Does Early Decision limit chances for merit aid

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For all the sanctimonious outrage above about “what’s wrong with turning down an ED for financial reasons”, why can’t you understand that when you sign the agreement and turn over your financial picture to the school, you are supposed to be telling the truth about your finances.

If nothing material changed (and no PP, your prayers for a raise next year do not count), you’re a total jerk and you’ve basically LIED. Both YOU and the school have agreed on what would be feasible. If nothing changed except “just kidding, I don’t want to go anymore”, then your kid deserves to be blacklisted from all colleges.

Who exactly on the admissions boards is going to go through the list of 60,000 kids from various schools who were admitted ED ?
And which colleges are going to deny admission to a kid who can’t afford an $80,000 school but who might be able to attend a different school that offers more aid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your ability to attend is contingent on receiving merit aid, you cannot apply early decision.

You might, but might not, get merit money, and regardless, once accepted, you are obligated to enroll.

My understanding is that if you don't get the FA package that you need you are allowed to not enroll based on finances. I've read this multiple places.

this is true

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your ability to attend is contingent on receiving merit aid, you cannot apply early decision.

You might, but might not, get merit money, and regardless, once accepted, you are obligated to enroll.

My understanding is that if you don't get the FA package that you need you are allowed to not enroll based on finances. I've read this multiple places.

That understanding is not quite right.... if you don't get essentially the same level of FA package that the NPC suggested you would receive when you ran the NPC before applying to the school only then you are allowed to break the ED agreement.

On the other hand, if you ran the NPC before applying, saw an unaffordable EFC number, and yet applied ED anyway then you have no valid basis to break the ED agreement.

The NPC is only an estimate. Does it say "run the NPC before applying ED" on the ED contract? Many things can change. Maybe the student is hoping to get a scholarship from somewhere else or merit aid. Maybe the parent is going to get a raise, but doesn't. If you think you can swing it but find out you can't, you need to break the contract. I don't think the contract is based on the NPC. The "valid reason" is you don't have the money you thought you would, wherever it might have come from.

If you are the kind of person that would break an ED agreement because you didn't get the raise you hoped for, or would break it because your snowflake did not get the Jefferson Scholarship at UVA he wanted, then all I can say is that the ED school is better off without you and your kid.

I don’t get the reason for the distain. If someone’s child wants to apply early and is committed to going to a school but it turns out they can’t afford it because they didn’t get enough FA, merit aid, or money from somewhere else that they were expecting, they are allowed to say “we don’t have the money.” This is why there is a clause related to lack of finances.

I don't get it either PP. Anyone interested in applying ED and money is an issue should talk to the school to clarify their ED policy. Almost all allow you to turn down the offer for financial reasons and don't specify what those reasons need to be. People making disparaging comments about people who turn down ED for financial reasons don't know what they're talking about.

Simply not true. Several admissions representatives we spoke with said, if your ability to attend is contingent upon receiving merit scholarship money, then do not apply ED because it is a binding commitment.

Okay - again , that is not true. If they don’t offer you enough aid you can walk and nothing bad will happen to you.
We just did this last year. DD wanted to go to a top 5 school and the only way you have a chance to get into that school really is by applying ED.
She got in. Our financial aid discussions with the college hen took a few weeks and in the end it was an acceptable offer to us (but still insane compared to state school).
I can’t elaborate on our FA appeal but it was intense and a bit stressful , but necessary.

Elite schools do not award marinade. My comment above is related to merit, not financial aid.

If your financial aid was insufficient, yes, that is a reason to get out of your binding commitment. That is a totally different animal from merit scholarship money hoped for, but not awarded.

[Anonymous]

^^^ Merit aid, not marinade. LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your ability to attend is contingent on receiving merit aid, you cannot apply early decision.

You might, but might not, get merit money, and regardless, once accepted, you are obligated to enroll.

My understanding is that if you don't get the FA package that you need you are allowed to not enroll based on finances. I've read this multiple places.

That understanding is not quite right.... if you don't get essentially the same level of FA package that the NPC suggested you would receive when you ran the NPC before applying to the school only then you are allowed to break the ED agreement.

On the other hand, if you ran the NPC before applying, saw an unaffordable EFC number, and yet applied ED anyway then you have no valid basis to break the ED agreement.

The NPC is only an estimate. Does it say "run the NPC before applying ED" on the ED contract? Many things can change. Maybe the student is hoping to get a scholarship from somewhere else or merit aid. Maybe the parent is going to get a raise, but doesn't. If you think you can swing it but find out you can't, you need to break the contract. I don't think the contract is based on the NPC. The "valid reason" is you don't have the money you thought you would, wherever it might have come from.

If you are the kind of person that would break an ED agreement because you didn't get the raise you hoped for, or would break it because your snowflake did not get the Jefferson Scholarship at UVA he wanted, then all I can say is that the ED school is better off without you and your kid.

I don’t get the reason for the distain. If someone’s child wants to apply early and is committed to going to a school but it turns out they can’t afford it because they didn’t get enough FA, merit aid, or money from somewhere else that they were expecting, they are allowed to say “we don’t have the money.” This is why there is a clause related to lack of finances.

I don't get it either PP. Anyone interested in applying ED and money is an issue should talk to the school to clarify their ED policy. Almost all allow you to turn down the offer for financial reasons and don't specify what those reasons need to be. People making disparaging comments about people who turn down ED for financial reasons don't know what they're talking about.

Simply not true. Several admissions representatives we spoke with said, if your ability to attend is contingent upon receiving merit scholarship money, then do not apply ED because it is a binding commitment.

Okay - again , that is not true. If they don’t offer you enough aid you can walk and nothing bad will happen to you.
We just did this last year. DD wanted to go to a top 5 school and the only way you have a chance to get into that school really is by applying ED.
She got in. Our financial aid discussions with the college hen took a few weeks and in the end it was an acceptable offer to us (but still insane compared to state school).
I can’t elaborate on our FA appeal but it was intense and a bit stressful , but necessary.

Elite schools do not award marinade. My comment above is related to merit, not financial aid.

If your financial aid was insufficient, yes, that is a reason to get out of your binding commitment. That is a totally different animal from merit scholarship money hoped for, but not awarded.

We are hoping for merit aid and/or FA. I don’t see why it’s so different. Both are somewhat of a crapshoot and aren’t guaranteed.

[Anonymous]

This is a conversation you need to have with the financial aid office of the ED school.

If you don’t qualify for need based aid (you’ve run the NPC calculator) and you need merit aid to afford the ED school, then DO NOT apply for ED.

Ya’ll are confusing merit (non-need based aid) with need based aid. Colleges award merit according to their own rules, and it has nothing to do with your financial picture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your ability to attend is contingent on receiving merit aid, you cannot apply early decision.

You might, but might not, get merit money, and regardless, once accepted, you are obligated to enroll.

My understanding is that if you don't get the FA package that you need you are allowed to not enroll based on finances. I've read this multiple places.

That understanding is not quite right.... if you don't get essentially the same level of FA package that the NPC suggested you would receive when you ran the NPC before applying to the school only then you are allowed to break the ED agreement.

On the other hand, if you ran the NPC before applying, saw an unaffordable EFC number, and yet applied ED anyway then you have no valid basis to break the ED agreement.

The NPC is only an estimate. Does it say "run the NPC before applying ED" on the ED contract? Many things can change. Maybe the student is hoping to get a scholarship from somewhere else or merit aid. Maybe the parent is going to get a raise, but doesn't. If you think you can swing it but find out you can't, you need to break the contract. I don't think the contract is based on the NPC. The "valid reason" is you don't have the money you thought you would, wherever it might have come from.

If you are the kind of person that would break an ED agreement because you didn't get the raise you hoped for, or would break it because your snowflake did not get the Jefferson Scholarship at UVA he wanted, then all I can say is that the ED school is better off without you and your kid.

I don’t get the reason for the distain. If someone’s child wants to apply early and is committed to going to a school but it turns out they can’t afford it because they didn’t get enough FA, merit aid, or money from somewhere else that they were expecting, they are allowed to say “we don’t have the money.” This is why there is a clause related to lack of finances.

I don't get it either PP. Anyone interested in applying ED and money is an issue should talk to the school to clarify their ED policy. Almost all allow you to turn down the offer for financial reasons and don't specify what those reasons need to be. People making disparaging comments about people who turn down ED for financial reasons don't know what they're talking about.

Simply not true. Several admissions representatives we spoke with said, if your ability to attend is contingent upon receiving merit scholarship money, then do not apply ED because it is a binding commitment.

Okay - again , that is not true. If they don’t offer you enough aid you can walk and nothing bad will happen to you.
We just did this last year. DD wanted to go to a top 5 school and the only way you have a chance to get into that school really is by applying ED.
She got in. Our financial aid discussions with the college hen took a few weeks and in the end it was an acceptable offer to us (but still insane compared to state school).
I can’t elaborate on our FA appeal but it was intense and a bit stressful , but necessary.

Elite schools do not award marinade. My comment above is related to merit, not financial aid.

If your financial aid was insufficient, yes, that is a reason to get out of your binding commitment. That is a totally different animal from merit scholarship money hoped for, but not awarded.

We are hoping for merit aid and/or FA. I don’t see why it’s so different. Both are somewhat of a crapshoot and aren’t guaranteed.

You are confusing need and non-need based aid. They are not the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all the sanctimonious outrage above about “what’s wrong with turning down an ED for financial reasons”, why can’t you understand that when you sign the agreement and turn over your financial picture to the school, you are supposed to be telling the truth about your finances.

If nothing material changed (and no PP, your prayers for a raise next year do not count), you’re a total jerk and you’ve basically LIED. Both YOU and the school have agreed on what would be feasible. If nothing changed except “just kidding, I don’t want to go anymore”, then your kid deserves to be blacklisted from all colleges.

No one is talking about not telling the truth about their finances. No one is talking about a kid not wanting to go anymore. We are talking about not having enough money to go. Reasons include: not getting the FA that you hoped for, not getting a scholarship from somewhere else, not getting merit aid, a family member not being able to help when you hoped they would etc etc. It turns out you can’t afford the school so you use the clause that releases you from the commitment for financial reasons.

You should check with the college if “not getting merit aid” is a reason to get out of an ED agreement. Most schools do not look at merit aid as financial aid. It is free money given to whomever they choose.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your ability to attend is contingent on receiving merit aid, you cannot apply early decision.

You might, but might not, get merit money, and regardless, once accepted, you are obligated to enroll.

My understanding is that if you don't get the FA package that you need you are allowed to not enroll based on finances. I've read this multiple places.

That understanding is not quite right.... if you don't get essentially the same level of FA package that the NPC suggested you would receive when you ran the NPC before applying to the school only then you are allowed to break the ED agreement.

On the other hand, if you ran the NPC before applying, saw an unaffordable EFC number, and yet applied ED anyway then you have no valid basis to break the ED agreement.

The NPC is only an estimate. Does it say "run the NPC before applying ED" on the ED contract? Many things can change. Maybe the student is hoping to get a scholarship from somewhere else or merit aid. Maybe the parent is going to get a raise, but doesn't. If you think you can swing it but find out you can't, you need to break the contract. I don't think the contract is based on the NPC. The "valid reason" is you don't have the money you thought you would, wherever it might have come from.

If you are the kind of person that would break an ED agreement because you didn't get the raise you hoped for, or would break it because your snowflake did not get the Jefferson Scholarship at UVA he wanted, then all I can say is that the ED school is better off without you and your kid.

I don’t get the reason for the distain. If someone’s child wants to apply early and is committed to going to a school but it turns out they can’t afford it because they didn’t get enough FA, merit aid, or money from somewhere else that they were expecting, they are allowed to say “we don’t have the money.” This is why there is a clause related to lack of finances.

I don't get it either PP. Anyone interested in applying ED and money is an issue should talk to the school to clarify their ED policy. Almost all allow you to turn down the offer for financial reasons and don't specify what those reasons need to be. People making disparaging comments about people who turn down ED for financial reasons don't know what they're talking about.

Simply not true. Several admissions representatives we spoke with said, if your ability to attend is contingent upon receiving merit scholarship money, then do not apply ED because it is a binding commitment.

Okay - again , that is not true. If they don’t offer you enough aid you can walk and nothing bad will happen to you.
We just did this last year. DD wanted to go to a top 5 school and the only way you have a chance to get into that school really is by applying ED.
She got in. Our financial aid discussions with the college hen took a few weeks and in the end it was an acceptable offer to us (but still insane compared to state school).
I can’t elaborate on our FA appeal but it was intense and a bit stressful , but necessary.

Elite schools do not award marinade. My comment above is related to merit, not financial aid.

If your financial aid was insufficient, yes, that is a reason to get out of your binding commitment. That is a totally different animal from merit scholarship money hoped for, but not awarded.

We are hoping for merit aid and/or FA. I don’t see why it’s so different. Both are somewhat of a crapshoot and aren’t guaranteed.

You need to educate yourself. They are very different, and one is a crapshoot whereas the other is more defined.

Merit aid is awarded by a school based on its own somewhat subjective criteria. You could be an academic rock star and still not receive it for whatever arbitrary reason the school has.

Financial aid is based on the FAFSA and objective formulas.

If you are reliant on merit (not financial) aid to attend, you should not apply Early Decision. One of the admissions people said that exact thing in those exact words at a presentation DC and I attended last spring.

DC as a clear front-runner first choice school and is in fact an academic rock star, with stellar grades and scores. Notwithstanding this, DC did not apply ED to said school because her ability to attend is contingent on receiving merit aid (we don't qualify for FA), and we cannot risk ED acceptance without it being awarded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all the sanctimonious outrage above about “what’s wrong with turning down an ED for financial reasons”, why can’t you understand that when you sign the agreement and turn over your financial picture to the school, you are supposed to be telling the truth about your finances.

If nothing material changed (and no PP, your prayers for a raise next year do not count), you’re a total jerk and you’ve basically LIED. Both YOU and the school have agreed on what would be feasible. If nothing changed except “just kidding, I don’t want to go anymore”, then your kid deserves to be blacklisted from all colleges.

No one is talking about not telling the truth about their finances. No one is talking about a kid not wanting to go anymore. We are talking about not having enough money to go. Reasons include: not getting the FA that you hoped for, not getting a scholarship from somewhere else, not getting merit aid, a family member not being able to help when you hoped they would etc etc. It turns out you can’t afford the school so you use the clause that releases you from the commitment for financial reasons.

You should check with the college if “not getting merit aid” is a reason to get out of an ED agreement. Most schools do not look at merit aid as financial aid. It is free money given to whomever they choose.

+1

They will say no, it is not a reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation you need to have with the financial aid office of the ED school.

If you don’t qualify for need based aid (you’ve run the NPC calculator) and you need merit aid to afford the ED school, then DO NOT apply for ED.

Ya’ll are confusing merit (non-need based aid) with need based aid. Colleges award merit according to their own rules, and it has nothing to do with your financial picture.

We will probably call the school but I’m curious why you think it matters where the money comes from (FA/merit aid/other scholarships/family help/rotc). Bottom line is we need some assistance to pay. No guarantee we will get the money but it’s possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation you need to have with the financial aid office of the ED school.

If you don’t qualify for need based aid (you’ve run the NPC calculator) and you need merit aid to afford the ED school, then DO NOT apply for ED.

Ya’ll are confusing merit (non-need based aid) with need based aid. Colleges award merit according to their own rules, and it has nothing to do with your financial picture.

We will probably call the school but I’m curious why you think it matters where the money comes from (FA/merit aid/other scholarships/family help/rotc). Bottom line is we need some assistance to pay. No guarantee we will get the money but it’s possible.

Because the schools categorize it differently.

Run the calculator and it will say what the school has determined your need is (most of us disagree with those figures btw). Colleges that guarantee to meet 100% of need, mean that they will provide that number to anyone they admit ED or RD.

If you are confident in your ability to pay the net price out of funds you have at the time of the application, then apply ED. It is unlikely you will get more from the college.

If you are not, for whatever reason (including waiting on a relative to die, applying for outside scholarships, whatever) you cannot apply ED. Period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation you need to have with the financial aid office of the ED school.

If you don’t qualify for need based aid (you’ve run the NPC calculator) and you need merit aid to afford the ED school, then DO NOT apply for ED.

Ya’ll are confusing merit (non-need based aid) with need based aid. Colleges award merit according to their own rules, and it has nothing to do with your financial picture.

We will probably call the school but I’m curious why you think it matters where the money comes from (FA/merit aid/other scholarships/family help/rotc). Bottom line is we need some assistance to pay. No guarantee we will get the money but it’s possible.

Because the schools categorize it differently.

Run the calculator and it will say what the school has determined your need is (most of us disagree with those figures btw). Colleges that guarantee to meet 100% of need, mean that they will provide that number to anyone they admit ED or RD.

If you are confident in your ability to pay the net price out of funds you have at the time of the application, then apply ED. It is unlikely you will get more from the college.

If you are not, for whatever reason (including waiting on a relative to die, applying for outside scholarships, whatever) you cannot apply ED. Period.

Quite true and what PP^ is saying is correct. Merit aid is decided by the school and it is usually awarded when they want a particular student for something. The more elite the school the less like there will be any merit aid at all. For example, DS got awarded $26K from two small LACs you've never heard of only because they wanted his ACT score for reporting purposes to USN&WR. However, his ACT was about the high norm for state flagship an even with the 26K, it was still cheaper for him to go to the more prestigious flagship. No other institution, including ivies offered any merit whatsoever because they can get whatever stats they want from their normal applicant pools of 35,000. Financial aid, however, is determined by the FAFSA, which you file with the U.S. Department of Education. Their computers tell you what THEY (feds) think is your family contribution should be - and usually, as in our case or of donut hole families - that amount is full pay. The EFC (expected family contributiion) figure goes to the colleges. The colleges then look at the EFC - if your EFC is zero, then yes they will try to find some package of loans, pell grants, grants, workstudent, merit money to come up with an affordable package. But if your EFC is like most people in the D.C. area, you may get nothing. However if you file the FAFSA you can have your child obtain the standard $5500 federal unsubsidized loan, which our children do every year. That amount jumps about $1000 each year so your student will come out owing rougly $25K in total student debt but the rate of interest is low and the payout period is long. The different is going to fall on you, the family. That's why in-state options have become so desireable. Most of us can't afford $70-$85K a year in after-tax dollars, especially when we have more than one child in college at the same time. Do you have a good college counselor to talk to? They can explain all of this to you and give you direction

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation you need to have with the financial aid office of the ED school.

If you don’t qualify for need based aid (you’ve run the NPC calculator) and you need merit aid to afford the ED school, then DO NOT apply for ED.

Ya’ll are confusing merit (non-need based aid) with need based aid. Colleges award merit according to their own rules, and it has nothing to do with your financial picture.

Your financial picture is not just a fill in the blanks thing though. First you fill out the standard form but then you can appeal and explain special circumstances which they may or may not approve. At a private school aid is definitely fungible. The school may or may not want to work with your family and the only way to find out is to apply.

We had friends whose daughter was offered aid in loans and the dad called and asked for it in the form of grants and they changed it to grants- and off she went.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation you need to have with the financial aid office of the ED school.

If you don’t qualify for need based aid (you’ve run the NPC calculator) and you need merit aid to afford the ED school, then DO NOT apply for ED.

Ya’ll are confusing merit (non-need based aid) with need based aid. Colleges award merit according to their own rules, and it has nothing to do with your financial picture.

We will probably call the school but I’m curious why you think it matters where the money comes from (FA/merit aid/other scholarships/family help/rotc). Bottom line is we need some assistance to pay. No guarantee we will get the money but it’s possible.

Because the schools categorize it differently.

Run the calculator and it will say what the school has determined your need is (most of us disagree with those figures btw). Colleges that guarantee to meet 100% of need, mean that they will provide that number to anyone they admit ED or RD.

If you are confident in your ability to pay the net price out of funds you have at the time of the application, then apply ED. It is unlikely you will get more from the college.

If you are not, for whatever reason (including waiting on a relative to die, applying for outside scholarships, whatever) you cannot apply ED. Period.

Quite true and what PP^ is saying is correct. Merit aid is decided by the school and it is usually awarded when they want a particular student for something. The more elite the school the less like there will be any merit aid at all. For example, DS got awarded $26K from two small LACs you've never heard of only because they wanted his ACT score for reporting purposes to USN&WR. However, his ACT was about the high norm for state flagship an even with the 26K, it was still cheaper for him to go to the more prestigious flagship. No other institution, including ivies offered any merit whatsoever because they can get whatever stats they want from their normal applicant pools of 35,000. Financial aid, however, is determined by the FAFSA, which you file with the U.S. Department of Education. Their computers tell you what THEY (feds) think is your family contribution should be - and usually, as in our case or of donut hole families - that amount is full pay. The EFC (expected family contributiion) figure goes to the colleges. The colleges then look at the EFC - if your EFC is zero, then yes they will try to find some package of loans, pell grants, grants, workstudent, merit money to come up with an affordable package. But if your EFC is like most people in the D.C. area, you may get nothing. However if you file the FAFSA you can have your child obtain the standard $5500 federal unsubsidized loan, which our children do every year. That amount jumps about $1000 each year so your student will come out owing rougly $25K in total student debt but the rate of interest is low and the payout period is long. The different is going to fall on you, the family. That's why in-state options have become so desireable. Most of us can't afford $70-$85K a year in after-tax dollars, especially when we have more than one child in college at the same time. Do you have a good college counselor to talk to? They can explain all of this to you and give you direction

Private schools don’t use the FAFSA, they use the CSS profile from the college board (a total ripoff they charge you to send it to each school and the software is terrible) and there is a Net Price Calculator for each school.