Not gifted, but wants to learn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

During “results season” someone on here posted that something like 40-50% of their schools second graders went to AAP every year. That was astonishing. It’s maybe 4 or 5 kids at most from our school every year.

It's even more astonishing if you break the results down by race and by SES. My school has 20-25% acceptance into AAP, but that translates to about 100% acceptance of South Asians, 75% of other Asians, and 50% of white kids getting in. Slightly less than half of the kids who are not FARMS got in. It just shows that groups who value education, want their kids in AAP, and have the means to enrich their kids are generally able to get their kids into AAP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think my son is gifted, but he has incredible executive function skills and loves to work hard. He is a rising second grader and said school was too boring last year and he hopes it is harder next year. Over the summer, he wanted to learn 2nd and 3rd grade math, so we're currently on multiplication and division.
I really feel like he would benefit from being in the AAP program, though his NNAT score was just around 120. What are the chances that a child that is not actually gifted, but interested in working hard and learning, can be placed in the AAP program? My older daughter has learning disabilities, so this is all new to me.

My two older children are merely "bright" certainly not gifted (IQs both below 120) and they are enjoying full time AAP. I can't compare with the regular 3rd grade and up but our experience is that any above average child will do fine in AAP. If you have a great base school with lots of learning opportunities and a high achieving peer group, that will probably be fine too. We didn't have that hence the push to move to the AAP center.

Forgot to mention, they both worked through this book and scored well on the Cogat. Even getting a few more questions right is a huge increase on the test score and "prepping" absolutely inflates the scores. $15 well spent. Sorry haters.


https://www.amazon.com/Gifted-Talented-COGAT-Test-Grade/dp/0997943955/ref=pd_sbs_14_2/134-9624849-1030943?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=0997943955&pd_rd_r=8ac15734-d548-477a-9e1c-56c6420b91b6&pd_rd_w=nFsSQ&pd_rd_wg=8R67l&pf_rd_p=43281256-7633-49c8-b909-7ffd7d8cb21e&pf_rd_r=JG2JA4ZY5RE2BXGEMXH6&psc=1&refRID=JG2JA4ZY5RE2BXGEMXH6

I guess that's why scores alone don't guarantee admission. But how do you know that it worked though? My kid did ok on the NNAT (mid 120s) didn't prep and did much better on the Cogat (141) (and is now in AAP). It's not like you can do a FCPS Cogat pre-test to compare.

[Anonymous]

Assuming it’s because her kids have IQs under 120 but got Cogat scores that were much higher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think my son is gifted, but he has incredible executive function skills and loves to work hard. He is a rising second grader and said school was too boring last year and he hopes it is harder next year. Over the summer, he wanted to learn 2nd and 3rd grade math, so we're currently on multiplication and division.
I really feel like he would benefit from being in the AAP program, though his NNAT score was just around 120. What are the chances that a child that is not actually gifted, but interested in working hard and learning, can be placed in the AAP program? My older daughter has learning disabilities, so this is all new to me.

Dear Op, You can actually work on making your son obedient and train him to learn to follow teacher instructions to the T. If he is identified as a favorite by the teacher and the AART, then your GBRS will be very high. They do not measure gifted abilities You can then practice Cogat paper folding section and eventually go over other areas. A very high GBRS and a high Cogat will get your child selected. The only point I would like to make you aware is that the time you spend teaching your child is way more valuable in making him successful than relying on public school AART, AAP or GenEd teachers who manage 26 children per class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think my son is gifted, but he has incredible executive function skills and loves to work hard. He is a rising second grader and said school was too boring last year and he hopes it is harder next year. Over the summer, he wanted to learn 2nd and 3rd grade math, so we're currently on multiplication and division.
I really feel like he would benefit from being in the AAP program, though his NNAT score was just around 120. What are the chances that a child that is not actually gifted, but interested in working hard and learning, can be placed in the AAP program? My older daughter has learning disabilities, so this is all new to me.

Dear Op, You can actually work on making your son obedient and train him to learn to follow teacher instructions to the T. If he is identified as a favorite by the teacher and the AART, then your GBRS will be very high. They do not measure gifted abilities You can then practice Cogat paper folding section and eventually go over other areas. A very high GBRS and a high Cogat will get your child selected. The only point I would like to make you aware is that the time you spend teaching your child is way more valuable in making him successful than relying on public school AART, AAP or GenEd teachers who manage 26 children per class.

This is an absurd post.

[Anonymous]

NP here. I have two children. I'm of the mindset: do not impede, do not promote. That is why I won't prep. If one child ended up qualifying for AAP I would not prevent them from going, but I can not, in good conscience, do anything to promote it. Separating them, labeling them differently, I think, is pretty terrible for the sibling relationship. It exacerbates a very small difference. They are not that far apart in their abilities. If one of them were a true academic outliner, I might feel differently. I want to give them an equal start. I want them to have experiences in common, especially early educational experiences. What they achieve later in their educational career, I know, will be due to individual strengths and work ethic, but I want them to be offered the same beginning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP here. I have two children. I'm of the mindset: do not impede, do not promote. That is why I won't prep. If one child ended up qualifying for AAP I would not prevent them from going, but I can not, in good conscience, do anything to promote it. Separating them, labeling them differently, I think, is pretty terrible for the sibling relationship. It exacerbates a very small difference. They are not that far apart in their abilities. If one of them were a true academic outliner, I might feel differently. I want to give them an equal start. I want them to have experiences in common, especially early educational experiences. What they achieve later in their educational career, I know, will be due to individual strengths and work ethic, but I want them to be offered the same beginning.

You realize in many, of not most, cases, families with two siblings have both in AAP? What do you do if you don’t promote the first kid and they are GE and the second kid is accepted? Not let them attend?

[Anonymous]

I think the PP addressed that

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't listen to these naysayers. My kid had a 118 CoGat and got in because she's a lover of learning, creative, and a very hard worker. Prep for the CoGat and he'll get a good score and a good GBRS if he loves learning and works hard. He totally belongs in AAP. Very few kids are actually gifted in AAP. They are just smart, and so is your kid.

This is inaccurate. The scores tend to be clustered with the mean score a few points above the cutoff point of 132. Yes some kids do get admitted with lower scores but it's not accurate to say that very few kids are 'actually gifted.'

Getting 132 or higher on the Cogat does not make your kid gifted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here. I have two children. I'm of the mindset: do not impede, do not promote. That is why I won't prep. If one child ended up qualifying for AAP I would not prevent them from going, but I can not, in good conscience, do anything to promote it. Separating them, labeling them differently, I think, is pretty terrible for the sibling relationship. It exacerbates a very small difference. They are not that far apart in their abilities. If one of them were a true academic outliner, I might feel differently. I want to give them an equal start. I want them to have experiences in common, especially early educational experiences. What they achieve later in their educational career, I know, will be due to individual strengths and work ethic, but I want them to be offered the same beginning.

You realize in many, of not most, cases, families with two siblings have both in AAP? What do you do if you don’t promote the first kid and they are GE and the second kid is accepted? Not let them attend?

This seems like a false problem. First kid goes GE because best suited there, and second kid goes AAP because best suited there. I know several families in my neighborhood who've had a mix of GE/AAP in their family. It's really not an issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think my son is gifted, but he has incredible executive function skills and loves to work hard. He is a rising second grader and said school was too boring last year and he hopes it is harder next year. Over the summer, he wanted to learn 2nd and 3rd grade math, so we're currently on multiplication and division.
I really feel like he would benefit from being in the AAP program, though his NNAT score was just around 120. What are the chances that a child that is not actually gifted, but interested in working hard and learning, can be placed in the AAP program? My older daughter has learning disabilities, so this is all new to me.

Dear Op, You can actually work on making your son obedient and train him to learn to follow teacher instructions to the T. If he is identified as a favorite by the teacher and the AART, then your GBRS will be very high. They do not measure gifted abilities You can then practice Cogat paper folding section and eventually go over other areas. A very high GBRS and a high Cogat will get your child selected. The only point I would like to make you aware is that the time you spend teaching your child is way more valuable in making him successful than relying on public school AART, AAP or GenEd teachers who manage 26 children per class.

Being obedient and following teacher instructions to the t are not going to result in a high GBRS. If anything, doing those things will make a child look as though he has not a speck of creativity and only knows how to do what he is told.

[Anonymous]

By definition only 2% of kids in FCPS are gifted. And it’s not a given those kids are even in aap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think my son is gifted, but he has incredible executive function skills and loves to work hard. He is a rising second grader and said school was too boring last year and he hopes it is harder next year. Over the summer, he wanted to learn 2nd and 3rd grade math, so we're currently on multiplication and division.
I really feel like he would benefit from being in the AAP program, though his NNAT score was just around 120. What are the chances that a child that is not actually gifted, but interested in working hard and learning, can be placed in the AAP program? My older daughter has learning disabilities, so this is all new to me.

Dear Op, You can actually work on making your son obedient and train him to learn to follow teacher instructions to the T. If he is identified as a favorite by the teacher and the AART, then your GBRS will be very high. They do not measure gifted abilities You can then practice Cogat paper folding section and eventually go over other areas. A very high GBRS and a high Cogat will get your child selected. The only point I would like to make you aware is that the time you spend teaching your child is way more valuable in making him successful than relying on public school AART, AAP or GenEd teachers who manage 26 children per class.

Being obedient and following teacher instructions to the t are not going to result in a high GBRS. If anything, doing those things will make a child look as though he has not a speck of creativity and only knows how to do what he is told.

Not true. Most of the AAP kids at my dd's school are really good at working hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:By definition only 2% of kids in FCPS are gifted. And it’s not a given those kids are even in aap.

Depends on your definition, I guess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think my son is gifted, but he has incredible executive function skills and loves to work hard. He is a rising second grader and said school was too boring last year and he hopes it is harder next year. Over the summer, he wanted to learn 2nd and 3rd grade math, so we're currently on multiplication and division.
I really feel like he would benefit from being in the AAP program, though his NNAT score was just around 120. What are the chances that a child that is not actually gifted, but interested in working hard and learning, can be placed in the AAP program? My older daughter has learning disabilities, so this is all new to me.

Dear Op, You can actually work on making your son obedient and train him to learn to follow teacher instructions to the T. If he is identified as a favorite by the teacher and the AART, then your GBRS will be very high. They do not measure gifted abilities You can then practice Cogat paper folding section and eventually go over other areas. A very high GBRS and a high Cogat will get your child selected. The only point I would like to make you aware is that the time you spend teaching your child is way more valuable in making him successful than relying on public school AART, AAP or GenEd teachers who manage 26 children per class.

Being obedient and following teacher instructions to the t are not going to result in a high GBRS. If anything, doing those things will make a child look as though he has not a speck of creativity and only knows how to do what he is told.

The PP (or someone like the PP), complaining that only well behaved kids loved by teachers get good GBRS, likes to post the same thing in every AAP thread. It is a bogus argument. But I don't agree with the follow up post. My DSs classroom had a bunch of scrap paper for kids to work on when they finished their work. My well behaved DS would finish his work and then get scrap paper and start to write his own story, in English, or do math problems he made up, in Math. His teachers, he is in language immersion so he had two, both commented on how well he occupied himself doing extra work while not disturbing other kids in the class who were still working.

Teachers observe what is happening in the classroom. They see the kids who are bored, smart, and disruptive because they are bored and struggle with how to handle the down time once they finish their work. They know that those smart, bored kids need more of a challenge and that is reflected in their GBRSs. Teachers see the kids who are smart and quiet and not being disruptive and will comment on that. Teachers also see kids who are doing well, maybe on the upper end of the class, who are disruptive but who are likely to be caught academically by their peers in the near future.

I understand that the system is not prefect. In classrooms where the teacher is more challenged, they might miss the quiet kid that is well behaved but could benefit from AAP.

DS is starting second grade and I am worried about his GBRSs because I know he is the quiet kid who doesn't raise his hand. His K and First Grade teacher both talked about that at the parent teacher conference. They both also knew that he was one of the go to kids who could give the correct answer when they called on him. And they knew that he would work independently when he finished his work. So I know that they saw him and were working on building his confidence so he would participate more on a voluntary basis. But I am not so sure how those GBRSs will work out.

Prep, don't prep that is a families decision. My DH bought the GBRS book with a couple of exams from Amazon to go through with DS. DH was bored in school a lot and is worried that DS will be as well. I have learning disabilities and struggled in ES and MS, I found my footing in HS, so I was never bored. I think DS would be fine if he stayed in his language immersion program but DH is worried that the math is too slow and boring. The first grade math was really slow and boring so I understand where DH is coming from. I don't think DS needs the prep but it is not something I am worried about.