Responding to triangulation/gaslighting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
That goes well beyond NPD.

Your mother is very sick. If anyone can accompany her to her doctor and get her to explain this to the doctor, and get evaluated and put on meds, that would be great.

Make sure she doesn't have access to weapons or anyone else's finances apart from her own.

Pp here. I think you haven’t dealt with this flavor of dysfunction before.

There are a lot of degrees between what OP and I are describing and being so delusional/confused that a doctor could pick up on it.

There is one cardinal rule in these family systems and for people like OP’s mom: you save face and you don’t show outsiders the reality.

Even if OP took her mom to a doc, her mom would probably end up charming the pants off the doctor and planting some seed that Op was only there to get Mom’s money or some other nonsense.

The fundamental rule governing life for people like OP’s mom is that nothing can ever be their fault. Absolutely nothing. So all the delusions surround that fundamental issue. They know what day and time it is and could pass a cognitive test.

[Anonymous]

Sorry I got cut off above.

But ask someone like OP’s mom “why don’t you and your daughter speak?” Or “what would you do differently if you had a do over?” And you’ll get the kinds of bat doo doo that OP described.

[Anonymous]

I feel for you Op. Your mom is way worse than mine however I caught my mom lying to my sister about me a few years back. I had always wondered why my sister doesn't want to know me. Then it all clicked.

These types of mothers are dangerous for your other relationships. Keep her at a distance. Drop the rope. She will infect the rest of your life given any chance to do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
That goes well beyond NPD.

Your mother is very sick. If anyone can accompany her to her doctor and get her to explain this to the doctor, and get evaluated and put on meds, that would be great.

Make sure she doesn't have access to weapons or anyone else's finances apart from her own.

+1 I would suspect dementia, but you say she’s always been like this? It’s one thing to be a paranoid person (which a symptom of paranoid personality disorder, dementia, neurosis, etc.) but if she *truly* believes that your brother has died, then that’s a symptom of psychosis, and serious mental illness with delusions.

[Anonymous]

^^ particularly as you say she’s always been like this, and not just recently.

[Anonymous]

The good news is that you and your siblings are on the same page. The only way to have a relationship with her is to set those boundaries and relieve yourself of any expectations of her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
That goes well beyond NPD.

Your mother is very sick. If anyone can accompany her to her doctor and get her to explain this to the doctor, and get evaluated and put on meds, that would be great.

Make sure she doesn't have access to weapons or anyone else's finances apart from her own.

I have tried to intervene in her care precisely twice, and will never do it again. She will act like she needs help because she is confused. She told the doctor’s office that she kept forgetting about appointments and couldn’t get herself there. She was in her late 50s at the time. The reality was that she knew the doctor told her she needed surgery, and she didn’t want to have it. She’s afraid of hospitals stays due to trauma early in life. When the nurse called to explain, I told her my mother was just trying to avoid the needed care, and it was clear the nurse thought I was a terrible, uncaring child. The truth is that I had spoken to my mom many times about what was needed, and every conversation ended with her blaming all the doctors and nurses for being idiots who were using her to make a buck. She manipulated them very effectively. Another time, she had convinced me that she was improving herself with therapy. She said family therapy would help our communication. I was in my 20s, and more gullible back then. She had convinced the therapist that my sister and I were abusing her and trying to ruin her marriage. The therapist did not believe me when I tried to explain the situation. She basically weaponized the therapist. This is common in people with personality disorders.

I appreciate your comment, PP. what you’re suggesting is rational and normal. I’m just not dealing with rational or normal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
That goes well beyond NPD.

Your mother is very sick. If anyone can accompany her to her doctor and get her to explain this to the doctor, and get evaluated and put on meds, that would be great.

Make sure she doesn't have access to weapons or anyone else's finances apart from her own.

+1 I would suspect dementia, but you say she’s always been like this? It’s one thing to be a paranoid person (which a symptom of paranoid personality disorder, dementia, neurosis, etc.) but if she *truly* believes that your brother has died, then that’s a symptom of psychosis, and serious mental illness with delusions.

She’s 61, so not really at prime dementia age. None of this behavior is new, just an extension of previously manufactured details.

[Anonymous]

Op here again. I read up on paranoid personality disorder. That could be it. Who knows? I’m not a doctor, just a person trying to avoid some abuse. The symptoms of the different personality disorders overlap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
That goes well beyond NPD.

Your mother is very sick. If anyone can accompany her to her doctor and get her to explain this to the doctor, and get evaluated and put on meds, that would be great.

Make sure she doesn't have access to weapons or anyone else's finances apart from her own.

I have tried to intervene in her care precisely twice, and will never do it again. She will act like she needs help because she is confused. She told the doctor’s office that she kept forgetting about appointments and couldn’t get herself there. She was in her late 50s at the time. The reality was that she knew the doctor told her she needed surgery, and she didn’t want to have it. She’s afraid of hospitals stays due to trauma early in life. When the nurse called to explain, I told her my mother was just trying to avoid the needed care, and it was clear the nurse thought I was a terrible, uncaring child. The truth is that I had spoken to my mom many times about what was needed, and every conversation ended with her blaming all the doctors and nurses for being idiots who were using her to make a buck. She manipulated them very effectively. Another time, she had convinced me that she was improving herself with therapy. She said family therapy would help our communication. I was in my 20s, and more gullible back then. She had convinced the therapist that my sister and I were abusing her and trying to ruin her marriage. The therapist did not believe me when I tried to explain the situation. She basically weaponized the therapist. This is common in people with personality disorders.

I appreciate your comment, PP. what you’re suggesting is rational and normal. I’m just not dealing with rational or normal.

PP you replied to. I'm not faulting you at all, OP, for not doing more!

Can YOU make an appointment with a psychiatrist to learn more about your mother's condition, and can they point you to resources? It would mean the cost of an appointment, and of course the psychiatrist will tell you they cannot diagnose without seeing the patient, so explain this upfront when you call... but I'm sure you are not the only person to seek help from a psychiatrist in that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel for you Op. Your mom is way worse than mine however I caught my mom lying to my sister about me a few years back. I had always wondered why my sister doesn't want to know me. Then it all clicked.

These types of mothers are dangerous for your other relationships. Keep her at a distance. Drop the rope. She will infect the rest of your life given any chance to do it.

+1

This 100%.

[Anonymous]

So here’s what you do: have Golden Alien brother show up at her place rattling chains in the middle of the night. He can tell her to F off, and that you other two have joined him in hell.

[Anonymous]

The other thing to consider is that she wants attention. Kids do this, they ratchet up the bad behavior when they are not noticed for the good behavior. So, try to reach out and give her positive feedback for even the tiniest good behavior and talk to her about topics that are not inflaming. Once she does the crazy stuff - grey rock. See if that helps with reinforcing the good behavior and reducing the crazy stuff.

[Anonymous]

OP I think your mom has mental illness.

[Anonymous]

+100 on the grey rock. When you cut off contact, a person like this will attempt to cause you a lot of trouble and there will be repercussions and drama. You just want to be as boring as possible, steer every conversation into the banal and mundane and innocuous. You can create boundaries by using very short requests without explanations, and repeat ad nauseum, for example: "I don't want to talk about my siblings with you. How is your garden doing?"