What’s wrong with William & Mary?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Va population looking at LACs pays $30,000 less a year than for most private schools.

What does this mean!

This is Paying for College 101

Many LACs cost more than $70k a year all in. And many top LACs don’t give merit aid. WM costs a bit over $40k in state. That makes WM $30k a year less expensive for a DCUM donut hole family.

I’d love to send my kid to Hamilton or Bowdoin or Amherst. But not if I’m paying $120,000 more over 4 years.

Why are those the only two options. There are many great schools ranked lower than Bowdoin and Amherst. You have set up a false set of options for yourself.

Sure. My kid has applied to Oberlin, Kenyon, Grinnell, Macalester, etc and we are crossing our fingers for merit aid. But our kid would have to max out merit to get the cost down to WM— many of these schools cap at $25k. And the fact remains, if you don’t qualify for need based aid and your kid doesn’t get merit, or doesn’t max out merit, WM costs a lot less than private SLAC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Va population looking at LACs pays $30,000 less a year than for most private schools.

What does this mean!

This is Paying for College 101

Many LACs cost more than $70k a year all in. And many top LACs don’t give merit aid. WM costs a bit over $40k in state. That makes WM $30k a year less expensive for a DCUM donut hole family.

I’d love to send my kid to Hamilton or Bowdoin or Amherst. But not if I’m paying $120,000 more over 4 years.

Thanks for clarifying! We are a donut home family and DC is applying to 3 SLACs - they each off pretty good aid-so I hear. DC lived WandM. DC is an introvert - think cat lady like prefers reading a book over drinking with random people. WandM looks like a good fit. Hoping DC gets in! Hoping the SLACs offer competitive aid!

Yep. I have an introverted, nerdy boy. Has an amazing offer from Wooster EA, his safety. Fingers crossed that he gets into WM or merit looks great from some of the other SLACs. Would at least stand a chance at UVA but not applying.

[Anonymous]

^^congrats on Wooster!

my cat lady DC is applying to UVA due to pressure from family and friends. But really has no interest. I think WM would be a better fit. Some SLACs offer more than 25k in merit aid. DC applying to 2 that offer up to 40k in merit aid.

[Anonymous]

I have no iron in the fire on this one but W&M is a fantastic choice for any serious student. Clearly, OP's kid didn't get in ED and is trying to work out her issues. I wish people didn't use this forum that way, but they do.

And, as to high selectivity percentage, both UVA and W&M stats are higher than, say Pomona College, because applicants are self-selected and directed by the high school counselor, who directs in-state Virginia students to the best institution for the student. With SCHEV and Naviance stats, the counselors are now able to make a pretty good guess as to chance. The counselor's (and high school's) credibility is at stake; they are not going to back the application of a student with a number of A-s and B+s to the top VA schools. Sure, they might put in an application as 14:23's kid did, but not attend (thus making for a low yield percentage). Also a lot of high stats kids from Virginia use UVA and W&M as safeties for Ivies (mine did). The counselors write letters of recommendation to the Virginia institutions and prepare the high school profile against which each student in the Virginia high school is compared. That's how UVA and W&M know if your students is in the top 10% or 5% of the class. the counselors are also responsible for checking the "most rigorous" box to tell the institution if your student has taken the most rigorous courses that the high school has to offer. This is why you cannot compare the selectivity and yield numbers of small privates to publics. Many publics don't have the resources or desire to compete on USN&WR yield and selectivity figures because their mission is different than that of a small SLAC trying to work its way up the food chain on the USN&WR rankings.

[Anonymous]

Nothing is wrong with W&M, OP, except that you keep posting negative comments about it. It's a fantastic value and very very difficult to get into. Look at the SCHEV statistics someone posted above. If you are applying from NOVA without hooks, you need a 4.43 just to be competitive. My children didn't apply because they wanted engineering and a big school but if they wanted the SLAC experience, we would have definitely been in line with all the other families from Virginia.

[Anonymous]

What is a donut hole family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What is a donut hole family?

Google it. CAme from medicare language originally. https://www.smartplanforcollege.com/donut-hole/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have no iron in the fire on this one but W&M is a fantastic choice for any serious student. Clearly, OP's kid didn't get in ED and is trying to work out her issues. I wish people didn't use this forum that way, but they do.

And, as to high selectivity percentage, both UVA and W&M stats are higher than, say Pomona College, because applicants are self-selected and directed by the high school counselor, who directs in-state Virginia students to the best institution for the student. With SCHEV and Naviance stats, the counselors are now able to make a pretty good guess as to chance. The counselor's (and high school's) credibility is at stake; they are not going to back the application of a student with a number of A-s and B+s to the top VA schools. Sure, they might put in an application as 14:23's kid did, but not attend (thus making for a low yield percentage). Also a lot of high stats kids from Virginia use UVA and W&M as safeties for Ivies (mine did). The counselors write letters of recommendation to the Virginia institutions and prepare the high school profile against which each student in the Virginia high school is compared. That's how UVA and W&M know if your students is in the top 10% or 5% of the class. the counselors are also responsible for checking the "most rigorous" box to tell the institution if your student has taken the most rigorous courses that the high school has to offer. This is why you cannot compare the selectivity and yield numbers of small privates to publics. Many publics don't have the resources or desire to compete on USN&WR yield and selectivity figures because their mission is different than that of a small SLAC trying to work its way up the food chain on the USN&WR rankings.

If you are implying that the poster who was put off by the faculty panel is posting because her child did not get in...you are wrong. That panel caused my DC not to apply. So there's that...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have no iron in the fire on this one but W&M is a fantastic choice for any serious student. Clearly, OP's kid didn't get in ED and is trying to work out her issues. I wish people didn't use this forum that way, but they do.

And, as to high selectivity percentage, both UVA and W&M stats are higher than, say Pomona College, because applicants are self-selected and directed by the high school counselor, who directs in-state Virginia students to the best institution for the student. With SCHEV and Naviance stats, the counselors are now able to make a pretty good guess as to chance. The counselor's (and high school's) credibility is at stake; they are not going to back the application of a student with a number of A-s and B+s to the top VA schools. Sure, they might put in an application as 14:23's kid did, but not attend (thus making for a low yield percentage). Also a lot of high stats kids from Virginia use UVA and W&M as safeties for Ivies (mine did). The counselors write letters of recommendation to the Virginia institutions and prepare the high school profile against which each student in the Virginia high school is compared. That's how UVA and W&M know if your students is in the top 10% or 5% of the class. the counselors are also responsible for checking the "most rigorous" box to tell the institution if your student has taken the most rigorous courses that the high school has to offer. This is why you cannot compare the selectivity and yield numbers of small privates to publics. Many publics don't have the resources or desire to compete on USN&WR yield and selectivity figures because their mission is different than that of a small SLAC trying to work its way up the food chain on the USN&WR rankings.

If you are implying that the poster who was put off by the faculty panel is posting because her child did not get in...you are wrong. That panel caused my DC not to apply. So there's that...

No, I don’t think so. Your child is having a great experience, much better than those kids at W&M. You made that clear. I think the above is for people who are interested in W&M.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have no iron in the fire on this one but W&M is a fantastic choice for any serious student. Clearly, OP's kid didn't get in ED and is trying to work out her issues. I wish people didn't use this forum that way, but they do.

And, as to high selectivity percentage, both UVA and W&M stats are higher than, say Pomona College, because applicants are self-selected and directed by the high school counselor, who directs in-state Virginia students to the best institution for the student. With SCHEV and Naviance stats, the counselors are now able to make a pretty good guess as to chance. The counselor's (and high school's) credibility is at stake; they are not going to back the application of a student with a number of A-s and B+s to the top VA schools. Sure, they might put in an application as 14:23's kid did, but not attend (thus making for a low yield percentage). Also a lot of high stats kids from Virginia use UVA and W&M as safeties for Ivies (mine did). The counselors write letters of recommendation to the Virginia institutions and prepare the high school profile against which each student in the Virginia high school is compared. That's how UVA and W&M know if your students is in the top 10% or 5% of the class. the counselors are also responsible for checking the "most rigorous" box to tell the institution if your student has taken the most rigorous courses that the high school has to offer. This is why you cannot compare the selectivity and yield numbers of small privates to publics. Many publics don't have the resources or desire to compete on USN&WR yield and selectivity figures because their mission is different than that of a small SLAC trying to work its way up the food chain on the USN&WR rankings.

If you are implying that the poster who was put off by the faculty panel is posting because her child did not get in...you are wrong. That panel caused my DC not to apply. So there's that...

No, I don’t think so. Your child is having a great experience, much better than those kids at W&M. You made that clear. I think the above is for people who are interested in W&M.

+1. It's a wonderful option for in-state Virginians who want the smaller SLAC experience but it is very difficult to get into.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is a donut hole family?

Google it. CAme from medicare language originally. https://www.smartplanforcollege.com/donut-hole/

HHI of about $150k-$300k in the DMV. Too high to qualify for need based aid. Too low in a high COL area with nutso real estate prices to shell out $300k per kid for college.

[Anonymous]

William and Mary has been woefully underfunded for decades. That’s not it’s fault. It has had a hard time getting the basics right, such as a school mascot and logo. But it’s nearing the end of a seemingly successful billion dollar fundraising drive (no easy feat), so here’s hoping for the best. There should be a larger number of scholarships available. It’s a sui generis school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems to me that it doesn’t really have a bright future as a public school. In a time of increased popularity for many Virginia public universities, William & Mary seems to be caught in a downward spiral. Its application numbers are stagnant, its female-male ratio is ridiculous, its acceptance rate has increased to almost 40 percent, its yield rate is terrible, it’s poorly positioned in terms of tech growth, it’s very expensive, and it’s now looking to increase (?) enrollment because it needs the bucks. Discouraging my kid from applying. Is it time for the school to consider becoming a private college or to affiliate with Tech or something?

UNC and Emory have the same gender balance.

For 2018 entering class, UVA was 57% female, VCU 64%, JMU 59%, Longwood 69%, CNU 56%, MWU 66%, Radford 59%, ODU 53%. Only male majority were VT at 55% male and VMI at 83% male. GMU was 50/50. UNC-CH was 59% female. National is close to 58 percent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems to me that it doesn’t really have a bright future as a public school. In a time of increased popularity for many Virginia public universities, William & Mary seems to be caught in a downward spiral. Its application numbers are stagnant, its female-male ratio is ridiculous, its acceptance rate has increased to almost 40 percent, its yield rate is terrible, it’s poorly positioned in terms of tech growth, it’s very expensive, and it’s now looking to increase (?) enrollment because it needs the bucks. Discouraging my kid from applying. Is it time for the school to consider becoming a private college or to affiliate with Tech or something?

UNC and Emory have the same gender balance.

For 2018 entering class, UVA was 57% female, VCU 64%, JMU 59%, Longwood 69%, CNU 56%, MWU 66%, Radford 59%, ODU 53%. Only male majority were VT at 55% male and VMI at 83% male. GMU was 50/50. UNC-CH was 59% female. National is close to 58 percent.

+1. My son is applying to WM and SLACs. I told him to enjoy the one time in his life that he will Ben’s for from affirmative action. His sister works harder and has better grades. Should have equivalent test scores. And will have a harder time in college admissions because she isn’t looking at hardcore STEM.

College admissions is where you really see the results of girls having earlier prefrontal cortex development and better executive functioning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s ok that your kid didn’t get accepted. They wouldn’t have liked it anyway. Anyways.

Spot on, I went there years ago and regret not choosing a different school w/ more social outlets. It’s a pressure cooker for. no. Reason.. like on Friday night no one wants to go out because they are studying.