (except for cars and house - we are not in debt)
14) I do not buy designer clothes, bags, shoes etc. Most of my clothes come from Kohl's and Macy's.
15) I will not buy most things from a shop, if I can buy from Costco.

Finally, I have confirmed that there is someone else on the boards like me! Our choices have left us in a comfortable position as we reach middle age, and it is a great feeling.

I know you are really eager to feel superior but the fact is that only some of the items on this list are choices. Others are pure luck.

6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates. - That's pure luck.

8) No one is in therapy. - That isn't a choice, that's the lucky circumstance. It isn't a character flaw to need therapy.

9) No divorce, alimony, child support. - Few people getting divorced do so by choice. Some had that choice sprung upon them.

10) No fertility treatments. - THAT is pure luck, had nothing to do with choice. Go into a fertility clinic waiting room and marvel at how young the women waiting there are.


Perhaps, it is a lucky break to not have these costs. Just like it is a lucky break that many people get really high paying jobs with less qualifications than others. Or make a killing in stock markets. I do not begrudge their lot in life nor should they begrudge mine.

Never claimed I am richer. Just said that I have managed fine with what I make. Please also read my reply about what I would have done with my house if I did not have retirement savings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

NP here. On less than 200K HHI, we have funded our retirement, heavily insured, Prepaid college tuition for both kids, 2 cars, a SFH in the suburbs. Our kids will have very little or no student loans.

So what did we not do?
1) Did not do private schools
2) Did not have student loans
3) Did not upgrade to a bigger house (ours is 3200 sq ft)
4) Do not lease new cars. We have fuel efficient cars
5) Do not have pets.
6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates.
7) No childcare cost now.
8) No one is in therapy
9) No divorce, alimony, child support
10) No fertility treatments
11) No spa days
12) Only some organic stuff is consumed - milk, eggs, meat, berries. Rest is regular produce.
13) Do not have consumer loan (except for cars and house - we are not in debt)
14) I do not buy designer clothes, bags, shoes etc. Most of my clothes come from Kohl's and Macy's.
15) I will not buy most things from a shop, if I can buy from Costco.

Finally, I have confirmed that there is someone else on the boards like me! Our choices have left us in a comfortable position as we reach middle age, and it is a great feeling.

I know you are really eager to feel superior but the fact is that only some of the items on this list are choices. Others are pure luck.

6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates. - That's pure luck.

8) No one is in therapy. - That isn't a choice, that's the lucky circumstance. It isn't a character flaw to need therapy.

9) No divorce, alimony, child support. - Few people getting divorced do so by choice. Some had that choice sprung upon them.

10) No fertility treatments. - THAT is pure luck, had nothing to do with choice. Go into a fertility clinic waiting room and marvel at how young the women waiting there are.

Perhaps, it is a lucky break to not have these costs. Just like it is a lucky break that many people get really high paying jobs with less qualifications than others. Or make a killing in stock markets. I do not begrudge their lot in life nor should they begrudge mine.

Never claimed I am richer. Just said that I have managed fine with what I make. Please also read my reply about what I would have done with my house if I did not have retirement savings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

NP here. On less than 200K HHI, we have funded our retirement, heavily insured, Prepaid college tuition for both kids, 2 cars, a SFH in the suburbs. Our kids will have very little or no student loans.

So what did we not do?
1) Did not do private schools
2) Did not have student loans
3) Did not upgrade to a bigger house (ours is 3200 sq ft)
4) Do not lease new cars. We have fuel efficient cars
5) Do not have pets.
6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates.
7) No childcare cost now.
8) No one is in therapy
9) No divorce, alimony, child support
10) No fertility treatments
11) No spa days
12) Only some organic stuff is consumed - milk, eggs, meat, berries. Rest is regular produce.
13) Do not have consumer loan (except for cars and house - we are not in debt)
14) I do not buy designer clothes, bags, shoes etc. Most of my clothes come from Kohl's and Macy's.
15) I will not buy most things from a shop, if I can buy from Costco.

Finally, I have confirmed that there is someone else on the boards like me! Our choices have left us in a comfortable position as we reach middle age, and it is a great feeling.

I know you are really eager to feel superior but the fact is that only some of the items on this list are choices. Others are pure luck.

6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates. - That's pure luck.

8) No one is in therapy. - That isn't a choice, that's the lucky circumstance. It isn't a character flaw to need therapy.

9) No divorce, alimony, child support. - Few people getting divorced do so by choice. Some had that choice sprung upon them.

10) No fertility treatments. - THAT is pure luck, had nothing to do with choice. Go into a fertility clinic waiting room and marvel at how young the women waiting there are.

Perhaps, it is a lucky break to not have these costs. Just like it is a lucky break that many people get really high paying jobs with less qualifications than others. Or make a killing in stock markets. I do not begrudge their lot in life nor should they begrudge mine.

Never claimed I am richer. Just said that I have managed fine with what I make. Please also read my reply about what I would have done with my house if I did not have retirement savings.

I do not at all begrudge you your good fortune. I'm happy for you. I just don't think you should make it sound like it's all a product of choices. Some of it is a product of luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I know you are really eager to feel superior but the fact is that only some of the items on this list are choices. Others are pure luck.

6) Brought the house at the BOTTOM of the market. Even with the housing crash we were up 50%. Very low mortgage rates. - That's pure luck.

8) No one is in therapy. - That isn't a choice, that's the lucky circumstance. It isn't a character flaw to need therapy.

9) No divorce, alimony, child support. - Few people getting divorced do so by choice. Some had that choice sprung upon them.

10) No fertility treatments. - THAT is pure luck, had nothing to do with choice. Go into a fertility clinic waiting room and marvel at how young the women waiting there are.

Perhaps, it is a lucky break to not have these costs. Just like it is a lucky break that many people get really high paying jobs with less qualifications than others. Or make a killing in stock markets. I do not begrudge their lot in life nor should they begrudge mine.

Never claimed I am richer. Just said that I have managed fine with what I make. Please also read my reply about what I would have done with my house if I did not have retirement savings.

I do not at all begrudge you your good fortune. I'm happy for you. I just don't think you should make it sound like it's all a product of choices. Some of it is a product of luck.

Life is a series of good and bad luck. You hedge the risks by prioritizing, saving, living below your means, getting insurance and planning for the future. Things balance out for everyone. My point was that living in DC skews people's perception about what "surviving" means.

Single mom with dead-end job, high school education, special needs kid and a long commute on a lemon of a car, making $30,000 - I could call that surviving. I do not call making less than 200K in any shape and form - surviving. Get a grip!

Therapy, fertility treatments, alimony..these are not common costs that people will undergo - who are surviving - around the world. These seem to be very common in this area however. I will throw in detox from drugs and treatment for gambling addiction as well. Yes, these are expenses that people have - we did not. Luck? Or just good choices?

I am sick of seeing people crying they cannot make ends meet, but insisting on buying a house. Please, Rent! Save for retirement, for your kids college. The whole idea of home ownership because it is the American dream is a bogus idea. People are chained by this idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Sure it can work but without a lot of room for savings, 529s, incidentals. . . This is how ppl end up feeling strapped. 70% of their take home is going to the mortgage, childcare, and food.

Child care can be up to 65% of take home pay.

That's when it's time to quit work and SAH.

+ 100

The fact is that no one is assigning a dollar amount to the work SAHP do at home, the savings as well as cost of going to work - clothes, commuting, childcare etc.
But sometimes it is more economical if one partner stays at home and takes care of things at home and save money. If HHI goes up along with expenses - then it may not be worth it for one partner to WOH

How could childcare come to 65% of take home? Is that for just one person or the whole HHI? I can't imagine going that route. We currently pay 13k for childcare for one. Our take home would have to be 20k for that to be 65%. If I made that little I'd qualify for various childcare vouchers so I actually wouldn't even be paying that. So I call BS or you're paying for luxury care you can't afford.

Everybody cannot quit work and be SAH. Sometimes the man just is not the higher earner. Sometimes him staying home is just not a valid alternative either. 13K for child care for one kid is a very good deal. Everybody does not get such a good deal. Some people have more than 1 kid. This is not because of bad choices. We did just fine and were able to afford more than 1, but then life happens and work is not that guaranteed and so even household finances change.
illness and disability happens to all kinds of people