Shaw Middle School Community Meeting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seriously, don't understand the negativity. Garrison was slated to close and the Shaw community rallied to save it. It's doing very well now. Thank you to those who are organizing! We will be there.

Can you provide specific details about how Garrison is doing well, other than their finally modernized building? How has that changed since 2012, when the Shaw community rallied to save Garrison? I joined the campaign to save Garrison way back when. But I don't see a school that has changed all that much (in terms of number of students or student achievement) in the intervening 6 years, and part of me wonders if consolidating Garrison and Seaton back then would have been better. Last year, Garrison had <35 kids in each grade, K-5.

I am not a Garrison parent (did not get off the WL this year), but I have studied the scores quite a bit because I want a long-term school for my children. Garrison's are on the upswing: https://garrisonelementary.org/2018/08/30/parcc-scores-released/

[Anonymous]

The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seriously, don't understand the negativity. Garrison was slated to close and the Shaw community rallied to save it. It's doing very well now. Thank you to those who are organizing! We will be there.

Can you provide specific details about how Garrison is doing well, other than their finally modernized building? How has that changed since 2012, when the Shaw community rallied to save Garrison? I joined the campaign to save Garrison way back when. But I don't see a school that has changed all that much (in terms of number of students or student achievement) in the intervening 6 years, and part of me wonders if consolidating Garrison and Seaton back then would have been better. Last year, Garrison had <35 kids in each grade, K-5.

I've also wondered if combining Garrison and Shaw would have been a really good idea, actually. But the movement did prove that the Shaw community can rally and advocate and change minds in DCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seriously, don't understand the negativity. Garrison was slated to close and the Shaw community rallied to save it. It's doing very well now. Thank you to those who are organizing! We will be there.

Can you provide specific details about how Garrison is doing well, other than their finally modernized building? How has that changed since 2012, when the Shaw community rallied to save Garrison? I joined the campaign to save Garrison way back when. But I don't see a school that has changed all that much (in terms of number of students or student achievement) in the intervening 6 years, and part of me wonders if consolidating Garrison and Seaton back then would have been better. Last year, Garrison had <35 kids in each grade, K-5.

I've also wondered if combining Garrison and Shaw would have been a really good idea, actually. But the movement did prove that the Shaw community can rally and advocate and change minds in DCPS.

*combining Garrison and Seaton

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seriously, don't understand the negativity. Garrison was slated to close and the Shaw community rallied to save it. It's doing very well now. Thank you to those who are organizing! We will be there.

Can you provide specific details about how Garrison is doing well, other than their finally modernized building? How has that changed since 2012, when the Shaw community rallied to save Garrison? I joined the campaign to save Garrison way back when. But I don't see a school that has changed all that much (in terms of number of students or student achievement) in the intervening 6 years, and part of me wonders if consolidating Garrison and Seaton back then would have been better. Last year, Garrison had <35 kids in each grade, K-5.

I've also wondered if combining Garrison and Shaw would have been a really good idea, actually. But the movement did prove that the Shaw community can rally and advocate and change minds in DCPS.

Except that they missed the boat on this one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

+1 I have lived in Shaw for almost 10 years and the number of families has exploded. On just our block, we went from being the only family with kids to one of 6. That happened on every block.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

+1 I have lived in Shaw for almost 10 years and the number of families has exploded. On just our block, we went from being the only family with kids to one of 6. That happened on every block.

Welcome to the Hill in the early 2000s. We still have a middle school problem. DCPS doesn't do middle school well across the city. Be careful what you wish for because you may end up with what they give you and not at all what you want.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

+1 I have lived in Shaw for almost 10 years and the number of families has exploded. On just our block, we went from being the only family with kids to one of 6. That happened on every block.

(And of those families, all are attending or planning on attending seaton, and NONE plan to continue at Cardozo)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

+1 I have lived in Shaw for almost 10 years and the number of families has exploded. On just our block, we went from being the only family with kids to one of 6. That happened on every block.

(And of those families, all are attending or planning on attending seaton, and NONE plan to continue at Cardozo)

It is way, way too late to claw this back. Figure out what you want. Garnett-Patterson? Improvements at the Cardozo site? Because you missed the boat on Shaw Middle's building.

[Anonymous]

I don't live in the area, truly have no dog in this fight. Personally as a DC resident and taxpayer what concerns me is the money being poured into these brand new schools which then are barely half full. Remember when Brookland folks agitated for a standalone middle school? $50 million later that beautiful, Metro-accessible building has 250 kids in it. Same for Dunbar, Coolidge, Woodson, etc. There seems to be an "if you build it, they will come" thought process that hasn't really been born out in actual decisions made by parents to send their kids to these schools. What seems to happen (from an outsider perspective) is a first mover problem where the predominantly lower income kids who were at the old schools start at the new one, and the middle and upper income families look at that and say "I don't want my kid to be the first (white, upper income black, whatever) kid in that grade". So all these middle and high schools get rebuilt, and the assumed influx of a more diverse student body doesn't materialize.

So now you have hundreds of millions in under-used buildings. That's the hard thing to see.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

+1 I have lived in Shaw for almost 10 years and the number of families has exploded. On just our block, we went from being the only family with kids to one of 6. That happened on every block.

You are absolutely wrong about this. There is still opportunity to change these plans. Nothing in DC is written in stone.

(And of those families, all are attending or planning on attending seaton, and NONE plan to continue at Cardozo)

It is way, way too late to claw this back. Figure out what you want. Garnett-Patterson? Improvements at the Cardozo site? Because you missed the boat on Shaw Middle's building.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

+1 I have lived in Shaw for almost 10 years and the number of families has exploded. On just our block, we went from being the only family with kids to one of 6. That happened on every block.

You are absolutely wrong about this. There is still opportunity to change these plans. Nothing in DC is written in stone.

(And of those families, all are attending or planning on attending seaton, and NONE plan to continue at Cardozo)

It is way, way too late to claw this back. Figure out what you want. Garnett-Patterson? Improvements at the Cardozo site? Because you missed the boat on Shaw Middle's building.

Why didn't these oh so capable advocates speak up earlier in the process? The Banneker decision has been publicly underway for months.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't live in the area, truly have no dog in this fight. Personally as a DC resident and taxpayer what concerns me is the money being poured into these brand new schools which then are barely half full. Remember when Brookland folks agitated for a standalone middle school? $50 million later that beautiful, Metro-accessible building has 250 kids in it. Same for Dunbar, Coolidge, Woodson, etc. There seems to be an "if you build it, they will come" thought process that hasn't really been born out in actual decisions made by parents to send their kids to these schools. What seems to happen (from an outsider perspective) is a first mover problem where the predominantly lower income kids who were at the old schools start at the new one, and the middle and upper income families look at that and say "I don't want my kid to be the first (white, upper income black, whatever) kid in that grade". So all these middle and high schools get rebuilt, and the assumed influx of a more diverse student body doesn't materialize.

So now you have hundreds of millions in under-used buildings. That's the hard thing to see.

It is because DCPS refuses to reckon with the low performance of the feeder schools. With incoming 6th graders several years behind, a middle school can hope to bring them to grade level but not much more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with “leave us all alone” is that middle schools are by definition regional and the area around here (1) has middle grades at Cardozo in an umderfilled space and (2) is not a growth area for DC, even if people like you feel like “pioneers “ following the revitalization of downtown.

First of all, Cardozo isn't an option for most mid-city families. The test scores are atrocious, so it's no surprise that the school is under enrolled. I would never considered sending my children there. That leaves charter schools or private schools. Move the Middle School out of Cardozo and Shaw Middle could have been a viable option.

To your second point, I'm not sure what metrics you are using to say that the downtown area isn't growing. I've lived in Logan Circle for over 10 years. LC and Shaw haven't stopped growing in that time and the number of young families has increased dramatically. Instead of trying to find a way to retain these families in the area, DCPS makes decisions that will force many of these families to move or leave DCPS altogether.

+1 I have lived in Shaw for almost 10 years and the number of families has exploded. On just our block, we went from being the only family with kids to one of 6. That happened on every block.

Welcome to the Hill in the early 2000s. We still have a middle school problem. DCPS doesn't do middle school well across the city. Be careful what you wish for because you may end up with what they give you and not at all what you want.

We could certainly learn from the Hill but I have no idea what your point is. Don't fight for something better?