Luther Jackson MS Enrollment Plunges as Expected

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes it's not about social engineering b/c the logistics (housing, dividing roadways, existing school zones, proximity, and future HS pyramid assignments) dictate a reasonable rezoning plan.

You are right that LJMS will be proportionally more ESOL and FARMS. These kids were there from the beginning, and LJ just lost some of its middle income kids who weren't ESOL/FARMS. So, it's not as though FCPS added ESOL/FARMS kids to LJ.

That said, sometimes there are logical reasons to pull one set of kids to another school that has nothing to do with trying to drive one school down or bring one school up. It is a secondary consequence -- that LJ is going to be more ESOL/FARMS.... but that is also a product of the types of housing that is built closest to the school facility.

I understand that in almost every decision, there are some people who feel like they got a better deal and some people who feel like they got a worse deal. I feel for you if you are a middle income household that is still zoned for LJMS.... but, it's not like LJ was that great before (in the gen ed side). You are mostly getting what you bought into. The people who got a windfall are those who used to be zoned for LJ and now are zoned for TMS.

Objectively speaking -- if you believe every kid is capable of success given the right conditions -- it has to be a net gain for the ESOL/FARMS kids at LJ to have more space and have more attention from the administration.

I don't own in Jackson or Thoreau, but I can see that this is making another school in the county more undesirable. How many of these do we want? If Luther Jackson was just on the cusp of being good enough before, this will send it in the wrong direction. Not good FCPS.

Yes, that is the objective assessment of the bad decision made here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can someone kindly post a link to this data that FCPS released? I can't seem to find it!

http://schoolprofiles.fcps.edu/schlprfl/f?p=108:42:1358751757792:::::

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Responding to 22:12 -- that's why they keep the AAP center at LJMS and why they won't put a center at TMS (they want more TMS AAP kids to come over to LJ to keep the scores up -- masking the lower gen ed test scores). It's similar to other schools where the gen ed population is largely ESOL/FARMS, but the center makes the whole school look at least middle of the pack. If a school is middling when it has a center, then the non-center part (the gen ed part) must be less than "middle". Twain is like this. Lorton Station. LJ. Then there are schools that have a large ESOL/FARMS population with the center and the gen ed is doing quite well i.e. Springfield Estates.

But, for the most part, how a school performs is going to be dictated by the type/quality of housing near the school. People who are struggling live in lower cost housing and the kids are bringing their struggles to school.

Because LJ has the AAP center, it will not become another Lee or Annandale that spirals down into ashes. It'll be more like Twain.

I wouldn’t be so sure about that. LJ now has the lowest 7th grade enrollment of any middle school with an AAP center. People will send their kids to Twain if the alternative is Key. Substitute Thoreau for Key and you get a different result. FCPS is gutting LJ.

[Anonymous]

I think the long term prospects for Luther Jackson are good. The Mosaic District and the other building in the area will eventually have more middle class students to balance it out. Kilmer and Longfellow have neighborhoods that could easily be moved to LJ to help with their overcrowding.

[Anonymous]

Agreed. In addition, based on experiences with two children (including one there right now), Luther Jackson still provides an outstanding and rigorous AAP program. The AAP teachers are top notch and students are extremely well-prepared for high school-level work, whether at base school or TJ. A significant percentage of the AAP kids from Louise Archer continue to choose LJ, TJ placement continues to be strong for a program of its size, and many of the top-performing students academically at TJ and Madison are LJ alumni.

[Anonymous]

"Luther Jackson Enrollment PLUNGES As Expected"

I can't help think that you are trying to bait people into an argument with your dramatic word choice. It was expected -- and INTENDED -- that LJMS's enrollment would in fact drop when kids were required to move over to another MS. And kids were going to be required to move OUT of LJMS because it was overcrowded!

Your whole issue is that you wanted more of the poor kids moved out of LJMS. And the decision didn't go your way.
But, let's not forget that the whole point of rezoning is to effect a reduction in enrollment at the school that is overcrowded. Somebody had to be moved out. And on the corollary -- somebody had to be moved over to TMS.

There was a school that was far undercapacity next to a school that was far overcapacity. 300-ish kids from the over-capacity school had to move out. Which kids? You had two groups -- those who are part of Oakton HS and those who are part of Falls Church. It wouldn't make any sense to take 300 Falls Church kids out of LJMS and send them to TMS.

At the base of this rezoning decision was the need to remove 300 kids from LJMS.

The answer given was: the kids who are not in this pyramid long term.

[Anonymous]

LJ is now over 200 students under capacity in the first year after this change was implemented. Thoreau still has capacity, but will likely be over capacity by the fall of 2019 and surely over capacity by 2020.

At the same time as LJ's enrollment is dropping, its ESOL and FARMS rates are going up - this will be confirmed later this year when the Virginia Department of Education publishes demographic information on schools in the state (they now do this earlier than FCPS, which waits longer to publish such data that it used to).

It was predicted, it is happening, and it is bad news for LJ, courtesy of School Board members who rail against things like climate change (over which they have no authority) while ensuring that future LJ students will go to a school with fewer teachers, fewer electives, less actively involved parents, and the smallest AAP middle school center in the county. Some flashy condos in Mosaic aren't going to change that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:LJ is now over 200 students under capacity in the first year after this change was implemented. Thoreau still has capacity, but will likely be over capacity by the fall of 2019 and surely over capacity by 2020.

At the same time as LJ's enrollment is dropping, its ESOL and FARMS rates are going up - this will be confirmed later this year when the Virginia Department of Education publishes demographic information on schools in the state (they now do this earlier than FCPS, which waits longer to publish such data that it used to).

It was predicted, it is happening, and it is bad news for LJ, courtesy of School Board members who rail against things like climate change (over which they have no authority) while ensuring that future LJ students will go to a school with fewer teachers, fewer electives, less actively involved parents, and the smallest AAP middle school center in the county. Some flashy condos in Mosaic aren't going to change that.

I’m thrilled with the decisions made and it has made LJ a better school environment. Do you even have a kid at lj?!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:LJ is now over 200 students under capacity in the first year after this change was implemented. Thoreau still has capacity, but will likely be over capacity by the fall of 2019 and surely over capacity by 2020.

At the same time as LJ's enrollment is dropping, its ESOL and FARMS rates are going up - this will be confirmed later this year when the Virginia Department of Education publishes demographic information on schools in the state (they now do this earlier than FCPS, which waits longer to publish such data that it used to).

It was predicted, it is happening, and it is bad news for LJ, courtesy of School Board members who rail against things like climate change (over which they have no authority) while ensuring that future LJ students will go to a school with fewer teachers, fewer electives, less actively involved parents, and the smallest AAP middle school center in the county. Some flashy condos in Mosaic aren't going to change that.

I’m thrilled with the decisions made and it has made LJ a better school environment. Do you even have a kid at lj?!

To the bolded poster, you don't do you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Luther Jackson Enrollment PLUNGES As Expected"

I can't help think that you are trying to bait people into an argument with your dramatic word choice. It was expected -- and INTENDED -- that LJMS's enrollment would in fact drop when kids were required to move over to another MS. And kids were going to be required to move OUT of LJMS because it was overcrowded!

Your whole issue is that you wanted more of the poor kids moved out of LJMS. And the decision didn't go your way.
But, let's not forget that the whole point of rezoning is to effect a reduction in enrollment at the school that is overcrowded. Somebody had to be moved out. And on the corollary -- somebody had to be moved over to TMS.

There was a school that was far undercapacity next to a school that was far overcapacity. 300-ish kids from the over-capacity school had to move out. Which kids? You had two groups -- those who are part of Oakton HS and those who are part of Falls Church. It wouldn't make any sense to take 300 Falls Church kids out of LJMS and send them to TMS.

At the base of this rezoning decision was the need to remove 300 kids from LJMS.

The answer given was: the kids who are not in this pyramid long term.

There previously were no kids destined for Oakton High School at Thoreau. All they did was separate Oakton High School kids into four feeder middle schools. Franklin, Carson, Luther Jackson, and now Thoreau. While overcrowded was a concern, there was no real reason to switch Oakton High school bound kids to Thoreau because of some high school feeder issue.

[Anonymous]

Oakton High School used to have 3 feeder middle schools. All they did was add a fourth.

[Anonymous]

NP, if I add up 7th and 8th grade for Thoreau - it hasn't gone up 200 kids from last year. (??)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oakton High School used to have 3 feeder middle schools. All they did was add a fourth.

They also turned Thoreau into a split feeder to not just two, but three, high schools (Madison, Marshall, and Oakton). In the past, there have been situations where the School Board moved wealthier kids out of poorer schools (ex: moving the 1/2 of Wakefield Forest at Annandale to Woodson or the 1/2 of Ravensworth from Annandale to Lake Braddock) and said it was a good idea because they were eliminating a split feeder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Luther Jackson Enrollment PLUNGES As Expected"

I can't help think that you are trying to bait people into an argument with your dramatic word choice. It was expected -- and INTENDED -- that LJMS's enrollment would in fact drop when kids were required to move over to another MS. And kids were going to be required to move OUT of LJMS because it was overcrowded!

Your whole issue is that you wanted more of the poor kids moved out of LJMS. And the decision didn't go your way.
But, let's not forget that the whole point of rezoning is to effect a reduction in enrollment at the school that is overcrowded. Somebody had to be moved out. And on the corollary -- somebody had to be moved over to TMS.

There was a school that was far undercapacity next to a school that was far overcapacity. 300-ish kids from the over-capacity school had to move out. Which kids? You had two groups -- those who are part of Oakton HS and those who are part of Falls Church. It wouldn't make any sense to take 300 Falls Church kids out of LJMS and send them to TMS.

At the base of this rezoning decision was the need to remove 300 kids from LJMS.

The answer given was: the kids who are not in this pyramid long term.

There previously were no kids destined for Oakton High School at Thoreau. All they did was separate Oakton High School kids into four feeder middle schools. Franklin, Carson, Luther Jackson, and now Thoreau. While overcrowded was a concern, there was no real reason to switch Oakton High school bound kids to Thoreau because of some high school feeder issue.

It was never about consolidating the OHS pyramid kids. You seem to be missing the issue at the core of the rezoning question.

1. LJMS was severely over crowded.
2. 300 kids needed to be moved out of LJMS.
3. Which kids should be moved out of the Falls Church feeder MS?
(a) 1/4 of the kids who will attend FCHS after leaving Jackson or
(b) all of the kids who will attend OHS after leaving Jackson ?

Remember that the AAP part of LJMS is not all OHS kids. It is primarily FCHS kids. Those AAP/OHS pyramid kids are making the CHOICE to attend LJMS for the program that is also offered at their "base middle school" (i.e. Thoreau). So, you can't really complain that those kids are now coming from two different MS (TMS and LJMS) before going to OHS. They have the option to stay with their neighborhood peers by doing AAP at TMS. But that is all beside the point and I am getting drawn into your straw-person argument (re: feeders to OHS).

The real issue is WHICH group of kids were the "right" group of kids to take out of Jackson and put into TMS. The LJMS people on this thread who are unhappy seem to ignore the elephant in the room... that is, if it wasn't the OHS-pyramid kids (who conveniently numbered about 300 kids), it would have to be the FCHS-pyramid kids being re-zoned out of their own pyramid! How is that ok?

The fact is, there wasn't any logical grouping of 300 kids that was a proportionate representation of the whole population. The Falls Church pyramid IS more ESOL/FARMS than this part of the Oakton pyramid. The school board made a decision that was based on reasonable considerations (i.e. keeping all the Falls Church pyramid kids together with their peers, keeping all the Oakton pyramid kids together with their elementary school peers, reducing overcrowding, using newly available space). Yes, there are downsides to that decision re: demographics at LJ. But some of you seem to be forgetting that there would have been downsides to other options as well. Did you really want the school board to factor in the race of the remaining students and say "we can't have THAT many Hispanic students in one school, let's make sure we keep more white kids there." ???

In any case, the decision was made. And the people on the ground have been dealing with it just fine. As the PP who does have a child at LJ mentioned, they are thrilled to not be so crowded and to still have good academics. TMS parents aren't belly-aching about having 275 kids "dumped" on them. Seems like OP doesn't have a child at LJ, but wants to stir the pot and pretend to be sooo concerned about the needier kids (who OP apparently thinks should have been moved out of LJMS)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Luther Jackson Enrollment PLUNGES As Expected"

I can't help think that you are trying to bait people into an argument with your dramatic word choice. It was expected -- and INTENDED -- that LJMS's enrollment would in fact drop when kids were required to move over to another MS. And kids were going to be required to move OUT of LJMS because it was overcrowded!

Your whole issue is that you wanted more of the poor kids moved out of LJMS. And the decision didn't go your way.
But, let's not forget that the whole point of rezoning is to effect a reduction in enrollment at the school that is overcrowded. Somebody had to be moved out. And on the corollary -- somebody had to be moved over to TMS.

There was a school that was far undercapacity next to a school that was far overcapacity. 300-ish kids from the over-capacity school had to move out. Which kids? You had two groups -- those who are part of Oakton HS and those who are part of Falls Church. It wouldn't make any sense to take 300 Falls Church kids out of LJMS and send them to TMS.

At the base of this rezoning decision was the need to remove 300 kids from LJMS.

The answer given was: the kids who are not in this pyramid long term.

There previously were no kids destined for Oakton High School at Thoreau. All they did was separate Oakton High School kids into four feeder middle schools. Franklin, Carson, Luther Jackson, and now Thoreau. While overcrowded was a concern, there was no real reason to switch Oakton High school bound kids to Thoreau because of some high school feeder issue.

It was never about consolidating the OHS pyramid kids. You seem to be missing the issue at the core of the rezoning question.

1. LJMS was severely over crowded.
2. 300 kids needed to be moved out of LJMS.
3. Which kids should be moved out of the Falls Church feeder MS?
(a) 1/4 of the kids who will attend FCHS after leaving Jackson or
(b) all of the kids who will attend OHS after leaving Jackson ?

Remember that the AAP part of LJMS is not all OHS kids. It is primarily FCHS kids. Those AAP/OHS pyramid kids are making the CHOICE to attend LJMS for the program that is also offered at their "base middle school" (i.e. Thoreau). So, you can't really complain that those kids are now coming from two different MS (TMS and LJMS) before going to OHS. They have the option to stay with their neighborhood peers by doing AAP at TMS. But that is all beside the point and I am getting drawn into your straw-person argument (re: feeders to OHS).

The real issue is WHICH group of kids were the "right" group of kids to take out of Jackson and put into TMS. The LJMS people on this thread who are unhappy seem to ignore the elephant in the room... that is, if it wasn't the OHS-pyramid kids (who conveniently numbered about 300 kids), it would have to be the FCHS-pyramid kids being re-zoned out of their own pyramid! How is that ok?

The fact is, there wasn't any logical grouping of 300 kids that was a proportionate representation of the whole population. The Falls Church pyramid IS more ESOL/FARMS than this part of the Oakton pyramid. The school board made a decision that was based on reasonable considerations (i.e. keeping all the Falls Church pyramid kids together with their peers, keeping all the Oakton pyramid kids together with their elementary school peers, reducing overcrowding, using newly available space). Yes, there are downsides to that decision re: demographics at LJ. But some of you seem to be forgetting that there would have been downsides to other options as well. Did you really want the school board to factor in the race of the remaining students and say "we can't have THAT many Hispanic students in one school, let's make sure we keep more white kids there." ???

In any case, the decision was made. And the people on the ground have been dealing with it just fine. As the PP who does have a child at LJ mentioned, they are thrilled to not be so crowded and to still have good academics. TMS parents aren't belly-aching about having 275 kids "dumped" on them. Seems like OP doesn't have a child at LJ, but wants to stir the pot and pretend to be sooo concerned about the needier kids (who OP apparently thinks should have been moved out of LJMS)?

I’m nearly certain the complainer (op) is the same one with no lj kid from last spring who essentially admitted the problem was her property value tanking.